366 replies to this topic

[Namwons]

OR...we could have actually collision detection per mech? like if i have my mech aimed down, and my legs are in the way of rotation, i would have limited rotation. if i were to aim skyward, clearing my arms of any obstacles, i would have greater/full range of twist. That would add another level of pilot skill.

[Karyudo ds]

UnLimiTeD, on 09 June 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

If you say it should only ever be 120°, you should also advocate for rear firing weapons, and there better not be any changes to weapons to ensure balancing. I personally think a video game of today should be able to change those kind of things a little to keep things interesting and varied.

Part of the problem with the 120 degrees is that you can only assume that from 60 degree chunks. That's why to me Battletech has never really been a Table Top game, it's played normally with hex sheets, not terrain. Granted it can but it's rules weren't designed with that in mind originally. Still on top of that hard limit EVERY mech, waist or not, could torso twist, because the game didn't care, even had arm mounted firing arcs for mechs that could turn their arms. "There's a rule for that" indeed.

Mini-rant aside I don't expect everything to be stuck with 120 degrees, mostly just around it. 360 seems like to much, didn't like it in MW4. It was useless to me in congested areas anyway.

[deathrollheng]

I sure hope SO i would also like to see say a quickdraw that can rotate arms as well maybe for a more elite mech choice

[Teralitha]

On the hex board, let me ask you a question... did you have to be hex aligned in order to twist and fire? or were u able to declare a twist in any degree within that 120 and fire? Ive played it, but its been so long I dont remember. If you had to be lined up perfectly, then how is that going to be mimiced here, and for that matter, there are no hexes at all.

So there really is no reason not to have some 360 mechs. It added more flavor and more diveristy in skilled play. It would be an improvement to the game to have a "few" 360 mechs. They never broke the game in mw4. They enhanced it.

[The unnamed one]

I say only a few mechs, like the ones in MW4 to have 360 or greater turn radius than other mechs and some that have the legs hooking into the arms ie. nova/blackhawk to have a very very limited turn radii like in MW3.

[Gorith]

360 twisting would make it lessen the effectiveness of lighter chassis because part of your defence is staying out of certain firing arcs... Last time i checked the devs are trying to make lighter chassis more appealing so not everyone fields heavy and assault mechs. Giving the 360 twist would fly in the face of this.

[Teralitha]

Gorith, on 09 June 2012 - 03:41 PM, said:

360 twisting would make it lessen the effectiveness of lighter chassis because part of your defence is staying out of certain firing arcs... Last time i checked the devs are trying to make lighter chassis more appealing so not everyone fields heavy and assault mechs. Giving the 360 twist would fly in the face of this.

Your not even making any sense... Ive seen 360 in action in mw4. There was nothing wrong with it whatsoever. No complaints, from anyone... not even BT experts cared about it then.

Your not going to stay out of someones firing arc that is targeting you. 360 or not, if they have any piloting skill. 360 will have zero effect on this aspect for light mechs, or any mechs. You have to have actually played in an enviroment like mw4 that had 360 mechs, to have any real basis for your arguements against it.


Why do I want 360 mechs? because they take skill to pilot, and I like the challenge. It adds another level of skilled dynamics to the game. And I like more variables to increase the skill curve in a game of skill. Dont dumb this game down pls...

Edited by Teralitha, 09 June 2012 - 03:51 PM.

[Roland]

Gorith, on 09 June 2012 - 03:41 PM, said:

360 twisting would make it lessen the effectiveness of lighter chassis because part of your defence is staying out of certain firing arcs... Last time i checked the devs are trying to make lighter chassis more appealing so not everyone fields heavy and assault mechs. Giving the 360 twist would fly in the face of this.

I think folks need to realize something.

I don't believe that anyone is suggesting that ALL mechs get 360 torso twist.

But adding such a capability to some of them helps add variety to the chassis.

[Gorith]

Teralitha, on 09 June 2012 - 03:45 PM, said:

Your not even making any sense... Ive seen 360 in action in mw4. There was nothing wrong with it whatsoever. No complaints, from anyone... not even BT experts cared about it then.

Your not going to stay out of someones firing arc that is targeting you. 360 or not, if they have any piloting skill. 360 will have zero effect on this aspect for light mechs, or any mechs. You have to have actually played in an enviroment like mw4 that had 360 mechs, to have any real basis for your arguements.

then you have obviously never taken a light vs anything in MW4 yes you CAN stay out of firing arcs or at the very least minimize your time in them using good piloting... it's impossible to stay out of the firing arc of a mech with a 360 degree firing arc (not counting being above them)

[Roland]

Having a 360 degree torso twist doesn't really equate to a 360 degree firing arc. It just means that it's easier to get their firing arc facing towards you.

[He11Stinky]

The 360 turn is a good idea and i love it i also believe it make might the game faster imo but at the same time you have heavy mechs that are able to do so then it might be hard to balance

[Teralitha]

Gorith, on 09 June 2012 - 03:58 PM, said:

then you have obviously never taken a light vs anything in MW4 yes you CAN stay out of firing arcs or at the very least minimize your time in them using good piloting... it's impossible to stay out of the firing arc of a mech with a 360 degree firing arc (not counting being above them)

You noob... I have piloted and mastered every mech there is. There is nothing I havent done, no mechs I cant defeat, in any chassis that exists in mw4.

I have taken out entire teams with a raven, dont lecture me about what is possible driving a light mech vs anything.

But I will say, not all mw4 light mechs were as useful.(vs heavies/assaults) Owens, for example, was rather useless, but not totally... They were all fun to play.

But this isnt about the usefulness of light mechs. Even in MWo a heavier mech can overpower a light, that hasnt changed.
This is about 360 torso twist. And how it improves the level of piloting skill. And the over all skill factor of the game. To not have it at all, would be doing a disservice to the level of skilled play in the game.

Edited by Teralitha, 09 June 2012 - 04:20 PM.

[verybad]

PewPew2, on 09 June 2012 - 10:39 AM, said:

Ya theres no such things as 360 degree twist for mechs in battletech. I understand you want super-mechs that do absolutely everything but there has to be a balance somewhere.

Unless you use quirks.Extended Torso twist, while this only allows 270 twist, it's enough to get any target in your fire arc.

While 360 twist woudl be super powerful in Battletech TT, it is not in Mechwarrior. The reason for this is that in real time games, you're constantly adjusting, turning and twisting. It's simply not that big a deal in Mechwarrior. It simply makes for an interesting difference between mechs.

It wasn't uber powerful or unbalancing in MW4, and it wouldn't be so in MWO. An easy way to balance it is to slow down the speed of twist, or give it to a mech that has less optimal hard points.

[Steel Talon]

360 is reason i love Raven in MWLL

Maybe every mech should have own turn range to add diversity

Edited by Steel Talon, 09 June 2012 - 04:28 PM.

[Frostiken]

Iron Harlequin, on 09 June 2012 - 01:39 PM, said:

When would you use 360 torso twist honestly?

It's rare, and it's not easy to use since you can't see where the hell you're going, but it does come in handy.

It's not so much 'using the 360 twist', it's 'not having your aim interrupted by twist limits'.

This doesn't matter as much in MWO though because there's no reticule shake from walking, which is kind of lame.

Teralitha, on 09 June 2012 - 04:07 PM, said:

You noob... I have piloted and mastered every mech there is. There is nothing I havent done, no mechs I cant defeat, in any chassis that exists in mw4.

I have taken out entire teams with a raven, dont lecture me about what is possible driving a light mech vs anything.

But I will say, not all mw4 light mechs were as useful.(vs heavies/assaults) Owens, for example, was rather useless, but not totally... They were all fun to play.

But this isnt about the usefulness of light mechs. Even in MWo a heavier mech can overpower a light, that hasnt changed.
This is about 360 torso twist. And how it improves the level of piloting skill. And the over all skill factor of the game. To not have it at all, would be doing a disservice to the level of skilled play in the game.

[Deathz Jester]

Does it count as mastering a mech if I played MW4 on hardmode?

[Frostiken]

I totally mastered all the mechs in MechCommander.

[Warfeli]

I absolutely loved playing the Vulture and Thanatos precisely because of this 'advantage'. Although I believe it was balanced over all and added to the depth of the game. Playing against a skilled pilot in a Thanatos or Vulture made me think twice before engaging them in a duel or attempting to run circles around them for 10 minutes as a scout Mech spamming lasers or SRMs.

Edited by Warfeli, 09 June 2012 - 05:06 PM.

[Teralitha]

Frostiken, on 09 June 2012 - 04:34 PM, said:

It's rare, and it's not easy to use since you can't see where the hell you're going, but it does come in handy.

Yes this is exactly why it should be in the game. Increases the skill factor, as driving a 360 mech, is harder than not.

[Evedro Solais]

If you want a 360 spin, get a Quad mech with a turret.