49 replies to this topic

[Storming Angel]

Nesutizale, on 28 October 2021 - 08:28 AM, said:

Are there more SC Devs around here? I remember that Sean Tracy and Dan Tracy are Mechwarrior fans, also I don't know if they ever played MWO but they worked on Living Legends IIRC.

Sean once said that he would like to do an online Mechwarrior title but would go in a different direction to MWO. Man I would love to see what the SC team could come up with when it would focus on a Mechwarrior title.



From what I remember PGI said a change of the engine would bring in two major problems.
First of is how to finance that change. The people who allready play MWO will most likely not pay again to get what they allready had and I tend to agree. Unlooking everything or paying for it to get it back....

Then there is the porting of all the assets and databanks so that every player gets back what he had. I don't know about how problematic that realy is. I mean a lot of the mechs are allready ported to MW5 so its possible.
What I expected to be more problematic is changeing the entire mechlab to MWOs system, working on the interface for MP purposes and most importently getting the multiplayer matches working. Something that isn't present in the current game.

As for updateing the old maps with better graphics....do you think that the game could handle that without blowing up the CPU?
Beside that, I think what MWO realy needs is a clear vision of where the game should go.

Gameplay, Gunplay, Monetarisation, basicly everything would need to be brought up to 2020+ before we can even start talking about what engine to be used or what graphics to update.
MWO needs a person kinda like Chris Roberts with a vision of where things should go...but without the feature creep

I'm fine with starting again if it means we are able to get bigger updates, and a better game engine to play with too be honest. There's only two engines i can think of cry engine 5 or unreal 5 for this game.

Then they will need to sort out what they want to do with the game from there on in.

[Nesutizale]

@w0qj

Seriously, a skin is what made you quite the game?

I didn't even looked at it for two other reasons. Price, which I didn't had to pay and a gold skin....seriously....gold? Do I look like the F Emperor of mankind or a Castodes?
I mean nothing against Kitten, he looks very good in gold.

If you don't get the referance, don't worry, its silly lets just say that gold isn't the color I would show up in on the battlefield. Even less if the mech would be made out of gold what would be even worse

Anyway. A Mechpack, as long as its not pay to win and PGI did that one thing very good in my opinion, isn't something I would quit about.

Edited by Nesutizale, 28 October 2021 - 08:58 AM.

[Storming Angel]

Nesutizale, on 28 October 2021 - 08:56 AM, said:

Seriously, a skin is what made you quite the game?

I didn't even looked at it for two other reasons. Price, which I didn't had to pay and a gold skin....seriously....gold? Do I look like the F Emperor of mankind or a Castodes?
I mean nothing against Kitten, he looks very good in gold.

If you don't get the referance, don't worry, its silly lets just say that gold isn't the color I would show up in on the battlefield. Even less if the mech would be made out of gold what would be even worse

Anyway. A Mechpack, as long as its not pay to win and PGI did that one thing very good in my opinion, isn't something I would quit about.

Its the scummy practice that made him quit along with how PGI was more interested in that, than trying to make MWO a better game and a more marketable game, no reason to sell something for such a mental price. Standards are important otherwise don't be surprised when things get terrible. (For some reason, people think this won't translate over from certain industries to their everyday lives, when eventually it will.)

[Pika]

Nesutizale, on 28 October 2021 - 08:28 AM, said:

Are there more SC Devs around here? I remember that Sean Tracy and Dan Tracy are Mechwarrior fans, also I don't know if they ever played MWO but they worked on Living Legends IIRC.

Sean once said that he would like to do an online Mechwarrior title but would go in a different direction to MWO. Man I would love to see what the SC team could come up with when it would focus on a Mechwarrior title.

I know of at least a few! I play pretty much daily with a bunch of other SC people from all over the place. I personally have been a fan of Battletech since I was a little kid and now I'm on the wrong side of 30 I still push for mecha in everything I have a hand in developing. If CIG were to get the right... if that were to happen, I would be a very happy 'Mechwarrior.

But man what I would give to work on a Battletech game one day. A dream!

Quote

Then there is the porting of all the assets and databanks so that every player gets back what he had. I don't know about how problematic that realy is. I mean a lot of the mechs are allready ported to MW5 so its possible.
What I expected to be more problematic is changeing the entire mechlab to MWOs system, working on the interface for MP purposes and most importently getting the multiplayer matches working. Something that isn't present in the current game.

This is what I would like to see and then a timeline skip into Dark Age or even IlClan era just to give us anything we like and factions playing a FAR more important role from the start. Hell you could even make it so that the game has a timeline that progresses until a victory state is hit, and then it resets, similar to how WW2 Online does it.

But yeah, all spitballing.

To get on point through: WoT is... aggressive in how it treats the player. PGI may have asked you to dig deep occasionally, but WoT would ask you to do that then put you against T7s in your T4 tank. D:

Edited by Pika, 28 October 2021 - 09:08 AM.

[w0qj]

I'm willing to start all over again as a Founder MWO2 player!
(And I'm speaking as a MWO legendary founder player).

Just give all MWO Founders the same benefits as a MW5 Founder (ie: double [+100%] Founders benefits + a few Special Variant for MWO2 pre-order). Anyone else with 2+ Ultimate Mech Packs in MWO would get [+30%] Founders benefits. Any MW5 player with DLC purchased also gets [+30%] Founders benefits!

Nesutizale, on 28 October 2021 - 08:28 AM, said:

Are there more SC Devs around here? I remember that Sean Tracy and Dan Tracy are Mechwarrior fans, also I don't know if they ever played MWO but they worked on Living Legends IIRC.

Sean once said that he would like to do an online Mechwarrior title but would go in a different direction to MWO. Man I would love to see what the SC team could come up with when it would focus on a Mechwarrior title.



From what I remember PGI said a change of the engine would bring in two major problems.
First of is how to finance that change. The people who allready play MWO will most likely not pay again to get what they allready had and I tend to agree. Unlooking everything or paying for it to get it back....

Then there is the porting of all the assets and databanks so that every player gets back what he had. I don't know about how problematic that realy is. I mean a lot of the mechs are allready ported to MW5 so its possible.
What I expected to be more problematic is changeing the entire mechlab to MWOs system, working on the interface for MP purposes and most importently getting the multiplayer matches working. Something that isn't present in the current game.

As for updateing the old maps with better graphics....do you think that the game could handle that without blowing up the CPU?
Beside that, I think what MWO realy needs is a clear vision of where the game should go.

Gameplay, Gunplay, Monetarisation, basicly everything would need to be brought up to 2020+ before we can even start talking about what engine to be used or what graphics to update.
MWO needs a person kinda like Chris Roberts with a vision of where things should go...but without the feature creep

[Nightbird]

Star Citizen's most expensive ship is 3000$ and people complain the quantity is limited so they can't grab one because of bot buyers.

[Nesutizale]

@Pika

Nice to hear that there are so many fans at CIG. Yah also started out at a younger, better age. Fells as if I had know Kerensky personaly
Anyway its good to know that there are enough people interested in MW and got the knowledge to do something with it. Now you just have to finish SC in about 4 years. Then the MW license from PGI runs out and you could take over in doing a MW game. No pressure

As for the games timeline. I also thought about Dark Age. Either the formation of the Republic or the fall of it with its many new factions.
The timeline resetting idea sounds interesting for a faction play like theme. Not so sure about a PvP game though.

Well as you said its theory crafting but hey you never know. Write it down, let it sit in your ideabox and if you are lucky good stuff happens and if not, well you just spend some time to write stuff down.


As for the WoT topic. That is realy the one point where PGI was allways very generouse and much better then any of the Wargame titles. Played Word of Warships for a time and gave up because I wouldn't spend the money on it again and again.
Prefer to buy a mech or color or mechbay every now and then when I have the money.

[LordNothing]

Nesutizale, on 28 October 2021 - 12:57 AM, said:

Lets first get MWO to a presentable state before we start advertising the **** out of it
While I like the changes that are dripping in slowly its biggest problem is the old engine. I know its kinda a beaten horse but it is a problem we can't deny. The CPU bottleneck is a shock for new players and frankly MWO is the slowest running game I have and currently also the oldest. I don't count StarCitizen here as its not done but its a conntender to MWO in FPS with both running similar but one is a game in progress while the other has been out for many years. Only that MWO crashes far less

Beeing the optimist I am...well who am I lying to...I hope that the new Crytech people from (fill in company name here) somehow can improve the engine run more stuff on the GPU.
Else the only way for MWO to improve is an engine change but this will not happenb because money or if some modders take MW5 and build a MW5-Online....what is also very unlikely.

i personally think the window for advertising has long since passed. the time for ads was back during launch. i think something like an engine port is going to cost as much as making a whole new game (and likely derived from mw5 because it would be cheaper).

it may be possible to use the existing engine, and put a lot of spit and polish into the game. like qol features, bugfixes, a huge graphics update pass, and trim down the lesser used game modes, improve npe etc. then do a re-branding (for example 'mwo redux') and advertising campaign. and this would have to be a huge monolithic update, not something trickled in and half assed or the whole thing would backfire.

Edited by LordNothing, 28 October 2021 - 01:53 PM.

[w0qj]

It'll be christened as [drum roll...] ... MWO Reloaded !!

[LordNothing]

w0qj, on 28 October 2021 - 03:26 PM, said:

It'll be christened as [drum roll...] ... MWO Reloaded !!

or mwo: we can actually afford to do this the right way now.

[PocketYoda]

Until WoT decides to add Battletech to its line up i have little to no interest in it.. The whole reason i even play this is for a very very very loose watered down broken version of Battletech..

I have zero interest in competitive game play of any kind, i'm just here to enjoy mechs.

Edited by MechaGnome, 28 October 2021 - 08:40 PM.

[Nesutizale]

LordNothing, on 28 October 2021 - 01:52 PM, said:

i personally think the window for advertising has long since passed. the time for ads was back during launch. i think something like an engine port is going to cost as much as making a whole new game (and likely derived from mw5 because it would be cheaper).

it may be possible to use the existing engine, and put a lot of spit and polish into the game. like qol features, bugfixes, a huge graphics update pass, and trim down the lesser used game modes, improve npe etc. then do a re-branding (for example 'mwo redux') and advertising campaign. and this would have to be a huge monolithic update, not something trickled in and half assed or the whole thing would backfire.

I think I heard them talk about a rebranding and new ads in the future for MWO ... but the updates will most likely as they are now.
Well there is still the that other companie they have contacted that still has some CryEngine people who are looking into stuff....but I can't realy tell what that is supposed to mean.

I realy hoped that with Bombadil they would have more communication on what the plans are. I mean its allready more then before, don't get me wrong and I like it. Still I kinda feel in the dark. Missing a clear vision of what is to come. Yah Cauldron inspired patches and map reworks but what is the big picture?

[Ch_R0me]

Nesutizale, on 28 October 2021 - 12:57 AM, said:

Lets first get MWO to a presentable state before we start advertising the **** out of it
While I like the changes that are dripping in slowly its biggest problem is the old engine. I know its kinda a beaten horse but it is a problem we can't deny. The CPU bottleneck is a shock for new players and frankly MWO is the slowest running game I have and currently also the oldest. I don't count StarCitizen here as its not done but its a conntender to MWO in FPS with both running similar but one is a game in progress while the other has been out for many years. Only that MWO crashes far less

If only PGI could switch over to the Open 3D Engine... It's a open-sourced Amazon Lumberyard, while based on CryEngine.

Andrewlik, on 27 October 2021 - 11:38 AM, said:

I used to play World of Tanks for a long time, (Heck, search my username on google and you can find some of my old forum posts) but eventually quit because it felt overly monetized, pay to win, and balance was out the window.

I recently (like january) started playing MWO coming from MW5 coming from HBS BT, and I find that MWO does do alot of things better than WoT (at least for me):

1. Monetization
I don't feel like I'm being gouged for money at every corner. I don't feel like I "need" to spend money in order to "Afford" to play the mechs I want - this, tied into the fact there is no "tech tree" means I can far more easily play the mech I want to play
Cosmetics are a bit overpriced, but otherwise, MWO's monetization feels fair.

2. Balance and customization

(Almost surely thanks to The Cauldron), MWO's meta feels far more varied, with alot more builds that are "viable" than WOT.
I mean, the difference between "meme" and "meta" is far smaller in MWO than in WOT.
WOT ranked meta has devolved into the same ~6 or so fast heavies and mediums with impenetrable turrets and 1 light that just makes other lights obsolete.
In MWO, I'm seeing alot of variety, even between mechs of the same chassis and variant.
With MWO, there is such good customization that on some mechs (such as my previous Catapult K2) I can't decide on whats the best build because so many feel viable, where as with WOT there is rarely more than 1 way to play a tank.

(...)

I fully agree - right now PGI's monetization practices are examplary atm, yet like others I still remember the outrage for going the same route like WG.net / Gaijin / Mail.ru and so on (incl. chinese game makers).

And about WoT: know something by myself - played since 2012; my max tank tier is 6, maybe 7; my wn8 is... 42

Can't adjust to this game. It's so damned toxic, both mechanics and people. That's why I tend to play War Thunder (realistic damage system) / Armored Warfare (PvE) to scratch the tank itch.

Otherwise - MwO is far better, since there isn't any stupid tree tiering, all available mechs are already available for purchase, not mentioning mechanics more suited to my preffered gamestyle

[Nesutizale]

I don't know if switching to an open source engine would be good. I once worked with an open source thing and in the end we decided to seperate us from them and do our own thing because every time there was an update to the engine something else broke. Mostly the stuff we needed and had just started to get working.

So depening on how often its updated I would shy away from open source or not.
Also PGI has just hired a bunch of people working with unreal engine, the ported a lot of assets over ot that engine and you can still find a lot of people working with that engine.

SO I think moneywise and companies sadly have to keep taps on that, I think unreal engine is the more realistic way of doing an MWO 2.0

[Duke Falcon]

MWO all the way!
WoT advertised itself with huge lies. Tank simulator PvP game! And your mothers still alive? WoT were a pile of ****. Badly mad, badly looking and badly moderated(?). And they asked real money for stuffs not even worth it. Evev WoW would beat WoT in a tank pvp competition. And now they have warships, spriggans, flying horses with horns, whatever sh!t they just think could still sell for mostly directly-toxicated-brainless stravags. And I mean it.
MWO is far better. It is almost a comparison of a demigod and a maggot. WoT failed epic...
On the other hand MWO have scarcer player base often result long waiting times (FP queue!).

[Ch_R0me]

Nesutizale, on 29 October 2021 - 06:32 AM, said:

I don't know if switching to an open source engine would be good. I once worked with an open source thing and in the end we decided to seperate us from them and do our own thing because every time there was an update to the engine something else broke. Mostly the stuff we needed and had just started to get working.

In that case, maybe PGI could stay within selected version, just sending back the modifications they would deem useful to anybody... Hell, somebody said that Star Citizen have the heavily modded engine here.

Nesutizale, on 29 October 2021 - 06:32 AM, said:

So depening on how often its updated I would shy away from open source or not.
Also PGI has just hired a bunch of people working with unreal engine, the ported a lot of assets over ot that engine and you can still find a lot of people working with that engine.

SO I think moneywise and companies sadly have to keep taps on that, I think unreal engine is the more realistic way of doing an MWO 2.0

If so... Maybe you're right in this case. At least Unreal Engine 5, like with Mw5.

[Nesutizale]

@Ch_R0me
Yes Star Citizen started out with a version of Cryengine, started to hire peopel from Crytech as they had massive layoffs. Later switched to Lumberyard, what is Cryengine with another Label on it and with Amazons server infrastructure as support.
Still by now there are so many modifications to the engine that they internaly call it the StarEngine.
IIRC they also have a contract part that feeds back some of the modifications to Crytech, also since some lawsuit trouble has taken place I am not sure how this part is working out.

That is at least as far as I know the story, maybe one of the Dev from SC can correct me if they read this.

[LordNothing]

Nesutizale, on 29 October 2021 - 12:03 AM, said:

I think I heard them talk about a rebranding and new ads in the future for MWO ... but the updates will most likely as they are now.
Well there is still the that other companie they have contacted that still has some CryEngine people who are looking into stuff....but I can't realy tell what that is supposed to mean.

I realy hoped that with Bombadil they would have more communication on what the plans are. I mean its allready more then before, don't get me wrong and I like it. Still I kinda feel in the dark. Missing a clear vision of what is to come. Yah Cauldron inspired patches and map reworks but what is the big picture?

im not even sure there is a big picture. i view cauldron/map reduxes/booster packs as bones thrown to the remaining population so they don't leave. even if we complete all of those things the game will still look dated and would be a hard sell to new players. a big jihad pack with a few new weapons and a couple brand new from scratch maps (they would need to look quite spiffy to use in ads). and i would also clean up some of the dead modes. a monolithic mm and reduced divisions for solaris would be nice. and idk what could/should be done about fp (entire threads have been devoted to that). but a re-branding would need to be big and far reaching to be successful.

[Blood Rose]

The few things I remember from playing WoT:
>The game was heavily nation biased. You either played the Big Three or you struggled. And gods forbid you tried to play thhe British tanks.
>The game was heavily weight-biased. The heavy players whined and the game was altered. Narrow corridor maps became the norm, and there was plenty of cover from artillery.
>The game was (and probably still is) a paypiggies wet dream. Pay up or struggle. Premium ammo was literal p2w.
>Armour and gun penetration values were changed at a whim and **** historical accuracy
>HP pools for tanks

[w0qj]

Might I suggest this, already achievable already within the existing MWO engine, given enough manpower/resources (OK, everything but the combat pet part anyways):

- - - - - - - - - -
Let's dream big!

MWO Timeline Expansion (the first one since the Civil War timeline expansion)

Omnimechs for Inner Sphere!
New Mech chassis such as Stone Rhino!
IS gets advanced ATM, Lasers

Clan gets advanced MRM, RAC, and PPC! New mech chassis!
Angel ECM! Bloodhound Active Probe!

Premium Combat pets (Elemental, Elemental IIC, Pollux tanks, helicopters, etc.)!

Brand new maps!

Deepened Faction Play experience!

Love to dream big

LordNothing, on 29 October 2021 - 03:50 PM, said:

...a big jihad pack with a few new weapons and a couple brand new from scratch maps (they would need to look quite spiffy to use in ads). and i would also clean up some of the dead modes. a monolithic mm and reduced divisions for solaris would be nice. and idk what could/should be done about fp (entire threads have been devoted to that). but a re-branding would need to be big and far reaching to be successful.