478 replies to this topic

[LucidFir]

In case it's not been said, and if this gets read by even 1 other player who hadn't considered it I'll consider it worth my time to type:

DO NOT STAND BEHIND THE FRACKING ATLAS!

The number of times I've been engaged, drawing fire, and then been unable to back away from it as the firepower increases because some [insert the worst expletive you can think of here] was gormlessly standing behind me...

Anyway. Don't stand behind your fellow mechs, whatever they are, especially if they're using cover. If they're using cover, they probably - y'know - want to be able to back around it occasionally rather than being forced to stay in the open by their wonderfully helpful team.

[RavenGenesis]

the only dead atlas is one without support, if there's anything beside him that's not an assault he'll be extremely tough to handle as people will not stop shooting the atlas but frantically swap targets to aim at his supports too... that leaves more than enough time for an atlas to chew you up..

but i saw too many matches where the lights and meds rush the other base, and leave a group of slow crawlers behind, and funny enough if the rush fails, and get counter rushed... those assaults will have done nothing the whole match and lost

[Reza Malin]

Moenrg, on 26 December 2012 - 04:04 PM, said:

As the long time Atlas pilot, here's some general "rules" for those following:

1) Do not follow directly behind, follow off to the side, so you can actually shoot at what the atlas is shooting at.

2) If the atlas is heading towards the enemy, he's probably in a brawling setup (in fact if it's me, I'm definately in a brawling setup)

3) Keep a fire lane, do not cut in front of the atlas, or be willing to live with an AC-20 in the back.

4) A good atlas pilot isn't going to chase light mechs, do your best to keep those away from him.

5) Once the atlas commits to a battle, he's there until the end, there is no 'breaking off', Once you see them engage, support them or expect that they are lost to the team.

This! As an atlas pilot, i concur with all. Well put sir. Especially the commit to a fight part. Its all or nothing once you turn that corner.....

[Void Angel]

Piloting an Atlas is about judgement. You have to weigh the risks, because you can't quickly reverse your movement. You can still break off in many areas, though - and it's best to do so if you're taking heavy damage while still being focused in a PuG. PuGs are nearly always slow to switch targets, so if you can protect yourself and your guns for later, by all means, break left or right and get out of contact, then re-engage cautiously from cover.

[JigglyMoobs]

I also wish people would take into consideration the particulars of an Atlas' weapons placement and movement. It has very low arms. It can't shoot very well over hills or obstructions. I needs particular trails to scramble up embankments. It does not have jump jets.

If you're supporting an Atlas, don't expect him to shoot over that hill. He can't unless he fully exposes his torso. Don't make him fight on hilly terrain. He'll have a very hard time maneuvering. The Atlas needs a relatively flat and rock free piece of real estate where he has some freedom of maneuver and can employ all of his weapons to good effect. If he needs to fight on a slope, it's best if he's going downslope at a mild angle.

To make that work an Atlas pilot usually has to be careful and patient in choosing the right terrain before committing to the fight. The team can help make this easier by directing or luring the enemy team to areas where the Atlas can be suitably employed.

Of course, it goes without saying that if the other team has more Atlases than yours, then you really DON'T want to fight on favorable Atlas terrain.

Edited by JigglyMoobs, 07 November 2013 - 12:45 PM.

[Eaerie]

Some atlas pilots need to take into consideration where the weapon mounts are too. I have been shot many times by atlas pilots because they think they are shooting over my head with those low slung weapons and instead are tearing into my back armor. the arms weapons are low and quite a distance from the sides to top it off.

[capt hungry]

MagicHamsta, on 19 December 2012 - 05:20 PM, said:

5) Because it looks better following an Atlas compared to following a mech that resembles a dong.

That sentence there just made my afternoon.

[Void Angel]

Eaerie, on 07 November 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

Some atlas pilots need to take into consideration where the weapon mounts are too. I have been shot many times by atlas pilots because they think they are shooting over my head with those low slung weapons and instead are tearing into my back armor. the arms weapons are low and quite a distance from the sides to top it off.

Conversely, the Atlas may actually be unable to see you, depending on terrain and your chassis.

[Eaerie]

Void Angel, on 17 November 2013 - 09:47 PM, said:

Conversely, the Atlas may actually be unable to see you, depending on terrain and your chassis.

I will grant you that it is a possibility except I have been hit in the back driving everything from a Locust to a Battlemaster. Terrain will stop an Atlas laser from hitting me, most times, if he cant see me because of how low slung those arms are.

[Void Angel]

If you're on a slope, and hugging him, he can very well be unable to see you, particularly if you're both moving - and especially if you're a bit off to the side and he's using his lasers. I have literally scored team damage against 'mechs I could not actually see.

[SaltBeef]

Really all that is needed is 1 light mech for support to keep the butt science lights off!!!,... or add A-pods that blow out with such force they can damage a close mech therefore deterring proctology. Think 360 degree lbx 20.

[Void Angel]

Nah, You can fight lights if you know what you're doing. They can tie you up and prevent you from dealing with more dangerous opponents, and you can't ignore them, however. So they're very annoying, but you don't need an omnidirectional shotgun once your Atlas is mastered in order to deal with lights.

You do need more than just your one BattleMech, though. 12 enemies can chew through an Atlas in seconds if he's isolated - the point of this mini-guide is to prevent the Atlas from being in that position: Atlases should always be in a position to help as many teammates as they can manage.

[Alaskan Nobody]

Void Angel, on 20 November 2013 - 01:45 AM, said:

Nah, You can fight lights if you know what you're doing. They can tie you up and prevent you from dealing with more dangerous opponents, and you can't ignore them, however. So they're very annoying, but you don't need an omnidirectional shotgun once your Atlas is mastered in order to deal with lights.

I can second that - and I still use the 300 std my Atlas came with (terrain permitting is a huge aid of course)

On the other hand - if you see your Atlas buddy being attacked by lights - and if you feel your aim is decent enough to help (better not to shoot sometimes than to TK) then please please help him.

I had a match where I got chewed to pieces by 3 hostile spiders in the middle of my own team, when I died the spiders had not been shot at once other than by me, that I could tell

[DyDrimer]

Best Match i have had was supporting a atlas last week, scored 150 with almost 1200 damage and if i could post the screen without the "post_ to_ short"error i would so i could point out that the atlas, one other and me, He knew wth he was doing and it was nice to be there supporting him, Between use 3 we got almost all the kills. He WAS the tip of the spear he knew what to do, if there was more atlas pilots like him there would never be a topic like this on the boards.

[XphR]

I still have yet to see a single Atlas engage in pumping fluid underground at high pressure in an attempt to free more germanium, but when I do.. Ill make sure I do my best to follow him in support.

[Nick Makiaveli]

RavenGenesis, on 06 November 2013 - 07:28 PM, said:

the only dead atlas is one without support, if there's anything beside him that's not an assault he'll be extremely tough to handle as people will not stop shooting the atlas but frantically swap targets to aim at his supports too... that leaves more than enough time for an atlas to chew you up..

but i saw too many matches where the lights and meds rush the other base, and leave a group of slow crawlers behind, and funny enough if the rush fails, and get counter rushed... those assaults will have done nothing the whole match and lost

Not following your logic. If the lights rush the base, some of the enemy team RTBs, then the only way that is bad is if the lights/meds decide to hang around and duke it out.

I love running a wolf pack and base rushing. When they straggle in one or two at a time and we start racking up kills, pretty much a win every time. Eventually some heavies show up and we usually bail, but if the Heavy/Assaults have done their job and pushed the main line, it's all over but the mopping up.

Now if the main line has been destroyed, then it's a good thing we have their base half capped already, so maybe we can rush back and finish it off before it's over.

Unless you are in a 12 man, you should have a plan to handle Lights and relying on PUG Lights is not a good plan in my opinion.

[Void Angel]

FrostCollar, on 19 December 2012 - 03:07 PM, said:

I fail to see how Atlases or any other assault mechs are involved in natural gas extraction.

XphR, on 22 November 2013 - 03:09 PM, said:

I still have yet to see a single Atlas engage in pumping fluid underground at high pressure in an attempt to free more germanium, but when I do.. Ill make sure I do my best to follow him in support.

[Shade4x]

The reality is that the PUG teams look like this
Assult: LRM or Sniper, Heavy Sniper, Med: Sniper, Light, DPS or Sniper.
Every single one has the idea to build around killing a slow assult mech thats out in the open. The reality is that it rarely happens, and people are cought up in a snipe fest. So you will see builds like 1 ER LLAS, 1 PPC and an AC/2 on a heavy or an AC/20 and an ER LLAS. Then you will watch as these guy's try to out snipe a dual gauss Muromets, or a 2x AC/5 2x PPC highlander. While they are snipeing, a light mech will run around in the back field and kill an assult mech or two, because no one has the weapons to counter them, nor the aim. So your team spends to much time on the light mech's, allowing for the enemy to get free shots. Currently whoever wins either has an ECM with the team or chases the light mech's the least.

The reality is that assults should either be build as brawlers, LRM boats (limit 1 per team as assult please) or Brawler support (DPS and somewhat tanky) and designed to take out assults, heavy's and mediums. Heavy's can be anything, but should be designed to fight assult to mediums and make the best LRM boats per ton, while Mediums should be light killers and snipers. Lights should be designed to take out other lights and provide a decent alpha hit and run.

What i see litterly in every game is an ER PPC spider/locust that sits back and does not scout/cap/harass. Mediums that build for killing assults and snipeing, then dieing the second anyone focus's on them, Heavy's that are such heavily sniper builds that they get cored by the one enemy light that doesn't have a snipers build and Assult's with either 4 ER LLAS and LRM's, or LRM 20's and AC/20's that both stay behind a hill. This has been true since day one of this game. Why? Because they get one good game that no one focused on them, and pull a 600 damage game with 3 kill (steals). The reality is that you can easily get those numbers on a brawler build if atleast one other brawler charges with you.

There is one problem here. You cannot change what the player base does. They want to snipe, because they don't want to die early. It destroys their illusion that they are the best.


I would like to offer some of my PUG strategies to this discussion.

1) Work your way up from medium mech's to assults. The atlas should not be your first mech, It's to highly skilled, that means avoid playing it on the trial mechs. Noob atlas's are the #1 reason for loses.
2) When you get good, play highly mobile assult mech's, like battlemaster and victor's designed for medium or close range. It allows you to be where the team needs you, because if your not their, you can bet no one else will be.
3) If your in a fast mech with decent armor (80 kph assult or like a jenner) Aim for their back lines. More often then not, the enemy will turn to shoot you in the back, exposing their backs to your entire team. This usually forces your team to charge. Just make sure they are in position and communicate before you go.
4) Know how to flank. Get your mech undected on the side of the enemy's line, and wait for the fight to start. The second your team charges, you charge as well. Force the enemy to either let you back them, or let your atlas back them.
5) Don't walk infront of players. Learn to shoot at bad angles, it's a certainy in this game that the worst aim, most cowardly ***** will take the best position only to constantly retreat from it while shooting their lasers into a rock. They will try to shoot through you if you are there. Just let them have it.
6) Don't walk infront of players, especially in the first 5 seconds of the match. Most people either want to do a weapons test after setting their fire groups, or just want to shoot like an *****. I can't tell you how many times matches where lost because some ***** walked infront of me, as im testing the heat gen of lasers firing directly into the ground, and decide to try to core you because they think your firing at them. Conversly, i cannot count how many times i've had a jagermech block my assult mech's retreat because he wants to shoot an ac/2 and retreat directly behind me.
7) If you see an atlas, ask every time if they are an LRM boat, or brawler. If they are an LRM boat either quit, or get the next biggest assult mech to lead the charge.
8) if your a light mech you absolutely have to scout. If your team knows where the enemy is, and what types of mech's, and locks, you will win almost every time.
9) If your testing a crazy build, try it in training grounds first, then if you take it into a match, tell your team it's a new build and what type it is. This way they don't count on you.
10) Use jump jets to dodge your own team. A victor that jumps with a stupid jagger mech thats right behind him allows the ***** to actually be useful.
11) if your in an assult mech or heavy mech, tank. Even if your XL'ed, you have more armor then anyone. Tank the first few shots so your team doesn't lose that 2x AC/20 Jagger instantly, or that 3 SRM 6 backer.
If you want to win every PUG game, it's rather simple. Have 1 good light scout, have 1 mech that can peel light mech's and support a charge and 2 assult mech's that will charge together. 4 snipers rarely wins a fight, even when they attempt to be on the same target. And no, solo, the best way to win matches is not to be a godly sniper, it's to be a godly scout or godly brawler.

[Shade4x]

Nick Makiaveli, on 22 November 2013 - 08:14 PM, said:

I love running a wolf pack and base rushing. When they straggle in one or two at a time and we start racking up kills, pretty much a win every time. Eventually some heavies show up and we usually bail, but if the Heavy/Assaults have done their job and pushed the main line, it's all over but the mopping up.

It's not against what he said. You need a cordinated group to do that. The reason it works is because not only are you able to get a kill or two, but you either force their team to split, or give your team the enemy's backs. One of the most effective things i do after i scout with my spider, is base cap on assult maps. I never stay, i just wait till a few turn around and come back. It takes alot of tonnage out of the fight, and i can generally circle back and meet up with my team. What your describing is an actual strategy. The point where it fails is if you A) stay their when the main fight is going on and less tonnage then your group is coming back, or when you don't scout. Both times your team can get eaten up and then they will just come to kill you. But yea, its a great strategy as long as you dont hang your team out to dry. That i think was more of void's point. Wolf pack attacking from behind when the brawl has started is perhaps the easiest way to win a match.

[JigglyMoobs]

IMO a good pug team looks something like this:

4x poptarts with 2xppc + AC

2x Atlas D-DC with 2x ER LL + 2x UAC5 - mutual ECM supported bubble for the team and fire power for breaking coordinated assaults on flat ground

3x Heavy/Mediums - for flanking dakka, sniping, LRMs or light defense

Substitute 1 or 2 of the above with a Stalker or 2 to exchange heavier firepower for mobility or ECM.

If the Assault mechs are also carrying LRMs the team will play in a more defensive/ standoff style, and will need ECM less.
If the Assault mechs are not carrying LRMs the team needs to be more aggressive, and will need ECM more.

3x fast lights - scouting, harassment, capping, locking.

Edited by JigglyMoobs, 23 November 2013 - 01:08 PM.