62 replies to this topic

[indigo]

Ok ... this really makes me think ... why????
(I'm pretty sure that this issue has been mentioned before, but I still dont get how the design team won't listen tot the comunity....)

So lets say ... we have a "Hero" mech ... YLW ... and you like it ... or not ... besides the point. U play a lot with it and get more and more experienced with the particular version of a CNT chasis... This all goes naturally with unlocks which you get through experience.... until u get to "Elite" unlocks....

Now you have to BUY 3 different versions of CNT just to go and unlock the rest???
So... if you want to improve your mech with advanced stuff, which you are able to install because you spent so much time in that particular chasis, you need to spend time in OTHER versions of the same. WTF? Many of those versions are so far apart from each other in terms of gameplay that sometimes it is more logical to compare it to other chasis or even a class...

OK .. so will someone give me one SANE reason why I need to spend almost C$13000000 (=135!!!!!!! matches with average of 96000 pay per match) just to be able to unlock progression of the unlocks .... Oh yeah ... not to mention the extra experience you need to gain ...Situation gets even worse if you go up in the heavier classes ... it becomes nearly impossible

or .. WAIT!!!! You can always BUY the MC credit and without playing unlock these... there you are ... if that is not pay to win I really don't know it anymore....

I play particular version of the chasis, for me the most logical way of thinking is:
- you play a certain config so long that you get so much experience that you may become elite
- but due to the different gameplay styles between the versions ... that has absolutelly NO connection to the rest of the chasis or buying 3 different versions just to unlock your progression
- if you want to make it difficult to become elite and to make these modules/unlocks something special make it more expensive in XP instead in something I can buy with hard currency or C$...

this said ... I am sitting here with almost 44000 experience points on my YLW which I cannot use due to the fact that I find the rest of the centurions not fun to play and would rather spend C$ on other chasis... This way I can continue to play in my YLW for next 2 years ... become MORE than elite in it and still not be able to unlock the "Elite" stuff...

To make things even worse ... it costs MONEY to transfer these XP points to GXP points ??? WTF?

[Lon3Wo1f]

I don't like the three 'Mech variants to unlock Elite and Master but it is not p2w as you claim. You can buy those other variants with CBills and while it will take longer you can still do it all for free. If it was p2w you would only have the option to use actual money whereas here it's used in a typical f2p situation. If you want to do it for free you can but it'll take you longer and if you want to do it sooner you can pay for it.

I have 3 Cats and 3 Atlas but don't necessarily like them all. I still went through the process of grinding each Atlas and I'm doing the same with the Cats now. I have MC so I could use the mountain of XP I have on my Founders 'Mechs but I'm avoiding that route. It's painful at times but I feel like I've really earned those perks when I get them.

[Nicholas The 2nd]

You will need to spend MC to converting XP to GXP or to spend MC to buy new mechbays. Without MC it is possible to have only 2 elite chassis.
So to make a long story short, this system is mading you to buy and spend MC.

Edited by Nicholas The 2nd, 20 November 2012 - 05:47 AM.

[SgtExo]

Nicholas The 2nd, on 20 November 2012 - 05:47 AM, said:

You will need to spend MC to converting XP to GXP or to spend MC to buy new mechbays. Without MC it is possible to have only 2 elite chassis.
So to make a long story short, this system is mading you to buy and spend MC.

Not true, you could concentrate on one chassie, and when finished, sell it off and start on another one. You wont lose your unlocks if you sell your mech. It might be more expensive in C-Bills, but its duable which means that it isnt p2w.

[GT Hawk]

NOT play to win. Wang not a win any match mech.

And sorry but I agree with the 3 mechs to get elete. The idea is that you are a elete pilot of that specific STYLE of mech. So to be amazing at a style of mech you need to work up severlal versions of it. I am working on cent right now with a Yang, AL and A versions. all uild a little diffrentley and all I am enjoying beyond all else. The idea is you have to PLAY the game, thats it. Playing gets you cash with gets you more mechs which allowes you to level up aid mechs.

[DeeSaster]

Nicholas The 2nd, on 20 November 2012 - 05:47 AM, said:

So to make a long story short, this system is mading you to buy and spend MC.

Wrong. You MAY spend MC to speed up the process, you do not have to do it at all. Just about how a F2P game should work IMO.

[Mavorock]

Personally, I enjoy the current state of the unlocks. Though I question the balance of these unlocks, I think it helps make me a more flexible pilot.

[indigo]

Lon3Wo1f, on 20 November 2012 - 05:39 AM, said:

I don't like the three 'Mech variants to unlock Elite and Master but it is not p2w as you claim. You can buy those other variants with CBills and while it will take longer you can still do it all for free. If it was p2w you would only have the option to use actual money whereas here it's used in a typical f2p situation. If you want to do it for free you can but it'll take you longer and if you want to do it sooner you can pay for it.

I have 3 Cats and 3 Atlas but don't necessarily like them all. I still went through the process of grinding each Atlas and I'm doing the same with the Cats now. I have MC so I could use the mountain of XP I have on my Founders 'Mechs but I'm avoiding that route. It's painful at times but I feel like I've really earned those perks when I get them.

So I see... you EARNED those 3 by investing SO MUCH TIME ... I guess you'd feel a lot less comfortable if I'd just "buy" myself to the same level of experience with $... THAT is what I'm talking about ... it is NOT fair..

I see so many comments here like: "it's not P2W because you can play and earn C$ and buy the same" Yeah sure .. the same argument would be valid in a situation where you'd need to play 20000hours just to get an AC20 ... is that OK?

GT Hawk, on 20 November 2012 - 05:54 AM, said:

NOT play to win. Wang not a win any match mech.

And sorry but I agree with the 3 mechs to get elete. The idea is that you are a elete pilot of that specific STYLE of mech. So to be amazing at a style of mech you need to work up severlal versions of it. I am working on cent right now with a Yang, AL and A versions. all uild a little diffrentley and all I am enjoying beyond all else. The idea is you have to PLAY the game, thats it. Playing gets you cash with gets you more mechs which allowes you to level up aid mechs.

I am sorry but I have to disagree with you ... if you think that all those versions share the same style then you are not playing it at Elite level ... sure basically they seem similar .. butas you go up in the skill they start to deviate as they should ... and there is the point again ... being Elite for one specific chasis or version of it doesn't mean you are for all of them ... yet this system implies this ...

[Cleverbird]

Dot dot dot

*ahem* I do kinda agree... I have a Hunchback 4SP and I have absolutely no intention of getting any of the others, but I'm forced to do so if I want to get those elite unlocks

[Sevaradan]

None issue. It takes maybe a day to grind enough cbills to buy a med mech.

[indigo]

Sevaradan, on 20 November 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

None issue. It takes maybe a day to grind enough cbills to buy a med mech.

Really? Let's C ... 3 versions of CNT chasis - Need approx. 15407500 C$ with average 96000 payof per game.... 161 matches needed ... average timeplay ..lets say 8mins + 2-3 for prep and all ... 10 mins avg .. 1610minutes = 26.8 hours of gameplay ...
So NO ... not really on average you would need to play NON STOP for more than a day to buy all 3 versions of a medium mech ... just think how much a assault would cost ... just to unlock elite ... do your homework ....

[Taryys]

You only have to have 3 variants unlocked and YLW + 3.

This method is supported by some psychological theories on learning where a person who has a broad base of knowledge in similar areas can exceed the skill level who only has experience in one thing.

You do keep your unlocks when if you do choose to sell the mech, and can always come back to finish it later if you like.

[Reoh]

After playing several variants of the same chasis you start to understand it's systems more profoundly, that permitting you to apply better system tweaks to squeeze more potential out of it. Incidentally, doing so and grinding out the 3 variants (of which I thought the YLW counts as one anyway?) you can afford o not only **** those mechs out but also get a surplus stash of cash to drop on whatever mech chasis you choose to work on next.

Makes sense to me.

[Broceratops]

in theory it should be fun to play a different playstyle for a while instead of the same thing over and over.

[Sevaradan]

indigo, on 20 November 2012 - 06:31 AM, said:

Really? Let's C ... 3 versions of CNT chasis - Need approx. 15407500 C$ with average 96000 payof per game.... 161 matches needed ... average timeplay ..lets say 8mins + 2-3 for prep and all ... 10 mins avg .. 1610minutes = 26.8 hours of gameplay ...
So NO ... not really on average you would need to play NON STOP for more than a day to buy all 3 versions of a medium mech ... just think how much a assault would cost ... just to unlock elite ... do your homework ....

Did I say anything about 3 versions? You guys must have horrible win %s or something. I've mastered out the atlas, hunchback, cat and jenner since OB started non premium, non founders and still have more cash left over than I could spend, (at least until a new mech I want to play comes out) somewhere around 35 million last time I actually looked at the c-bill #s.

[The Herrick]

Sevaradan, on 20 November 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

None issue. It takes maybe a day to grind enough cbills to buy a med mech.

Yeah. If you spend the entire day doing it.

If I want to spend 8 hours being bored to death I go to work.

Sevaradan, on 20 November 2012 - 06:43 AM, said:

Did I say anything about 3 versions? You guys must have horrible win %s or something. I've mastered out the atlas, hunchback, cat and jenner since OB started non premium, non founders and still have more cash left over than I could spend, (at least until a new mech I want to play comes out) somewhere around 35 million last time I actually looked at the c-bill #s.

[citation needed] Gonna need some images to back up that statement, bub.

Also most of us have low win rates because we don't circlejerk in premades.

[Sevaradan]

The Herrick, on 20 November 2012 - 06:46 AM, said:

Also most of us have low win rates because we don't circlejerk in premades.

So your saying you want them to change the game for you because you intentionally loose more and make less $?

[DangerousFat]

The CN9-D can be built exactly the same as the Yen Lo Wang, so if you only like the YLW's play style you can 100% replicate it with that one. The CN9-A can be built nearly identically to how most people build the YLW as well, perhaps with a smaller engine, so take some more heat sinks or an AMS or something to compensate. Still, same gameplay. No offense, but your argument just falls flat.

As for pay-2-win... good Lord will people stop using that term wrong. Pay-2-win ONLY refers to being able to buy something with money, that cannot be bought with freely earned credits, that ALSO offers a distinct advantage. Gold rounds in World of Tanks is exactly the definition of pay-2-win, but there is literally nothing in MWO at the moment that fits this definition. Buying time is not pay-2-win, it's pay-2-save-time. I've mastered, MASTERED 3 Catapult chassis, 3 Centurion Chassis, 3 Raven Chassis, 3 Dragon Chassis, and 2 of my 3 Hunchback Chassis since Open Beta launched and the only MC I've spent has been to get the YLW because I WANTED the YLW. You absolutely do not have to spend a dime on the game if you don't want to and that makes any pay-2-win argument 100% invalid. End of discussion.

I'm sorry you don't like the other Centurion chassis, I personally think you're missing out. The CN9-A is a fantastic chassis, I run it with an LBX10, 3 - SSRMs, and 2 - Medium Lasers and it is an absolute blast to play and annihilates light mechs and puts out serious damage against all other chassis. You can generally make any chassis work for you, if you take the time to think about your builds, but I think you need to branch out and try new things. You might like some weapons you didn't think you would if you really gave them a chance over 10 or so matches and not just for one drop and then immediately make up your mind that you hate it. I HATED the AC/20 at first, but I respect it now, it has its place and I will use it when I need that weapon role filled again. I still prefer the Gauss, but I won't kick and scream about using the AC/20 anymore.

[Gristle]

indigo, on 20 November 2012 - 05:18 AM, said:

...So lets say ... we have a "Hero" mech ... YLW ... and you like it ... or not ... besides the point. U play a lot with it and get more and more experienced with the particular version of a CNT chasis... This all goes naturally with unlocks which you get through experience.... until u get to "Elite" unlocks....... if that is not pay to win I really don't know it anymore....

...

Wait....What?

You have a YLW, so obviously you don't have a problem spending money on this game, and also understand paying for convenience, at least at some level, then are going to rant about P2W and having to spend the MC that you've already bought to make it convenient to get the Elite and Master perks on your YLW?

Edited by Gristle, 20 November 2012 - 06:56 AM.

[Cole Allard]

No, actually...

he is saying he didnt pay a dime, but wants the same progress through all the mechs as a premium member has. Being able to play for free is not enough...he wants it made easyer (or faster) to get the nice skills without to much of a grind...or he wants an explanation why its like this. Thing is, you can explain it as much as you want, he wont like the answer and will make you responsible for everything if you dare answer.

And...circlejerk...good one...you play alone in your little room, I just join game with friends. While playing I meet people from all over the world, what is very nice actually. You? You get a visit once in an hour from you cat while you wonder where the 7 people you play with are going.

To each, his own?