313 replies to this topic

[Cochise]

I was a fleet commander in Eve Online and we made all our recruits go through a process before they became full fledged wingmen. You could pretty much tell right away who was gung ho and who wasn't. It wasn't a hard process or anything its just that some people want to be part of a team and some don't.

After you went through that, you were assigned a role based on your skill set and your ship and during a battle everyone just followed orders because if they didn't, they were dead. Not because of anything we would do to them but because good team work in a fleet battle was just necessary for survival. You did it because you wanted everyone to get home alive and you needed to rely on each other to make that happen. If you didn't, you were dead or pretty much ostracized from the group anyway. The game was setup very strongly as "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the one."

I don't know if MWO will be balanced quite that way, but what's the point of joining an outfit if you're going to ignore the commanders orders? If the commander doesn't know what he's doing, then why follow him anyway? My corp was a pirate corp so all pilots on a mission shared the booty. My job was to make sure we had a juicy target and had tactical advantage so the pilots got a good payday, were happy and got home alive. If I failed too many times, well there goes the credibility. I hope people would ignore me. You want mercs in your outfit, not wimps.

[zverofaust]

Boymonkey, on 11 March 2012 - 04:35 PM, said:

Oh and other people have responded in this thread and it gives us an idea of what type of people we will play with.

Congrats (the rest of my comment was insulting and flame baiting and so Grimm removed it rather than spanking me in public)

Cochise, on 11 March 2012 - 04:40 PM, said:

I was a fleet commander in Eve Online--

:Stops reading:

Edited by Mason Grimm, 11 March 2012 - 05:06 PM.
Really? Tact people, tact.

[Boymonkey]

Cochise, on 11 March 2012 - 04:40 PM, said:

I was a fleet commander in Eve Online and we made all our recruits go through a process before they became full fledged wingmen. You could pretty much tell right away who was gung ho and who wasn't. It wasn't a hard process or anything its just that some people want to be part of a team and some don't.

After you went through that, you were assigned a role based on your skill set and your ship and during a battle everyone just followed orders because if they didn't, they were dead. Not because of anything we would do to them but because good team work in a fleet battle was just necessary for survival. You did it because you wanted everyone to get home alive and you needed to rely on each other to make that happen. If you didn't, you were dead or pretty much ostracized from the group anyway. The game was setup very strongly as "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the one."

I don't know if MWO will be balanced quite that way, but what's the point of joining an outfit if you're going to ignore the commanders orders? If the commander doesn't know what he's doing, then why follow him anyway? My corp was a pirate corp so all pilots on a mission shared the booty. My job was to make sure we had a juicy target and had tactical advantage so the pilots got a good payday, were happy and got home alive. If I failed too many times, well there goes the credibility. I hope people would ignore me. You want mercs in your outfit, not wimps.

Good post and you summed up a good team player by saying "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the one." while an order may seem silly at the time in the long run it may work for the best for the whole team.

Cheers for your posts
Oh and ignore the troll

[Ty Cannon]

Well hopefully I'm with a group of players, teammates I hope that will follow orders from there commander. Another question is are these commands pre-trained in a practice? Is the game going to allow the basic formations and movements to make it easier for the Commanders. Just curious I guess we will wait and see.


Ty Cannon

[Cochise]

Boymonkey, on 11 March 2012 - 04:47 PM, said:

Good post and you summed up a good team player by saying "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the one." while an order may seem silly at the time in the long run it may work for the best for the whole team.

Cheers for your posts
Oh and ignore the troll

Yep it's true. I also think people get "found out" if they're a crappy leader and other people gravitate towards great commanders. I had the opportunity to fly my wing under some really sharp people that were just fantastic leaders and really talented at gathering intel and managing a lot of irons in the fire. The best commanders always balanced the risks vs rewards very well and thought of their pilots.

We had a policy that if you were sent on a kamikazi mission, and it was sometimes necessary, the corporation would reimburse you for your loss. That was only fair. If you are going to take one for the team, the team needs to step up to the plate and help you out. I developed some great friendships that I still have to this day. It will be interesting to see how all this unfolds in MWO.

[Mason Grimm]

Boymonkey and Zverofaust,

Please play nice or I will turn this car around and you will both go to your rooms. Save the useless banter for the battlefield.

[ilkhan]

People might think their commander is giving bad orders, but you don't have all the information they do.

Telling a Raven to attack a Mad Cat single handedly might sound stupid but it worked (/will work if you are going on timeline) for Mech-Commander Harrison of the 1st Davion Guards on Port Arthur.

[Tarl Cabot]

(chuckles)

It will take some time, but people will weed themselves out. What type of in game organization will there be other than in the military arm the House? Will it be extremely loose setup (adding unit name to game name) to where, at a glance, you only know that that person is in your House.

At first there will likely be more PUG than later on. People, whether they are a unit commander or not, will make names for themselves, both good and bad. People will decide on how they interact with the bad players, with or without any game controls.

Will I follow when need be? Hai, as that is one of many ways to evaluate potential leaders. Also, as one following orders it allows one to have a better overview of how things unfold.

[Barbaric Soul]

I'll probably TK the first person that tries to be my commander in a open game.

[Jenin]

I thrive on proving I'm a good team player when leaders win my confidence and respect. You don't have to be right all the time or make the best call, you just have to show me you aren't saying it just to say it and throwing me to the wolves. I will gladly make sacrifices of myself if I see where the leader is going with things.

On a personal level, I am not a decisive individual, I am prone to hesitation and second guessing, but that is where I trade my weakness for strength in being a good team player. If I'm given a task, I usually go get it done without distraction and hesitation. I like being dependable.

[Thom Frankfurt]

Thorn Hallis, on 11 March 2012 - 10:53 AM, said:

I'll only do it if the bitchlorette Romano Liao herself shows up on the battlefield.

Be careful what you wish for...

Sure I'll follow orders, if they make sence. I'm a team player, but if my team mates drop the ball, then it's every man for himself.

[summonerpilot]

I've already claimed the position of lance leader for my little gang of prospective players. If there is a player that gets to be the company commander, I'd forward his orders to my lance so long as he's not being a total moron.

[The Cheese]

I learned the value of following the commands of a good leader from end-game raiding in various mmorpgs.
I learned the danger of following the commands of a bad leader from the same thing.

Give me a good leader, and I will obey faithfully.
Give me a bad leader, and I will do whatever I feel is going to help win the battle.

I expect that the Merc units will have the best commanders, as the better units will be closer to an organised "guild" structure with players having predetermined roles in the unit. Everyone should know their role here, and that will help them win.

I expect that the houses will have some trouble with their commanders, as the commander position for each match will basically be fair game for anyone with a commander module. Reputation as a good commander is the only thing that will get you a good following here.

I don't expect many lone wolves to play as commanders, and those that do won't be followed often. They're too much of an unknown factor.

[Seabear]

Teamwork seems to be the key to sucess from all I've been reading about the game. Seems to me the real role of the commander is going to be in the organization and preparation of a unit for combat. Most of us sound competent enough to succeed in any role we happen to choose. Once we know the plan and our role in it, the commander's role becomes one of keeping everyone informed so we can do our jobs. Sure things change or the unforeseen happens which may require a change on the fly, otherwise a good commander lets his(her) people work. Prepare 'em. Point 'em in the right direction and get out of the way unless something drastic happens. Like Patton said, it will amaze you when you see how well people can get things done when you tell them what you want done but not how to do it.
If a commander is screaming orders , there is something wrong, and things are going to go south in a hurry for his warriors! If he (she) is trying to tell every one of the how to do the job, there is no co-ordination and he(she) needs to be replaced. You depend on the members of your team so that you can concentrate on the job at hand. That has to include the commander as well.
Sun Tzu should be required reading for anyone who seeks to be a commander.

[FinnMcKool]

well we will see how it works out, but it seems the commanders role will be more of informing his team , than telling them what to do.

After all the mission objectives I hope will be clear before a drop is made , and if everyone chose their own role I would think they
want to play that role.


Me I want to win , and being a team player often meant others got the kills or the glory , but I was happy to be on the winning team.

[HeroicTofu]

I will follow my commander until he proves himself incapable. Depending on the game mode, I think it would be quite a good feature to be able to change commanders after a certain number of rounds have elapsed (not right away to give the commander a chance) so that if one person isn't up to the task, it goes onto the next person to give them a shot. Maybe by player vote after 3 rounds (Assuming we have battles that would work out to this).

[GDL Irishwarrior]

Depends on the order, I suppose. If the order is clearly idiotic, and following it would obviously result in a loss, then it ain't happening. Aside from that, though, I'm gonna trust the commander - I'm not a big tactics guy, so I'll let the people that ARE into strategy do the master planning

[Tifalia]

As long as said commander is competant and actually knows and uses strategy instead of plain old brute force to win the day, then I will follow said commander. But before I even accept someone as my new CO, I would like a list of her/his qualifications, referrals et cetera. No more and no less than the Real World.

[EmyLightsaber]

Just as long as I get points/ cbills (enough to cover both repair, rearm, and salvage) then I would be all for suicidal charges. If not, then you can kiss me where the sun don't shine.

[Kargush]

Orders are orders.

I still reserve the right to gripe. And the right to say "I told you so" if the orders are stupid.