141 replies to this topic

[Fergrim]

Blackjack, if i'm not mistaken, they aren't doing any balancing by weight but solely by ELO. Can anyone correct me on this?

Hence the games we all played yesterday with 6 trebs and 2 atlas vs the same.

I too hope that weight/class balancing starts coming into play... However, we have to remember that the more pressure put on matching requirements, the harder it is to find games...

And the player-base seems so damn narrow at this point that I've more than once run into friends I wasn't grouped with, simply by dropping at the same times of day.

For example, yesterday, our teamspeak had four 4man drops going on, by happenstance we ended up in a game with one of the other Lances without even thinking the word "sync drop".

This to me indicates a shallow player-base.

[Astarot]

JAFO, on 20 February 2013 - 05:04 AM, said:

Oh please. Your nothing but a Troll and flaming yourself. Go solo Pug your way to another game because If you were such a dedicated battletech player you would have been a founder. No money, no job? that's your problem.

*looks at legendary founder tag, looks at the fact that he likes solo games as well....* I can't decide which group to be in....

[Fergrim]

I've just set permissions to allow you access to both :]

I'll be solo queue'ing the moment they have a solo "ranked" queue :]

[Chrithu]

Fergrim, on 20 February 2013 - 06:48 AM, said:

Blackjack, if i'm not mistaken, they aren't doing any balancing by weight but solely by ELO. Can anyone correct me on this?

Hence the games we all played yesterday with 6 trebs and 2 atlas vs the same.

I too hope that weight/class balancing starts coming into play... However, we have to remember that the more pressure put on matching requirements, the harder it is to find games...

And the player-base seems so damn narrow at this point that I've more than once run into friends I wasn't grouped with, simply by dropping at the same times of day.

For example, yesterday, our teamspeak had four 4man drops going on, by happenstance we ended up in a game with one of the other Lances without even thinking the word "sync drop".

This to me indicates a shallow player-base.

Hmm I might be wrong but as far as I understood it first matches by ELO and tries to match weight classes at the same time. If that doesn't work (makes wait time longer) the weight class matching is dropped. If it still doesn't work the ELO matching is loosened.

I know I could just look up the Matchmaker Thread in the Dev section but I am lazy.

[Fergrim]

I'm lazy too, so I'll trust you :]

Our ELO'd matches did seem like we had similar weights vs similar weights I suppose.

Also, yesterday, during MM3... just to show how effective it is, assuming lancemates are going to be of roughly equivalent skill..

Our lance leader was trying to solo queue in order to get a sense for what his ELO rating might be.. another four of us from the lance were just chain-dropping games to continue working on our group-ELO..

Anyway long story short, he ended up in a game against us! He had hit launch like two minutes before we did, but once we did, he catapulted into our game lol

Thus showing our ELO's to be roughly similar, as one would expect from Lance Leader to lance members.

Damn, we hijacked this thread with camaraderie.

Goons will be angry :]

Edited by Fergrim, 20 February 2013 - 07:00 AM.

[JAFO]

Jason Parker, on 20 February 2013 - 05:47 AM, said:

So just because I didn't buy me a nice badge to show up under my forum name I am less dedicated than you?

Dude you just continue to prove that at least in your case I was exactly right and I don't want to be in a group with you.

Let's leave it at that because if we go on you might just drag me down to your niveau of argumentation and get us both warned/banned.

Think what you want. The only thing you have proven is that your a forum troll looking for a fight.

We can agree to disagree and leave it at that because all your doing anyway is continue to make excuses and flame.

We're done here..

Edited by JAFO, 20 February 2013 - 07:12 AM.

[Jetfire]

JAFO, on 19 February 2013 - 05:39 PM, said:

I do think bigger much bigger. I think people forget about the Dedicated Battletech player base that already exists here. That group alone will expand the player base with team warfare.. Standard PUG's just wants to shoot at anything that moves then in 3 months they will go to the next new game.

Btech players will be here for 10 years and financially support this game.

On the other hand, the dedicated players will wait for or return for that game play once it comes along in the coming months. Leaving those 3 month rotational players who bring income just due to their volume out in the cold would be poor business. PGI knows we want CW and knows they have to deliver to keep this game alive, but they also have to keep the money coming in now and if CW is 3-9 months out, then the casual players are what is going to bridge that gap.

It isn't what we want, it isn't ideal, but it seems like the truth. Nothing that I have seen suggests PGI is rolling in the dough yet, making ends meet, sure, but they need to make sure not to miss out on the easy money.

Edited by Jetfire, 20 February 2013 - 07:29 AM.

[Fergrim]

I agree with that sentiment, about not missing out on the easy money.

Personally, I donate as often as I can afford, due to my love and appreciation for the project. So far, I'm very happy with what they've done with my hundred or so dollars and I plan to continue at least through premium time.

However, again, the term "casual player" sounds a lot like the term "middle class" in politics. Nameless, voiceless... except for everyone who isn't them speaking up for them.

I still wonder if, by definition, that there are any "casual players" posting on the forum, as the activity itself somewhat precludes the label casual.

[Chrithu]

Fergrim, on 20 February 2013 - 07:38 AM, said:

I still wonder if, by definition, that there are any "casual players" posting on the forum, as the activity itself somewhat precludes the label casual.

Maybe there are different kind of casuals depending on the context. In the context of MMOs in my view the term casual relates a lot more to time spent in the game than to dedication/involvement. In most MMO Forums you'll find a lot of people that post their feedback quite frequently and often (and thus could be viewed as dedicated) and still consider themselves a casual player because they only have a few hours per week to play.

In the context of speaking about gaming in general a casual player is someone that doesn't necessarily do gaming as a hobby but views it as something similar to watching TV. It's a means of passing time or get entertainment. But that kind of gamer I think mostly isn't involved into gaming enough to even get around to trying something of the complexity of most MMOs. They probably often stick to the social gaming stuff on Facebook or playing "shallow" partygames with friends on consoles like the Wii.

[Arete]

Relics, on 20 February 2013 - 05:42 AM, said:

Please fix the MM! At High Elo I had the best matches I have ever had since I started playing this game. Finally pilots that know what they are doing, matches that last 15 minutes, no one dies for 5 minutes. We need this back, and back right away.

I have no idea what elo rating I'm at, but I agree totally. I usually solo or dual with a friend, and matches with the new matchmaker were great yesterday. Some of them were mixed a bit odd; large skill difference on the team, but both teams had the same amount of <100 damage players that did stupid things at least. And the matches where both teams had the same skill level overallt were simply awesome. Manouvering and trading fire for 5 minutes, and noone had died yet. Scouts were scouting. Atlases and stalkers were used to breach the lines. LRMs were used for pinning people, and strike forces of fast mechs naturally assembled to mess with the LRM boats.... New matchmaker is looking good imho :-)

Edited by Arete, 20 February 2013 - 07:55 AM.

[Jetfire]

Fergrim, on 20 February 2013 - 07:38 AM, said:

I still wonder if, by definition, that there are any "casual players" posting on the forum, as the activity itself somewhat precludes the label casual.

It has a lot of connotations. I think in this case casual players are those who are just playing a game, like I play Halo or Borderlands. Then you have the team players who are more hobbyists than gamers, maybe call them enthusiasts? Those are a majority of the founders group I would guess. They are looking for the Meta game, sort of like a bowling league, long term competition and rivalry. Last you have the E-sports guys who are basically hardcore enthusiasts.

Enthusiasts will support this game a long time if PGI runs CW right and I think they will eventually. The casuals that rotate through though are what will make PGI the profit they need to grow though. You don't run a business by just making ends meet, you need that profit. Especially because a portion of those casuals become new enthusiasts.

[Sprouticus]

Fergrim, on 20 February 2013 - 06:48 AM, said:

Blackjack, if i'm not mistaken, they aren't doing any balancing by weight but solely by ELO. Can anyone correct me on this?

Hence the games we all played yesterday with 6 trebs and 2 atlas vs the same.

I too hope that weight/class balancing starts coming into play... However, we have to remember that the more pressure put on matching requirements, the harder it is to find games...

And the player-base seems so damn narrow at this point that I've more than once run into friends I wasn't grouped with, simply by dropping at the same times of day.

For example, yesterday, our teamspeak had four 4man drops going on, by happenstance we ended up in a game with one of the other Lances without even thinking the word "sync drop".

This to me indicates a shallow player-base.

According to Paul, they are using both weight class & ELO. Now what the process is for that, no on e really knows except the folks at PGI. They have also said they are keeping separate ELO's for different mechs (variants?)

It very well might try to match ELO, THEN try to match tonnage. If it cant match tonnage it just matches ELO. This would be a fairly poor implementation if that is the case.

I posted before that they need to have weight class (or even better chassis or variant) MODIFY ELO. instead. That way ELO is dynamic, you don't have to keep separate ELO's for different mechs, and most importantly you don't end up with hige weight discrepancies (or if you do, the person in the smaller mech )

[Fergrim]

Quote

if CW is 3-9 months out, then the casual players are what is going to bridge that gap.

Side point...

Wouldn't it be the less casual players that you can expect to maintain a game through it's beta stages?

It's an awful lot of hullabaloo for a semi-interested person to get involved in the beta version of a game. Add in the factor of also being willing to donate/make MC purchases..

Makes me wonder who their primary audience really is.

[Tvrdoglavi]

Thank you for rolling back the match making so quickly. It just had to be done since it simply wasn't working. It was close to impossible to find a match.

[JAFO]

Fergrim, on 20 February 2013 - 09:48 AM, said:

Side point...

Wouldn't it be the less casual players that you can expect to maintain a game through it's beta stages?

It's an awful lot of hullabaloo for a semi-interested person to get involved in the beta version of a game. Add in the factor of also being willing to donate/make MC purchases..

Makes me wonder who their primary audience really is.

Right now it seems their primary audience is the FTP player that might put money into this and buy MC. At least that is what it seems like because that is what they always cater to. They listen to the executives and investors that pull their puppet strings and tell them this game needs to make a profit. Which is what this is all about to them.

I think there are good points and bad points to FTP gaming. Yes everyone gets to try your game and it will bring in new players, but will it bring in quality players and develop a solid player base? There are arguments for both sides, I don't have that answer.

They know they have the Battletech Player base but they don't think it is enough, that is why people like me are very irritated at what they are doing, but there is nothing I can do about it accept play the game, but I won't put anymore money into it at this point.

I Really do hope this game brings on community warefare sooner than later because that will make the game. Right now they are just trying to suck as much money out of the existing player base that they can. Hopefully they will realize what they are doing before they alienate the Battletech player base or any other player that likes to play this game.

[warner2]

JAFO, on 20 February 2013 - 10:05 AM, said:

Right now it seems their primary audience is the FTP player that might put money into this and buy MC. At least that is what it seems like because that is what they always cater to. They listen to the executives and investors that pull their puppet strings and tell them this game needs to make a profit. Which is what this is all about to them.

I think there are good points and bad points to FTP gaming. Yes everyone gets to try your game and it will bring in new players, but will it bring in quality players and develop a solid player base? There are arguments for both sides, I don't have that answer.

They know they have the Battletech Player base but they don't think it is enough, that is why people like me are very irritated at what they are doing, but there is nothing I can do about it accept play the game, but I won't put anymore money into it at this point.

I Really do hope this game brings on community warefare sooner than later because that will make the game. Right now they are just trying to suck as much money out of the existing player base that they can. Hopefully they will realize what they are doing before they alienate the Battletech player base or any other player that likes to play this game.

I hope that it's a short term versus long term thing. They've got to make the game successful short term so that it survives, so that they can then introduce all of the features everyone wants long term. That doesn't quite explain how they managed to knock out 8 v 8 in match-maker phase 3, but does explain how certain features are deemed lower priority to making something profitable fast.

[Helbourne]

I for one enjoyed the new Elo system. I solo drop 99% of the time. I am not part of any sort of official house (yes I chose Fed Sun for the heck of it in the forums). I swear my k/d ratio went from .67 to .69 (my win/lose ratio it horrible too) yesterday, during the few hours Elo was active. I was surviving longer than 3-4 minutes during those matches.
I like playing heavy mechs, the cats and cataphracts. I know I am by far the best player. Yes the wait times between matches were kind of long at times. Yes it failed to find several in a row. It didn't bother me all that much. Here is to hoping that the devs can make the proper adjustments, hunt down any bugs, and put it back in ASAP.
I believe that solo/ lone wolf/ pugs can co-exist with organized teams.

Edited by Helbourne, 20 February 2013 - 11:02 AM.

[Alois Hammer]

Paul Inouye, on 19 February 2013 - 05:26 PM, said:

Lone wolves isn't the best term since it is a "faction" But it's the solo drop players we're talking about.

...and it hasn't occurred to anyone to just call them "solo players" to minimize the confusion?

That explains a lot around here, actually. How's progress on Third Pers Enhanced Viewing Options going?

[Carrion Hound]

Darknight99, on 19 February 2013 - 07:42 PM, said:

To bad I didnt get to try it. Pgi focus on what you need to do because people will be mad regardless. Support and patience is what we need. If you are working late at the office and missing your family I salute you.

°
I agree with this guy. Just keeping doing what you do. Once the speed of the MM3 system is increased, and optimized the game will be more fun for everyone.

PS: QUIT WHINING! Be grown men and women.

[Coolant]

makes sense this issue got thru QA...all of their internal beta-testers probably have near equal ELO...of course they wouldn't have issues finding a match because they match up well. At least they reverted back quickly.