101 replies to this topic

[An6ryMan69]

Easily one of the worst patches ever.

Literally every single nerf here hits some of my favorite mechs.

Mauler in literature is supposed the be only very slightly less tough than an Atlas...

Lucky I barely play anymore, and this kind of thing is why.

Plenty of other games that don't stick it to players with endless nerf roulette, clearly tha's where people should be....

[w0qj]

I'm looking forward to playing the Mauler after this March patch!

It's got a DPS buff

[GargoyleVine]

legendary Vulture, a good ballistic slot and missile slots xtra armour quirks no omni-pods, delay the patch

[LavaDa1shi]

An6ryMan69, on 15 March 2025 - 06:54 PM, said:

Easily one of the worst patches ever.

Literally every single nerf here hits some of my favorite mechs.

Mauler in literature is supposed the be only very slightly less tough than an Atlas...

Lucky I barely play anymore, and this kind of thing is why.

Plenty of other games that don't stick it to players with endless nerf roulette, clearly tha's where people should be....

The games been in an endless buff cycle for a while now I believe, imo it's about time they actually start nerfing overperformers for the health of the game, remember back years ago when having really good mounts instantly made a mech meta? Now quirks are the main thing that determines the viability of a mech in most cases, it's getting to the point where you see a mech and you're like "Oh their build is trash, I will destroy them" you start trading with the mech and it destroys you because it has like -50% cooldown.

Also I believe I can pretty definitively say that the Mauler change is a buff.
If it had similar survival to atlas it would be nuts imo
The mx90 comes to mind with really good mounts + god convergence and very good firepower
If it was also almost as tanky as an atlas it would be ridiculous imo.

avenger cannon, on 14 March 2025 - 07:20 PM, said:

What do you mean? They removed the durability

It lost structure for HUGE firepower buffs.
It's pretty easy to calculate the DPS buff

DPS of 6ac5 before = 21.426
DPS of 6ac5 after = 26.784

DPS of 6ac5 with skills before = 24.348
DPS of 6ac5 with skills after = 31.512

31dps is a lot, that's close to sovereign levels iirc
And then there's also the 5% range it's getting.
And since structure isn't as strong as armour it's not losing a lot of survival, I believe it's pretty definitively a buff.

Edited by LavaDa1shi, 15 March 2025 - 10:09 PM.

[Crashburn]

Little late seeing this post, but I just had to comment on this gem!

"We’ve kind of been slacking on updating the warhorns released for MC."

^ ROTFLMAO!! I believe the Dervish was the last warhorn released for MC. It's been so long that I couldn't remember when it came out and had to look up when that pack was released (2019). Six years ago.

Saying that's "kind of" slacking is the understatement of the decade! I'd almost say that phrase was worded intentionally to see if anybody would catch that undersell.

Full disclosure, I could be wrong, perhaps a warhorn or two have been released in the previous years since the Dervish. You'll have to forgive me though, I used to check periodically to see if they were for sale. After years of not seeing them for MC, nor ever getting an answer to the few times I posed the question in forum posts/discord, one tends to give up.

I guess the old adage applies here though....better late than never!

Still....kinda slacking?!.....

InnerSphereNews, on 14 March 2025 - 03:28 PM, said:

Note: We’ve kind of been slacking on updating thewarhorns released for MC. We are doing a large backlog of old warhorns andadding them all to the store for 750 MC. In the future, a mech pack, booster,or legend will have its warhorn released for 750 MC 8 months after the packreleases. Loyalty, reward, or prestige warhorns will not be released. Standingand hanging items from these packs will not be released. The warhorns that havebeen added to the ingame store for 750 MC this patch are Clan Gatlin, RetroMini, Retro Handheld, Cicada, American Thanksgiving, Stryker, Warden, Hunter,Predator, Bloodname, Crusader, Hatchetman, Moonwalker, Juggernaut, Dreadnaught,Scattershot, Arges, Seraph, Desperada, Howl, Gausszilla, Stone Crusher, StoneRhino, Scaleshot, War Emu, Warlord, Hashke, Abaddon, Blight, Gorewing, Onyx,Longbow, Aksum, Spitfire, Sovereign, Li Dok To, Red Reaper, Kasai, Black Hawk-KU,Bullshark, Ferroblast, Behemoth, and Argent.

Edited by Crashburn, 15 March 2025 - 10:08 PM.

[Ttly]

LavaDa1shi, on 15 March 2025 - 09:51 PM, said:

The games been in an endless buff cycle for a while now I believe, imo it's about time they actually start nerfing overperformers for the health of the game

Said overperformers:
Ballistic Sovereign (not touched this patch while the Maul is)
ECM Nightstar (actually nerfed this patch)
Stone Rhino (nerfed again already)
Bullshark (finally got its armor nerfed)
Sleipnir (4LB10 slow+glass build makes this kind of weird one to nerf, guess someone wanted people to run 4LB5 instead?)
HAG80 Maul (nerfed here too)
HAGzilla (killed with ammo quirk removal, back to 4GR Gzillas)
ACboat snipers the like of Bane and DWF-C (ECM) with UV arm pods (untouched and are already quirkless/low quirk for the most part)
Warlord (untouched, but what can you do other than nerf its armor right?)
War Emu (also untouched, still weird that they buffed its durability months ago even)

I'd say this patch while it could've been better (the medium laser Vulcan definitely needed to lose that flamer range and MG RoF quirk, and the Summoner CT pod quirk buffs is a weird decision rather than So8 buffs), is one of the better ones already in the balance decisions.
I'm kind of surprised that there's no Firemoth nerfs either, probably just testing how the FB Struct bugfix would impact it first before they do anything to it. Or just waiting for cbux release as usual.

Edited by Ttly, 15 March 2025 - 11:08 PM.

[LavaDa1shi]

Ttly, on 15 March 2025 - 10:36 PM, said:

Said overperformers:
Ballistic Sovereign (not touched this patch while the Maul is)
ECM Nightstar (actually nerfed this patch)
Stone Rhino (nerfed again already)
Bullshark (finally got its armor nerfed)
Sleipnir (4LB10 slow+glass build makes this kind of weird one to nerf, guess someone wanted people to run 4LB5 instead?)
HAG80 Maul (nerfed here too)
HAGzilla (killed with ammo quirk removal, back to 4GR Gzillas)
ACboat snipers the like of Bane and DWF-C (ECM) with UV arm pods (untouched and are already quirkless/low quirk for the most part)
Warlord (untouched, but what can you do other than nerf its armor right?)
War Emu (also untouched, still weird that they buffed its durability months ago even)

I'd say this patch while it could've been better (the medium laser Vulcan definitely needed to lose that flamer range and MG RoF quirk, and the Summoner CT pod quirk buffs is a weird decision rather than So8 buffs), is one of the better ones already in the balance decisions.

Slepnir does not run 4lb10, it's as you said a slow and fragile mech so no reason to brawl with it. You either do 4ac5 2lppc or 4uac5, or 2uac5+2uac10 if you wanna be chad, and those builds are very very strong, hence the nerf.

Gausszilla is already stronger with 4gauss 1erll then 2hag30 2gauss so by getting -10% more cooldown it's just being buffed imo so that's one of the few changes I disagree with.

ac2 dakka boats like the dire aren't overperformers imo because although they farm lots they are fragile gun boats and ac2s suck at killing things so they aren't that great for carrying your team or killing things, just farming dmg especially when compared to something like Gauss ERLL builds which are way better at carrying but don't farm nearly as much because lower DPS and SDPS.

The bane is much better at killing things then the dire because uac2s and it gets 9/10 of them, but it's way more fragile.

Edited by LavaDa1shi, 15 March 2025 - 11:33 PM.

[Ttly]

LavaDa1shi, on 15 March 2025 - 11:18 PM, said:

ac2 dakka boats like the dire aren't overperformers imo because although they farm lots they are fragile gun boats and ac2s suck at killing things so they aren't that great for carrying your team or killing things

The averages for WR, damage, and KDR doesn't seems to say that. With the BANE-1 having them at like 52%, 514, and 1.22, which is the upper end for assaults.
And the BANE-6 trailing not too far behind (I'm surprised it's behind seeing that it has ECM even) at 51%, 485, and 1.18.
No real stats for the 8AC2 DWF-C since it's muddled with people running other builds on it since the UV arm pods aren't as accessible so the BANE-6's will have to do.

Edited by Ttly, 16 March 2025 - 12:17 AM.

[Wraith 1]

I'm excited to try these balance changes, but some of them are very questionable...

...I mean honestly, the high ground was already incredibly overpowered, did it really need a buff?

[LavaDa1shi]

Ttly, on 16 March 2025 - 12:09 AM, said:

The averages for WR, damage, and KDR doesn't seems to say that. With the BANE-1 having them at like 52%, 514, and 1.22, which is the upper end for assaults.
And the BANE-6 trailing not too far behind (I'm surprised it's behind seeing that it has ECM even) at 51%, 485, and 1.18.
No real stats for the 8AC2 DWF-C since it's muddled with people running other builds on it since the UV arm pods aren't as accessible so the BANE-6's will have to do.

The avg player stats aren't the best way to gauge a mech imo, actually playing it and testing it is.

1v1 a ac2 dire or bane vs a Gauss ERLL dire, or an ac5 annihilator, a poptart like an erppc exe.
ac2s generally will lose.

Now 1v1s aren't the best gauge for QP but I think it can offer some insight, ac2s with lots of range + high dps farm people who run around in the open very easily, but because of their lower alpha they are one of the easiest types of builds in the game to counter.

I am not saying they are bad at all, I mean the majority of QP players are people who run around in the open and get farmed which is why ac2s perform well, but they are weapons for farming low skill players, any decent player with any of the many counters should easily counter an ac2 dire or bane in a game.

It's why they're very rare in comp, they're terrible against good players and in comp you only go against good players.
Now yes comp doesn't directly transfer to QP, but I am not saying it's bad in comp so it's bad in QP, but I believe comp can help reveal it's weaknesses and act as insight if that makes any sense.

Also as a note people run builds other then uac2s on the banes 1 and 6, like the 14 pac2 bane 1 lots of people like to run. I personally primarily run hagvom on my Bane 6 because I believes it carrys games better, and also shielding with the big arms is really important for the Bane imo because of how fragile it is.

Edited by LavaDa1shi, 16 March 2025 - 01:34 AM.

[Samziel]

Martaloc, on 15 March 2025 - 11:03 AM, said:

This is not omnimech, battlemech, so much worse because you cant use the other Mad Dog omnipods to this.
So you understand better, just like the Howl Madcat is battlemech too, Sigma is non omnimech either, just a battlemech.
So you stuck forever with only 2 energyhardpoints on it. No other weapon hardpoints on Sigma.............

Where do you get the battlemech from? The picture literally has the omnipods tab on the right and you can see the omnipod selection on top of each component. It's an omnimech. Revenant CT and 1/2 Sigma ST will make for nice laservomit.

The duration quirk is interesting and feels a bit overdone. It's like a jumping faster Duelist. But at the same time its just 2 HLL, Arctic Cheetah can do that. We'll see after patch.

Martaloc, on 15 March 2025 - 03:26 AM, said:

.Of course zero minus energy heatquirk because this is a clanmech, cant be better as an IS mech , we know.

At least for SO8 it doesnt need any heatquirks. Doesnt need many heatsinks to keep firing 24/7.

Edited by Samziel, 16 March 2025 - 01:25 AM.

[Tronnus]

The RFL-LK gets Increased cooldown to -20% (from -10%) for his removed -10% LBx cooldown but the poor liitle RFL-DB does not get extra cooldown for his removed -5% STD AC cooldown.

[KursedVixen]

LavaDa1shi, on 16 March 2025 - 01:13 AM, said:

The avg player stats aren't the best way to gauge a mech imo, actually playing it and testing it is.

1v1 a ac2 dire or bane vs a Gauss ERLL dire, or an ac5 annihilator, a poptart like an erppc exe.
ac2s generally will lose.

Now 1v1s aren't the best gauge for QP but I think it can offer some insight, ac2s with lots of range + high dps farm people who run around in the open very easily, but because of their lower alpha they are one of the easiest types of builds in the game to counter.

I am not saying they are bad at all, I mean the majority of QP players are people who run around in the open and get farmed which is why ac2s perform well, but they are weapons for farming low skill players, any decent player with any of the many counters should easily counter an ac2 dire or bane in a game.

It's why they're very rare in comp, they're terrible against good players and in comp you only go against good players.
Now yes comp doesn't directly transfer to QP, but I am not saying it's bad in comp so it's bad in QP, but I believe comp can help reveal it's weaknesses and act as insight if that makes any sense.

Also as a note people run builds other then uac2s on the banes 1 and 6, like the 14 pac2 bane 1 lots of people like to run. I personally primarily run hagvom on my Bane 6 because I believes it carrys games better, and also shielding with the big arms is really important for the Bane imo because of how fragile it is.

Devs rarely play anymore. The cauldron made up of mostly high tier players do all the balancing suggestions now...

[BlueDevilspawn]

Feezou, on 15 March 2025 - 01:04 PM, said:

The JJ STs won’t help, since the mad dog has fragile STs. It gets its tanky laservom reputation from the C side torsos which give +25 armor. These only have +10, so I don’t think they will be particularly useful for laservom builds. You’re still gonna be using the low mounts in the ct/arms.

Yes but I wouldn’t build a lasvom with 4JJ. I’d take 1 torso and keep the other tanky one. Fluttering JJs along with existing survival would be perfectly fine and arguably a buff with the new mobility options. I would only take all 4JJ if I were making a 2 ERPPC 8 ERuL poptart, and in that case less survival is offset by low exposure playstyle.

[Cheeks Akimbo]

Had to read everything a few times but the patch seems good to me.

Always happy to get some more versatility out of the ever reliable Mad Dog.

Commando is still a beast of a zombie.
Grasshopper getting the JJ buff my beloved.
Slightly confused by Grand summoner buffs, but I'm very excited to see what I can do with those E variant shoulders now!

It's not unwelcome getting the numbers evened out but what the story with the change to Catapult and Thunderbolt structure?

Mauler concerned me at first as it's always lacking survivability, but honestly those are some strong buffs for it's TTK considering the mounts and (I think?) somewhat recent torso pitch and yaw buffs.

[Steel Raven]

Mad Dog Sigma is a 60 ton mech that has only two hard points, it's only selling point is one the insane quirk and we all know it will be eventually nerfed... and you want real money for it.. oof.

[simon1812]

the mad dog sigma seems....rather lack luster.

also: no melee in this update.

[BlueDevilspawn]

Cheeks Akimbo, on 16 March 2025 - 09:12 AM, said:

Had to read everything a few times but the patch seems good to me.

Always happy to get some more versatility out of the ever reliable Mad Dog.

Commando is still a beast of a zombie.
Grasshopper getting the JJ buff my beloved.
Slightly confused by Grand summoner buffs, but I'm very excited to see what I can do with those E variant shoulders now!

It's not unwelcome getting the numbers evened out but what the story with the change to Catapult and Thunderbolt structure?

Mauler concerned me at first as it's always lacking survivability, but honestly those are some strong buffs for it's TTK considering the mounts and (I think?) somewhat recent torso pitch and yaw buffs.

The Grand Summoner buffs were for two purposes - 1) get more out of the so8 for the P and C and 2) enable dakka combo builds for those using a single E torso. Jumping missile and ERPPC/apg builds were already more than viable, but dakka lacked the tonnage for adequate alpha or ammo.

Mauler hitboxes/geo have always been easy to pick apart so losing survival HP that would be gone quickly anyway in exchange for massive glass cannon offensive quirks was a reorientation of the mech’s capabilities.

[LavaDa1shi]

KursedVixen, on 16 March 2025 - 04:47 AM, said:

Devs rarely play anymore. The cauldron made up of mostly high tier players do all the balancing suggestions now...

Yes I know, where did you get the idea that I don't know that?

[LavaDa1shi]

Steel Raven, on 16 March 2025 - 10:44 AM, said:

Mad Dog Sigma is a 60 ton mech that has only two hard points, it's only selling point is one the insane quirk and we all know it will be eventually nerfed... and you want real money for it.. oof.

It's selling point is jjs and side torso energy, it's an omni mech so you can mix the side torsos with other omnipods for laservomit.
The Mad Dog was already probably the tankiest clan laservom heavy, now with jjs it's even tankier, and it has better mounts for the HLLs in the side torsos instead if the arms.

Edited by LavaDa1shi, 16 March 2025 - 11:35 AM.