316 replies to this topic

[C337Skymaster]

Curccu, on 16 April 2023 - 09:43 AM, said:

This thing is bad how? Except it hurts some strict BT fanatics.

It's bad because it breaks down inter-platform comparability and makes it more difficult for someone who starts playing MWO to transition to other games, like MW5, if all the stats are completely different. CASE weighs less in MWO, LBX is smaller in MWO. BAP is smaller AND weighs less in MWO. None of their favorite builds will be commutable across platforms because ALL the equipment is going to be different.

It's also bad because, and this has already happened with the change to CASE, when brand new players, just introduced to the game, are scrolling through the 'mech store, they're not going to know why some 'mechs are under-tonnage, and why some aren't.

As I and some others have already said: if you're going to keep doing this, just enable mixed tech and be done with it.

Edited by C337Skymaster, 16 April 2023 - 12:39 PM.

[Curccu]

C337Skymaster, on 16 April 2023 - 12:26 PM, said:

It's bad because it breaks down inter-platform comparability and makes it more difficult for someone who starts playing MWO to transition to other games, like MW5, if all the stats are completely different. CASE weighs less in MWO, LBX is smaller in MWO. BAP is smaller AND weighs less in MWO. None of their favorite builds will be commutable across platforms because ALL the equipment is going to be different.

It's also bad because, and this has already happened with the change to CASE, when brand new players, just introduced to the game, are scrolling through the 'mech store, they're not going to know why some 'mechs are under-tonnage, and why some aren't.

As I and some others have already said: if you're going to keep doing this, just enable mixed tech and be done with it.

And Mech Warrior 1-4 which pretty much all had different systems and mechanics? If new players cannot comprehend there are small differences in different games then mech building games are out of their grasp

[Roodkapje]

I see this kind of stuff mentioned for some mechs :

InnerSphereNews, on 14 April 2023 - 03:34 PM, said:

- Increased Ballistic cooldown to -20% in LA (from -10%)
- Increased LBX Spread to -10% in LA (from -5%)
- Increased LBX Spread to -15% in SO8 (from -5%)
- Increased LBX Spread to -10% in LA (from -5%)
- Added -5% Energy heat in CT
- Added 2.5% Mech top speed in CT
- Added -5% Energy cooldown in CT
- Increased MG RoF to 20% in LT, RT (from 10%)
- Added 5% Ballistic Range to LT, RT
- Added 10% Jump Jet burn duration in CT
- Added -25% Fall Damage in CT
- Added 10% Weapon velocity in CT
- Added 7.5% Heat dissipation in CT
- Increased LBX spread to -25% (from -15%) in LA
- Added 2.5% Range in CT
- Added -35% Jump Jet heat in CT
- Added -5% Energy heat in RA
- Added 15% Ballistic Range in CT
- Added -20% UAC Jam chance in RA
- Added -10% LBX Spread in CT

Does that mean we can finally mix and match outside the SO8 stuff with Clan Omnipod Mechs while keeping these advantages ?!

So for example my mech can have benefits per LA/RA/RT/LT/CT without needing the whole SO8 ?!

Quote

GRASSHOPPER



GHR-MJ:

• Removed -30% UAC Jam chance

Was considering buying the Hero but now I am not even looking at it for sure!

Quote

IS Beagle Active Probe:

• Equipment slots is reduced to 1 (from 2)
  
• Equipment weight is reduced to 1 ton (from 1.5 tons)

HALLELUJA!!! FINALLY!!!

Can we do something similar for the AMS options please ??

W A R L O R D, on 14 April 2023 - 05:56 PM, said:

Adding a drop deck allows players to be more strategic, thus making the game more complex, competitive and enjoyable.

Complex is something this game doesn't need : The learning curve is already too steep and high for many players sadly!

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I can't count how many times I've loaded up a brawler and Alpine Peaks gets spammed by a group with long range mechs.

+1 but then more in general :
- Pick Short Range Mech and get Long Range map.
- Pick Long Range Mech and get Short Range map.

Sometimes I make it work, but sometimes it also ends in horror...

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A drop deck would give players an opportunity to change their mech to something specialized for that map.
I see nothing wrong with that.

I wouldn't mind having the option to switch to a Light Mech when Conquest gets voted, but as others already said : Hellooo long boring ER LL/ER PPC/LURM matches!

And the Game Mode is called QUICK PLAY not LONG BORING PLAY after all...

ClumsyBunny, on 14 April 2023 - 05:59 PM, said:

Also, Caudron men, I'm interested in hearning why the Wolfhounds are getting nerfed, were they that overperforming?

My guess is Cauldron being Cauldron again, because if there is one mech I don't see often then it's the Wolfhound!

Lockheed_, on 14 April 2023 - 06:22 PM, said:

1. I don't want the game to be more strategic and complex.
I want some easy, dumb, fast, fun QP to relax.

If I wanted more I'd be playing FP or Comp.

The problem is that most playing for fun also use crappy mechs with crappy loadouts and are pretty much guaranteed 0-12 team mates!

And let's be honest here : FP is a dead mode...

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2. I play the game by picking the mech I feel like playing.
Map choice is secondary and not nearly as important as what mech I play. I'd probably just put the mech I want in the dropdeck and just play that.

Long queue waiting times ahoy! And getting stomped matches! LOL!

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3. If I feel like playing a mech that's a brawler, I am gonna pick that brawler and then if Alpine comes up that's what I'm gonna vote that because I love the map and then I embrace having to find a way to make the brawler work and that is actually fun for me.

We can agree on that one, however let's not do it on Alpine Peaks that makes me press that not working EJECT button!

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4. I don't want people to pick the mechs specialized for the map. That is boring AF. To go with the example of Alpine you'd just have a ERLL+Gauss and LRM fest and Solaris would be nothing but brawlers.

I am a bit 50/50 on that one... maybe... without the LURM SPAM... who knows ?!

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5. drop deck also possibly means more than one drop. I can't stand having long matches and having to go through several mechs. That's why I don't touch EQ or FP.

That would suck indeed!
Long match = OK, but not in FP style when you are playing QP mode!

Picking 1 mech out of 2 or 4 however wouldn't be that bad!

Matt Newman, on 14 April 2023 - 06:40 PM, said:

Or it may mean bringing in 4 mechs and only choosing one.

If you really have to do something like this with QP then please let it be that one!

TAMTAMBABY, on 14 April 2023 - 06:45 PM, said:

or light mechs are bad on a big map.

Ehh... WHUT?!?!

KursedVixen, on 14 April 2023 - 07:02 PM, said:

you get to choose four mechs in a drop deck when game launches you pick one of the four you may only use that mech 4 times...

That would be a HELL NO !!!

KingCobra, on 14 April 2023 - 07:12 PM, said:

Matt I don't understand why you don't just fix the game modes you already have in the game?

+1

Give us back decent games in FP like Scouting and Siege !!!

Or bring back Escort Mode for the heck of it ?!

Quote

Faction Play could be fixed by more faction rewards C-bills and a bracket system to balance team game play and Faction events.

Solaris could be fixed by making it light Vs light,medium Vs medium, Heavy Vs Heavy, Assault Vs assault.
And a round robin mode any mech goes for a championship mode?

Scouting mode same but more rewards, and a 8v8 team only mode, and put solo quick play back to the way it was originally intended to be just fun fast 12v12 solo players having fun? Rather than adding everything into solo quick play?

Sounds good to me!

DucPilot, on 14 April 2023 - 07:20 PM, said:

Agreed, QP should be simple and not require multiple drops like FP or Comp.

However, I do believe that many would like to pick what mech to play based on what map was voted on.
If that means long range mechs on Alpine, or all brawlers on Solaris, so be it.
No one should stop you (as you pointed out) from choosing what mech YOU want to play.

It's just that time and time again team balance is ruined because one team happened to have more players with the appropriate mech (by pure chance) for the chosen map than the other team.

Being able to choose what mech you want to bring AFTER the map has been voted on removes the not having the right mech for the map excuse.

And that is exactly what this game needs!

- No more potato loadouts!
- Hopefully more dedicated players instead of "Look at my TROLOLOLOL useless mech that is oh so FUN to me! I don't care that I take down the whole team with me!"

Runecarver, on 14 April 2023 - 10:11 PM, said:

So instead of fixing the fundamental design error with the Free Worlds Coliseum map where you have a dominating sniper ridge, the map maker lazily slapped down a dozen gigantic plateau pillars so that snipers with jump jets can get on top of those and be completely unreachable.

Well, have fun trying to fight against shadow cats or spiders on top of those as a short range or non jumping mech.

This game is circling the drain.

I tend to agree with that more and more sadly...

If they would just listen and make all those annoying camper spots OOB then we wouldn't have this mess!

BumbleBee, on 14 April 2023 - 10:55 PM, said:

Wait, please don't tell me you guys are actually going ahead with this.

Please leave QP as is and make a separate queue for "Dropship Mode", maybe even a checkbox if you want either, much like you have with the servers

Im not interested in respawn at all TBH

+1

Quote

Choosing the Mech for the map will just make the gameplay stale as people will only choose specialised builds, so there goes any variation

Might not be that bad, but might also cause long boring games that already happen sometimes without "Dropship Mode" in QP so who knows what will happen ?!

Orion_, on 15 April 2023 - 05:06 AM, said:

I don't have 30 minutes to sink into a match every time I play.

DAMN... then you might as well not play at all ?!

Quote

If they make DD for every match Ill barely be able to play unless it is a weekend.

Might not be a bad idea then!

Vellron2005, on 15 April 2023 - 07:18 AM, said:

RIP Coloseum

The new map ?!

If so, then I wouldn't mind that all !!!

C337Skymaster, on 15 April 2023 - 02:51 PM, said:

Really? First CASE, now Active Probe. Are you TRYING to make the Inner Sphere into Clans? When will the heresy end?!

Sorry, but I like it!

I feel like there is soo much unused tech in this game because it simply doesn't fit into a well built loadout...

When is the last time you used a "Targeting Computer MK IV" for example ?!
Things like Heavy Guass and Heavy PPC are also basically only for those who like to walk around in a big target box like the AWS-8Q or Fafnir 5/5B

Quote

Seriously, if you're gonna keep this crap up, just enable mixed tech and be done with it.

Hellooo Huntsman with Light PPC + TAG + Streak SRM2 SPAM to hunt Lights and cause awkward situations for a lot of Assaults

Quote

And I foresee the Marauder being equipped with 2x Gauss, 3x ERLL, and sitting on the back edge of the map dropping 4 strikes and sniping all match.

Like we don't have enough of those already ?!

Remember that player with a female nickname and 5 x ER LL the whole time ??
I am glad I don't see him/her anymore!

Steel Raven, on 15 April 2023 - 03:38 PM, said:

Players have been complaining it was messing with their frame rates.

While it looks nice, not noticable when people are shooting at you.

The potato PC's strike again!

Oh well...

C337Skymaster, on 15 April 2023 - 06:31 PM, said:

Secondly, if you keep turning half-ton equipment into whole-ton equipment (CASE: 0.5 > 0.0, now BAP: 1.5 > 1.0), how am I supposed to use up random half-tons of leftover weight?

JJ's where possible ?!

And if they change Laser AMS too then you could use one of those to fill your mech up!

C337Skymaster, on 16 April 2023 - 06:02 AM, said:

I'm right there with you on most of that. It's been getting crazier and crazier as the years have gone on. This game STARTED by trying to faithfully emulate all of the TT mechanics, and one by one, they all got shouted down by people who didn't appreciate their history, or abandoned by PGI for some glitch or other, rather than fixed to work properly (looking at you, knockdowns, and arm convergence).

- And a lot more... -

If they didn't do all those things then no one would be playing this game by now!

Current generation or maybe even generations of gamers by now are too lazy to explore new things sadly...
I even give tips to players during matches and while some accept it and be like "Thnx dude!" there are plenty of others who simply don't care or even get mad and insulting!

The easier, the better and companies only see $€$€$€$€ in their eyes so you can forget having TT stuff in MWO or any new MechWarrior related game IMHO

Reno Blade, on 16 April 2023 - 07:22 AM, said:

The problem could be, if it will be too much walking after losing your first mech, it won't be much of a gain.

Good luck getting multiple players to wait and attack the other team TOGETHER instead of getting shot dead 1 by 1 like they already do plenty of times in QP at the moment!

Quote

Faction Warfare
I think most of the biggest factor that prevents pugs from playing it, is the competive/meta and planning aspect of the Drop Deck.
You always have to get your "best" meta to be successful, and that's not always the fun that people search in the game. Therefor many play QP only.

You should ALWAYS use the best mech or the best loadout for a mech no matter the game mode!

Losing because of potato builds is no fun at all...

C337Skymaster, on 16 April 2023 - 12:14 PM, said:

Ooor, we could bring back delayed weapon convergence, and not make every weapon always hit exactly the same point on a 'mech no matter what, with the smallest possible amount of time actually spent looking at the target, because "gotta keep twisting".

To be honest I have caught myself on not even twisting anymore unless I am one of the mechs left near the end of the match and might turn a loss into a victory...

Horrible and sad... I know!

[sycocys]

Tarl Cabot, on 16 April 2023 - 10:58 AM, said:

XL equipped mechs still die w/1st destroyed ST vs Clan XL, and most Clan equipment take up fewer slots and weight less.

Now, I am all for PGI doing an overhaul on the XL/cXL/LFE, each having similar properties, including not instantly dying with the lost of 1st ST. XL would have the most speed reduction and higher heat spike/penalty, cXL would be the middle of the pack with LFE having the lower penalties (it already has the lowest weight savings). And by putting cXL in the middle of the pack, it would also reduce the heatspikes,w/ST loss while also increasing its revised speed.

Honestly the heat spike is pretty r-tarded. You lose half your engine (and engine sinks) as well as torso and arms that also probably have sinks - so 100% of that contained heat should be ejected with the components that were holding that heat. That heat isn't magically transferring to the remaining components.

[BLACKR0SE]

Old players do not tolerate any change, innovation, I understood this.

[W A R L O R D]

Matt Newman, on 14 April 2023 - 06:40 PM, said:

FYI "drop decks" in quickplay may only mean Respawning 4 times in the same mech.
Or it may mean bringing in 4 mechs and only choosing one.
or it may be like Faction play.
We are not sure exactly how it will be implemented at this time as it would be "mode" dependent and modes are voted on.

We will do our best to keep you informed.

I love it! Keep on innovating, Matt! There will always be a small percentage of players who constantly complain and will never be happy, no matter what PGI does. They will always find something to complain about. There will always be a feature, a game mode, a quirk, a map, an event, a Mech, a Mech that wasn’t included in the sale, the cost of something, not enough of this or too much of that, and they’ll say the game is ruined. They did it back in 2013 when I started playing and they’re still doing it 10 years later.

Edited by W A R L O R D, 16 April 2023 - 05:02 PM.

[Oidipus Prime]

Reverse the Fafnir hitbox changes!

[Voice of Kerensky]

Reno Blade, on 16 April 2023 - 07:22 AM, said:

You could even go as far as putting a 5% damage reduction for each Tier below Tier1 (e.g. Tier5 has 20% reduced dmg taken) to balance out new players.
Or even go as far as giving unskilled mechs (including trials) another 5% on top.

Well, yes, it's a good idea for some old and very strong player to create an alternative account for himself and go under the guise of a new player with all these bonuses in the game.
It will be verry fun for real beginners to play with such a "newbie".
And that is exactly what will happen. Unfortunately, there are a lot of perverted sadists among the strong players in this game.
PGI already let them kill the FP, now they are killing the QP.

W A R L O R D, on 16 April 2023 - 04:55 PM, said:

There will always be a small percentage of players who constantly complain and will never be happy, no matter what PGI does.

Strangely, a "small percentage of players" here left more negative feedback on the idea of introducing drop decks into a quick game, while a "higher percentage" left less positive feedback on the idea.
Perhaps you are confusing the minority (which you obviously belong to) with the majority? Is it possible that exactly the majority of players didn't like this idea?

[C337Skymaster]

Roodkapje, on 16 April 2023 - 01:40 PM, said:

I feel like there is soo much unused tech in this game because it simply doesn't fit into a well built loadout...

When is the last time you used a "Targeting Computer MK IV" for example ?!
Things like Heavy Guass and Heavy PPC are also basically only for those who like to walk around in a big target box like the AWS-8Q or Fafnir 5/5B

I use a TC4 every time I take a Warhawk A or B out for a spin, or any other Clan 'mech with between 15 and 20 tons of direct-fire weaponry which incorporates a Targeting Computer. TC5 for 20.5-25 tons of Clan direct-fire, and on 'mechs whose stock build is supposed to include a C3 Master Computer (at the moment, just Shugo, the Hatamoto Chi hero).

Roodkapje, on 16 April 2023 - 01:40 PM, said:

To be honest I have caught myself on not even twisting anymore unless I am one of the mechs left near the end of the match and might turn a loss into a victory...

Horrible and sad... I know!

Yeah, me too. But you know that, even when they don't say it, anything that seems like it's coming out of the blue is coming from these "Cauldron" jokers, who are the absolute elite of the elite, and look at this game in a complete vacuum, with little regard for what it's supposed to be simulating, and THEY twist, and prefer all the Pinpoint Front Loaded Damage weapons so they can fire as they twist past their target, without stopping to aim, and either have such good eyesight, or such good computers, that they can time their trigger pull to when they're just passing over the component they want to shoot (ears are a big one), so they can take full advantage of engine weaknesses by carving the side torsos off in one or two shots, while we poor plebeians have barely scratched their paint.

Thus much weeping and gnashing of teeth at the weakness that is the IS XL engine.

Edited by C337Skymaster, 16 April 2023 - 06:24 PM.

[C337Skymaster]

As much as I take advantage of Ghost Heat exception quirks, I'm starting to think that those limits were imposed specifically with some of those 'mechs in mind, even though they are the stock builds, and granting them exceptions is just pushing power creep too far. I'm thinking of Awesomes with 3x Heavy PPCs, King Crabs with 2x AC/20, 3x SNPPC, any Clan 'mech with 2x UAC/20 (although the jam on those is such that I'm not too afraid of them so long as I don't get surprised by one at less than 100 meters). The exceptions for lasers and Gauss/PPC, in particular, feel like they're getting a little out of control.

[W A R L O R D]

Voice of Kerensky, on 16 April 2023 - 06:05 PM, said:

Well, yes, it's a good idea for some old and very strong player to create an alternative account for himself and go under the guise of a new player with all these bonuses in the game.
It will be verry fun for real beginners to play with such a "newbie".
And that is exactly what will happen. Unfortunately, there are a lot of perverted sadists among the strong players in this game.
PGI already let them kill the FP, now they are killing the QP.


Strangely, a "small percentage of players" here left more negative feedback on the idea of introducing drop decks into a quick game, while a "higher percentage" left less positive feedback on the idea.
Perhaps you are confusing the minority (which you obviously belong to) with the majority? Is it possible that exactly the majority of players didn't like this idea?

And?? You’re proving my point: There will always be a small minority of individuals that will never be happy with anything that PGI does. How you came to the conclusion that I was in that minority, is utterly confusing.

Whether PGI decides to implement drop decks or not, will not change whether I play the game or not. Some individuals have commented saying they will no longer play the game if drop decks are implemented or comments like “this game is circling the drain”. Those are the small minority who will never be happy. Are YOU part of that small minority that will never be happy?

Edited by W A R L O R D, 16 April 2023 - 07:14 PM.

[Voice of Kerensky]

W A R L O R D, on 16 April 2023 - 07:13 PM, said:

And??

And I'm saying that you have an absolutely wrong idea about the concepts of majority and minority.
If there are more people "against" than "for", then those speaking "against" cannot be called a minority, because they are the majority.
It seems to me that this is quite logical, and it is foolish to deny it. Although you can try. You have already convinced yourself of this, as I see.

Edited by Voice of Kerensky, 16 April 2023 - 10:47 PM.

[C337Skymaster]

Curccu, on 16 April 2023 - 01:21 PM, said:

And Mech Warrior 1-4 which pretty much all had different systems and mechanics? If new players cannot comprehend there are small differences in different games then mech building games are out of their grasp

How many people have access to those games, anymore?

More to the point, however: MWO doesn't have a PvE component. MW5 doesn't have a PvP component. Why? Because they were meant to be that for each other. Meaning they're meant to compare much more closely to each other. Keeping equipment the same is a key component to that.

[C337Skymaster]

Matt Newman, on 14 April 2023 - 06:40 PM, said:

FYI "drop decks" in quickplay may only mean Respawning 4 times in the same mech.
Or it may mean bringing in 4 mechs and only choosing one.
or it may be like Faction play.
We are not sure exactly how it will be implemented at this time as it would be "mode" dependent and modes are voted on.

We will do our best to keep you informed.

Oh, chiming in on this whole "drop deck in QP" or "pre-match 'mech selection" idea: Matt, a much more "balanced" approach to something like this (which technically should only be available to Omnimechs, but "balance" and all that), is not to allow the selection of different 'mechs before the game drops, but to be able to use the "save/load loadout" 'mechlab feature in the loading screen. Once the match loads, players can load a pre-saved build that they saved on THAT chassis (MAD-4H with LRMs or SRMs, depending on the map, for example, or Atlas with ERPPC/Gauss, or AC/20/SRM, etc, but always that MAD-4H, because that's what they dropped in, or always their AS7-D, because that's what they dropped in).

I think it'll be easier to implement, and it'll help cut down on the straight up abuse that system will take, otherwise.

I've been toying with the idea for this system for a year or two, now, but it was originally intended to reflect the flexibility of Omnimechs, and the rigidity of Battlemechs, that an Omnimech can be quickly reconfigured in the drop ship above a planet, or in a Forward Operating Base between skirmishes, and a Battlemech cannot. It was also supposed to provide justification for PGI to add IS Omnis.

Edited by C337Skymaster, 17 April 2023 - 01:30 AM.

[BLACKR0SE]

why are you throwing new players away?
Which one will be easier for a new player?
random machines and maps?
Or compatible machines?
I think the only problem with the old players here is to maintain their rank.

Edited by TAMTAMBABY, 17 April 2023 - 02:18 AM.

[BLACKR0SE]

I hope there will be longer wars. more tense wars, more chaos. I love chaos.

It was very nice to increase the armor of all the machines in the event, it had been a long war with the Atlas.

[BLACKR0SE]

The only problem with Faction Play in my opinion is the long waiting time.
If this time does not exist, everyone enters and plays as they enter the normal game.
I think they should focus on reducing this time.
In addition, the menu structure is complex.

Edited by TAMTAMBABY, 17 April 2023 - 02:43 AM.

[BLACKR0SE]

random faction matches are ridiculous.
all those logos, flags, crests are losing their value.


I'm fighting for this faction today.
for the other tomorrow.
that's ridiculous.
is losing its value.

Edited by TAMTAMBABY, 17 April 2023 - 02:50 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

This is a good change if it really is lostech to just alter heat vision so it doesnt work as sniper vision on hot maps.

• Changed map heat settings to from 0.15 to 0.0 (Mechs are not visible on thermal vision after 700m)

All you have to do is make it so map heat doesnt affect thermal vision background shade, make it black past 700m on ALL maps, regardless of temperature, but if you cant do that then you should apply this 'fix' to literally every single hot map (both TTs, Tourmaline, Rubellite, Vitric Station and Caustic Valley, plus Sulphureous Rift and Vitric Forge in FP).

It would be a bit of a shame to lose the variation in cooling, but its totally effing stupid for heat vision to work as sniper vision on some maps.

If its a problem on TT Crucible, its just as much of a problem on the other hot maps.

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 17 April 2023 - 03:26 AM.

[W A R L O R D]

Lockheed_, on 16 April 2023 - 07:34 PM, said:

And there will always be a small percentage who gets so desperate by others having opposing views they will try to gaslight them into believing they are in the minority, or trying to invalidate them, portraying them as the "always unhappy". Are YOU part of that small minority? Yes you surely are!

Im not sure who I would be trying to gaslight…In your original post, IIRC, everything you highlighted was a complaint about the game. If it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck…you’re a complainer. So my advice to you would be: If you’re looking for something that’s just “mindless” or whatever you called it, just try and enjoy whatever iteration the game takes on. I don’t agree with everything PGI does, or all the recommendations and balancing changes from the Cauldron, but I don’t go around making sweeping statements like “If PGI does this…then I’m NEVER coming back.” If you don’t like the direction of the game, you always have the option of not playing anymore. That’s all I have to say about this conversation.

GLHF o7 - and may your dmg be higher than your ping