196 replies to this topic

[Deathlike]

Pictures as promised.

Edited by Deathlike, 11 August 2013 - 07:15 PM.

[-Natural Selection-]

Where you got 12k =/- for salvage. We received about 30k for all those leggings.

[Deathlike]

Dozier, on 11 August 2013 - 07:12 PM, said:

Where you got 12k =/- for salvage. We received about 30k for all those leggings.

Yea... salvage is where most of the winnings used to be. It seems like poking people w/o killing them makes money... instead of raw, efficient, and useful damage.

Edit:

I don't think I did too much outside of one battle (outside of getting epic XP), but the numbers pretty much suggest what PGI is fearing for all the wrong reasons.

Edited by Deathlike, 11 August 2013 - 07:18 PM.

[Genewen]

Well, if I needed another reason why I had my Overlord pack refunded, they have delivered it now.

I've dropped games I had invested a lot of time and money before because they became to grindy. MWO will be no exception to that rule when new mechs I like come out and the grind to get them feels unacceptable. For now, not giving another cent to PGI/IGP will suffice.

Edited by Genewen, 11 August 2013 - 07:23 PM.

[aniviron]

Wintersdark, on 11 August 2013 - 09:04 AM, said:

Eh, they will. People are weird that way, the vast majority seem to like grinding. Baffles me.

Funny; I've tried to introduce five friends to this game, and the have all been driven away by how long the grind was- and that was before the earnings reduction.

[Windies]

aniviron, on 11 August 2013 - 07:17 PM, said:

Funny; I've tried to introduce five friends to this game, and the have all been driven away by how long the grind was- and that was before the earnings reduction.

^ This. People like a grind because it puts a sense of purpose or a sense of accomplishment or a sense of reward behind an act. If the reward, accomplishment or sense of purpose is not as great as the grind then it has failed and will push or turn people away.

[Deathlike]

aniviron, on 11 August 2013 - 07:17 PM, said:

Funny; I've tried to introduce five friends to this game, and the have all been driven away by how long the grind was- and that was before the earnings reduction.

The thing about the grind is that it works better WHEN you are all set up... you have your "money making mech" with some flexibility and grinding each other variants (the 3 other mechbay slots, outside of the one dedicated for the money mech).

When you are NOT set up (the cadet bonus is paltry and insulting because there's not enough), you are handicapped like you're running a trial mech... so it takes quite a bit more money to get on an "equilibrium" to get where you need to go.. and this is before ANY skill/premium time/MC is factored into the equation.

I've been saying this many times about it to PGI, but clearly the new user experience can go eff itself... because... NO TUTORIAL.

Edited by Deathlike, 11 August 2013 - 07:25 PM.

[Genewen]

People like grinding for advancing what they already have, like unlocking achievements, leveling stuff and getting higher tiers or special versions of equipment they own. They do not like grinding to actually have something to play. Don't even try to sell trial mechs as such.

I am fine with grinding XP for the pilot tree of a new mech, because I already have the mech, so I can tinker and play with it. If grinding for a new mech takes too long for my taste, I'll spend the limited time I have elsewhere instead of wasting it to grind for a mech it will take me weeks to get including equipment.

[atownexl]

I don't think I've ever felt this kind of frustration over a video game before. I want to play Mechwarrior; I'm willing (and have) to buy an overlord package and MC packages. I've spent more on this than any game I've ever played. I'm sure others are in the same boat.

I'm OK with spending $150 on what used to be a $60 box game. I'm not OK with feeling like I'm getting screwed over.

Putting up patch notes saying the game is being adjusted to account for a big change in matchups, and they making a much smaller statement that shows that the previous statement isn't true at all.. that's not right.

[Wintersdark]

aniviron, on 11 August 2013 - 07:17 PM, said:

Funny; I've tried to introduce five friends to this game, and the have all been driven away by how long the grind was- and that was before the earnings reduction.

I said majority, not all.

This still fits my point, though.

I think the number of people who will stop playing post-nerf due to grindiness but wouldn't have before the nerf isn't very big. Your friends quit before the nerf; they're clearly not grindy people.

I really, REALLY doubt many people will leave because of this; particularly not people with no frame of reference (re: Newer players who never experienced the old income level).

(Again, for clarity: I don't like the change, I just don't think it's going to hurt new player retention significantly.)

[Icedman]

Wow... that was an interesting listen.

So far, I've spent $100 on this game and was hoping this c-bill nerf was just horrible implementation. Now, with my PREMIUM time in a HERO mech, I am "spoiled" for expecting my c-bills to remain at the prior level?

Do you guys at PGI understand how insulting this is for fans of Mechwarrior? Those of us that have spent more on this F2P game than on triple A titles? You are shooting yourselves in the foot here and angering people who WANT TO GIVE YOU MONEY!

Hopefully someone will stop and think and realize that angering (curse words fit here too) people who literally want to give them money, decent amounts of it too, is a bad idea.

Also, to people who are saying that no one will leave because of this, you may be right. But it will hurt new player retention. The past level was JUST enough to feel like progress without it feeling too grindy. Now it's just ridiculous. The current meta is also playing a part... went into 5 consecutive games with a brand new AS7-D and got sniped, spider+LRMed and just overall destroyed (in cover, with the main group of my team each and every time). These things together with how terribly new players are taught how to do ANYTHING will make new player retention hard.

Start somewhere. Undo this c-bill BS. No reason for it and it cheapens your premium time in the process.

Edited by Icedman, 11 August 2013 - 09:34 PM.

[MustrumRidcully]

Wintersdark, on 11 August 2013 - 02:57 PM, said:

They're not figuring it out now. They've known all along, but it's harder said than done. I imagine earnings nerfs were a last resort, because... well, look at this thread. Obviously this wasn't the first choice for actions.

We'd not be ranting like this if the game had started here, or even lower and instead increased earnings; it's just that nobody likes getting less.

I can only surmise that they have more cbill sinks lined up for community warfare and likely had intended to just cruise along until then, but cbill stockpiles were simply getting too large, so they elected to reduce income to *** it back a bit until planned systems can come into play.

That's a much more plausible theory anyways.

An earning nerf doesn't equal a money sink, however.

[Sean von Steinike]

I wonder if the reduced earnings might be tired to this mythological community warfare? We are supposed to be getting bonuses based on our factions and such right? Perhaps when (if) they add in CW this will balance out.

[Natasz]

Did someone notice that you get 25k cbill as "winbonus" for a win, but for a defeat, you get the same 25k cbills as a "defeatbonus"?

[Genewen]

Natasz, on 12 August 2013 - 12:46 AM, said:

Did someone notice that you get 25k cbill as "winbonus" for a win, but for a defeat, you get the same 25k cbills as a "defeatbonus"?

Yes, the only difference between winning and losing is the salvage bonus. Which is now really tiny unless you leg everyone, so it doesn't really matter if you win or lose as long as your statistics stay the same.

[Arctourus]

I don't have a hero mech and I don't run premium time. I simply play for the fun of it. Previously, a standard winning match brough between 112K and 150K, depending on how well you did with damage done and kills. Now, a similar match earns between 65-80K. A big difference. It's not like I'm a freeloader either...I do buy mechbays and I spent a ton on the overlord package which I have to wait months to get. Also bought a Sarah's jenner. All told, around $100 for a free game. I don't appreciate the sudden loss of "free" income. Being able to earn the next mech was part of the fun, but since I don't get much playtime, it makes the anticipation turn into dread.

[Ransack]

Deathlike, on 11 August 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

I think the goons scarred Paul for life.

You win!

[Wintersdark]

MustrumRidcully, on 11 August 2013 - 11:32 PM, said:

An earning nerf doesn't equal a money sink, however.

I didn't say it did. I said they likely implemented this as a stop gap to delay people amassing absurd mountains of cbills while waiting for additional money sinks to come online with Community Warfare.

[-Natural Selection-]

Wintersdark, on 12 August 2013 - 11:02 AM, said:

I didn't say it did. I said they likely implemented this as a stop gap to delay people amassing absurd mountains of cbills while waiting for additional money sinks to come online with Community Warfare.

Why would they just allow people to play as they are/were and enjoy a smaller grind. Building an inventory of mech to mess with, and load out. Because atm, there really isnt a big hook to keep people here.

Then at the time (if it arrives) of CW announce there will be a wipe of cbills, so people can spend before. Either way some will be mad if they do, and some will if they dont.

[Mystery_Poison]

Unfortunately I have decided that PGI is earning too much and they need to earn less. I personally will be requesting a refund for a purchase I made recently. I am very dispelased with the way that they conduct business and saddened we could not come to a reasonable understanding.