593 replies to this topic

[Rejarial Galatan]

Howlin Wolf, on 01 May 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

Compressed time i can see. But how in the world can compressed time be justified during battle? While a mech is in repair mode does that force the time to speed up so everyone is shooting at each other in the same ratio as the repair/reload is being done?

just compress time to speed up the repair or rearm to make it feasable in game.

[Ravn]

Like an arcade game.

[Kudzu]

Ravn, on 01 May 2012 - 07:31 PM, said:

This is planetary conquest son! I'm not going to risk my Mech for some Sh__ty halo flag.

But would you risk it for an advanced prototype (or enemy officer, maps, McGuffin device, whatever) that needs to be captured from an enemy firebase and quickly brought back to your intel officer? Follow orders, soldier!

[Rejarial Galatan]

Ravn, on 01 May 2012 - 07:34 PM, said:

Like an arcade game.

well, they sure as heck will NOT keep time 1:1 when it comes to jumping system to system now will they? why not do the same on a smaller scale for repair/reload?

[Zylo]

Rejarial Galatan, on 01 May 2012 - 07:25 PM, said:

Zylo Zylo Zylo. I am a HUGE supporter of MFB's or some other system of repair reload, BUT, I am NOT asking for unlimited ammo or repairs. I AM saying the system SHOULD and MUST be there. Better to HAVE it and NOT need it, than to NEED it and NOT have it ya know? Hell, if they do it right, the MFB or w/e the repair mechanism is, COULD run out and SHOULD run out of supplies after so many uses <like 3-4 depending on ya know, the devs>. I am a pray and spray with my M240B LMG on BF3, extended mag 200 rounds per box, with 2 boxes unless i drop a kit. soo much fun that. but, i digress

The point is by asking for repair/rearm you essentially ARE asking for unlimited ammo as you can just keep refilling as needed. It upsets the balance of ammo weapons vs energy if you can just load minimal ammo and stick near the resupply point.

[Rejarial Galatan]

bloody hell. ill say this again: let the repair/rearm system have its OWN limited supply and once THATS gone, what you got is what you got till yer dead or match ends. sheesh. never SAID turn ammo limits OFF, i said, lets have the system to reload. think logistics man and think beyond this thread to the possibilities of HOW it can be implimented instead of focusing on why you think it SHOULDNT be....

[Howlin Wolf]

Rejarial Galatan, on 01 May 2012 - 07:31 PM, said:

just compress time to speed up the repair or rearm to make it feasable in game.

If rearm/repair is compressed, then firing speed and other mech actions should be ramped to match the time compression.

Edited by Howlin Wolf, 01 May 2012 - 07:54 PM.

[Ravn]

Kudzu, on 01 May 2012 - 07:34 PM, said:

But would you risk it for an advanced prototype (or enemy officer, maps, McGuffin device, whatever) that needs to be captured from an enemy firebase and quickly brought back to your intel officer? Follow orders, soldier!

Because I plan on killing everyone and taking that firebase as well.

Edit: Lol, did the elephant die?

Edited by Ravn, 01 May 2012 - 07:41 PM.

[Zylo]

Rejarial Galatan, on 01 May 2012 - 07:30 PM, said:

And those who refuse to accept the idea of a repair and reload system will not be swayed, my hope is that the devs are swayed in some fasion for a useable and feasable repair/reload/coolant flush system. ya, i dragged that last one over here lol. Ill buy this thread a beer later if its embarassed.

Heat removal by the heatsinks in a way works as a sort ammo for energy weapons. Coolant flush because you overheat easy is really no different a concept than staying near a rearm point to reload because you chose a small ammo load. It just reinforces poor habits of pilots who can not manage heat buildup or ammo depletion. I'm against both being added.

Rejarial Galatan, on 01 May 2012 - 07:39 PM, said:

bloody hell. ill say this again: let the repair/rearm system have its OWN limited supply and once THATS gone, what you got is what you got till yer dead or match ends. sheesh. never SAID turn ammo limits OFF, i said, lets have the system to reload. think logistics man and think beyond this thread to the possibilities of HOW it can be implimented instead of focusing on why you think it SHOULDNT be....

That would result in a race to throw as much ammo at the enemy team then run back to ninja the ammo load before the rest of your team can rearm. Sounds like a good way to kill any real teamwork.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Howlin Wolf, on 01 May 2012 - 07:40 PM, said:

If rearm/repair is compressed then firing speed should be ramped to match the time compression.

lordy. NO. I meant speed the effing repair/reload cycle up, not the bloody match or weapon cyclic times. sheesh

[Ravn]

Yup, Rej's elephant has gone astray again.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Zylo, real team work IMHO was killed when a built in VOIP was shelved to NOT be put in. While I admit PREMADE teams/merc corps with private servers for a VOIP WILL have GOOD cohesion, PUG groups will not. period. I can almost gurantee with about 99.99% certainty MOST players will NOT pay any attention to a chat box, when the SH** hits the fan in a fight, namely first enemy contact.

[Volthorne]

Rejarial Galatan, on 01 May 2012 - 07:53 PM, said:

Zylo, real team work IMHO was killed when a built in VOIP was shelved to NOT be put in. While I admit PREMADE teams/merc corps with private servers for a VOIP WILL have GOOD cohesion, PUG groups will not. period. I can almost gurantee with about 99.99% certainty MOST players will NOT pay any attention to a chat box, when the SH** hits the fan in a fight, namely first enemy contact.

I have no frigging clue how many times I've said this, but....

VOIP != TEAMWORK.

Edited by Volthorne, 01 May 2012 - 07:57 PM.

[Howlin Wolf]

Rejarial Galatan, on 01 May 2012 - 07:51 PM, said:

lordy. NO. I meant speed the effing repair/reload cycle up, not the bloody match or weapon cyclic times. sheesh

I think everyone should take advantage of the time compression not just the ones that wasted their ammo or loaded short before the match.

Edited by Howlin Wolf, 01 May 2012 - 08:03 PM.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Ravn, the elephant isnt goin astray people are soo tunnel visioned on the why NOT have this sytem and ammo easy button, they keep ignoring alot of factors that make this system a wonderful idea if done right, and ive faith PGI can do just that. Look, so you guys understand my logic and my drive, let me explain.

I am in no way saying that us vets have any real need for things like a Repair/Reload system or even a Coolant flush system. Especially if you played TT or MW2 back before the games took odd turns <MW3/4 namely> Heck, I would say for us vets, NOT using those systems can be badges of honor or pride or w/e. BUT, what you guys consistently forget is this. By our word of mouth to friends and family and then spreading beyond that depending on how enthusiastically we speak, and then the inevitable awesome campaign PGI will put on, we WILL get players who before this moment in time have NEVER read the novels, seen the cartoon, played ANY of the titles in the MW Franchise or played TT or read ANY of the source material. While, MOST if not ALL of these forums are vets, we will get non vets.

Look, When I speak so fervently on why we should have these systems, I am speaking for those who have yeat to hear of this wonderful universe, but will come to play when word gets out. I speak for those who have all their lives had the easy button in games, like World of Warcraft before Cataclysm hit, and have no clue what it is to have a game that makes you THINK your way through what your doing. This game when we get it, if PGI does this right, WILL make you think about your options, your strategies, your tactics and so on.

Please, do not think of yourselves in this issue, think of those who will come fresh to this franchise. If done right, heatmanagement will be a wonderful thing, but, the easy button crowd will not get it and end up quitting because they died when the mech shut down and they got pasted or because they FOUND shut down over ride and blew up because the reactor blew up from heat. That happens enough to new players and they WILL quit, especially if they are not cared for by GIVING them the chance to cool the mech with 2-3 seconds of coolant. THey will learn with this sorta system how to do things the best way for themselves. BUT, if you say: Its a stupid system, its flawed its this or that, then you take that chance to learn away from them. In all my pleading with you guys, I never once said THIS is HOW it MUST be done, I said this is HOW it COULD be done. I never said you MUST use these mechanics, I said you COULD use them.

Please do not out right dismiss these ideas because you find them distasteful to you for your own personal reasons, but, embrace them for those yet to know the thrill of taking that huge warmachine into a fight! Thank you. Also, I know this is a wall of text, sorry, but, yall hopefully see why I am so fervent on this.

[Zylo]

Rejarial Galatan, on 01 May 2012 - 07:53 PM, said:

Zylo, real team work IMHO was killed when a built in VOIP was shelved to NOT be put in. While I admit PREMADE teams/merc corps with private servers for a VOIP WILL have GOOD cohesion, PUG groups will not. period. I can almost gurantee with about 99.99% certainty MOST players will NOT pay any attention to a chat box, when the SH** hits the fan in a fight, namely first enemy contact.

Pug matches may not have perfect teamwork but that's not really a balance issue if it's 2 pug teams without voice chat fighting each other. There will be at least some teamwork even without voice though it would be expected that a pre-made team with voice would have superior teamwork, that is only logical. Even without voice chat if there is some sort of map marking system with waypoints or whatever that may be enough for basic teamwork. Something like the waypoints marking the map in Planetside could be quite effective in the absence of voice chat.

The issue with limited ammo resupply however would reduce the teamwork even more as players would try to score early kills with rush+spray&pray tactics, then run back to reload to grab all their ammo before it ran out. It would make limited teamwork in pug matches even worse.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Zylo, I ask you to please read my post directly above yours. May clear up my point, and end this debate. I hope

[Zylo]

Rejarial Galatan, on 01 May 2012 - 08:04 PM, said:

Please do not out right dismiss these ideas because you find them distasteful to you for your own personal reasons, but, embrace them for those yet to know the thrill of taking that huge warmachine into a fight! Thank you. Also, I know this is a wall of text, sorry, but, yall hopefully see why I am so fervent on this.

Sounds like the only person with tunnel vision is you wanting all these assistance mechanics like coolant flush and ammo reloads to make up for not being able to manage heat and ammo.

New players would never miss features that were never included but they may in fact have an ADVANTAGE over someone who might rely on these systems as they have developed no bad habits. You're afraid of losing a feature you have come to rely on (coolant flush), aren't you?

[Howlin Wolf]

I am hopeful that the devs wont just throw new players into the fray and there will be a practice area as i read suggested elsewhere in these forums for people to get acquainted and learn what they need before they drop into a zone. I believe education beats easy button anyday.

[Volthorne]

Rejarial, you're arguing for a system that would dumb down the learning curve. While I normally would agree with this FOR ANY OTHER TITLE, keep that **** out of a simulator. People learn better the hard way, anyway. If it works IRL it damn well works in a sim.

On MFBs/Ammo stockpiles: Re-arming mid fight is the dumbest thing you can do. If you didn't bring enough bullets, that's YOUR fault. Note I didn't say "reload" as that applies specifically to putting a fresh mag/more bullets into your gun from your on-hand supply.

On coolant flushes: Hell ****ing no. Not only are you venting tons of hot plasma from your reactor, you're adding in a vulnerable hatch that would be incredibly easy to blow through. Basically you're TRYING to get yourself killed with this.