629 replies to this topic

[justcallme A S H]

MPhoenix, on 29 November 2021 - 09:56 AM, said:

Okay, let's try this again S L O W L Y since some are having difficulty grasping the concept.

n o n e o f t h a t i s

g o i n g t o o




c h a n g e

But then you said this...

MPhoenix, on 28 November 2021 - 08:03 PM, said:

It's a general statement and for the most part they are fine but there's one issue that makes them utter BS in the game.

Absolute lack of consequence to the whole face hugging/strafing idiocy.

A 20 ton mech can take down a fresh 100 ton mech simple by running around it firing dinky weapons forever. Okay, it's a viable tactic for damage but to be able to destroy a fresh mech is nonsense.

So ye, it was a lights OP thread.

[Ihlrath]

If something looks too hard at most lights they tend to go down faster than a Kuritan Geisha... so... I mean there's that.

[LordNothing]

martian, on 28 November 2021 - 09:53 PM, said:

I have got one suggestion: Take a light 'Mech and play 20-30 games in it. Preferably, some light 'Mech that usually carries short range weapons and depends on getting close to the enemy. Something like Piranha, Locust or Flea.

this is actually a great way to improve your assault game and general anti-light tactics. you need to know your enemy. play a few and realize how easy it is to have one good clean shot ruin your game. which leads to asking, why cant i get a good clean shot? you pay attention, especially when you lose, and how your opponent responded. perhaps rather than running around like a chicken with its head cut off in a panic it stood dead still and took its time to aim, perhaps it threw up a uav or backed into a wall. now try to emulate that behavior in your assault mech. drill on it. and pretty soon all you will see is cookies, not lights.

and its not just your failures either, look at your victories in a light mech, and pay attention to what your opponents did wrong. try to learn the difference between a mech that is a threat and one that is easy prey. and that tells you what not to do in an assault mech.

Edited by LordNothing, 29 November 2021 - 04:16 PM.

[LordNothing]

Ravni, on 28 November 2021 - 09:59 PM, said:

It sounds like you desire a physics system where any collision damage between a light mech and an assault should result in crippling or lethal damage to the light. I have difficulty impressing upon you enough how terrible of an idea that is.

Instead, I suggest you attempt to pilot a Flea (or any light mech, really) to see how they play firsthand. While doing so, please take careful note of each time you bump or graze in to another mech - friend or foe - and then think about how much more awesome the game would be if your mech had just instantly exploded.

they tried that once, it was a fun patch, i tked so many squirrels that day (none intentionally). of course it was reverted pretty quickly.

Edited by LordNothing, 29 November 2021 - 04:29 PM.

[YueFei]

MPhoenix, on 29 November 2021 - 11:34 AM, said:

That Super Hornet has a set of seriously over-engineered rear landing gear designed to flex and take the impact. The impact is also not vertical, between decent and forward motion it's more of a lateral deflection.

So if we're making the comparison of rear landing gear impact absorption to armor impact absorption that means there has to be some form of sprung suspension for the armor plates.

Does this mean IS mechs use leaf springs and sealed shock absorbers and Clan mechs us coil overs and struts?


Side note: If not for politics and back room deals the F-14 Super Tomcat would have kicked the Super Hornet's butt and taken it's lunch money.

That Super Hornet in the drop test is just dropped straight down from 20 feet up. There's no lateral motion at all, and the vertical impact speed is about 40 kph.

Mechs have articulated joints and armor plating over a structure of artificial muscle and bone, so there's some flex and give there. Regardless, like I said, the mech in MWO do take damage in collisions, it just doesn't end a mech in a single crash.

The Super Tomcat would indeed have kicked ***, if (and it is a big if) it could avoid being as much of a hangar queen as the original Tomcat.

[MrMadguy]

Funny thing, but game was more or less alive despite of lack of new content...before all this changes. And now it seems to be dead. Because even in Tier 4 matchmaking was so bad yesterday, that I earned 0 kills. So, I can't complete current challenge now due to really bad matchmaking within last 1-2 weeks.

[pbiggz]

MrMadguy, on 29 November 2021 - 08:18 PM, said:

Funny thing, but game was more or less alive despite of lack of new content...before all this changes. And now it seems to be dead. Because even in Tier 4 matchmaking was so bad yesterday, that I earned 0 kills. So, I can't complete current challenge now due to really bad matchmaking within last 1-2 weeks.

my god dude. get good. ffs you cant externalize every single one of your personal failings.

[ScrapIron Prime]

MrMadguy, on 29 November 2021 - 08:18 PM, said:

Funny thing, but game was more or less alive despite of lack of new content...before all this changes. And now it seems to be dead. Because even in Tier 4 matchmaking was so bad yesterday, that I earned 0 kills. So, I can't complete current challenge now due to really bad matchmaking within last 1-2 weeks.

Mmmmmmyeah, that doesn’t pass the smell test. One bad game could be your team, sure… but if ALL your games are bad, there’s only one player in common in all those games.

[martian]

MrMadguy, on 29 November 2021 - 08:18 PM, said:

Funny thing, but game was more or less alive despite of lack of new content...before all this changes. And now it seems to be dead. Because even in Tier 4 matchmaking was so bad yesterday, ... So, I can't complete current challenge now due to really bad matchmaking within last 1-2 weeks.

There can be some one- or two hours-long periods, when the matchmaking is pretty substandard, but no such "bad matchmaking period" would be two weeks long.

MrMadguy, on 29 November 2021 - 08:18 PM, said:

.... that I earned 0 kills....

Then I would suggest that you should either adjust your tactics or switch to a different loadout (or 'Mech).

Maybe your Fafnir is not the most suitable 'Mechs for you? Have you tried a different 'Mech with a different armament?


Maybe you should try some light 'Mech since they are so powerful?

MrMadguy, on 17 November 2021 - 02:12 AM, said:

Lights are so OP now after recent changes, that they can two-shot Assaults. No point to talk about weight balance any longer. ...

[MrMadguy]

ScrapIron Prime, on 29 November 2021 - 09:03 PM, said:

Mmmmmmyeah, that doesn’t pass the smell test. One bad game could be your team, sure… but if ALL your games are bad, there’s only one player in common in all those games.

Stop it already. We all know, that 1 of 24 can neither win matches, nor lose them. One player can't do anything, if he doesn't have any support from his team. I'm average player. Tier 4 is below my skill level, as 50% skill means mid Tier 3. And if even Tier 4 is so bad, then this game is hopeless. Because long queues suggest, that this game doesn't even have 24 players available at any given moment.

Edited by MrMadguy, 29 November 2021 - 09:44 PM.

[martian]

LordNothing, on 29 November 2021 - 04:14 PM, said:

this is actually a great way to improve your assault game and general anti-light tactics. ...

Those players from the "Lights are OP" crowd never do that.

[Curccu]

martian, on 29 November 2021 - 10:27 AM, said:

That is interesting.

Fresh Fafnir's side torso has 42 points of structure and 100 points of armor, usually some 90-95 points of that amount facing front. Okay, you were missing a few points of armor.

I would like to see Mist Lynx that can melt some 130 points of armor+structure in two accurate alpha strikes ... in 3 seconds.

MLX MRMADGUY Pretty hard mech to build, 65 dmg "accurate" alpha with about 50% max heat... so it can shoot twice.... in 3 seconds.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

Curccu, on 29 November 2021 - 11:29 PM, said:

MLX MRMADGUY Pretty hard mech to build, 65 dmg "accurate" alpha with about 50% max heat... so it can shoot twice.... in 3 seconds.

by pretty hard you mean... impossible within the client's confines?

[justcallme A S H]

MrMadguy, on 29 November 2021 - 08:18 PM, said:

Funny thing, but game was more or less alive despite of lack of new content...before all this changes. And now it seems to be dead. Because even in Tier 4 matchmaking was so bad yesterday, that I earned 0 kills. So, I can't complete current challenge now due to really bad matchmaking within last 1-2 weeks.

Please at least check your data is accurate.

Once again you're not correct population is higher at the moment than it has been at this same point in 2020/2019.

[justcallme A S H]

MrMadguy, on 29 November 2021 - 09:39 PM, said:

Stop it already. We all know, that 1 of 24 can neither win matches, nor lose them. One player can't do anything, if he doesn't have any support from his team. I'm average player. Tier 4 is below my skill level, as 50% skill means mid Tier 3..

One player can do plenty if you pull your weight.

MrMadguy, on 29 November 2021 - 09:39 PM, said:

Because long queues suggest, that this game doesn't even have 24 players available at any given moment.

No it doesn't. The average T3-T5 game goes 7mins plus loading in/out time (2 more mins).

There could easily be 4-5 concurrent games running and the kicked off in relatively short succession and then you are simply needing to wait for it to come around again. This is completely normal.

Please provide proof, even very sketchy will do, that suggests only 24 people are available.

They could be from 5 different tiers. In different group sizes within different tiers. Have you even documented your wait times to actually quantify it? I bet not.


Stop it already.

[martian]

Curccu, on 29 November 2021 - 11:29 PM, said:

MLX MRMADGUY Pretty hard mech to build, 65 dmg "accurate" alpha with about 50% max heat... so it can shoot twice.... in 3 seconds.

Pretty nice build.

Those people with cheat codes ...

I guess it would be doable in BattleTech. But it is definitely impossible in MechWarrior Online.

[MrMadguy]

I don't care, how it happened. It just happened. He jumped on his JJ above my aim. I'm experienced enough to just wait to him to land. But this few seconds he was airborne were enough to rip my ST off. I didn't even notice, how it happened. I was too focused on killing him to watch for my armor. But when I noticed, that something was wrong, my front ST was already without armor.

Again. Popularity via power - is the worst idea. Lights are already about so called skill threshold problem. This problem boils down to "something is OP even if it's power is balanced, when it requires much lower skill threshold to play and much higher skill to counter". It's like stealth classes in RPGs. They're easy to play and hard to counter. And therefore they should always be underpowered to compensate this fact. Lights are already hard to hit via ballistics due to that pre-emptive aiming and convergence problems. Lights are hard to hit via lasers, because they just spread all dmg. Lights are hard to hit via missiles, because...well...they just simply avoid them. They can openly attack several more powerful enemies. They're already almost invulnerable. I already have gauss and tag in almost every new build to counter them. Their gameplay is already about spamming JJs and pew-pewing lasers or MGs. And PGI buff them even further? While they're the cheapest 'Mechs in whole game? It's simply unfair, when some other players are required to pay 5x lower prices to get the same or even higher power. May be we should balance prices first? I also want to pay just 1K MC instead of 7K for my hero 'Mechs. This game is hopeless, sorry. I don't even know, why I still play it from time to time. It's just that free 'Mech bay for event, that forces me to still do it.

Edited by MrMadguy, 30 November 2021 - 04:01 AM.

[RickySpanish]

I have contended that Assault 'Mechs are the most difficult class to play well, thereby making Lights not The Hardest, but to say that Lights are the easiest? Sir, have you actually piloted one?

[martian]

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

I don't care, how it happened. It just happened. He jumped on his JJ above my aim. I'm experienced enough to just wait to him to land. But this few seconds he was airborne were enough to rip my ST off. I didn't even notice, how it happened. I was too focused on killing him to watch for my armor. But when I noticed, that something was wrong, my front ST was already without armor.

And you do not even know if he fired lasers, missiles or machine guns?

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

Again. Popularity via power - is the worst idea. Lights are already about so called skill threshold problem. This problem boils down to "something is OP even if it's power is balanced, when it requires much lower skill threshold to play and much higher skill to counter".

If you really think that light 'Mechs in MWO have a low skill threshold, then I am afraid you are mistaken.

Yes, it is easy to buy a light 'Mech, and it is easy to drop in a light 'Mech in a game.

However, light 'Mechs require a high skill to do well. And the higher Tier you are in, the higher skill is needed to survive and be successful.

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

It's like stealth classes in RPGs. They're easy to play and hard to counter.

No matter how quirked MWO Lights are, they can be crippled or killed by just one good alpha strike from a well-designed heavy or Assault 'Mech (and some Mediums).

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

And therefore they should always be underpowered to compensate this fact.

Do you really think that some Mist Lynx or Firestarter with a half dozen of Small lasers is overpowered? Or Arctic Cheetah or Javelin armed with some Medium Lasers? Or some Osiris or Cougar perhaps? When compared with your Fafnir?

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

Lights are already hard to hit via ballistics due to that pre-emptive aiming and convergence problems.

Yes, you must learn how to "lead the target". Many MWO players have learnt it and so can you.

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

Lights are hard to hit via lasers, because they just spread all dmg.

Do you know that when firing laser, you can "correct your aim", so to speak, and place the laser beam back on the target? Some lasers such as ER Large laser or Heavy Large laser are infamous for having a long burn time that allows players to do this.

Or equip pulse lasers that offer a short duration.

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

Lights are hard to hit via missiles, because...well...they just simply avoid them.

Not many Lights can avoid Streak SRMs and there are situations when ATMs are difficult to avoid too. And since many light 'Mechs run short range loadouts, SRMs and MRMs are dangerous for them too.

I agree that fast lights can avoid LRMs fired from the maximum distance.

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

They can openly attack several more powerful enemies.

In Tier 5 maybe. It sounds like the recipe for suicide, if you play in higher Tiers.

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

They're already almost invulnerable.

The majority of light 'Mechs has only a few points of armor covering a few points of internal structure. Even those relatively well-quirked ones can be destroyed by heavier 'Mechs quite easily.

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

I already have gauss and tag in almost every new build to counter them.

Instead of TAG, would not it be better to add one more laser? If you can see them, you can hit them, ECM/Stealth or not.

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

Their gameplay is already about spamming JJs and pew-pewing lasers or MGs.

Of course light 'Mechs are using their speed and their agility to their advantage. What do you expect? Locust trying to slug it out with your Fafnir? Mist Lynx moving 30 km/h and on the ground only, so you can kill it with your 100-ton Fafnir?

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

And PGI buff them even further?

From the game balancing perspective: Yes. They have always been underperforming and the least played class of 'Mechs, so it was logical to buff them, so at least somebody would be willing to use them.

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

While they're the cheapest 'Mechs in whole game? It's simply unfair, when some other players are required to pay 5x lower prices to get the same or even higher power.

If those light 'Mechs are so OP and extremely cheap, why do they often end the game with the low Match Score?

If those light 'Mechs are so OP and extremely cheap, why is not the queue full of light 'Mechs?

If those light 'Mechs are so OP and extremely cheap, why are both teams often composed of heavy and medium 'Mechs, with one or two token light 'Mechs on both sides?

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

May be we should balance prices first? I also want to pay just 1K MC instead of 7K for my hero 'Mechs.
It's simply unfair, when some other players are required to pay 5x lower prices to get the same or even higher power.
This game is hopeless, sorry. I don't even know, why I still play it from time to time. It's just that free 'Mech bay for event, that forces me to still do it.

Light 'Mechs to not offer "the same or even higher power" as Assault 'Mechs.

Edited by martian, 30 November 2021 - 07:28 AM.

[pbiggz]

MrMadguy, on 30 November 2021 - 03:58 AM, said:

Please nerf lights because I dont like them.