226 replies to this topic

[One Medic Army]

SMDMadCow, on 10 June 2013 - 11:20 AM, said:

Yes, we have a canonical base to work from, but all i am seeing is that the Quickdraw will be a heat beast while the Dragon can use a ballistic to cool off. Again, neither better just different.

As someone who runs an XL350 in all his Dragons, I will appreciate having more hardpoints I can actually use.
2 of my dragons have ballistics, and AC/10 and an LBX10, but the extra weight these require means that all the energy weapons are reduced to just being medium lasers.

Also, you have to agree that having 2 missile slots in the CT, or having 3 ballistics all consolidated into a single arm are sub-par at best.
The fang, flame, and 1C aren't bad.

Edited by One Medic Army, 10 June 2013 - 11:28 AM.

[Sephlock]

One Medic Army, on 10 June 2013 - 10:57 AM, said:

Actually, we do know the minimum hardpoints, and their locations, for the various possible variants.
4G (and 4H):
LA 1E
LT 1M (10)
CT 1M (4)
RT 2E
RA 1E

5A (and 5K)
LA 1E
LT 2E
CT 1M (4)
RT 2E
RA 1E

5M isn't likely due to it having a "one-shot" launcher, and it has the same hardpoints/locations as the 4G and 4H anyway.

The 5m is pimped to the gills with star league tech, which would make the c bill price for it very high, which makes it a likely candidate given past variant pricing .

[One Medic Army]

Sephlock, on 10 June 2013 - 11:33 AM, said:

The 5m is pimped to the gills with star league tech, which would make the c bill price for it very high, which makes it a likely candidate given past variant pricing .

However they'd have to modify the stock loadout to swap the SRM4 one shot launcher to a normal SRM4, or introduce one shot launchers.

I'm really interested to see how they'll deal with it essentially only having 2 variants as far as base hardpoints go, and both of them having as many or more hardpoints than the 6 the Dragon gets.

[SMDMadCow]

One Medic Army, on 10 June 2013 - 11:26 AM, said:

As someone who runs an XL350 in all his Dragons, I will appreciate having more hardpoints I can actually use.
2 of my dragons have ballistics, and AC/10 and an LBX10, but the extra weight these require means that all the energy weapons are reduced to just being medium lasers.

Also, you have to agree that having 2 missile slots in the CT, or having 3 ballistics all consolidated into a single arm are sub-par at best.
The fang, flame, and 1C aren't bad.

I agree with the multi slots are not ideal, but are you trying to bank smaller lasers on your Dragon or larger energy? Ive seen plenty of energy heavy builds on Dragons.
Theres just not a significant difference in the chassis, both will have the same engine sizes and total armor, only 1 gets jets and the other gets ballistics. Its going to be like having 6 Hunchbacks, mostly the same and you need all 6 to elite out.

[One Medic Army]

SMDMadCow, on 10 June 2013 - 11:39 AM, said:

I agree with the multi slots are not ideal, but are you trying to bank smaller lasers on your Dragon or larger energy? Ive seen plenty of energy heavy builds on Dragons.
Theres just not a significant difference in the chassis, both will have the same engine sizes and total armor, only 1 gets jets and the other gets ballistics. Its going to be like having 6 Hunchbacks, mostly the same and you need all 6 to elite out.

My 1C runs the 2PPC, 2ML, srm6 build, and has since before the recent PPC buffs.
Not enough tons to use both heavy energy and ballistics.
Now, if this was a QuickDraw I could drop the SRM6 for a streak2 (or drop entirely) to pack on some more medium lasers and/or jumpjets. I could also actually go slower and mount a standard engine, which is just worthless on a Dragon with how tiny the side torsos are.

[scJazz]

FupDup, on 10 June 2013 - 10:23 AM, said:

Hardpoints are a concept invented by Microsoft when they made MW4 and continued by PGI for MWO. Hardpoints don't exist at all in canon.

Yeah I know that... I should have been far more specific in my question so that someone didn't you know... get all technical.

Still my question seems answered. The HP layout isn't posted anywhere we are just inferring it based on TROs.

[One Medic Army]

scJazz, on 10 June 2013 - 11:45 AM, said:

Yeah I know that... I should have been far more specific in my question so that someone didn't you know... get all technical.

Still my question seems answered. The HP layout isn't posted anywhere we are just inferring it based on TROs.

Pretty much.
Stock loadouts must be possible, therefore certain minimum in number and locations of hardpoints can be inferred.
Since the QuickDraw has so many weapons stock (6 or 7) it probably won't be gaining many extra hardpoints. Most other heavy mechs have 6 hardpoints total, jägers have 8, and the cataphract 4x has 7.

[SMDMadCow]

One Medic Army, on 10 June 2013 - 11:43 AM, said:

My 1C runs the 2PPC, 2ML, srm6 build, and has since before the recent PPC buffs.
Not enough tons to use both heavy energy and ballistics.
Now, if this was a QuickDraw I could drop the SRM6 for a streak2 (or drop entirely) to pack on some more medium lasers and/or jumpjets. I could also actually go slower and mount a standard engine, which is just worthless on a Dragon with how tiny the side torsos are.

Ok, I see what youre saying now. If you put that build on a Quickdraw, you would have to ditch the SRM for the 4 tons needed for 4 jets, of you wanted full jj capacity.

[Vodrin Thales]

Braggart, on 04 June 2013 - 10:21 AM, said:

The dragon is now dead.

No mech out there has as bad of hitboxes at the dragon, and then add the horrible weapon loadouts. The quickdraw is gonna be my go to mech.

4 PPCs in a fast moving jump jet capable 60 ton mech, Im gonna love it.

The Awesome would like a word with you.

[Angel of Annihilation]

SMDMadCow, on 10 June 2013 - 11:39 AM, said:

I agree with the multi slots are not ideal, but are you trying to bank smaller lasers on your Dragon or larger energy? Ive seen plenty of energy heavy builds on Dragons.
Theres just not a significant difference in the chassis, both will have the same engine sizes and total armor, only 1 gets jets and the other gets ballistics. Its going to be like having 6 Hunchbacks, mostly the same and you need all 6 to elite out.

As someone who has traditionally liked Dragons, I can see the Quickdraw being a fairly nice upgrade just due to the hardpoint locations.

The biggest issue I have always had with a Dragon is getting enough firepower on it due to 60 tons being an inefficent weight class for mechs combined with how heavy ballastic weapons and ammor are. A Gauss for example needs 18-19 tons (rought 25-30% of a 60 ton mechs total weight) to be really effective. The Quickdraw however won't rely on ballastics for its big hitting weapons. Also by locating at least one Missile slot to the side torso, it really opens up options the Dragon doesn't have. Additionally Jump Jets will just be icing on the cake.

Might try something like this:

2 LL - Arms
2 ML - RT
1 LRM15 + Atremis LT
1 SRM 4 CT
Jump Jets
300XL engine
Endo Steel
Double HS

[Vodrin Thales]

Viktor Drake, on 10 June 2013 - 12:03 PM, said:

As someone who has traditionally liked Dragons, I can see the Quickdraw being a fairly nice upgrade just due to the hardpoint locations.

The biggest issue I have always had with a Dragon is getting enough firepower on it due to 60 tons being an inefficent weight class for mechs combined with how heavy ballastic weapons and ammor are. A Gauss for example needs 18-19 tons (rought 25-30% of a 60 ton mechs total weight) to be really effective. The Quickdraw however won't rely on ballastics for its big hitting weapons. Also by locating at least one Missile slot to the side torso, it really opens up options the Dragon doesn't have. Additionally Jump Jets will just be icing on the cake.

Might try something like this:

2 LL - Arms
2 ML - RT
1 LRM15 + Atremis LT
1 SRM 4 CT
Jump Jets
300XL engine
Endo Steel
Double HS

While all this is true, ballistics currently outperform missiles by a long shot, especially SRM's. Success of the quickdraw at high level play will depend on energy hardpoints.

[Peter Valentine]

Where is the Orion???damn....:/

[Sephlock]

[Othello]

The 3 variants are announced. QKD-4G, 4H, and 5K.

[JackPoint]

Looking on Sarna i'm not overly impressed with this mech nor pgi's choice in varients.

"It has one major flaw though: its light armor protection. With armor on par with most mid-grade medium 'Mechs, the Quickdraw is barely capable of standing up to heavier 'Mechs."

Guess I won't be the only one disappointed to not see the Orion.

[FupDup]

Jackpoint, on 12 June 2013 - 11:05 AM, said:

Looking on Sarna i'm not overly impressed with this mech nor pgi's choice in varients.

"It has one major flaw though: its light armor protection. With armor on par with most mid-grade medium 'Mechs, the Quickdraw is barely capable of standing up to heavier 'Mechs."

Guess I won't be the only one disappointed to not see the Orion.

It's 60 tons. Its armor capacity is the same as the Dragon's (which isn't very impressive but that's not the point). The description is just talking about how the stock variants skimp on the armor, something which min-max will fix.


(And yes, I do also want the Orion instead of QD ).

Edited by FupDup, 12 June 2013 - 11:08 AM.

[One Medic Army]

Othello, on 12 June 2013 - 10:55 AM, said:

The 3 variants are announced. QKD-4G, 4H, and 5K.

Guess: all variants will have 7 hardpoints.
The G and H will receive either an extra energy or an extra missile (LT).
The K already has 7 hardpoints.

[SMDMadCow]

Othello, on 12 June 2013 - 10:55 AM, said:

The 3 variants are announced. QKD-4G, 4H, and 5K.

?? Without rear firing weapons, there is no difference in the 4G and 4H.

[One Medic Army]

SMDMadCow, on 12 June 2013 - 11:12 AM, said:

?? Without rear firing weapons, there is no difference in the 4G and 4H.

One will probably get an extra ener hardpoint, and the other will probably get an extra Lt missile hardpoint.
Of course, unless they have different quirks the stock models will be exactly the same.

[SMDMadCow]

One Medic Army, on 12 June 2013 - 11:15 AM, said:

One will probably get an extra ener hardpoint, and the other will probably get an extra Lt missile hardpoint.
Of course, unless they have different quirks the stock models will be exactly the same.

I see. Not impressed, will have to wait and see.