558 replies to this topic

[3Xtr3m3]

One of the reasons I most love the Black Hawk/Nova is the fact that I figure my cockpit is about knee high on an Atlas. So either I am gonna totaly shoot his knee out from under him, or he is gonna knee me right in the cockpit.

Sounds dirty when you put it like that. (shrugs) War Is Dirty.

[Polymorphyne]

I don't mind the mech staying alive once it loses a leg- I just take exception to it remaining upright in 99% of situations with only one leg.
Also, falling to the ground from losing a leg should do alot of damage to your mech.

[Cur]

Legging was never dishonerable.


It was moreso the people that would leg you, then run off , leaving you lying on the ground (or limping like a crippled penguin) while more combat ensued elsewhere, is dishonerable.


The two seem to have got tied together at some point.





Point being, Legging is a valid gameplay tactic, but some people like to be jerks and deliberately cause you grief for a laugh.

There should be something in place that encourages the person whom decides to leg to finish off their victim rather than make them sit there twiddling their thumbs for 5mins or loose points from suiciding/ejecting to get back into the game.

[Wyzak]

Cur, on 26 February 2012 - 02:06 PM, said:

Point being, Legging is a valid gameplay tactic, but some people like to be jerks and deliberately cause you grief for a laugh.

There should be something in place that encourages the person whom decides to leg to finish off their victim rather than make them sit there twiddling their thumbs for 5mins or loose points from suiciding/ejecting to get back into the game.

Best way to do this is make sure a legged mech still presents a threat. If we're in an open field and you have no mountains or buildings to hide behind, and I have a Gauss rifle and cause my mech to sit up after legged, you better finish me off. In the books the mech pilots crawl using their arms or weapon barrels but almost invariable plug up or damage their arm weapons in the process of doing so, and deliver the killshot with some small weapon in the head or chest. Must be a way to represent this potentiality without an overabundance of "Immortal Warrior" style comebacks.

[Rastan]

gosh, it's been like 8 years since I played a MW game, I guess im a "legger" dont remember all the hatred back then but it was very effective.

If they allow you to take out a mech by blowing one of it's legs off.. I shall be.. um.. LEGGING.

Don't be hating cause my Medium mech took out your 100 ton behemoth, everyones got legs fairs fair.

[Corwin Maxwell]

Personally i think alls fair in love and war...and you should use every tactic/trick to your advantage. Do you really think any mech warrior vet from the novels/stories if they were real life people. would argue against "legging".

[M4NTiC0R3X]

Regardless of the age of this thread - I saw a new post on the headlines

the legs - Two heavily armored targets <- Beam to the knee

the cockpit - Weak spot <- Target acquired

Which would you rather have a 1080 pic of?

[LimiterOne]

Well... I'm going to shoot your arm off if given the chance, why NOT shoot your leg? If you show me a vital part I'm going to shoot it, period, because it's combat. Legging might be frowned upon, but at the end of the day you're ejecting because your mech isn't viable in combat because I blew out your knee actuators.
As for it being honorable or not, it's not like I'm shooting YOU with an autocannon as you lay writihing in pain. That's not cool. But I'll turn your mech into swiss cheese, while you watch.
Go cry to your commander if you don't like it.

Peace (through superior firepower)

LO

[Captain Red Shirt]

was playing the original mechwarrior a little while ago, yes you can shoot their leg out and they fell, used this in a 1v2 mission, granted the one with one leg could still fire at me since i didn't move

that being said, if you have working jump jets and you make it a little hard to shoot out a leg, you should be able to fly in short bursts or at least stand on one leg (although moving will be a slight issue, again jump jets)

Edited by Captain Red Shirt, 06 March 2012 - 10:17 PM.

[SilentWolff]

[Fluffinator]

You can function just fine with 2 legs missing

Edited by Fluffinator, 07 March 2012 - 02:29 AM.

[Kiyoshi Amaya]

SilentWolff, on 06 March 2012 - 10:23 PM, said:

It's supposed to be a leg, not a horse! And no, I don't want to see legless mechs on horses!

[Victor Morson]

mwhighlander, on 02 February 2012 - 02:35 PM, said:

MechWarrior: Living Legends : Unfortunately, I have not been able to play this title, so my knowledge is limited. From what I do know is "legging" is still generally frowned upon. Also, there is no 'mechlab from my knowledge so which ever config you select, you cannot allocate or distribute additional armor. What you see is what you get. If someone else could help explain that would be awesome.

I'd just like to say that the reason Living Legends has this reputation despite the majority of hardcore players and devs not feeling this way is because it's greatest weakness is community size. As a result, the clan (CSJ) that owns the most popular server has more "voice" than they otherwise should have and extremely, extremely whiny about how other people play the game. I've been kicked off their server not just for legging, but for taking off arms and gun mounts from their members before, because somehow that wasn't "honorable." They're the types of players that try to take concepts like Clan Zell and twist it around into some non-canonized set of rules and get mad at people for shooting them in knockdowns.

Long story short, the less vocal majority of players in Living Legends aren't like this. The devs aren't like this. A ton of good folks aren't like this. Legging basically just uses the MW2 system here and is harder, in general, than shooting for the CT with very few exceptions.

Honestly the main reason I am not active in Living Legends much these days is the small community that allows minority voices and attitudes to harm the game through simply owning the highest speed servers, despite stellar work by the mod team. I was really glad to see people like Flying Debris involved with MWO!

EDIT: Also, as far as system, I'll admit I'm a fan of the MechWarrior 4 system of legging. Mostly because legged 'mechs don't become turrets and can limp around the battlefield, and escorting them / trying to keep them alive despite their condition is actually a lot of fun. I'm totally happy with any past system, or something new, though.

Dr.Killinger, on 23 February 2012 - 08:04 AM, said:

I can't agree with you more! I've actively tried to leg: it's difficult if the mech is maneuvering. However, I once popped over the hill in an Uziel prime, only to meet an assult mech with a heavily damaged leg from an earlier firefight. It would have been stupid for me to have not shot that leg! If I'm honest, the only time I leg is when other shots from me or other people have resulted in a damaged leg. It's a tactic to take advantage of, and it's not broken.

There is a direct link between people who do not want to move while shooting and steadily keep mobile and those that complain about legging. The majority of pilots that get really angry about losing guns and legs I was talking about in MWLL prefer to drive as slow as possible or stop and focus entirely on gunning, which is why their legs - which would be vastly harder targets than the CT - become such easy targets. Same thing with assaults that have larger legs - they don't advance behind cover to keep their leg profiles limited and instead just walk right out in the open and park and shoot.

I'm not a bad shot but I'm nowhere near good enough to selectively blow off guns and legs with 100% accuracy against someone trying to pull evasive moves, and will go for their CT almost every single time unless crippling damage hit another area out of luck. But against people who aren't moving much, it changes everything.

Basically a lot of people that hate legging don't try to protect their legs and rather rely on freaking out about it instead of learning to play evasively.

Edited by Victor Morson, 07 March 2012 - 03:31 AM.

[Stovebolt]

Easy solution - make sure you're in hull down position. Frankly, I'd rather have realistic (i.e. if they blow up your legs, you fall over) solution than magic legs or what have you...just adapt your tactics to fit the situation, not the other way around.

Good tankers in WWIIOnline didn't run around with chickens with their heads cut off, blazing wildly, they watched and waited or did a little shoot and scoot. The really good guys did a little of both.

I'm sure this game will have far more opportunities for cover than the previous incarnations of MW (from what I can tell from screenshots, they didn't exactly have a whole lot of stuff to hide behind), so I I'm pretty optimistic that it won't be a huge problem so long as you KNOW IT IS A WEAKNESS AND ADJUST ACCORDINGLY.

[Trogusaur]

I was looking through some of the material the devs had mentioned concerning heat sinks, and how placing them in the legs would dissipate heat in water. With this in mind, would that not give warriors even more incentive to leg and incapacitate mechs from the waist down? Personally, I found it annoying to be outright winning an engagement against an enemy with lesser skill, only to be legged and systematically crumpled while having all torsos still green. One may argue that it is a perfectly viable tactic (which it is, I just hate when it is abused like such), but now heat dissipation is also in the crosshairs. Even if a pilot is aware of the legging threat and moves heat sinks accordingly, it will not exempt him from walking around like a gimp for half the match after taking an Arrow IV to the knee.

My fear is that this may give one more reason for pilots to further exploit one of the most exploited tactics in Mechwarrior history. Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems there is no reason not to leg when looking at the incentive. Maybe balancing will allow one to place even more armor on the legs, or another alternative will be found, but I could see this being a glaring weakness to any 'mech not fast enough to keep those actuators moving. Sorry if this has already been touched up on, this information came out a while ago and I was unable to find a thread specifically discussing this.

Edited by Lord Trogus, 09 March 2012 - 10:47 PM.

[Orzorn]

With the new convergence mechanics and the apparent difficulty of aiming that, and considering every weapon shown so far either has a flight time (even the ACs) or has a firing time (lasers), consistently hitting the legs is a thing of the past.

If you manage to leg someone in MWO, I think you'd have to have put a lot of effort into it, or they weren't moving at all.

Even still, we haven't yet heard whether destroying a legs internals will make you lose that leg.

[Insidious Johnson]

Ah, so legging will be more challenging! Or, a group effort involving many "roles".

[Barbaric Soul]

Orzorn, on 09 March 2012 - 09:02 PM, said:

consistently hitting the legs is a thing of the past.

If you manage to leg someone in MWO, I think you'd have to have put a lot of effort into it, or they weren't moving at all.

Don't be too sure about that. I know plenty of people, myself included, that have no problems blowing the legs out from under a fast light mech with guass and ppc in MW4. It'll happen here aswell. People will just have to get used to the aiming system of MWO.

Personally, I wouldn't worry too much about it. As long as you had armor on your legs in MW4, 2-3 torso shots were usually a faster kill. I'd be willing to bet it'll be the same in MWO.

[Lightfoot]

Legging never bothered me. Obviously there needs to be a balance so that legs are not the first target.

In Mechwarrior 4 I looked forward to facing someone trying to leg my 'mech because I would just change my 'mech's facing after one leg took significant damage. Then they would start missing, trying to hit the far leg, meanwhile they were starting to lose torso weapons and armor and became an easy win. On the otherhand, if an opponent's 'mech's leg went red from an incidental hit, that meant very low leg armor and the legs became my target.

My rule/advice is that legs don't shoot back, but the rest of the 'mech does.

I am more concerned about headshots being too easy like they were in MW3 or for that matter that arms blow off on the first hit like in MW3. That would ruin MWO if that sad lesson was forgotten.

[Name140704]

Lightfoot, on 09 March 2012 - 09:17 PM, said:

Legging never bothered me. Obviously there needs to be a balance so that legs are not the first target.
...
My rule/advice is that legs don't shoot back, but the rest of the 'mech does.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Edit: Flamers are in The legs can't do anything when the reactor is shut down

Edited by NARCoMAN, 09 March 2012 - 09:32 PM.