90 replies to this topic

[StalaggtIKE]

From article:

Quote

I also asked Inoye of Piranha is happy with the recent implementation of the ECM (electronic counter-measures) system to MWO, which allows some mechs to equip radar and lock-on jamming equipment. "The effect [of ECM] is working as intended and forces players to play a lot smarter," he said. "Specialized Mechs still have their place on the battlefield but they are going to need the assistance of their teammates to succeed. If you plan on taking specialized Mech into a match, plan wisely and have alternate weapon systems that will help you with mid to long-range combat. People are thinking we need to severely 'nerf' the ECM. This is not the case at all. There is already 1 counter-ECM item in the game (TAG), and likely there will be a couple more involving modules and weapon effects."

Source: http://m.pcgamer.com...st-mode-release

Do you agree with the direction of ECM? Simple poll: yes or no.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 19 December 2012 - 10:33 AM.

[StalaggtIKE]

Bump!

[Blitz Krieg]

Loaded question is loaded.

is it perfect? No, no part of the game is perfect. A better question would be "are you satisfied with the current implementation of ECM"

[Corralis]

I'm absolutely fine with ECM, it is working as intended and it adds a new level of challenge to the game. Now I don't use LRM boats so I imagine it's annoying as hell for you guys but I am still fine with that because it stops you from sitting at the rear and just hitting one button. The game requires skill which seems to have been forgotten by nearly all gamers these days and this game requires an enormous amount of teamwork as well. So get your Tag mechs out, get your ECM mechs in counter mode and then you can rain death on people like in the old days. Remember the game has always been designed to be difficult, not like the traditional shooters you are used to from the like of EA and Activision (who clearly believe that all gamers are dumb and need their hands holding), so embrace that difficulty and learn to work with ECM. Also don't forget in 10 years ECCM comes out and then you'll be laughing again.

[Waladil]

I'm more interested in that part of Paul's quote:
"and likely there will be a couple more involving modules and weapon effects."

That statement might mean A LOT. For example, we're hearing that PPCs might get an EMP effect. So what if shooting an ECM 'Mech with a PPC turns off it's ECM for about 10 seconds? That'd be a pretty powerful counter to ECM, especially on the big Atlas D-DCs. So Paul did not emphasize that all of ECM's play and counter-play are finished, just that they've got that aspect the way they want.

[StalaggtIKE]

Blitz Krieg, on 14 December 2012 - 03:01 PM, said:

Loaded question is loaded.

is it perfect? No, no part of the game is perfect. A better question would be "are you satisfied with the current implementation of ECM"

How is it loaded? Did you miss the part where Paul Inoye said that it is working as intended? You've probably read too many anti-ECM threads, I don't care about that. This is far simpler, I want to see where the majority of the players stand; do they also share the same sentiment of Paul or disagree.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 14 December 2012 - 03:42 PM.

[Mad Elf]

Corralis, on 14 December 2012 - 03:30 PM, said:

I'm absolutely fine with ECM, it is working as intended and it adds a new level of challenge to the game.

Removes at least two of the roles from the supposedly important "role warfare", reduces the chassis selection to a small fraction of those available, forces gameplay into two very limited forms?

I'm glad you're happy. Me, I'd rather never have to put up with a pack of invisible teleporting Ravens again.

[Kiblams]

The issue is that a lot of people see (whether correctly or not) the reduction in LRMs and rise of rushing mechs with lasers as a huge step towards an arcade game such as CoD and so it is having the opposite effect than you are describing.

Whether this is symptom of matchmaking strangers rather then organised team play where equipment can be planned and tactics hatched will remain to be seen...

Edited by Kiblams, 14 December 2012 - 03:39 PM.

[CaptOven]

In PUG games you tend to need to build more "all rounder" Mechs just in case your own.

My 2 LRM 15, 2 ML and 2 Streak Catapult certainly isn't overpowered but good enough. And now I find it effected in at least half of the matches and crippling in around a quarter to a fifth when an ECM Atlas magically appears at my feet.

I suppose I should think about swapping out the Streaks and ML for MPL but it's a lot less effective against Light Mechs who are generally they ones to come and pick on my Cat in the first place.

Plus LRM Mechs can't shouldn't follow ECM bubbles and it a single ECM stays back your then have less to cover the others.

[Ryvucz]

Another one of these.

[Blitz Krieg]

StalaggtIKE, on 14 December 2012 - 03:36 PM, said:

How is it loaded? Did you miss the part where Paul Inoye said that it is working as intended? You've probably read too many anti-ECM threads, I don't care about that. This is far simpler, I want to see where the majority of the players stand; do they also share the same sentiment of Paul or disagree.

Because I quite like how ECM works, but think it could be tweaked. Therefore I would answer No to this question. It doesn't mean I want ECM changed dramatically though.

I don't think it is "perfect". Perfection is such a specific state that asking "is this perfect?" almost ensures that every answer will be a no

It's basic survey question design 101 stuff. This is a loaded question that favours one response over another.

Also if you wanted to ask if people agree or disagree with Paul Inoye, perhaps you should have asked that question instead.

Edited by Blitz Krieg, 14 December 2012 - 05:46 PM.

[Stingz]

Remove the Null-Signature radar-invisibility, then we can start talking about ECM balance.

Radar detection reduction is much too heavy currently, especially since BAP won't reduce the effects.

Edited by Stingz, 14 December 2012 - 07:38 PM.

[StalaggtIKE]

Blitz Krieg, on 14 December 2012 - 05:42 PM, said:

Because I quite like how ECM works, but think it could be tweaked. Therefore I would answer No to this question. It doesn't mean I want ECM changed dramatically though.

I don't think it is "perfect". Perfection is such a specific state that asking "is this perfect?" almost ensures that every answer will be a no

It's basic survey question design 101 stuff. This is a loaded question that favours one response over another.

Also if you wanted to ask if people agree or disagree with Paul Inoye, perhaps you should have asked that question instead.

Woah, woah, woah, buddy. You are looking way too far into this. This thread has nothing to do with someone liking or disliking ECM. It is simply asking if you agree with Paul, whom clearly states that he feels there is nothing wrong with ECM. No where does he states that it should be tweaked or there are plans to tweak it. Despite all of the ECM feedback and suggestions, he clearly feels that it is perfect in its current form. So, why create another thread with more suggestions? This is an extreme poll to accompany an extreme view point shared by the lead designer.

The poll is simple; is ECM perfect the way it is? I hope that PGI will see that most do not feel that ECM is not perfect and realize they should be more flexible.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 14 December 2012 - 07:07 PM.

[Imagine Dragons]

I don't agree with paul.

Mainly because currently ECM is too mindless in its use currently.

"Specialist" mechs doesn't mean it can brawl at the same level as any other brawler with the benefit of ECM thats passively controlled.

I mean we had Specialist mechs in the form of LRM boats, and they tended to get murdered when forced into a brawl...

ECM? Ha, just another mindless equipment that takes the same skill set as the maligned StreakCat... IE positioning, then its just cruise control from there...

Edited by XenomorphZZ, 14 December 2012 - 07:07 PM.

[GalaxyBluestar]

Corralis, on 14 December 2012 - 03:30 PM, said:

I'm absolutely fine with ECM, it is working as intended and it adds a new level of challenge to the game. Now I don't use LRM boats so I imagine it's annoying as hell for you guys but I am still fine with that because it stops you from sitting at the rear and just hitting one button. The game requires skill which seems to have been forgotten by nearly all gamers these days and this game requires an enormous amount of teamwork as well. So get your Tag mechs out, get your ECM mechs in counter mode and then you can rain death on people like in the old days. Remember the game has always been designed to be difficult, not like the traditional shooters you are used to from the like of EA and Activision (who clearly believe that all gamers are dumb and need their hands holding), so embrace that difficulty and learn to work with ECM. Also don't forget in 10 years ECCM comes out and then you'll be laughing again.

basically many chassis are poor for pugging, why do we have pugs if this is the direction we're going? well what do you do with an aws 8r???? it has 2 energy hardpoints hardly sufficient to defend yourself against brawlers given you're a fat lumbering assault mech and everyone moans take a tag. one ppc to fend people off? no it's srms or nothing there. i also understand what an cat a1 pilot is going through, pugging? srms is the safe bet anything else is undesirably too dodgey. that's why many have turned to lights, the new plague. this version of ecm has really taken a tole on fire support, i miss sniping and flanking the lrm boats. i know it's all been said before and a poll like this has been done already so i'm just saying the same old before the lock.

ecm will work better in conquest mode, it won't be all knife fights and ninja capping with more territory to cover, looking forward to a mix of gameplay again!

[LynxFury]

It would deepen role warfare if it did a fraction of that it does now. It's badly overpowered and needs major reduction of capabilities.

[Caducus46]

ECM is fine, forces people to think about positioning, work to find the ECM mech and play. Seems like most of the crying is coming from the Streak Cats, which were no skill to begin with, and LRM boats, which now have to actually think. And with all the items still yet to be introduced, its still not time to complain about "balance" just yet.

[LynxFury]

"ECM is fine, forces people to think about positioning, work to find the ECM mech and play"


Actually its had the opposite effect. There's not longer looking for ways to get to the LRMs boats in the rear or risking loosing the cap while taking the border of the map to avoid detecting, or mid to long range and focused sniping; mech variety has dramatically dropped especially in the 8x8 matches. Medium mechs are supposed to be the work horses, but they have all but vanished.

Edited by LynxFury, 14 December 2012 - 08:42 PM.

[Stingz]

LynxFury, on 14 December 2012 - 08:40 PM, said:

"ECM is fine, forces people to think about positioning, work to find the ECM mech and play"


Actually its had the opposite effect. There's not longer looking for ways to get to the LRMs boats in the rear or risking loosing the cap while taking the border of the map to avoid detecting, or mid to long range and focused sniping; mech variety has dramatically dropped especially in the 8x8 matches. Medium mechs are supposed to be the work horses, but they have all but vanished.

Radar detection reduction means LRMs have little damage potential. If the ECM mech is fast, and notices LRMs heading towards a teammate, it can chop off lock mid-flight.

Current mediums are slower (64 k/ph is heavy speeds), or less armored than they should be. The "good" mediums are about 81 k/ph, with decent weapons and armor.

[Caducus46]

I love when people think a game isn't right because it doen't go how they think it should. I've seen a dramatic increase in teamwork because of ECM. For those of us who PUG, there is actually communication and working around the ECM Mech. What many fail to realize is, you can have an ECM on your team as well. Seems most of the complaining is about the adverse effets on the individuals posting. ECM can be nullified with Counter from your own team's ECM mechs. But that takes thought and teamwork. Also, since the patch you've seen a decrease in Mech variety. Me too, a lot of Cataphracts out there now, so that arguement seems moot and selfserving.

Edited by Caducus46, 14 December 2012 - 09:17 PM.