359 replies to this topic

[Verminard]

The whole thing with the new movement was that, it was supposed to limit the heavier mech, making lighter mechs more viable, but once again the implementation is just terrible and badly thought out, with no basis how objects in motion behave. What about conservation of momentum? you hit a slight humock that has a high slope then you just grind to a halt and loose all manouverabity, where as momentum would carry you over with but a change of speed.

Then theres the fact that the slope makes no differance to your movement going downhill unless u are sliding down a too steep slope, wtf if that all about gravity only works in one direction?

These things are all affecting JJ's leading to very strange movment results and often warping, especially when there is another mech trying to occupy the same space as you.

Take it out PGI and come up with a better implementation, or forget it all together.

[Charles Seneca]

Good idea, Badly implemented. What happened to momentum?

momentum = mass*velocity

Not the hardest formula in the world.

This means a 100 ton mech moving at 50kph has MORE momentum than a 30 ton mech moving at 140kph.
Which in turn means that decceleration due to gravity will be less on the 100 ton mech and greater on the 30 ton mech.

At the moment it seems that deceleration is equal on all mechs regardless of momentum. RIDICULOUS! Have the devs never driven a lorry or jugernaught? They should give it a try.

The other factor is that these mechs are bipedal. The taller the mech the greater the potential clearance between foot and floor. Meaning that taller mechs would be able to move up STEEPER slopes than shorter mechs, albeit at a greatly reduced speed. They would also be able to step over obstacles, such as boulders, that would stop a smaller mech dead.

So why do light mechs fly over boulders that are 50% their hight but assault mechs slam to a stop?

Overall, the system needs more thought.

[Grendel408]

Definitely introduced new tactics to the map... however I noticed on Canyon while using JJs to skirt up an incline, reaching the top I would get stuck at the top and have to manuever slightly to move on the next terrain section/level of the map. Played around on many sides of the map and noticed this several times while in my Jenner... otherwise I do like the new terrain modifier you've introduced, just needs a little tweaking.

Edited by Grendel408, 03 July 2013 - 09:53 AM.

[Xelchon]

Tbh I was pretty pleased when I heard this. Was excited; BUT it was until I saw how it was implemented.
First of all,yes, the momentum. Second of all the angle limit. I know a bit military stuff; not gonna say Im an expert. I can pretty much relate to what makes mechs charming in a battlefield. THE LEGS! It's the mech's ability to respond VERY well to the changes in terrain while a tank may topple over for being too wide and having a static centre of weight. Maneuverability and versatility; that's what a robot must provide its user. Something a tank does not have.
Hell, that's why we have the neurohelmets for; it's not for show!
A simple Unimog Truck can traverse a slope 45 degrees. It's being used for decades! I'm not even begininning about a tank.
A mech? I don't say make it 80; but 45 is a slope for a child's toy, especially considering this is Science-fiction level technology we are talking about.
A mech which can't climb a simple hill shouldn't be on the battlefield. Nobody would exchange it for a tank if it doesn't have a capability as simple as that. Make it 55 atleast, dunno, just test it; many guys out give incredible feedback. Or do something like this:
Use the leg length/structure of each mech as a variable. Each mech can have a different ability to climb. This could further vary and tweak mechs and set their abilites apart from each other.
Also, mechs should be able to one-step at least to a height half their legs' height. A friggin Atlas shouldn't trip or turn its course because there's small dais or rock before it; its ridiculous.

Edited by Xelchon, 03 July 2013 - 10:16 AM.

[Morang]

Have yet to test it more thoroughly, but it's definitely a step in right direction. Wall-walking on Alpine looked strange for me. These restrictions in turn should require tweaking maps to improve balance and pathfinding, problems with small rocks have surfaced, some mechs belonging to certain archetypes are questionable (as is their models scale), but overall I'm glad that you PGI have implemented this. Looking forward for collisions/DFA.

[Milocinia]

It's definitely a good idea but as mentioned by many, the drop off comes too quickly and there needs to be some kind of momentum programmed in.

In addition to that, many maps require a bit of a rework as the flow of movement and the ensuing battles are adding even more imbalanced to the already awful gameplay.

Much work to be done PGI.

[Vraxx]

Conceptually I like it but I agree the gradient issue puts you at a stand still on some small obstructions like rocks or small surface divets. Had a point in Tourmaline where my forward speed would drop off because of a small rock that my foot was on so I'd go from 71 to 25kph until I turned 180 away from the rock and could move normally.

I understand keeping the physics of the grade of the slope but is there no way to factor height of the object a bit more on the rules for object traversal?

[Warlord Rufgar]

I don't like the new movement feature. In my opinion it would be enough to slow down the mechs when climbing hills, but only by a fix amount per degree. So the mech needs 'more' power to climb a hill. But don't let them stop on their way to the top of the hill by slowing him down till he stops. And i need a computer for a special vision where i can see green and red for where i can walk and where i don't.

I don't like the new movement feature. In my opinion it would be enough to slow down the mechs when climbing hills, but only by a fix amount per degree. So the mech needs 'more' power to climb a hill. But don't let them stop on their way to the top of the hill by slowing him down till he stops. And i need a computer for a special vision where i can see green and red for where i can walk and where i don't.

[Judge Doug]

I guess everyone needs to stop piloting assaults...

[AussieGiant]

As I said in the first post, it's a great move and needs a bit of refinement. It has to be kept in order to make light and mediums part of the equation.

[Runebasher]

good idea, bad implentation

• Mechs are slowing down to fast (momentum)
  
• When you are jumping (JJs), an a slope greater than 45° you wont fall down you are just stuck!
  
• Even a pile of **** with a slope greater than 45° stops Mechs completely!

[flaser]

Terribe implementation... momentum and enginer power should be able to overcome ridges better. Slow down, *eventually* stop, and start to slide back? SURE! But right now the system's too fiddly. I tend to pilot seriously over-powered heavy mechs (using the heaviest engines) and the *feel* of the mech behaviour is ridiculous.

I have nothing agains the concept itself, it's just that the implementation is horrible. This is a simulation game, you've got a physics engine under the hood... use it! It should be able to track momentum, weight, power with ease.

[garx8]

Bad idea all around. It is hard enough to keep up with the group when they can go faster than you but now I have to take a different route? Sometimes reality should not come before fun. Oh but wait are you telling me that in 3050 that they haven't come up with a foot design that can hold on more than a 45 degree incline (ever hear of cleats?) or that our mechs don't have the power to scale that incline? This also is annoying as hell and no fun. we are here to have fun right?

Edited by garx8, 03 July 2013 - 12:53 PM.

[MUDDD]

I see that most of what I was thinking has already been said in the first 8 pages. So I too am not happy with this latest patch. You went too far.

Edited by MUDDD, 03 July 2013 - 01:01 PM.

[GargoyleVine]

I like the game better before this last patch

[Ghostline]

Having played a couple of days with this change all I can say is what has been stated already in this thread. In concept I really like it. In implementation it's terrible. I have on SEVERAL occasions been completely stuck on small rocks. This has happened more so on river city than any other map. Utterly frustrating when you're just trying to take 30 seconds spinning trying to find the path that will let you unstick yourself.

Also one would think that when you have jump jets that they would at least give you some directional thrust other than straight up. On several occasions I would try to transverse a ledge where I would have no forward momentum but I could clear completely with my jump jets. Unfortunately jump jets don't provide any forward thrust, please don't tell me that jump jets only provide vertical thrust as if this was the case then jump jet assisted turns shouldn't happen either.

Suggestions I can think of that could possible fix this issue is to have an asset pass where a boulder the size of a mechs foot doesn't completely stop a mech dead in it's tracks like it was a 1000 foot impassible wall. Logic would dictate that you're not going to transverse a 90 degree slope that's taller than your mech but you would think that a 90 degree slope that's 5 feet high wouldn't be much if any of a hindrance to a 40 to 60 foot tall mech. Even if you had jump jets, you would need a running start first!

Edited by Ghostline, 03 July 2013 - 01:34 PM.

[Ciecieji]

Quote

The heat thing, also going to take some adjustment, but I think it's a step in the right direction. For all you whiny b*tches, if you don't like it, quit, stop crying here, and go make your own game- I dare ya!

Given that this is a thread to collect feedback about the change it's exactly the place that players should be crying about it.

Having said that, I'm not a huge fan of the new system. Partially because of frustration/balance issues, but mostly because it slows down the game. When I hit launch I'm looking forward to pounding other mechs into peices with my AC's and missiles, not finding traversable routes up terrain. I know there are alot of "sim" pilots out there who love the realism, but I'd prefer a fun mech fighting game to a realistic 3050 driving simulation - and frankly the whole outer sphere agrees with me, that's why they have trials.

[Kevin English Bab]

Niko Snow, on 02 July 2013 - 11:40 AM, said:

Tell us what you think of the new Movement sloping system!

Spoiler

- New Movement Archetypes.
- Mechs are now unable to traverse slopes greater than 45°
- Mechs will now slow down when climbing slopes from 20° to 45°, depending on mech size.

[Maelstrum]

Like most, I enjoy the initial idea but don't quite enjoy how its implemented.

Handled a Jagermech with 300XL engine (74kph) in Canyon Network and couldn't climb the paths clearly intended for that purpose. Found myself obligated to go snipe with no strategy available other than line of sight and accuracy.

Same with Alpine Peaks where I couldnt get up narrow snowy paths without stalling. Could only play in wide, lightly sloped fields of snow.

In River City, started south and once near the center platform, couldn't get past the ~2m tall ridge bordering the platform. 90deg angle prevents complete ascenscion, therefore we have the "pebble of infinite mass" issue for a tiny wall not much higher than my mech's shin. It should be a step, not a barrier. I had to take a long walk around, completely exposing my mech, to just get to the ramp. Meanwhile the other side has upper ground advantage and are clear to walk up the platform without thinking twice about exposure.

Finally, comm tower in Forest Colony is absolutely inaccessible now to mechs without jumpjets. Meaning north-side snipers will probably stay in base or head water... and keep near base.

Maps clear strategic vantage points are currently broken with the current iteration of the mechanic. Clear walking paths are now blocked, where choke points were once expected, now they are inevitable. Surprise attacks are now heads-on assaults.

Even the lights seem to struggle to move around and end up stuck in place. I expected it, but not as much.

Again, love the dynamics the mechanic has to offer. Hate how much it has currently reduced tactical manoeuverability and narrowed engagement possibilities.

Love you PGI, keep up the good work and those patches coming!

[Kuks Kublaa]

A rock the size of my fist stops my 90 ton Mech on flat ground...might aswell rename it to HillWarrior Online.

What used to be a shooting strategy game for me, is now nothing but fighting hills.Whats the point of all those pretty maps if you make 75 percent of it impassable?You walk (100km) around a hill to even see the enemy -and when you peek, he showers you with LRMs ; -Ofcourse you want to back up behind a hill to not get the whole 60 load,but wait...its your nemessis - a 2 cm pebble (Maybe you should add ER Pebbles to Consumables -to drop 5 of them in a radius like UAV XD).Enemies dont even position/chase us anymore. They just stand still and wait with their alphas/lrms.

Another thing- I walk up a (what used to be a designated area to climb) ridge on Cannyon.I CAN ACTUALLY CLIMB that hill ... right up to a point where I would reach flat ground and move forward - so I actually just waste time trying it (and then waste some more to get down from there somehow). I dont know about you , but i cant be a viable asset to my team if Im looking towards the ground all the time searching for tiny rocks,snowmen,lollipops,etc.

See you next patch, you can do it, I need a break anyway.

Edited by Kuks Kublaa, 03 July 2013 - 04:45 PM.