227 replies to this topic

[Rejarial Galatan]

FireNova, on 02 August 2012 - 07:19 AM, said:

Interesting....does your "equal faction rights" include the Jaguars as well I take it?

*senses another double standard about.....*

Aside from that I do agree that Clans need to be playable. All this "entitlement canon" and Clan/SJ hater rage really cannot be allowed to dominate the game. Im pretty sure its mostly the old school IS fanboys that are raging like never before simply because they do not want a challenge of any kind from anyone and just want to be handed victories to gloat over.

Seriously, the Inner Sphere old school players wanting this game to be chained to the past is just......silly......to say the least.

All Clans should be playable, even the Jags! As a die hard Wolf, even I want to see all of us who favor one Clan or the other get to suit up in his or her favorite Clans! As I said: Equal Faction Rights!

[Thorn Hallis]

FireNova, on 02 August 2012 - 07:19 AM, said:

Im pretty sure its mostly the old school IS fanboys that are raging like never before simply because they do not want a challenge of any kind from anyone and just want to be handed victories to gloat over.

You know, the same could be said about the Clan fanboys that want the Clans to be as OP as in canon. Not looking for a challenge and easy victories to gloat over.

[Iain wolf]

I do hpe the clans are made playable i´d love to play as elemeantal (Toad) or later IS eqivelant scout suit´s

[Geminus]

I'm Clan from the table top days. i'm clan because I always hated the inner sphere politics and ways of waging war. I like the clan philosophies. When I can be clan, I will be clan, Because until then i'm playing as my enemy.
As far as balance, I have faith in them. But, the inner sphere does create new tech and they do make tech that the clans don't have like C3 and TAG. And just as I choose clan, other players will choose the houses. Also they could always go for the option of clan tech salvage, and lets not overlook the option to open up Comstar.

I do think the best balance idea is leave the tech exactly as it is. Do maches as 2 stars vs 3 lances (10 v 12) or 1 Star vs 2 lances (5 vs 8), something to that effect. The true clan players are clan for the ideals, not the tech. Clans fight with honor, Clans fight with the fewest number they need. If you find the idea of always being outnumberred despite the tech upgrade, then clan is not for you.

Edited by Geminus, 04 August 2012 - 01:57 AM.

[Sephlock]

It woulda been cool as hell to have them as PvE enemies though.

I still remember back in MW2: Mercs, when I tried playing in a managed universe- the clanners just stayed outside the city and waited for us, then ripped us to pieces as we struggled to close. IS tech was just no match...

Granted, the fact that I was limited to a cruddy mech might have had something to do with it, but still .

[Abagnatius]

I have not read the whole topic, but balancing the clans to IS has been one of the dominant questions here afaik.

That is quite easy actually: Not being a TT master I still heard of that battle value of single mechs. 1 Atlas is 4 times as heavy as a Commando but not 4 times as battle-valuable. If we were so wise to move away from the notion that both teams HAVE to have the same number of Mechs and allow 10 vs 12 battles for example (or 9 vs 12, 8 vs 11 etc.) the clan balancing issue would dissipate automatically.
Since that is not likely to happen (1 lance = 4 mechs, 3 lances = 12 mechs and basta) there is something else: the clans are organized in stars of 5 mechs. Now: A logical clan vs IS battle would be 3 or 4 lances against 2 stars for example. 10 vs 12 or 10 vs 16 (depending on the battle value of the mechs) would be the way to go in my opinion once the clans arrive.
Since that will be in roughly 1 year Russ and his friends have a lot of time to iron things out, and they will find a usable solution. If you take preorders on clan mechs, Russ, please write down mine of 1 Mad Cat, 1 Uller and 1 Daishi.

[Xathanael]

Gridian, on 04 August 2012 - 02:04 AM, said:

I have not read the whole topic, but balancing the clans to IS has been one of the dominant questions here afaik.

That is quite easy actually: Not being a TT master I still heard of that battle value of single mechs. 1 Atlas is 4 times as heavy as a Commando but not 4 times as battle-valuable. If we were so wise to move away from the notion that both teams HAVE to have the same number of Mechs and allow 10 vs 12 battles for example (or 9 vs 12, 8 vs 11 etc.) the clan balancing issue would dissipate automatically.
Since that is not likely to happen (1 lance = 4 mechs, 3 lances = 12 mechs and basta) there is something else: the clans are organized in stars of 5 mechs. Now: A logical clan vs IS battle would be 3 or 4 lances against 2 stars for example. 10 vs 12 or 10 vs 16 (depending on the battle value of the mechs) would be the way to go in my opinion once the clans arrive.
Since that will be in roughly 1 year Russ and his friends have a lot of time to iron things out, and they will find a usable solution. If you take preorders on clan mechs, Russ, please write down mine of 1 Mad Cat, 1 Uller and 1 Daishi.

Gridian, on 04 August 2012 - 02:04 AM, said:

I have not read the whole topic, but balancing the clans to IS has been one of the dominant questions here afaik.

That is quite easy actually: Not being a TT master I still heard of that battle value of single mechs. 1 Atlas is 4 times as heavy as a Commando but not 4 times as battle-valuable. If we were so wise to move away from the notion that both teams HAVE to have the same number of Mechs and allow 10 vs 12 battles for example (or 9 vs 12, 8 vs 11 etc.) the clan balancing issue would dissipate automatically.
Since that is not likely to happen (1 lance = 4 mechs, 3 lances = 12 mechs and basta) there is something else: the clans are organized in stars of 5 mechs. Now: A logical clan vs IS battle would be 3 or 4 lances against 2 stars for example. 10 vs 12 or 10 vs 16 (depending on the battle value of the mechs) would be the way to go in my opinion once the clans arrive.
Since that will be in roughly 1 year Russ and his friends have a lot of time to iron things out, and they will find a usable solution. If you take preorders on clan mechs, Russ, please write down mine of 1 Mad Cat, 1 Uller and 1 Daishi.

If they go on a 1:1 timescale, as they have been, then the MAIN bulk of the invasion would begin in March 2013

[FireNova]

Thorn Hallis, on 04 August 2012 - 01:17 AM, said:

You know, the same could be said about the Clan fanboys that want the Clans to be as OP as in canon. Not looking for a challenge and easy victories to gloat over.

True. But no matter how powerful the weapons/tech might be for the Clans, it will still be meaningless if the Clans are just handed IS worlds in a planetary/competitive setting. Seriously, if I were so much as to see CSJ or any Clan being handed DC or other IS worlds without so much as lifting a finger to make any kind of effort from the Clan playerbase..... I would be seriously disappointed in this game as a whole. This is why following canon completely and to the letter T just cannot stand......otherwise.....who would care or even try for that matter?! Its like saying that someone who got a government check/handout for life would then start looking for a job.....

Entitlement canon for EITHER side will be disastrous and will only lead to a very quick end for this game. If planets/rewards/mechs is just handed out automatically via written "canon policy" then very few if anyone would even play......because the outcome for battles will be known to anyone who even bothers to look up the established "Catalyst lore", player competition would dry up faster than a small business would go OUT of business due to the many government regulations in place, and complete removal of factions like Clan Smoke Jaguar and St. Ives without letting the players have a say in it would only create uncertainty about factions and discourage free choice when it comes to what faction to choose to play as (because god forbid not everyone wants to play as the Successor States or the more popular Clan playerbase juggernauts like the Wolves, Falcons, or Bears.....some would like ComStar/Word of Blake for crying out loud or maybe the Periphery realms/states).

Goonswarm has taken that first step towards challenging the status quo and after listening to that one No Guts No Galaxy podcast #36 episode, I PRAY that they REALLY shake things up when it comes to challenging Davion dominance/authority in the game....maybe even give House Marik players a reason not to be so bored/disinterested in the game. FRR players are furiously wanting to change the fate of its faction or at the LEAST give Clan players a challenge instead of being the "punching bag of the year" faction. I myself would like to see my comrades in ~SJ~ along with other SJ players determine the destiny of Clan Smoke Jaguar during Operations Bulldog/Serpent instead of being rejected out of the game entirely and unable to participate on a competitive basis. Im sure St. Ives followers would like to be able to play as St. Ives and (with a bit of Davion help obviously) try to preserve the breakaway state and keep it from being completely absorbed by the legions of SQUAAAAAAAAAAAK.

BattleTech/MechWarrior just has too much potential to be tapped into to simply throw away just for the sake of "following canon". Its time to let players have a say in the game and determine the fate of the factions that they are passionate about.

[pseudolife]

balance of the games mechanics is going to be hard enough, and i honestly dont think they can or will. but im more interested in how they plan to balance the playerbase, or rather since they cant, what theyre going to do about it. Im thinking of a disastrous POS of an MMO called the old republic. ie, if factions arent roughly equal, how does matchmaking work? I spose have multiple factions will eliminate this problem a bit. but is anyone thinking about what the meta game will be like when there are 2 clanners for every IS?

i know theres a poll that shows the "what are you gonna pick" sides being pretty equal, but thats just people on the forum currently, imagine youre a new player after the game has launced, your dont really know a whole lot about BT, you examine the stats for each sides tech. which one are you going to choose?

[Toothman]

Enig, on 28 July 2012 - 01:27 PM, said:

Where do you guys crawl out of? How can you not love the Clans? Everything they do is for the greater good.

They are born in cans. They don't like girls. If they can't have a fight totally in their favor they whine and cry like spoiled children. Nothing to be proud of there.

[Cargo]

Clans, IS, Other mercs? Who cares just gimme somethin' to shoot at! **winks**

[Kodiak Jorgensson]

Toothman, on 04 August 2012 - 11:06 AM, said:

They are born in cans. They don't like girls. If they can't have a fight totally in their favor they whine and cry like spoiled children. Nothing to be proud of there.

better then playing for a faction that mindlessly destroyed there infastructure and then wonders why there technology sucks.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Lostech

[Beazle]

Kodiak Jorgensson, on 04 August 2012 - 06:24 PM, said:

better then playing for a faction that mindlessly destroyed there infastructure and then wonders why there technology sucks.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Lostech

Absolutely correct.

A society where children are raised to kill their own comrades (even siblings) for personal advancement, and devaules anybody who isn't willing/able to do so is OBVIOUSLY better than one where people fight and die for their country/beliefs.

I mean seriously, leadership by personal combat is much superior to any sort of silly democracy, republic, or feudal system.

Of course, the innersphere does have sarcasm...

[IceSerpent]

Beazle, on 04 August 2012 - 08:48 PM, said:

Absolutely correct.

A society where children are raised to kill their own comrades (even siblings) for personal advancement, and devaules anybody who isn't willing/able to do so is OBVIOUSLY better than one where people fight and die for their country/beliefs.

I mean seriously, leadership by personal combat is much superior to any sort of silly democracy, republic, or feudal system.

Of course, the innersphere does have sarcasm...

I think your sarcasm would work better if you used something that's actually different between Clans and IS. In the lore people on both sides killed their siblings and people on both sides fought for their country/beliefs. Also, feudal system didn't seem to have a clear advantage over "leadership by personal combat" scheme - both were fairly inefficient.

[Jaroth Corbett]

Toothman, on 04 August 2012 - 11:06 AM, said:

They are born in cans. They don't like girls. If they can't have a fight totally in their favor they whine and cry like spoiled children. Nothing to be proud of there.

Do you realize how stupid that sounds? First off, warriors couple A LOT, so sorry, but the males do like girls & vice versa. If you knew anything about the Clans you would know they prefer the fight to be in favor of the enemy. Winning against considerable odds is the Clan way. LOTS to be proud of there. Try reading first. You save yourself the embarrassment of making nonsensical posts.

[SakuranoSenshi]

SRS BSNS, y'all.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Jaroth Winson, on 04 August 2012 - 09:13 PM, said:

Do you realize how stupid that sounds? First off, warriors couple A LOT, so sorry, but the males do like girls & vice versa. If you knew anything about the Clans you would know they prefer the fight to be in favor of the enemy. Winning against considerable odds is the Clan way. LOTS to be proud of there. Try reading first. You save yourself the embarrassment of making nonsensical posts.

a trueborn may couple on occasion but there is this feeling about that which is 'born by natural methods' to be, less than viable. i will leave this up to your imagination to finish this race.

[IceSerpent]

Rejarial Galatan, on 04 August 2012 - 09:50 PM, said:

a trueborn may couple on occasion but there is this feeling about that which is 'born by natural methods' to be, less than viable. i will leave this up to your imagination to finish this race.

Can somebody...uhm...translate this into english? I gather that it has something to do with trueborn/freeborn, but can't figure out what exactly is being said, especially the "finish the race" part.

[Rejarial Galatan]

warning: explicit and touchy material follows this warning.

trueborn: born of genetic engineering, bred from the finest genetic material a clan has to offer. built to be the best warrior possible.

trashborn/freeborn: born by natural means after the act of coupling.

the race to the finish part? well, if a trueborn clan warrior feels that being a "freeborn" is a BAD thing, what exactly do you think they would do with the pregnancy? It is an act that I believe is best NOT said on this forum, as the views are polarized to one side or the other, and no good can come of me saying its actual name.

[SakuranoSenshi]

Talking around abortion is far worse than just saying it. It's not that big a deal and for those who feel it is, well, too bad, this is fiction and you're the minority opinion in reality too. Sorry.

Anyway, as eventually posted above albeit with much silliness, the Clans look down on natural birth, at least when it comes to their warrior caste and frequently terminate pregnancies that feel would lead to unsuitable offspring.