257 replies to this topic

[I Just Ate Your Grapes Bro]

Ashnod, on 01 November 2012 - 11:47 PM, said:

The best way to beat an LRM boat is to defend btw, but I guess you and all the other pugs are just to impatient to sit and wait huh?

*facepalm* .............and now I understand that all the "lern2paly" LRM boat spamming idiots simply can't read.........


Thank god almost every one of you is dumb enough not to even bother mounting any close range weapons, or think that you can go toe to toe with my cicada while I kill you while you helplessly spread the damage thinking I'm after anything but a big repair bill for you anyway.

Let me be completely clear here, I love all of you that mount your LRMs, you're one of the reasons my KDR is so high, all your free kills are appreciated. What makes me sad is, all the fair fights that are missed out on because half my team, or the enemy team (this argument goes both ways, it isn't always MY pug team getting LRMed, often times it's my OWN team loaded up with them, its still a problem....) has more LRMS than lasers and ballistics combined.

Edited by Ehrithane, 01 November 2012 - 11:58 PM.

[Protection]

Ehrithane, on 01 November 2012 - 11:53 PM, said:

*facepalm* .............and now I understand that all you "lern2paly" LRM boat spamming idiots simply can't read.................... at least that means I don't have to keep being cordial..............................

Can you point to an example of a competitive team fielding LRMs against another organized team not fielding LRMs, and winning?

Where and which tournament/league game? Which teams?

[I Just Ate Your Grapes Bro]

Protection, on 01 November 2012 - 11:57 PM, said:

Can you point to an example of a competitive team fielding LRMs against another organized team not fielding LRMs, and winning?

Where and which tournament/league game? Which teams?

you answered before the edit, but as I pointed out in case it wasn't clear, I'm not against LRMs at all, the one thing I am against is 5-6 LRM boats every match, it's out of hand and while I can't point out an example, this is one thing I almost never see against a premade, most have a few LRMs or even a couple LRM boats, not half their team doing nothing but spamming missiles without ever seeing a target they are hitting.

The problem is, you can't blame the people for abusing the system, these people are just like the suicide rushers, taking advantage of what is given to them, that's why something needs to change, otherwise pugging in this game will simply be a matter of who has more LRMs in the long run, and that won't keep new people coming in.

Edited by Ehrithane, 02 November 2012 - 12:04 AM.

[Protection]

Ehrithane, on 02 November 2012 - 12:00 AM, said:

you answered before the edit, but as I pointed out in case it wasn't clear, I'm not against LRMs at all, the one thing I am against is 5-6 LRM boats every match, it's out of hand and while I can't point out an example, this is one thing I almost never see against a premade, most have a few LRMs or even a couple LRM boats, not half their team doing nothing but spamming missiles without ever seeing a target they are hitting.

But when they do - against another premade - it is a woefully ineffective weapon system. It's barely viable right now in competition, and people are arguing to make them even worse.

[I Just Ate Your Grapes Bro]

Protection, on 02 November 2012 - 12:03 AM, said:

But when they do - against another premade - it is a woefully ineffective weapon system. It's barely viable right now in competition, and people are arguing to make them even worse.

Fair enough, that's a side of it I've never looked at heh..... makes the whole issue more complex

[SHORTZ]

LRMs are supposed to be devastating, hence why it is so important to have light mechs get all the targeting data in about the enemy so that they can be put to good use. I hate getting annihilated by LRM fire, but i then acknowledge it was my own damn fault for sticking my bare ******* in the open air. If you dont want to get hit by LRM's, just be smart about where you position yourself and/or take out the enemys spotters. Once that is done, it is hard for them to effectively use their missile boats.

Thats what i reckon

[Yokaiko]

Ehrithane, on 01 November 2012 - 11:41 PM, said:

Please, show me one location I've posted anything that disagrees with this point? Please read before throwing out random thoughts..... thanks. If your argument is that the Atlas was useful, sure, but you don't know the mechanics of the game if you don't think he'da been MORE useful LRM boating in a catapult instead or only mounting SOME LRMs on his Atlas and being in the fight soaking up damage.....


LOL! You guys can jump on this argument all you want. I don't die to LRMs, but I also don't hide behind them either and claim that anyone that dies to them simply needs to "L2P" Stop using LRM boats, then we'll see which one of us knows how to play. The simple number of them flying through the air all the time, coupled with the insane amounts of damage that LRM boats get every match, despite sitting in the back of a match the hole time, in itself is the problem. NOT the fact that they exist. I'm not asking for longer lock, I'm not asking for them to be useless, I'm not asking for more spread. I simply want them to be in line with every other weapon in the game, not the clear choice for the "I win" button.

It doesn't matter how well you know how to play, if half your pug team dies to LRMs, you aren't likely to come out on top. Currently, if you are looking to put out the most damage, an LRM in your missile spot is the best option bar none. This is simply rediculous. Considering the level of skill involved in missiles, LRMs should be the LEAST damaging (currently the most) SSRMs in the middle and SRMS should be the big damager, this is exactly opposite of how it currently is. Currently, the less skill a weapon takes, the more damage it does.

Then again, when I put it that way, I can see why so many of you are so quick to defend LRMs heh....

*below deleted for double posting*

Lol we had three launchers, and that wasn't a boat atlas, it was a stock RS.

To the rest of your post they ARE hands down the least efficient damage dealer, if you don't want LRM killing rambos in your pug, don't pug. It takes a minimal amount off coordination to make LRM teams useless.

Unfortunately, that is one thing pugs totally lack. I've broken heavy LRM teams numerous times with very simple tactics. Once you kill an LRM teams scouts you basically have them. Play peak-a-boo and run them out of ammo. One K2 with a good pilot can basicly stomp three LRM boats, more if you have lights to keep the rest busy so they aren't shooting your brawlers.

One Jenner with a kamikazi pilot can basically shut down two cats, they HAVE to deal with it or be eared.

[Pesht]

Yokaiko, on 02 November 2012 - 01:32 AM, said:

Lol we had three launchers, and that wasn't a boat atlas, it was a stock RS.

To the rest of your post they ARE hands down the least efficient damage dealer, if you don't want LRM killing rambos in your pug, don't pug. It takes a minimal amount off coordination to make LRM teams useless.

Unfortunately, that is one thing pugs totally lack. I've broken heavy LRM teams numerous times with very simple tactics. Once you kill an LRM teams scouts you basically have them. Play peak-a-boo and run them out of ammo. One K2 with a good pilot can basicly stomp three LRM boats, more if you have lights to keep the rest busy so they aren't shooting your brawlers.

One Jenner with a kamikazi pilot can basically shut down two cats, they HAVE to deal with it or be eared.

Short version: I've broken LRM teams with mouth breathers who will blow all their ammo shooting me when I'm obviously not getting hit and will stand in the open for me to shoot them with lasers.

Right..... obviously no problem here.

[Wolfways]

The only OP thing about LRM's is they they are the only weapon that fires straight through cover.

[Red squirrel]

I abstained my vote because I think it depends.
Usually I would say my Founders CAT or my 4xLRM15 Awesome are not OP compared to other common builds Gausscats or SSRM spammers.

But then I just started in a PUG team with 4 LRM boats. I gues out total loadout was about 4xLRM20 4xLRM15
and we shreddid this Atlas within mere seconds. AMS useless - no chance to turn around to get cover......
...so I vote LRM teams are boring.

But then he should have had a scout giving him target information on our team and he might not have approached us through the open water.

[Dr Killinger]

I 'regular' numbers, not at all. As soon as a team takes a few dedicated missile boats, focuses fire, and spots effectively... the enemy can do very little to get past them.

[Ashnod]

Ethri, LRM's only do the damage that they do because the player's being hit by them are allowing them to do that, if they used cover and perhaps tried to break line of sight, tried defending instead of blinding waddling out into the open only to get absolutely raped by LRM's.. and btw, I only have one LRM boat out of the 10 or so mech variants I use - thanks.

Edited by Ashnod, 02 November 2012 - 02:39 AM.

[Yokaiko]

Pesht, on 02 November 2012 - 02:11 AM, said:

Short version: I've broken LRM teams with mouth breathers who will blow all their ammo shooting me when I'm obviously not getting hit and will stand in the open for me to shoot them with lasers.

Right..... obviously no problem here.

Or be the mouthbreather running into 5 LRM boats......5 of anything really.

Which is the issue?

[Marineballer]

They do twice damage as they should do with reference to the table top.
So they are OP.

They should balance the damage to 1.3 or 1.4 of normal damage.

[Malicious Wind]

Steel Claws, on 29 October 2012 - 11:43 PM, said:

Right now you are seeing a lot of LRMs becaause the trial mechs haave aa lot of LRMs. In addition some people realize that few people have put on AMS yet. This will change as time goes on. Missile boats are meat on the table once your within their minimum range of 180. I've already pulled the LRMs from my Founders Cat (just as soon as I had the money) because there are far more effective weapons.

People will drift away from them because:
1 Most of the missiles miss becaause of terrain or lost lock.
2. More people will eventually be running AMS.
3. When more lights are running around they will get special attention.

Take the above and throw that **** in the trash. I'm in a group of four going up against groups of eight founders using as many as six chain firing missiles boats with 2 scout/spotters. This is a strategy and it works to well. We tried bunching together whle all running AMS and it was so ineffective as to be laughable.

[Ragor]

LanceUy, on 30 October 2012 - 12:07 AM, said:

LRMs are ok. How many more threads before people will realise this that...

... they do something wrong.
Simply check my sig.

The game (and the LRM mechanic) is designed to NOT stay in the open, to move around and position with care.
LRM volley is incoming (and be sure, two others will follow the first one) step back to get some cover and break the lock.
Job done.

'No, me is does want LRM to be suqishy -> I simply stay in the open.'
Ok, that's your choice to present you on the golden plate.

And for me there is not much more fun than close the distance to a LRM boat pack by moving towards them using the terrain and then pop up in their face below their minium range 'Hi!' and just see their reaction:
- One will always use the LRM point blank to... distract me? Cheer me up?
- One will use his two mighty light beam lasers (aka flashlights) to welcome me.
- One will bravely continue to launch his volleys towards the rest of my team since he knows he can't fight me that close and tries to dish out as much damage as possible while I tear his back apart.
- Two will always run away and then forget me as soon as they are around the next corner...

[I Just Ate Your Grapes Bro]

LRMs do twice the damage as TT

Armor was increased to twice the value as TT

No other weapon was increased to do twice the damage as TT, therefore the armor increase is nulified using LRMs, it is NOT nulified using any other weapon. This simple logic means that LRMs are currently overpowered. They currently have a "buff" that no other weapon benefits from by nulifying the additional armor used to make matches more survivable.

Not surprisingly, most people still haven't realized that not everyone that sees these weapons are overpowered has a problem with them. As I said before, keep using LRM boats, pads my KDR... but you are ignoring the fact that a broken mechanic means new players won't stick around/no word of mouth, if you want a successful game, it needs to be a balanced one.

Edited by Ehrithane, 02 November 2012 - 03:06 AM.

[MustrumRidcully]

Ashnod, on 02 November 2012 - 02:39 AM, said:

Ethri, LRM's only do the damage that they do because the player's being hit by them are allowing them to do that, if they used cover and perhaps tried to break line of sight, tried defending instead of blinding waddling out into the open only to get absolutely raped by LRM's.. and btw, I only have one LRM boat out of the 10 or so mech variants I use - thanks.

I think I should present a new weapon idea to PGI maybe they'll bite.

"Ultra PPC": Deals 30 damage per shot for 15 heat every every 5 seconds, weighs 8 tons, occupying 5 crit slots and needs a special type of "capacitor" ammo - 20 capacitors per ton, and a minimum range of 120m. The ammo explodes of course.

This weapon shouldn't be OP at all, because it would only do the damage it does because the player's being hit by them are allowing them to do that. If they used cover and tried to break line of sight, tried defending instead of blinding waddling out of the open only to get absolutely raped by the Ultra PPC, they would do just fine.


I don't know, I have the feeling my idea might get shut down. Maybe because it's not canon. But maybe also because my argument is about as compelling as yours - of course when you don't expose yourself to an enemy weapon, it's harmless.

But, tell me, why is it easier to find cover from LRMs then it is to find cover from a Gauss or PPC? Because they can fly over cover but the direct-fire weapons cannot? (And I am not even talking about bugged covers that don't intercept anything). Because you can be shot and targeted by them without seeing the attacker?

THe LRMs should have their indirect fire advantages. That's fine. But there is no reason to add a damage advantage on top of it.

[Dommel]

I vote yes.
Going critical damage by reciving 1 LRM salvo in a light mech(jenner) seems a little OP to me.
Also had an instance where a streak SRM catapult destroyed my left arm in 1 shot.. also a bit OP?
Both these instances is at the beginning of the match, full armor on everything except legs.

[Ashnod]

Dommel, on 02 November 2012 - 03:20 AM, said:

I vote yes.
Going critical damage by reciving 1 LRM salvo in a light mech(jenner) seems a little OP to me.
Also had an instance where a streak SRM catapult destroyed my left arm in 1 shot.. also a bit OP?
Both these instances is at the beginning of the match, full armor on everything except legs.

Doesn't really happen unless your not moving, and you should pretty much always be moving, weaving, etc.


Also about the streak cat, 8 streak 2's doing 2.5 damage per missile.. yea You are playing a light mech you need to realize how fragile you are, and do your damn best to avoid as much damage as possible.

Edited by Ashnod, 02 November 2012 - 03:23 AM.