120 replies to this topic

[MagnusEffect]

in my book:

most players make terrible Clanners, they mostly just like the "elite" status it entails

I would much rather see the Clans be introduced as a mutual threat to ALL players a la PvE. This way the Clans can be A REAL THREAT and have A REAL ADVANTAGE in terms of technology while still putting all players on equal footing. Also, by making the Clans everyone's enemy, we can look forward to some AWESOME PvE fights and EPIC LOOTAGE! (within reason of course)

Edited by MagnusEffect, 03 November 2011 - 11:54 AM.

[mbt201188]

While I believe that it would be cool to have company employees play the clans I really doubt that would happen. So I voted for other players also because I know so many of you out there want to be a clanner.

[Aaron DeChavilier]

Amarus Cameron, on 03 November 2011 - 11:38 AM, said:

Incorrect freebirth, we come to recreate the star league, the Inner Sphere's continued predations on their neighbors creates nothing other than hate and destruction.

The Clans do not attack civilian targets, only military ones. (barring Edo, that Star Captain was retracted anyway, plus the Yakuza are to blame there.)

how disgusting, a person from the Cameron bloodline proclaiming themselves a clanner? and that the clans come to recreate the Star League? as for not attacking soft targets, that doesnt excuse a militaristic and manifest destiny bent you clans have. Personally for this game, either bots are clanners, or only the very best should be clan, because clan tech is so inherently op. I would throw down with real clanners any day of the week rather than being inundated by a flood of clan kiddies who only go for the tech.

[Stormwolf]

Aaron DeChavilier, on 03 November 2011 - 12:12 PM, said:

how disgusting, a person from the Cameron bloodline proclaiming themselves a clanner? and that the clans come to recreate the Star League? as for not attacking soft targets, that doesnt excuse a militaristic and manifest destiny bent you clans have. Personally for this game, either bots are clanners, or only the very best should be clan, because clan tech is so inherently op. I would throw down with real clanners any day of the week rather than being inundated by a flood of clan kiddies who only go for the tech.

Very true, without honor rules and some amount of RP the Clans cease to be Clans.

Don't let the munchkins ruin my favorite factions.

[verybad]

I'm looking forward to them being implemented so I can kill them.

When they are implemented, I hope players will have to start new characters at least to use clan tech unless it's salvaged. I think it's obvious that they WILL be implemented, but I think it will be more entertaining to kill people talking about how honerable they are in their MadCat/Timberwolf yada yada yada...

Can NOT Wait

[MagnusEffect]

What annoys me most though is that if we let players take the Clan factions, as they stand now, there will be VERY LITTLE distinction between the Clans and Inner Sphere other than superior technology. This one fact means that Clantech will have to be either watered down (which sucks for everyone) or made arbitrarily more expensive, but in doing so, makes standard online fights of 10vs10,16vs16,etc. VERY one-sided fights... the clear advantage going to who fields more clan mechs.

I can't stress enough that for the good of EVERYONE, make the Clan factions super badass NPCs and let us ALL take them on together. In other words, let the Clans play the very important role of "wildcard" as they were when they were first introduced.

Edited by MagnusEffect, 03 November 2011 - 12:38 PM.

[CoffiNail]

You see, they HAVE to make players the Clans, why because there goes a HUGE chunk of the player base who says ***** you! I very much may be one of those players. MW2:31CC and GBL ARE my two games, when ever I played MechCommander 1 and 2 I would focus on trying to get clan mechs and re forming lances in to stars. I will only play IS as long as I have to, and if they do not give that option, I will probably just stick to MWLL.

I do agree there should be a set of tests for The Clan players. They should be players that know the lore and in combat trials will show that they will fight one on one letting other clan members know they have chosen to pick this target. Or even better a sensor to let you know this mech is already targeted by trothkin.

I to the dismay of my team mates in PUBs on MWLL will often let someone finish their battle before jumping in to finish off the enemy if he happens to win the fight. I also get extremely frustrated when I am in a battle with someone for the better part of a minute and we are both skillfully dodging and manuvering to have some surat filth come and pop a couple PPCs in me, ending the duel.

If they picked the right players through a set of Trials before hand, then let those players pre-play as clans in Clan vs Clan battles to hone their skills of zell.

If done right, it could be amazing!

Also bidding, as someone pointed out earlier. Clans Bid, This would be the staple as well to see which clan star/binary commander gets to do the drop. Yeah going to suck when your star looses the honor, but hey part of being Clan.

On the topic of the staff playing the clans... too laughable. I am sure they will get some game time, but DEVs do not play the game the same way. They would not be running around going, "Alright need to take out this unit" they run around and go "Oh hey there is that enemy on radar, wait... why is that building's texture not sitting right, I think I need to remember to tell -person- to get that fixed. DEVs from my knowledge tend to analyze their game when they play it.

[MagnusEffect]

so you would rather have a watered down distinction between the Clans and Inners Sphere like most of the other games rather than actually introduce new and potentially awesome gaming dynamic?

unless player owned clans are FORCED into behaving like Clans, they aren't going to behave a whole lot differently from their non-Clan counterparts. Also, Clans getting the best toys, expect most players to gravitate towards them. New players + best toys = pretty terrible idea if you ask me.

As much as I want to support your passion for instilling rules on Clan players, I doesn't seem practical at all unless the devs totally commit to it by way of game mechanics... that doesn't seem likely.


I will meet halfway on this:

What if joining a Clan was INVITE ONLY and limited to ONLY TOP RANKED PLAYERS according to *fill in blank*. Lose your ranking by a certain amount and get booted from the Clan. It would have to be coded in as an actual game feature:

Basically, you go about your life as Inner Sphere scum; kicking ***, taking names. Then one day you get a letter in your email saying "CONGRATULATIONS! YOU HAVE BEEN SELECTED TO JOIN THE ELITE RANKS! Enter this code into the game to unlock the right to make a Clan warrior. Be warned! Glory will bring you distinction, but dishonor will bring you dispossession! (i.e. get kicked out)"

Also, Clan forces would have to deal with all the Clan rules such as bidding forces, limited numbers/tonnage etc... all for the "GLORY OF TEH CLAN!" nonsense. Basically, bragging rights. That's what you clanners want afterall

Edited by MagnusEffect, 03 November 2011 - 01:15 PM.

[verybad]

They can allow players to be clans, just have their tech more expensive to upgrade (which it is in the boardgame also using BV)

I have no problem with them being available to players (who are more fun to fight than bots). Give them drawbacks like more expensive upgrades, perhaps some penalty to salvage if they team up on enemies (Zelbrigen) stuff like that.

12 years olds playing maxed out daishis and screaming about how it's dishonorable to leg someone...not so much fun to play with.

So long as their is a balancing system, no matter what is used, so that the IS units don't become instantly obsolete in competitive play then Im fine with it. Still probably not gonna change over to clan tech once it becomes availalbe however. Too boring and overused.

[CoffiNail]

MagnusEffect, on 03 November 2011 - 01:00 PM, said:

I will meet halfway on this:

What if joining a Clan was INVITE ONLY and limited to ONLY TOP RANKED PLAYERS according to *fill in blank*. Lose your ranking by a certain amount and get booted from the Clan. It would have to be coded in as an actual game feature:

Basically, you go about your life as Inner Sphere scum; kicking ***, taking names. Then one day you get a letter in your email saying "CONGRATULATIONS! YOU HAVE BEEN SELECTED TO JOIN THE ELITE RANKS! Enter this code into the game to unlock the right to make a Clan pilot. Be warned! Glory will bring you distinction, but dishonor will bring you dispossession! (i.e. get kicked out)"

Also, Clan forces would have to deal with all the Clan rules such as bidding forces, limited numbers/tonnage etc... all for the "GLORY OF TEH CLAN!" nonsense. Basically, bragging rights. That's what you clanners want afterall

Yeah I like the invite only. PGI and MWO Staff could be the pickers easily.. the GMs may have an idea of people who they are watching ,etc.

[Woodstock]

I don't think its just roleplaying on the forums or over comms though. The player has to be better ... higher accuracy, more kills more damage delt etc etc. There needs to be demonstrable superiority!

[Kyll Long]

theforce, on 02 November 2011 - 03:02 PM, said:

I voted bots.

I'm one of the 2 people who don't like the clans...but because there's only 2 of us...we're stuck with them I would like to see something like the following:

1. clans invade, and entire IS plays against bots. These would be scripted battles where the IS are retreating and the clans eventually occupy the IS.
2. Devs do a FRAKLOAD of balance testing to determine what's fair for PvP (ISvClan) battles. For example - 1 250 ton star vs. 1 750 ton company is.
3. Open balnce testing to players in a solaris form.
4. Allow PvP IS vs clan battles.
5. Have a parallel universe in 3015 with no clans.

Clans are for those who can't target on their own and need all those boosts they get from outrageuos tech.

That makes you one of three now

[Woodstock]

If the AI is upto the task I'd like the clans to be played by AI units but for players to be slowly selected to join the AI ranks maybe as star commanders.

this way we can have viscous mass battles against the initial clan invasion but the die hard clanners will still get to live out their dream.

[zverofaust]

The developers probably set a date of 3049, and specifically mentioned that their in-universe timeline would sync with ours, so that they'd have a year to plan and properly execute a proper "arrival of the Clans". Probably by making them a playable faction.

[Chris Fetladral]

I have read over this thread so many times it's making my head hurt.

I honestly believe the players should have the option of playing as Clan when they are introduced.

I have been seeing some posts on how there will be a mass of fourteen year olds who would play Clan for the 'Elite' status. That will be very true but who cares? In theory clan tech should be 100x better than the current tech of the IS, but tech alone does not a Clanner make. Regardless of how it is implimented, you are going to have those players who are halo-schizo (Rainbow Six Vegas 2 anyone), then you are going to have those players who will beleive according to clan lore. I want to believe that alot of the posters here would have confidence in their own skill as players and not worry too much over the 'hogwash' that will come with the Clan invasion.

To those who will be IS through and through, you will have mundane matches not really worth your time, but then you will find yourself in scenarios where you will experience the gameplay against Clanners the way it was supposed to be. Even if you happen to befall a match in which most players are your typical 'I must win, my mech is better than yours', there might be someone willing to challenge you to Zellbrigen and THAT, my friends, is what will make your gaming more memorable.

let me tell you a little story.
I remember the chaos of MW3 and MW4, where most rooms (aside from league battles) were a huge free-for-all. I was in a room playing as Gimpoid_Wolfen. I exclusively use the Timber Prime with a slight variation (trade the mguns for more sm lasers). The teams were even then a member of the opposing team lagged-out. In a game of missle and laser boats, a player in a slightly modified Bushwacker kept getting his **** handed to him due to overwhelming odds., to the point where he/she would just stand there and take the abuse. I hailed my fellow kin, informing them that I would challenge that pilot to Zellbrigen. After 10-15 mins (can't remember exactly how long but it was long) of constant chasing, attacking, defending, the match ended and the player added me as their friend on the Zone. Basically, those last mins of combat between us made the entire conflict worth it for them.

I guess what I'm trying to say is to don't sweat the small stuff regarding the Clans. You never know what you might find.

[Eegxeta]

I think though it should take a lot more to be a member of the Clan as Clan pilot have to undergo heavy training. I think to be a Clan mechwarrior you should have to prove yourself as a Clan mech warrior show that you actually have skill. Being a Clan mechwarrior should be earned not by kills, not by level or rank, not by purchase but through skill: how well someone fought, how skilled was there aim, how well the mech was piloted. Anyone can rack up kills or earn money. It should also go down to how honorable do they fight things like did they give the opponent a chance to eject or did they just aim for the cockpit, did they cripple the opponents mech (like destroying the legs or shooting off weapons so that they can't defend themselves). Being a Clan mechwarrior shouldn't be easy a person should have to make a commitment and if that break it they will lose Clan status.

[IS Wolf]

Aethon, on 03 November 2011 - 03:33 AM, said:

Thus, a high BV star of Clan mechs (five) could go up against two low BV lances (8 mechs). Or, a trinary of Clan mechs (15) could go up against a Company of IS mechs (16). The IS would still have a slight advantage due to their number (more tactical options available), but...if done right...it would work just fine for gameplay reasons.

A Company is 3 lances, thus 12 Mechs, not 16..

Eegxeta, on 03 November 2011 - 07:16 PM, said:

I think though it should take a lot more to be a member of the Clan as Clan pilot have to undergo heavy training. I think to be a Clan mechwarrior you should have to prove yourself as a Clan mech warrior show that you actually have skill. Being a Clan mechwarrior should be earned not by kills, not by level or rank, not by purchase but through skill: how well someone fought, how skilled was there aim, how well the mech was piloted. Anyone can rack up kills or earn money. It should also go down to how honorable do they fight things like did they give the opponent a chance to eject or did they just aim for the cockpit, did they cripple the opponents mech (like destroying the legs or shooting off weapons so that they can't defend themselves). Being a Clan mechwarrior shouldn't be easy a person should have to make a commitment and if that break it they will lose Clan status.

Have to point out that a Clan warrior will leg, disarm an opponent if s/he has fought their duel valiantly and skillfully enough. How else do you think we get our Bonds(wo)men? By asking nicely?

[Phades]

omegaclawe, on 02 November 2011 - 02:29 PM, said:

How do you balance IS vs Clan, you ask? It's simple - Bidding! The clans want to fight with less mechs! The IS units want to fight with more! Let the inferior IS outnumber the Clans!

You folks are totally ignoring player bias. Something similar happened in planetside as well. Most everyone shifted out of vanu and some out of the TR and all funneled into the NC due to the map setups and general objectives favoring their weapons. I guarantee you the same exact thing will occur when the clans are introduced if they are not given a overly severe handicap, like under 40 tons only.

Also, i'd advise against discrediting hybrid systems that encourage both co-op and competitive play styles. People have to have some method to earn cash again after they get their **** handed to them enough times

MagnusEffect, on 03 November 2011 - 01:00 PM, said:

so you would rather have a watered down distinction between the Clans and Inners Sphere like most of the other games rather than actually introduce new and potentially awesome gaming dynamic?

unless player owned clans are FORCED into behaving like Clans, they aren't going to behave a whole lot differently from their non-Clan counterparts. Also, Clans getting the best toys, expect most players to gravitate towards them. New players + best toys = pretty terrible idea if you ask me.

As much as I want to support your passion for instilling rules on Clan players, I doesn't seem practical at all unless the devs totally commit to it by way of game mechanics... that doesn't seem likely.


I will meet halfway on this:

What if joining a Clan was INVITE ONLY and limited to ONLY TOP RANKED PLAYERS according to *fill in blank*. Lose your ranking by a certain amount and get booted from the Clan. It would have to be coded in as an actual game feature:

Basically, you go about your life as Inner Sphere scum; kicking ***, taking names. Then one day you get a letter in your email saying "CONGRATULATIONS! YOU HAVE BEEN SELECTED TO JOIN THE ELITE RANKS! Enter this code into the game to unlock the right to make a Clan warrior. Be warned! Glory will bring you distinction, but dishonor will bring you dispossession! (i.e. get kicked out)"

Also, Clan forces would have to deal with all the Clan rules such as bidding forces, limited numbers/tonnage etc... all for the "GLORY OF TEH CLAN!" nonsense. Basically, bragging rights. That's what you clanners want afterall

Nice in theory, but in execution what you will find is an ever growing group of people who will never lose their position since they get to "slum it up" against people with inferior skills (follows the lore, but is bad for a game) and better guns and rides. IE, sure it sounds cool, but will warp game play badly since if they were owning it up with POS designs and blunt sticks, they will really own it with min/max designs and sharp swords.
.

Edited by Phades, 03 November 2011 - 10:07 PM.

[MagnusEffect]

Bottom line I will reiterate: if the Clans as a faction cannot be made fundamentally different to "behave" like the Clans, make them vicious AI that we all have to fear/fight against as an unwelcome third party/wildcard.

We REALLY need to avoid the Clans become "just another House" like in recent MW titles.

Simply making their equipment cost more and dropping into battle with less tonnage/mechs is boring and uncreative. Think harder people.

[Phades]

MagnusEffect, on 03 November 2011 - 10:10 PM, said:

Bottom line I will reiterate: if the Clans as a faction cannot be made fundamentally different to "behave" like the Clans, make them vicious AI that we all have to fear/fight against as an unwelcome third party/wildcard.

We REALLY need to avoid the Clans become "just another House" like in recent MW titles.

Simply making their equipment cost more and dropping into battle with less tonnage/mechs is boring and uncreative. Think harder people.

You can't force people to role play the most clean idealistic clan style of honor and tactics. That is the bottom line. And unfortunately that is the reality they have to code against. Even if they were to try, you would have a backwards system rewarding good players in the IS, but punishing good players in the clans, as inherently "good" players (competitive natured spike style folks) are going to get the job done in the most efficient manner possible. While lore wise this would elevate their rank, unless of course they used overwhelming force (oops we are talking about the competitive crowd), which would be always. Thus just as they reach their desired "elite" status level, they would lose it the first chance they got to use it. It would **** off the guys at the top and invariably **** off the folks at the bottom since that will invariably end up being what they face off against most frequently from their point of view once the game matures to that point.

Now don't get me wrong, I've played on the short end of the stick plenty of times and longer than i'd care to admit. I can deal with it to a degree, but after awhile it just gets overwhelming. Other folks are not nearly as patient or stubborn as I am and will give up. Seen it happen far too often. What i've put forward isn't imaginative or creative, but it is harsh and realistic given the circumstances.

Edited by Phades, 03 November 2011 - 10:22 PM.