288 replies to this topic

[TheGunBunny]

Rodder, on 15 January 2013 - 04:58 PM, said:

Now ask yourself, where do you want to live? Vancouver ... hm ok Vancouver .... California / Silicon Valley sounds better, doesn`t it? Endless summer and a well paid job ... Vancouver is no match to that ( just an example, i don`t want to bash Vancouver so please don`t rip my head off )

Cheaper taxes in Canada than California for some one making that money..

[Mikhalio]

I'm not aruging for skill sets. I'm putting the blame on management who did not properly allocate and hire correctly for a project of this scale.
Further more, upon realizing their team had gaping talent holes, are not moving to fix this; but instead continue to promote their game to retail venues, and focus on throwing out more cash grab content, while the core game has not moved since the fixed assets were added to the files in October 2012.
Yes, the core game really has not had a material update beyond assets simply "unlocked". That's what you are paying for, or being booked as future revenue to pay for. Funny, right ?

You give too much credit to their execution failures. If a job stays open, and it's critical to your product then you are not working hard enough to fill it.

If your product is to drill for oil, and you dont have anyone who knows how to rent an oil well: you have a major execution problem, no matter how many presentations or press releases you put out.

If your product is to build a mech simulator, and you dont have anyone in the team who knows how to build a proper multiplayer for said P2P simulator: you have a major execution problem.

See the point ?

Mittani, and the goons clearly asked them about their execution timeline, and the question was dodged under the auspicies PGI was working on this nebulous "big patch". So now that the patch has dropped, I fail to see (after looking in the files and seeing no material update to the new map files still locked, or the meta-game UI) what exactly are they doing ?

What have they spent 40 days doing ? Because it sure as hell has not been building new content, which is only what we could assume those extra 28 employees are paid to do; this assumes Garth and that one budding employee spent 40 days tweaking crit slot code and heat sinks..... They were very proud to tweet and post this very mission critical update to their product.

Edited by Mikhalio, 15 January 2013 - 05:07 PM.

[Theron Branson]

I am not suprised therefore not really let down by this patch. I had some hope though due to them saying it was going to be a "BIG" patch so I know not to believe anything until it comes. I honestly thought for a second we would get house and Merc decals and numbers too. Then I woke up from my slumber.

[TheGunBunny]

Mikhalio, on 15 January 2013 - 05:03 PM, said:

I'm not aruging for skill sets. I'm putting the blame on management who did not properly allocate and hire correctly for a project of this scale.
Further more, upon realizing their team had gaping talent holes, are not moving to fix this; but instead continue to promote their game to retail venues, and focus on throwing out more cash grab content, while the core game has not moved since the fixed assets were added to the files in October 2012.
Yes, the core game really has not had a material update beyond assets simply "unlocked". That's what you are paying for, or being booked as future revenue to pay for. Funny, right ?

You give too much credit to their execution failures. If a job stays open, and it's critical to your product then you are not working hard enough to fill it.

If your product is to drill for oil, and you dont have anyone who knows how to rent an oil well: you have a major execution problem, no matter how many presentations or press releases you put out.

If your product is to build a mech simulator, and you dont have anyone in the team who knows how to build a proper multiplayer for said P2P simulator: you have a major execution problem.

See the point ?

Mittani, and the goons clearly asked them about their execution timeline, and the question was dodged under the auspicies PGI was working on this nebulous "big patch". So now that the patch has dropped, I fail to see (after looking in the files and seeing no material update to the new map files still locked, or the meta-game UI) what exactly are they doing ?

What have they spent 40 days doing ? Because it sure as hell has not been building new content, which is only what we could assume those extra 28 employees are paid to do; this assumes Garth and that one budding employee spent 40 days tweaking crit slot code and heat sinks..... They were very proud to tweet and post this very mission critical update to their product.

Once again, you don't work there and have no idea what you are talking about.

[Mikhalio]

TheGunBunny, on 15 January 2013 - 05:08 PM, said:

Once again, you don't work there and have no idea what you are talking about.

Once again, you assume that all players lack your education in how a project of this size is being managed and what PGI is letting slide through the door as 'content'.

Please explain to me, what exactly I have erred in stating and correct me if you have better knowledge of the situation...

[TheGunBunny]

Mikhalio, you have no clue of their business model, their revinue stream, the content they have or have not made, the work done or not done by employees, what jobs said employees had to work on, which jobs were put ahead of others in the studio, what the over all projects timeline is or was...Soooo you are pulling everything out of your ***....

[White Bear 84]

PANZERBUNNY, on 15 January 2013 - 12:56 PM, said:

Hey guys...they've been on vacation for a month. I think they deserve some slack here.

+1

Dawg, on 15 January 2013 - 01:05 PM, said:

....maybe hookers and some coke. (just kidding,i dont do coke)

Let us know how the hookers go

mekabuser, on 15 January 2013 - 01:13 PM, said:

ouch... I dont know why they are too dense to realize that good maps make all the difference.

Because calling the developers dense is a form of constructive criticism..

..giving up reading this thread, too much self entitlement trolling and whinging going on.. ..the dev's obviously have a roadmap that they are working to, some things will take longer than others, which is why you might not always get your candy.. ..and some things might end up delayed because of unforeseeable consequences. Rome wasnt built in a day and netcode doesnt get fixed overnight.. ..chill out ffs, give the game time, PGI is not a huge developer, and yeah it is the start of the new year so dont expect christmas to come right away..

NB: Anyone commenting on the netcode, did you actually read the patch notes RE: status of networking code, lets refresh (http://mwomercs.com/...50#entry1740750), waiting a few weeks is absolutely nothing and the work is there..

Rant over.. ..so bored of people whinging because they dont get their candy..

[Mikhalio]

TheGunBunny, on 15 January 2013 - 05:13 PM, said:

Mikhalio, you have no clue of their business model, their revinue stream, the content they have or have not made, the work done or not done by employees, what jobs said employees had to work on, which jobs were put ahead of others in the studio, what the over all projects timeline is or was...Soooo you are pulling everything out of your ***....

So, you have no insight to provide ? except an ad homin attack. Classy.

I'll walk you through my insight, we can then compare notes and please feel free to educate us all on your insight into where I am calling out their ********. Ok ?

The business model is not rocket science to understand. You can look at their plan in the FAQ section, and their revenue model is well documented in their press materials. Their paid sub model and cash-store content model is very public and can be proxied by other famous studios who run similar models.

In about 30 min. one can easily figure out a.) how much it cost to get them a working Crytek game, a staff, and how much cash they burn through on a monthly rate. b.) figure out based upon the work they have done in the pak files, how fast and what they are struggling with. Most game communities who track what game they want to hop to next actually do a bit of this very standard back-checking on new 'high impact' projects like MWO.


We know how many people work at the team, as they have stated the headcount in the past, and its also found on their mainpage in developer PR photos. They have 1 team currently fully allocated to this product.

Work done has and can be tracked by looking at the progress of files added in each patch update. This method of tracking project development is as old as Everquest when "top tier" guilds would open the files in editors to learn about the next big raid dungeon.

We know the salaries they pay, because recruiters and headhunters disclose that street level material to anyone with credentials to do background checking.

So again, feel free to poke holes in what I'm saying anytime Gunbunny. I see nothing wrong with what I've poasted. They're doing a **** job, and it's showing very plainly to anyone who's actually versed in this kind of tradecraft.

Edited by Mikhalio, 15 January 2013 - 05:22 PM.

[Wizace]

realy more ECM, 1 or 2 per side is still fun . but 5 or 6 is way to much

[Rodder]

Mikhalio, on 15 January 2013 - 05:03 PM, said:

You give too much credit to their execution failures. If a job stays open, and it's critical to your product then you are not working hard enough to fill it.

Only at this one, single and special issue and only because i know a bit of that business.

I know a 3d-artist working for a major company in private and had my share of talking to lead game designers and so on ( i am gaming since gaming exists and like to go to Meetings and Conventions. If you want to know the truth, just get them drunk, most of them can`t drink much ), and to be honest, those kind of specialists PGI is looking for are a... err .... hmm ... let`s just say they are a bit pampered and used to get what they want, to say it nice.

[Mikhalio]

Rodder, on 15 January 2013 - 05:22 PM, said:

Only at this one, single and special issue and only because i know a bit of that business.

I know a 3d-artist working for a major company in private and had my share of talking to lead game designers and so on ( i am gaming since gaming exists and like to go to Meetings and Conventions. If you want to know the truth, just get them drunk, most of them can`t drink much ), and to be honest, those kind of specialists PGI is looking for are a... err .... hmm ... let`s just say they are a bit pampered and used to get what they want, to say it nice.

Yup, but that's the reason they are paid that premium. If PGI can't secure that talent, to fill that gap; then that is clearly the top guy's problem. Thats why he gets paid the big bucks, to make the big deals, that get the product done.

It's not happening. And that's plain to see after 4 months of dead-time, with the exception of 18-hour side projects being marketed as content updates.

[TheGunBunny]

Mikhalio, on 15 January 2013 - 05:20 PM, said:

So, you have no insight to provide ? except an ad homin attack. Classy.

I'll walk you through my insight, we can then compare notes and please feel free to educate us all on your insight into where I am calling out their ********. Ok ?

The business model is not rocket science to understand. You can look at their plan in the FAQ section, and their revenue model is well documented in their press materials. Their paid sub model and cash-store content model is very public and can be proxied by other famous studios who run similar models.

We know how many people work at the team, as they have stated the headcount in the past, and its also found on their mainpage in developer PR photos. They have 1 team currently fully allocated to this product.

Work done has and can be tracked by looking at the progress of files added in each patch update. This method of tracking project development is as old as Everquest when "top tier" guilds would open the files in editors to learn about the next big raid dungeon.

We know the salaries they pay, because recruiters and headhunters disclose that street level material to anyone with credentials to do background checking.

So again, feel free to poke holes in what I'm saying anytime Gunbunny. I see nothing wrong with what I've poasted. They're doing a **** job, and it's showing very plainly to anyone who's actually versed in this kind of tradecraft.

This was not an ad homin attack, I just dislike people that are not part of a company that think they know how the inner working of said company is run. Its a speculative at best and dead wrong at worst. So you seriously think they let you have the stuff they are testing in house as works in progress? You are a forum warrior that thinks hes knows how the company is being run when in fact you know as much as I do, which is nothing. I have seen your kind on every game forum I have been apart of. You say "facts" as you see them with no backup.

[Mikhalio]

So, your just white knighting a company because you have admitted you are upset someone has and is providing methods on what is researched criticism of a failing project ? ok.

Speculation is stating "I think they have something big in the pipe and I'm a fan of whatever they produce"

An Opinion is stating "I have looked at what is in the public disclosure, and I'm not only unimpressed but this is why I feel this project will not last unless they fix or pick up the pace in delivery". This may shock you, but there is a big industry of guys who just get paid daily to do this all day. Some of us just do this for fun, because we expect better from people like PGI. Some even bother to explain the methods when asked nicely, see above.

An ad homin attack is not defending by stating why you are supporting them, but consistently arguing that we should ignore what is infront of us, on their website and releases; and dismissing the methods with self-imposed ignorance.

See the point ?
Done replying to you Bunny.

Edited by Mikhalio, 15 January 2013 - 05:32 PM.

[Spleen5459]

new mech may "warp" as we have not fixed netcode yet............I can't beleive they actually put that in the notes.......embarassing.

[Umbra8]

TheGunBunny, on 15 January 2013 - 05:26 PM, said:

This was not an ad homin attack, I just dislike people that are not part of a company that think they know how the inner working of said company is run.

Hmm. Let's look up what ad hominem means... http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Ad_hominem

'An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man"), short for argumentum ad hominem, is an argument made personally against an opponent instead of against their argument.^[1] Ad hominem reasoning is normally described as an informal fallacy,^[2][3][4] more precisely an irrelevance.<sup>'

Now lets look at what you wrote...</sup>

TheGunBunny, on 15 January 2013 - 05:26 PM, said:

I have seen your kind on every game forum I have been apart of. You say "facts" as you see them with no backup.

Attacking the man, not the argument itself... check.

It's ad hominem

Edited by Umbra8, 15 January 2013 - 05:39 PM.

[TheGunBunny]

Mikhalio, on 15 January 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

So, your just white knighting a company because you have admitted you are upset someone has and is providing methods on what is researched criticism of a failing project ? ok.

Speculation is stating "I think they have something big in the pipe and I'm a fan of whatever they produce"

An Opinion is stating "I have looked at what is in the public disclosure, and I'm not only unimpressed but this is why I feel this project will not last unless they fix or pick up the pace in delivery".

An ad homin attack is not defending by stating why you are supporting them, but consistently arguing that we should ignore what is infront of us, on their website and releases; and dismissing the methods with self-imposed ignorance.

See the point ?
Done replying to you Bunny.

How am I defending, I am not defending this company. What I am saying is you know NOTHING. Stop acting like you do.You did not say this is why this project will not work (like I haven't heard that before in a game, Lineage2 which I played for 5 years was dieing from the day I started to the day I quit. Same talk from warriors like you) I never said they have something big coming or I believe they are working on something big, for I don't know...just like you. Funny you don't beleive what they say when its fits your world view of them. They release news about updates that you don't believe but then you point to information they give to back up your statements. Thats called cherry picking facts that fit for you. Stop posting why you think they should have hired someone or its their job to hire someone, you have no idea why they can't or haven't. Maybe they can't find someone that fits or maybe they don't have the right amount of money or maybe something completely different. Once again you don't know, do you. You are not a share holder or work for them. So type on Forum Warrior, but just remember you know exactly nothing.

Edited by TheGunBunny, 15 January 2013 - 05:41 PM.

[TheGunBunny]

Umbra8, on 15 January 2013 - 05:38 PM, said:

Hmm. Let's look up what ad hominem means... http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Ad_hominem

'An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man"), short for argumentum ad hominem, is an argument made personally against an opponent instead of against their argument.^[1] Ad hominem reasoning is normally described as an informal fallacy,^[2][3][4] more precisely an irrelevance.<sup>'

Now lets look at what you wrote...</sup>



Attacking the man, not the argument itself... check.

It's ad hominem

I said because he doesn't back them up with facts, that is not an attack on him but his method. Then I go on to explain why, I did not just call him dumb and walk away...

Edited by TheGunBunny, 15 January 2013 - 05:44 PM.

[Solis Obscuri]

Mikhalio, on 15 January 2013 - 05:20 PM, said:

In about 30 min. one can easily figure out

Glad to know lots of serious thought goes into your theorycrafting.

[Mikhalio]

Solis Obscuri, on 15 January 2013 - 05:46 PM, said:

Glad to know lots of serious thought goes into your theorycrafting.

Quality, not quantity bro. +1

Thesis stands defended that PGI has not done ****, and is burning cash while making nothing close to where we were to-be in 2013. I'll change my stance when I see someone post anything to refute or defend PGI's failcascade.

Seriously: Go download a 3d viewer and take a look. Until then, the comments stand.

Edited by Mikhalio, 15 January 2013 - 05:53 PM.

[shayne77]

i am very disappointed with th way this game is turning out.

PGI.....WTF over!, when are you guys going to acually roll out some mechs that are useful?
a few that come to mind are the Marauder, axeman, thunderbolt, crusader. you know...the good mechs!, if you have to do some creative editing or drawing to bring in the warhammer, archer, battlemaster, or pheonix.....then DO SO!

i understand i takes time to build the model for a mech and getting the movements right for the game....the spider though, out of all the mechs you could choose you picked the spider!!!!!!!, how about the locust, that probably would have been a better choice.