1089 replies to this topic

[Twisted Power]

So, PGI once again says "we like the fact that ECM cloaks you suck it." Like it has been said before somebody really high up likes ECM and it is going to stay broke. They(and by that I mean he) want it to do the things it should not do.

To end it all, I hate to break this to you PGI but just because you say "ECM brought a whole new level of strategy and skill to the battlefield" does not make that true. It did not, you lie through your teeth. It reduced all strategy and skill.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Good thing is I quit after the last patch. So this just helps me feel better about it.

Guess I'll give it a go after 3 or 4 months.

[XX Sulla XX]

ECM does not really bother me the way it is. But I would like it if all mechs had the option to turn off or on radar like in Mechwarrior 4. Honestly their system seemed to work a lot better as far as radar.

[WassonG]

How about you "fix" the ******* match maker while your at it...

You seem to be wasting a ****-ton of time and effort on ECM alone, and achieving nothing of any real value.

Keep your focus on making sure every mech and weapon system has a place...or this game is ******* pointless.

Edited by WassonG, 03 April 2013 - 02:46 PM.

[shintakie]

Vassago Rain, on 03 April 2013 - 02:26 PM, said:

Because that atlas is the command atlas, so it should have the command gear. You all complain that it's not fluffy, but that's exactly how the game's designed.

But the Atlas that actually gets ECM is the K2 which is an updated version of the Atlas-K, a mech we actually have in game right now. Explain that one away oh great one.

[Daggett]

I welcome the fact that PGi is realizing that the friendly signatures should not be cut-off by ECM.
In my eyes this is currently what makes ECM way too powerful, especially in PUG matches where the team NEEDS to know the position of friendly mechs in order to coordinate themselves in the heat of the battle (chat is no option when being fired upon).

Hardpoint restriction however is kinda pointless unless it is the CT where ECM has to be located.

The most dangerous ECM mechs are the light ones. It is hard enough to hit those, no one will ever aim for anything else than the legs or the whole thing above them. They are simply too fast to aim at an arm or side torso.

And on an Atlas you can't afford to aim at the side torso (not speaking of arms) just to destroy the ECM. You shoot on the CT unless you think the Atlas is dumb enough to run an XL-Engine.

So personally if you remove the disruption of friendly signatures, i could be ok with ECM.
Still being able to hide the whole enemy team (which was just buffed by the new thermal view nerf) still is a bit over the top for ecm's small drawbacks, but i could at least live with it.

[StalaggtIKE]

The hardpoint is a welcomed change. The IFF removal was a cool aspect of ECM that actually fit in with IW. I kind of hate to see it go. The parts that should be removed, such as the null signature, remains. ECM is no longer an aspect of IW, but instead a anti-missile tool and radar neutralizer. It gives the team with ECM the radar advantage. This is more prevalent with the resent change to thermal vision. Overall I feel this is too little and too late.

Since it has been decided that it is now balanced, let's make it equip-able on every mech.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 03 April 2013 - 02:28 PM.

[Felicitatem Parco]

I think we can all agree that Canon-Variants-Get-Canon-Specific-Equipment doesn't hold water when every single Mech can mount XL Engines, EndoSteel, FerroFibrous Armor, Double Heatsinks, and BAP... so talks of "Canon Fluff" doen't really apply.

Edited by Prosperity Park, 03 April 2013 - 02:29 PM.

[shintakie]

Prosperity Park, on 03 April 2013 - 02:28 PM, said:

I think we can all agree that Canon-Variants-Get-Canon-Specific-Equipment doesn't hold water when every single Mech can mount XL Engines, EndoSteel, FerroFibrous Armor, Double Heatsinks, and BAP.

Then can we agree all mechs should get ECM too? I can dig that.

Because that is the logical conclusion of your argument there.

Edited by shintakie, 03 April 2013 - 02:30 PM.

[hammerreborn]

Vassago Rain, on 03 April 2013 - 02:11 PM, said:

Which has a lot more to do with the triple missile slot for rocketpunch than ECM, and before brawling and ECM were even a thing, you could artemis lurm farm in the ghetto.

So...

And since the SRM nerf most people are saying the D-DC is useless, and with every state rewind lights have been disappearing at an alarming pace.

[INSEkT L0GIC]

shintakie, on 03 April 2013 - 02:04 PM, said:

And how do you propose we get better tactics in pugs with the inability to even see where your team is let alone have absolutely no effective way to communicate with them with the terrible chat interface we have.

Seriously. I can't even delete more than 1 letter at a time in my chat window because holdin backspace does NOTHING. Zero. Zip. Nada. I have to hit backspace for every single letter if I mess up. somewhere. The only other option is CTRL+A.

I pug almost exclusively and it is still fairly easy to discuss tactics at the start of a match. Against other puggers, equally disorganized, it is usually easy enough to separate their ECM mechs from the herd to focus fire as well.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Prosperity Park, on 03 April 2013 - 02:28 PM, said:

I think we can all agree that Canon-Variants-Get-Canon-Specific-Equipment doesn't hold water when every single Mech can mount XL Engines, EndoSteel, FerroFibrous Armor, Double Heatsinks, and BAP... so talks of "Canon Fluff" doen't really apply.

They don't care dude.

[Rofl]

I wonder what will happen if they ever introduce Angel ECM. It's a long ways off, but who knows if they're rush the timeline. I imagine it will make it so that if your crosshairs point over the mech for more than 0.5 seconds, they are forced away in a random direction. That way direct fire weapons have trouble hitting you too!

[Rajun]

ECM should generate heat and target locks are jammed for all mechs within the ECM radius! Not just your opponents!

m2c

[Stalkerr]

Quote

[color=#959595]That said, there are two things suggested by the community that struck a chord and we will be looking into implementing soon:[/color]

• ECM should have a dedicated hardpoint (tonnage/space does not change). That way ECM will always be in a known location on a Mech and can be directly targeted by attackers.
  
• ECM should not cut out friendly signatures on the battlefield. Friendly Mechs should always be identifiable and not obscure team play.

Paul, I love you for your love for Battletech bud, but these are not good ideas from the perspective of building a deep and lasting metagame in MWO.

• ECM should not be a dedicated hardpoint so people can disable it. This defeats the purpose of having a mechlab in the first place. You might as well rename it the "Weapon Lab", because you're essentially taking away the ability to customize a robot to be as effective as possible. There is already a counter to ECM and it's called ECM on counter. Alternately, you could also make BAP counter ECM, and call it a day. Plus, PPCs can temp counter ECM now a well. PLEASE do not make lazy game design choices like this. You kill off the depth of metagaming robot builds with these kinds of decisions.
  
• ECM should continue to cut out friendly signatures. If your teammates are that far split off from you without some sort of ECM counter, there should be some sort of penalty when they come under an ECM umbrella. This is a perfectly valid game mechanic and should remain in the game.

Short story... if you make these changes, you nerf ECM so much there is no reason to ever bring one on any robot in MWO's metagame. If your intention is to make the ECM useless and make MWO matches a more shallow experience, then you're on the right track. As a former game designer myself I implore you, please do not take the easy road on this and think carefully through the downstream implications of your decision.

Thanks,

[Rofl]

shintakie, on 03 April 2013 - 02:29 PM, said:

Then can we agree all mechs should get ECM too? I can dig that.

Because that is the logical conclusion of your argument there.

That would be fine. We don't need LRMs and Streaks in this game, apparently. They can go the way of the MG and Flamer if this trend continues!

[Vassago Rain]

shintakie, on 03 April 2013 - 02:28 PM, said:

But the Atlas that actually gets ECM is the K2 which is an updated version of the Atlas-K, a mech we actually have in game right now. Explain that one away oh great one.

That's not. We don't have that one, and never will have it. So they consolidated the mechs into 'tech,' 'generalist,' and 'commander.'

[Rofl]

Stalkerr, on 03 April 2013 - 02:32 PM, said:

Paul, I love you for your love for Battletech bud, but these are not good ideas from the perspective of building a deep and lasting metagame in MWO.

• ECM should not be a dedicated hardpoint so people can disable it. This defeats the purpose of having a mechlab in the first place. You might as well rename it the "Weapon Lab", because you're essentially taking away the ability to customize a robot to be as effective as possible. There is already a counter to ECM and it's called ECM on counter. Alternately, you could also make BAP counter ECM, and call it a day. Plus, PPCs can temp counter ECM now a well. PLEASE do not make lazy game design choices like this. You kill off the depth of metagaming robot builds with these kinds of decisions.
  
• ECM should continue to cut out friendly signatures. If your teammates are that far split off from you without some sort of ECM counter, there should be some sort of penalty when they come under an ECM umbrella. This is a perfectly valid game mechanic and should remain in the game.

Short story... if you make these changes, you nerf ECM so much there is no reason to ever bring one on any robot in MWO's metagame. If your intention is to make the ECM useless and make MWO matches a more shallow experience, then you're on the right track. As a former game designer myself I implore you, please do not take the easy road on this and think carefully through the downstream implications of your decision.


Thanks,

You're kidding right?

[Nicholas Carlyle]

He is.

[Deathlike]

Prosperity Park, on 03 April 2013 - 02:28 PM, said:

I think we can all agree that Canon-Variants-Get-Canon-Specific-Equipment doesn't hold water when every single Mech can mount XL Engines, EndoSteel, FerroFibrous Armor, Double Heatsinks, and BAP... so talks of "Canon Fluff" doen't really apply.

In the sense that one variant gets ECM, the problem unfortunately is that if you considered the mech's variants as a whole, ECM is the cherry on top with the mechs that have them.

ECM is supposed to be "special" for the purposes of balance, but technically ECM is THE imbalance, and imbalances light mech diversity further.

Giving ECM to "all" light mechs only changes the problem, and doesn't address the fact that ECM itself needs to be nerfed a lot more.

Edited by Deathlike, 03 April 2013 - 02:35 PM.