138 replies to this topic

[Calem]

The OP must play a different game. Just yesterday I parked a 4 x LRM15+Artemis Stalker on Forest Colony beach, sweeping my TAG over a running ECM-Spider in the water. I fired four full volleys of 60 missiles each; again; with TAG applied and perfect line of sight.

The Spider lost a whopping 1%, and I'm not even sure if that was due to the LRMs or due to the things it was harassing. I suspect the LRMs must've technically exploded too far away from the actual hit boxes.

Bottom line: There's a lot more things wrong with Lights than with LRMs. Hit registration is currently severely borked.

[JudgeDeathCZ]

LRMs was not problem for me be4 ECM and they are not problem now(now its like if you boat LRMs you are lost bcuz of ECM mechs).
I use AMS on all my mechs except ECM commando(speed is better here).

Today one of our mechs(I mean in my team) was catapult-a1 with 2xLRM15,2xLRM10,LRM5 and SSRM2..yeah most usefull mech in this match vs 2xDDC and 3xECM light.And he had like 600 LRM ammo+300(LOL) SSRMs xD .Its better if he delete that game for him -.- .

[Jakob Knight]

I don't know what game the OP was playing, but in the TT, a Spider or Jenner that took a single salvo from both LRM20s from an Archer was left either a smoking ruin, or barely able to walk. If anything, LRMs are tame in MWO by comparison, especially after the immunity-shield of ECM was implemented.

To sum up: In the TT, LRMs flew as fast as other weapons (or fast enuough that it made no difference). There was no option to put terrain between you and the firing unit before impact. LRMs could be fired indirectly, even by the unit firing them spotting for itself (changed in later rules sets), could do full damage at PB range (just hard to target with), and did an average of 60-75% of the rating of the launcher in damage when they did hit. ECM did nothing to them whatsoever, and AMS was just as much of a damage reducer as it is here (though with far less ammo to use it with). Mechs that were 'LRM Boats' were rightly considered heavy units, and no mech treated them as anything less than units that could kill them quickly if they landed hits.

Edited by Jakob Knight, 21 January 2013 - 07:54 AM.

[JudgeDeathCZ]

Calem, on 21 January 2013 - 07:48 AM, said:

The OP must play a different game. Just yesterday I parked a 4 x LRM15+Artemis Stalker on Forest Colony beach, sweeping my TAG over a running ECM-Spider in the water. I fired four full volleys of 60 missiles each; again; with TAG applied and perfect line of sight.

The Spider lost a whopping 1%, and I'm not even sure if that was due to the LRMs or due to the things it was harassing. I suspect the LRMs must've technically exploded too far away from the actual hit boxes.

Bottom line: There's a lot more things wrong with Lights than with LRMs. Hit registration is currently severely borked.

Well there is difference if that mech running towars/away from you or staying...and if he is smart and covering/strafing/circling etc...i think OP is that first case xD

[Skyfaller]

MrNemo, on 21 January 2013 - 06:49 AM, said:

Seriously why is this allowed? The hard core fans are all pretty much TT gamers and novel fans. No one wants light mechs blown up in one volley from some clown in a stalker throwing up 70 missiles per trigger pull. Especially as LRM's have been poorly implemented. They should be barely better then dumbfire SRMs for homing and artemis makes the group tighter that's it, but you guys turned them into sidewinder missiles. Why are they the dominant Battlefield weapon when they just aren't all that in books and on TT? Too lazy to change how they work? No problem let me help, 2 launchers (any size) per chassis, period. Here is another grief, why are weapons going to point of aim? how hard is it to assign a weapon a hit circle based on inherent accuracy, then modify it for variables like firing mech speed, heat and range? then the weapon hits a random spot inside that circle. That's Canon for ya right there. Heck WoT does that.....so this can't be too hard to implement. Your are already spiraling down the arms race rabbit hole that buries FPS games like CoD, et al. Lastly why the Spider? you knew it was broken (may experience warping) and no one wanted it ( we wanted the orion or highlander). The "It's Beta" excuse no longer holds water once you started accepting money.......It's starting to smell like too big a project for too small of a developer. Have you considered selling to one of the big boys who can get this off the ground? It has a lot of amazing potential, Looks pretty good, sounds are good, the few maps there are have good attention to detail. The basic physics seem on....A lot here to like, but there are a legion of warts on this.....

Let me just stop you there...

If you're dying, in a light, to LRMs, you are doing something VERY wrong.

LRMs are perfectly balanced now except for the ECM no-lock bubble effect part (if TAG countered that it'd be ok but it doesnt). You merely need to learn how to use terrain,cover and pay attention to the VERY generous warning message that gives you up to 10 seconds to get behind cover.

[OneEyed Jack]

I only have 2 problems with LRM boating. The first is when I'm 1v8 because my team didn't have the sense to come in out of the rain. The second is that I really, really want a toggle for AMS... for when my team doesn't have the sense to come in out of the rain. Also so I can bait the boats into running themselves out of ammo and still have some protection against the better boaters for when it's time to cross the killing zone. But mostly it just ****** me off when my entire AMS ammo bin runs dry while I'm standing in cover, not even being fired on.

[Agent of Change]

OneEyed Jack, on 21 January 2013 - 08:33 AM, said:

The second is that I really, really want a toggle for AMS... for when my team doesn't have the sense to come in out of the rain.

I agree with this, not even for the same reasons. As a part time missile lobber I've worked hard to adapt to the limitations currently in place on LRM's, part of this has been finding ways to remain useful in the age of ECM.

One of the things I've started to do recently and am considering trying on non-dedicated LRM mechs is using enemy AMS to locate enemy mechs. Because they can't turn it off all i need to do is suspect where a enemy mech or two might be and fire off unaimed lrms into the air, then listen and watch for the AMS to give away their position. Because you cannot turn off ams manually this tels me two things, one if AMS fires I've located mechs without risking anything and two if there are mechs they have no AMS against my missiles.

It only makes sense to allow it to be toggled.

[FerretGR]

MrNemo, on 21 January 2013 - 06:49 AM, said:

Seriously why is this allowed? The hard core fans are all pretty much TT gamers and novel fans. No one wants light mechs blown up in one volley from some clown in a stalker throwing up 70 missiles per trigger pull.

Not sure how that's not canon. There are LRM boats in canon that could easily down a light in a single shot, and it happens in the novels fairly frequently because there are lots of lights.

[Roadbuster]

Protoculture, on 21 January 2013 - 06:54 AM, said:

LRMs aren't that great unless someone is dumb enough to just stand in the open not moving and taking full volleys.

Nothing to add to that.
Cover is there for a reason, so is AMS.
It's really not hard avoiding LRMs in any situation.

[PropagandaWar]

Ramblin, on 21 January 2013 - 07:04 AM, said:

Is this guy serious?

I think so and it's funny. I get caught by them once in a great while and Im not in a speedy mech. A couple times it helped enemy meds and heavies keep me pinned down so they could blast me to ribbons. No LRM's have enough going against them not that one should not complain about them. I think Streaks are all that's left in the missle department of nefs.

[Solis Obscuri]

MrNemo, on 21 January 2013 - 06:49 AM, said:

Seriously why is this allowed? The hard core fans are all pretty much TT gamers and novel fans. No one wants light mechs blown up in one volley from some clown in a stalker throwing up 70 missiles per trigger pull. Especially as LRM's have been poorly implemented. They should be barely better then dumbfire SRMs for homing and artemis makes the group tighter that's it, but you guys turned them into sidewinder missiles. Why are they the dominant Battlefield weapon when they just aren't all that in books and on TT?

I don't think you've ever played CBT.

[AlexWildeagle]

Protoculture, on 21 January 2013 - 07:03 AM, said:

2 days ago I watched a Commando, last guy left on my team, that had ECM and was all red crit all over and had only one medium laser left kill 2 Catapults (only 2 left on enemy team) that couldn't run away from him and had nothing but LRMs. One just kept shooting in to the ground in front of him apparently unaware that LRM has a minimum range, and finally gave up, ran OOB and died. The other one kept trying to bull charge him and finally died. It was SO sad to watch and probably had 2 people rage quit the game.

They were stupid enough to not run balanced mechs they got what they deserved.

[The Cheese]

LRM's are pretty much perfect as they are. That 70 LRM stalker? get within 180m and he's toast.

Also, every time I launch 60+ LRMs at a light and they all hit, I smile. Whether he dies or not, he's gonna be hurting.

[Solis Obscuri]

FerretGR, on 21 January 2013 - 08:51 AM, said:

Not sure how that's not canon. There are LRM boats in canon that could easily down a light in a single shot, and it happens in the novels fairly frequently because there are lots of lights.

A good Atlas pilot can 2-shot a Raven with it's single LRM-20 on TT, provided he gets good cluster-hit rolls.

[AlexWildeagle]

Roadbuster, on 21 January 2013 - 08:53 AM, said:

Nothing to add to that.
Cover is there for a reason, so is AMS.
It's really not hard avoiding LRMs in any situation.

I always find these comments amusing......here I sit in cover. I move to another spot I melt to LRM fire. So here I sit. Look theres the enemy brawlers I sit here, they b-l-o-w me away. I move to engage and their LRM buddies melt me. Yes, cover is the answer...wait what was the question?
AMS, great for LRM5's and LRM10's a volley at a time. Simo volleys of 15s and 20s, not so much or at all.

Edited by AlexWildeagle, 21 January 2013 - 12:17 PM.

[Lucky Noob]

souns like the Ravenpilot i met on Friday who tried to run straight to me from 1000 meters, Tag hits and BAM

[Bobby Bolivia]

If you're getting wasted by LRM boats then you should figure out how to counter an LRM volley instead of making threads asking the devs to nerf something that doesn't need nerfing. If you're out in the open water on Forest Colony, no amount of nerfing will stop you from being killed prematurely.

[AlexWildeagle]

Solis Obscuri, on 21 January 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

A good Atlas pilot can 2-shot a Raven with it's single LRM-20 on TT, provided he gets good cluster-hit rolls.

Yes, with some luck. But I have seen a heavy mech 432/434 armor melt in less then a 30 seconds to LRM fire, he was in cover and was moving to another strategic cover point. NEVER would happen in TT.

[Cerlin]

And here i thought ECM OMG broke LRMS. Lrms are pretty decent and once ECM gets a rebalance they will be even better.

[Solis Obscuri]

AlexWildeagle, on 21 January 2013 - 12:22 PM, said:

Yes, with some luck. But I have seen a heavy mech 432/434 armor melt in less then a 30 seconds to LRM fire, he was in cover and was moving to another strategic cover point. NEVER would happen in TT.

Given that with the modified RoFs 30s in MWO equals 10 rounds in TT? You could easily knock out a heavy in even less time if you got a few lucky TACs.