445 replies to this topic

[Suki]

Kaijin, on 21 November 2012 - 12:27 PM, said:

The Streak Cat is the answer to poor netcode.

Broceratops showed me what the answer to the Streak Cat is....

The AC/20 Cat.

Rock...Paper...Scissors

The answer to the streak cat is also Cataphract 4x, it just rips Cata to shreds with its 4 AC5

[Blastcaps]

siLve00, on 20 November 2012 - 03:09 PM, said:

the only repatched the missing part.. nothing else.. streaks still spread out a bit but dont miss anymore.

gosh learn finaly to play vs a 270m range weapon.. thats so hard i can even avoid it with my medium mechs.

every1 can use it.. leave it or take it... make PGI fix the code.

actualy they can hit out to about 450m or so

[Weiland]

Captain Midnight, on 21 November 2012 - 10:09 PM, said:

Removing the shake, having them randomly target every component besides the head. Then they're just like LRMs.

I feel like I'm repeating myself Weiland, because you keep comparing the deadliness of streaks (which require ZERO skill) to ballistic weapons that require a great deal of skill. Should a braindead 5yr old in a streak A1 even be in the same ballpark as a seasoned veteran who has spent 100 hours working on his accuracy with a weapon-system and mech? I don't think so. Right now Streak A1s are S-tier "best mech in the game" level powerful and even if you CAN beat them with your premade group, a premade group can beat anything in this horrible pugged out 4v4v4v4 landscape we have ATM.

Streaks are one of the best weapons in the game, and require the least skill in the game. I just can't believe you don't see a problem with that. I feel like you are arguing with me because you don't like me at this point not because you have a legitimate opinion on streaks.

My point is that Streakcats are only as overpowered as the opposing pilot is unprepared or unable to handle them. I run up against streakcats all the time - and smack them down with impunity. They have severe downsides and they don't improve with skill - they're just baseline decent. I don't like them on the field and I give them pretty high priority on the "**** that target up" scale, but that's just because they're a threat.

In the last couple matches I played, I took down six A1s that were armed with streaks. I'm in a slow-*** mech - one of the things a Streak kitty is weak to.

Play the mech's weaknesses or avoid it and let a teammate that can handle it do the job.

[hanitora]

I wish they'd add toggle functionality in the game. Like so you could toggle a weapon group "on" so it's constantly firing non-stop until you toggle it off again.
I'd do that with my streaks, then I'd just mouseover enemies.
Actually, I think I could construct a toggle like that.. hmm. I'm going to give this idea a try

[MustrumRidcully]

topgun505, on 21 November 2012 - 10:39 PM, said:

@MustrumRidcully

6 missile hardpoints are not the problem per-se. The problem is you are building an entire mech design around a single weapon system that take little skill to use and negates a current major issue of the game (net-code) in order to gain a tactical advantage over everyone else. To put it in terms of other weapons .. it would be like you give a player a piece of equipment that allows all their lasers to operate with 0-heat generation. Can you imagine what would happen? You'd have laser-boats running out of control all over the place. I'm seeing more and more Streak-cats on teams over time. It used to be I would see 1 per team every couple of games. Now I'm seeing an average of 2-3 per team pretty much EVERY game. To me that's a pretty big warning flag that something may be out of balance.

it still sounds to me as if the weapon was the problem, not the number of hard points.


If there is a "little skill" weapon that is as effective as "high skill" weapons, and this becomes a notable problem if you can equip 6 of them... Then maybe the weapon itself is imbalanced. Of course, if you have just one weapon out of an arsenal of 6 that is twice as strong as the rest, that's less impressive than having 6 weapons that are all twice as as strong as the alternative, but it still points out that this weapon is too powerful.

The only thing 6 hard points of one kind point out is which weapons are imbalanced. Boating isn't automatically overpowered, otherwise we'd crap our pants when we see an Awesome with 6 PPCs.

[Weiland]

MustrumRidcully, on 21 November 2012 - 11:43 PM, said:

it still sounds to me as if the weapon was the problem, not the number of hard points.


If there is a "little skill" weapon that is as effective as "high skill" weapons, and this becomes a notable problem if you can equip 6 of them... Then maybe the weapon itself is imbalanced. Of course, if you have just one weapon out of an arsenal of 6 that is twice as strong as the rest, that's less impressive than having 6 weapons that are all twice as as strong as the alternative, but it still points out that this weapon is too powerful.

The only thing 6 hard points of one kind point out is which weapons are imbalanced. Boating isn't automatically overpowered, otherwise we'd crap our pants when we see an Awesome with 6 PPCs.

I say that it's the skill of the average player. SSRMs take advantage of stupidity and inanity more than anything. They don't get better with skill, but players generally get better with time. Generally.

[Suki]

Tarball, on 21 November 2012 - 03:12 PM, said:

You need an option to address the real problem, Blur and screen shake. I could protect my lights from streak cats if I could see my freakin screen.

let's remove screenshake at all, frome all weapons, why touch only streaks?

[Weiland]

Suki, on 21 November 2012 - 11:54 PM, said:

let's remove screenshake at all, frome all weapons, why touch only streaks?

Because you poor ******** need screen shake to tell you when you're getting hit. So do we, actually. It's a bit excessive at times but it's an important feature for both immersion and gameplay.

When they broke LRMs a while ago, they produced no screen shake whatsoever. In fact, they broke screen shake for every weapon. It was a nightmare. You never knew when you were getting hammered until you died from it, or went to fire a weapon and realized that you didn't have any weapons left to fire.

Edited by Weiland, 22 November 2012 - 12:03 AM.

[Weiland]

Seriously, y'all. Maybe adjustments need to be made, or maybe the issue is with the netcode, or maybe that a lot of players just really suck at adapting. But regardless, people need to quit QQing and learn to adapt. We're degrading into suggesting **** that would break the game just to make it easy mode, and that's no bueno, amigos.

[KinLuu]

People only believe streakcats to be overpowered/a problem, because nearly all of the current maps are focused on close range brawling. There simply is no map without at least one approach to the enemy capture zone that is covered by either hills, buildings or caves. You can easily take a full brawler build without ever having to worry about getting in range.

And close range weapons are OP at close range.

[TRIUMPH]

They aren't a weapon that was designed for competition and they're not fun to use unless you're a ********* who enjoys stomping bad players.

Want a weapon that will require skill rather than waiting for a couple of ticks of the metranome?
A player should have maintain cursor "lock" on target to guide SSRMs onto the enemy target. Reduce projectile speed to make guidance more manageable at the longer ranges but gimp it in cqc and against AMS. A player could guide missiles around curves but now saturating an area with AMS or closing the distance and looping around an enemy would make the situation about skill and positioning rather than having a full team always focus fire a streakcat into the ground even if its 500 meters out and there is an atlas being a hug wolf.

A mix of hard counters, soft counters, and player management is whats needed.

[xRaeder]

KinLuu, on 22 November 2012 - 12:15 AM, said:

People only believe streakcats to be overpowered/a problem, because nearly all of the current maps are focused on close range brawling. There simply is no map without at least one approach to the enemy capture zone that is covered by either hills, buildings or caves. You can easily take a full brawler build without ever having to worry about getting in range.

And close range weapons are OP at close range.

270m isn't close range. It is medium range considering the ranges of other weapons.

[Suki]

SamizdatCowboy, on 21 November 2012 - 05:09 PM, said:

I'm sorry but after playing the streakcat a bit more, this loadout is so unbalanced it makes me angry. There is ZERO skill, ZERO effort, and GUARANTEED massive damage.

To respond to your points:

First, I am a PUG player myself, there's no 'team coordination' I'm relying on.

Second this is not some 'magical match,' it is par for the course... look at my other screenshots and posts, and read my comment about how I only just started piloting the A1 to prove a point in this thread. My second match onwards in an A1 I've been able to consistently lay waste to the opposing team.

Third, forget kill shots. Kill shots are meaningless. Anyone can swoop in at the last second and nab the kill shot. That's why you have to look at overall damage done, and the overall damage done I'm consistently able to dish out in a streakcat is ridiculously over the top.


If it's a 1v1 or a 2v1 I'm basically guaranteed to kill the enemy mechs.. it doesn't matter if I'm up against a light or an assault. It takes coordinated focus fire from an entire lance to bring me down, and even then I'm usually able to take 2 or 3 of them with me...

No loadout should be guaranteed to win a 1v1 or 2v1.. I may be a good pilot, but I'm a good pilot in my hunchie and I was never able to dish out 900+ damage match after match... 4-5 kills, 700 damage was a great match.. it took serious effort and concentration.. in a streakcat it's a bad match when I don't rack up 4-5 kills and 700+ damage


Basically my plan is to continue ****** with the streakcat, ******* off a lot of players in the process, until the tide turns and there is enough public outcry that the balanced gets fixed. I hate it, I feel filthy doing it, I think it ruins the game, but maybe it's the only way to convince people this thing is seriously OP.

well, what can I say - a legendary founder player whith more then half a year experience trying to tell us he HAS ZERO SKILL.
not long ago my streak cat had a duel with dragon. Both teames were standing around the lake and watched. All I did is getting his armor to 80% and lived only becourse he ripped my ears firstly. All the shakes/smokes/etc. didn't help me at all. And the dragon wanted to kill me thet way destoing my parts one by one. If he started to sniping my big CT I would die more quickly.
next time centurion and dragon didn't even let me do more then 3 shots, they focused and kill me as soon as a focused one of them.

[Red Klown X]

Streak are ok , i want long range streak missile !

Streak cat is the scout hunter and the unique option for kill fast mech when your ping is high .

So dont nerf it , give us ecm .

[xRaeder]

klownnection, on 22 November 2012 - 12:23 AM, said:

Streak are ok , i want long range streak missile !

Streak cat is the scout hunter and the unique option for kill fast mech when your ping is high .

So dont nerf it , give us ecm .

A Streakcat can ripple fire his missiles at me shaking me all to hell preventing effective counter fire... and kill my Cataphract that has full armor in 20 seconds. He can do the same to an Atlas or any other Mech as well as hunt down lights. He can also use his JJs to get out of your Torso arc... negating most of your firepower.

Why the hell am I having to be told that I have to degun him... which takes longer than 20 seconds... when he will have killed me in that time?

Edited by xRaeder, 22 November 2012 - 12:28 AM.

[Captain Midnight]

A player with 1,000 games played can own a streakcat. A streakcat with 10 games played can own any player with less than 1,000 played.

REAL BALANCED.

OP =/= Undefeatable.

OP just means it is unreasonably good considering the factors involved. Such as, it's at least as good as ANY other build but it's easier to use than any other build. It's easily an S-tier weapon and it's auto-aim. It's as good in this game as hacking is in counterstrike, and people think it's fine? Incredible.

Streaks are insanely good, insanely overpowered. Full lances of 1,000+ games played founders can beat them by focusing fire and working together. That SUPPORTS the argument of them being OP, it does not refute it.

[Tsunamisan]

Personally i think they need to be dropped from 2.5 to 2pts per missile. Make the mech have to acquire lock sooner if the target goes out of LOS. Missiles shoul only fire in a cone in front of the mech. I a cat that had lock shoot streaks out his rear and no his torso couldn't see me but for some reason he still retained a lock. Some mechs can outrun streak cats some cant but another thing is AMS needs to shoot down streaks right now if i recall it shoots at them bot misses horribly if it even hits any of them. The other big question is will ECM make it so streak will not lock or make their guided less than 100% Honestly if streaks hit with a 80% chance they would still be great there should be no absolutes because then that overrides mech piloting if they know that every tim they pull the trigger they will hit.

[KinLuu]

xRaeder, on 22 November 2012 - 12:21 AM, said:

270m isn't close range. It is medium range considering the ranges of other weapons.

The medium laser has 270m aswell. And the medium laser is the classic example of a close range weapon.

Medium range for me is everything beyond 400m. Classic medium ranged weapons are the PPC and the large laser.

[Suki]

Weiland, on 22 November 2012 - 12:02 AM, said:

Because you poor ******** need screen shake to tell you when you're getting hit. So do we, actually. It's a bit excessive at times but it's an important feature for both immersion and gameplay.

When they broke LRMs a while ago, they produced no screen shake whatsoever. In fact, they broke screen shake for every weapon. It was a nightmare. You never knew when you were getting hammered until you died from it, or went to fire a weapon and realized that you didn't have any weapons left to fire.

then why removing streakshake if it helps to know you're getting damage?
Personally I'm really dissapointed in LRM's right now, I really like using them, i love when my teammate uses them profecionally on LRMboat and I really hate getting damage by them course loss of screenshake.

[One Medic Army]

Just ran into Grugore and Spitz, with their pre-made. Both of them running chain-fire Streakboats.
They both charged straight into our team with 2-3 supporters, we had superior position, were focusing fire, and outnumbered them.

We were completely slaughtered.

Next time I see them I'm just going to out of bounds myself and disconnect.
More fun and saves the repair bills.