155 replies to this topic

[Thorn Hallis]

Red October911, on 31 May 2012 - 08:10 PM, said:

I know this is a bit off topic and going back to real world stuff, but is the CC really actually a dictatorship or is it considered a dictatorship just like America say USSR as a dictatorship?

*I feel this post was too serious, so here's the pic of a smiling kitteh XD*

Lets say it this way: The Capellan Confederation is as much a dictatorship as the other successor states are, rulership is decided by birthright.

And I love the kitten.

[Minatorc]

We're not a dictatorship we're a monarchy.
Calling Hanse Davion a blithering ***** in a public place wont lead to your disappearance in the middle of the night. Saying the same about Romano in Capellan space will land you in a world of pain.
But to be honest here all the House leaders are megalomaniac egomaniacs.

edit: test *****
edit 2: wow i-d-i-o-t gets censored.

Edited by Minatorc, 01 June 2012 - 02:04 AM.

[Balls of Steele]

Hanse Davion is an eejit. Nope, that doesn't seem to get censored.

[Adridos]

Minatorc, on 01 June 2012 - 02:02 AM, said:

Calling Hanse Davion a blithering ***** in a public place wont lead to your disappearance in the middle of the night.

Of course not. They will wait for another day and then make an example of you:

Starting with the 30th century version of this:



And then make a Capellan/ Kuritan spy out of you and execute you in the public. That's the way kingdoms Davions are based on worked and the same applies to them.

[Balls of Steele]

That stuff looks more kinky than threatening.

[Egomane]

Balls of Steele, on 01 June 2012 - 08:21 AM, said:

That stuff looks more kinky than threatening.

I blame tha Internetz! I can clearly see, how a leather dressed Hanse Davion, armed with a nine-tailed whip, stands before his victim. Who did nothing else then to tell the world that Hanse is a sadistic and opressive tyrant. Poor guy!

[Minatorc]

Adridos, on 01 June 2012 - 04:03 AM, said:

Of course not. They will wait for another day and then make an example of you:

Starting with the 30th century version of this:



And then make a Capellan/ Kuritan spy out of you and execute you in the public. That's the way kingdoms Davions are based on worked and the same applies to them.

Exactly, keeping it all above board and legal

[Serevn]

Its been stated over and over that its the strength of the Capellan Confederation's people that have helped it to not only survive but prosper yet people keep saying that the Capellan Confederation's people are oppressed... as the smallest Successor State it has survived thanks to the dedication and skill of its citizens and soldiers despite other Powers attempts to wipe them off the face of the Inner Sphere.

[GoLambo]

Liaos people have survived and thrived in spite of their leadership, and you can frankly say the same about most of the inner sphere. I like the Davions mostly more because they have arguably the best military structure in the inner sphere, and have a fair number of colorful characters, places, and mechs I've always favored. And while Davions are really noted for having a lot of corrupt low level lords and a really spotty standard of living, at least not everyone in the leadership is painted as so consistently bad. Liao uses completely needless human rights abuses abound in the fiction at nearly every level of leadership. Davions got some bright spots among compared the callous execution of civilians en mass.

As for Liao, all the factions aren't that great but I just find the mustache twirling villianism too off putting, and green just isn't my favorite color. They're practically the hipster faction of Battletech now though, and they enjoy such popular support among players they're hardly going to be an underdog in game anymore, especially with the Goons involved. I look forward to the challenge at least, because I know Liao is going to have some of the best and brightest and I cant shoot kuritans.

Also note that I am Davion fan and hardcore socialist, the fans aren't all died from the same wool.

Edited by golambo, 02 June 2012 - 04:09 AM.

[feetjai]

Why House Liao? I don't know the details of each house, but I am born "in real " as an asian, so my heritage lies with the Liao's.
So it's just normal that I find more attachment to the Liao's.

From what I read in the forums, I do kinda like our history as someone else has said: "We are the underdog", but we always get up with our heads high, in honor and continue the battle again. Until the day we may rest....."

Edited by feetjai, 02 June 2012 - 04:00 AM.

[Adridos]

golambo, on 02 June 2012 - 03:40 AM, said:

...and they enjoy such popular support among players they're hardly going to be an underdog in game anymore...

Charts are against you. We are still the least supported faction, despite making Catapults, Ravens and Cataphracts.

[GoLambo]

Adridos, on 02 June 2012 - 04:12 AM, said:

Charts are against you. We are still the least supported faction, despite making Catapults, Ravens and Cataphracts.

That might be the case with the rabble, but most of the hardcore players I know are going Liao and it looks like the Goons are too. Goons hopping on the bandwagon is going to swell your ranks, I promise that.

[Max Liao]

Give me back Chesterton, and we'll be cool.

[Youngblood]

golambo, on 02 June 2012 - 03:40 AM, said:

I like the Davions mostly more because they have arguably the best military structure in the inner sphere, and have a fair number of colorful characters, places, and mechs I've always favored.

Speaking of militaries specifically, I like the CCAF a lot because it's much the opposite of the the AFFS. I think the laissez-faire command of the CCAF allowed for a lot of units, ideas, and characters that carried the beginnings of something truly original in sci-fi, almost real in their conglomeration of themes we used to find interesting in the 1980s.

I find Davion structure to be too rigid (Really? Units whose only defining trait is that they have Heavy 'Mechs? Come on.) and many of their frontline 'Mechs to be extraordinarily cheesy (so they can beat the bad guys, of course! Why tout that you're an Autocannon faction when you have the BEST missile boats AND energy boats?). Then the fact that they end up in bed with the faction that makes almost EVERY 'Mech only serves to make them more bland in my eyes. To me, "having everything" and "being the best at it all because there's no other way we can be" is just reeking of adolescent fantasy to me.

Quote

And while Davions are really noted for having a lot of corrupt low level lords and a really spotty standard of living, at least not everyone in the leadership is painted as so consistently bad. Liao uses completely needless human rights abuses abound in the fiction at nearly every level of leadership. Davions got some bright spots among compared the (sic) callous execution of civilians en mass.

That's an impression colored highly by excessive reading of the Warrior Trilogy, and also ignorance of the overall reality that the Inner Sphere as a story is trying to present. Not everyone can be happy in feudalism, and those (both in- and out-of-universe) who try to believe otherwise are simply deceiving themselves.

BattleTech has long left behind its infantile stage of black-and-white Mad Max culture, and the good and bad things that happen are now depicted almost like a facsimile testament to the achievements and downfalls of mankind, making it far deeper than the great majority of science fiction plots out there nowadays.

Quote

As for Liao, all the factions aren't that great but I just find the mustache twirling villianism too off putting, and green just isn't my favorite color. They're practically the hipster faction of Battletech now though, and they enjoy such popular support among players they're hardly going to be an underdog in game anymore, especially with the Goons involved. I look forward to the challenge at least, because I know Liao is going to have some of the best and brightest and I cant shoot kuritans.

Also note that I am Davion fan and hardcore socialist, the fans aren't all died from the same wool.

Best be trollin', FedRat. I see Capellan-bashing up and down mwomercs.com/forums, all day and night. Besides, most people don't go Capellan because they want to feel good about being evil. I'll leave the real reasons to your imagination, however.

[Ebynfel]

As a consumate merc, I honestly can say that I love that Davion/Liao border:)

On a serious notes, both realms have great merit. Being a Merc, both nations espouse their uses and take care of them well. They negotiate fair contracts, and for the most part, make good. there is very little for a merc not to like about either.

Now let's dig a little deeper. Many in Fedrat space say that the people of the Capellan Confederation are not free. They are enslaved and do the bidding of tyranical masters(the same is said looking from the other side back), but this is simply not true. The Capellans enjoy great personal freedoms, much unlike the Draconis Combine of House kurita. They have limits on what can be said, but so long as they support their government, they can be anything they dream of if they have the talents. Nothing wrong with that.

On the Suns' people, it is very similar. The people are free and taken care of for the most part, and enjoy great freedoms. This changes here, however, from worltd to world more often than in Capellan space. The Capellans have a much stronger centralized policy as the Suns has a much stronger feudal policy. Again, nothing wrong with this.

On the side of the militaries, both are amazing. The Capellans can scrap. They make do with what they have and are ingenious in tactics. The Federated Suns has an incredibly strong training program and brilliant strategic minds, and founded the RCT(Regimental Combat Team) formation found in combined arms tactics. There are equals to be drawn here, though there is no doubt the Suns has more problems than house Liao. Liao's other border is much less menacing i nthe form of the Free World's League, which is a very big reason why the warmachine of the Suns has not overrun them. Every time the Suns makes a dedicated assault into Liao space, the Combine punishes them for it by taking advantage of a more lightly defended border. The Piranha Principle at work in full effect.

honestly, I like them both from an outside looking in type of view, and can side with either easily. It's when you go Combine or Lyran i have problems.

[GoLambo]

Youngblood, on 02 June 2012 - 04:53 AM, said:

Best be trollin', FedRat. I see Capellan-bashing up and down mwomercs.com/forums, all day and night. Besides, most people don't go Capellan because they want to feel good about being evil. I'll leave the real reasons to your imagination, however.

All those harsh words and you call me a troll? Rich. Maybe you're not familiar with Goonswarm or Something Awful but I can tell you the world of Mechwarrior fans does not end on this forum. Liao may be unpopular at a glance but that's hardly the case with the less casual crowd. Don't fool yourself into thinking that your perspective is so unique, Battletech fans the world over have grown a big ol soft spot for Liao ever sinse Sun Tzu made it into the canon. They're going to be popular. They're going to have some of the best players, and lots of them. You're not the underdogs anymore, just the grognard faction.

I can almost guarantee the real underdogs are going to be Marik anyway.

[Adridos]

golambo, on 02 June 2012 - 07:18 AM, said:

All those harsh words and you call me a troll? Rich. Maybe you're not familiar with Goonswarm or Something Awful but I can tell you the world of Mechwarrior fans does not end on this forum.

Battletech fans the world over have grown a big ol soft spot for Liao ever sinse Sun Tzu made it into the canon. They're going to be popular.

He didn't call you a troll. The statement "Best be trollin'" is modern equivalent of " You better be joking".

And as for the popularity of Liao, we don't have the Sun Tzu and we're still that "punching bag all teh ******** live in and are being ruled by crazy leaders" Liking Sun Tzu's Confederation is easy, but loving the old Confederation (the one we're going to play as) is a completely different thing.

Also, we always had the best players around. Good players seek challenge, and being such an underdog certainly is one.

[Citizen Louis]

I like Liao; almost always have. I started playing the board game as Steiner, but switched to Liao after a few years because they were more interesting. I sacked New Avalon once in the board game Succession Wars (granted it was the first Succession War Scenario), and the guy playing Davion quit in shame. I'm probably only an average BattleTech player, and a mediocore mechwarrior, but I've earned my citizenship. The Vindicator is a solid mech who always seems to perform decently regardless of the scenario. I hope they add the Vindicator at some point in the not too distant future. They portayed the Davions as infallible, which is why I do not like them.

[Thorn Hallis]

Ebynfel, on 02 June 2012 - 05:12 AM, said:

...and founded the RCT(Regimental Combat Team) formation found in combined arms tactics.

That concept was allready around in the days of the Reunification Wars.

[Tifalia]

Volturnus, on 30 April 2012 - 04:40 AM, said:

Part of the reason I like House Liao so much is the fact that there are so few of us, and most of us seem to be pretty familiar with one another. I like things to be close-knit that way. It's nice to get on the forums at night and see the same guys in green that have always been there.

I'm with the CapCon, now and always.

I support this.