483 replies to this topic

[Erata]

101011, on 17 August 2013 - 04:55 PM, said:

We had one, then they took it away and replaced it with the montly CDU. Now, they've made it the quarterly CDU. I wouldn't be surprised if that disappears altogether. Does anyone, apart from the devs, actually KNOW WHAT RELEASE EVEN IS?


To go with his direction then, Valve. No one even knows whether Half-Life 3 is coming, but nearly every fan will swear to you it's gonna be amazing. (If they don't, then something must be wrong with them )

I'm citing other F2P games because it's exciting to actually have something to look forward to when being involved with the lifespan and growth of a game. It's like watching your metal babby robot grow up.

It's not as though revealing the long term plans is going to bring ruin down unto this fair game.

[Biglead]

mint frog, on 17 August 2013 - 04:13 PM, said:

I was a huge MWO supporter throughout closed beta, and up til a few months ago when serious concerns about the direction of the game made it impossible to continue doing so with a clear conscience. That being said, i'm sure PGI listens to forums users, as evidenced by the recent SRM damage polling. Wales Grey was mocking the hyperbole that seems to be the norm now as we get closer to launch and emotions are running high.

Thankfully, you were observant of what he was trying to do and decided to play along in a hyperbolic ramble. I applaud you for your witty banter as you have touched upon the silliness that comes from making absolutist statements like,

Fact: #savemwo gathered 800+ members representing 5000 pilots. They brought what they thought at the time was a way to save the game and it got ignored. Read into that.

Fact: PGI mod rages and bashes on #Savemwo and has his post overturned by another mod. What does that tell you about what PGI staff thinks?

Your pitchfork and torch approach got you no where. Sitting here playing forum warrior and attempting to get the devs to answer your loaded questions will get you no where. If you're unhappy with this game you and your flock of "skwawk sheep" can bounce. No one but you will miss your voice.

Edited by Biglead, 17 August 2013 - 06:49 PM.

[MechFrog1]

Biglead, on 17 August 2013 - 06:47 PM, said:

Fact: #savemwo gathered 800+ members representing 5000 pilots. They brought what they thought at the time was a way to save the game and it got ignored. Read into that.

Fact: PGI mod rages and bashes on #Savemwo and has his post overturned by another mod. What does that tell you about what PGI staff thinks?

Your pitchfork and torch approach got you no where. Sitting here playing forum warrior and attempting to get the devs to answer your loaded questions will get you no where. If you're unhappy with this game you and your flock of "skwawk sheep" can bounce. No one but you will miss your voice.

I know you're trying to troll me into a reaction that you can then report, so I won't give you the pleasure. I'll just let you know that I have a much higher opinion of the PGI devs than you seem to.

Edited by mint frog, 17 August 2013 - 08:14 PM.

[New Day]

ackstorm, on 16 August 2013 - 08:42 PM, said:

*sigh* #savemwo QQers.

Just because you decided to turn your dissent into a mob doesn't mean they will simply bow to your demands.

Go ahead, leave the game. The game has a HUGE player base and chances are, most of us wont even notice the minority of QQers you represent. That is, the people who actually meant what they said and were not just giving empty threats.

PGI has plans mapped out for the next 2 years no doubt and they are doing the best they can to implement that in the order they want. They listen to the players and make tweaks, you can't deny that, but they do so at their own discretion and they have every right to.

They created this game. A game in a franchise that has been all but dead (except for community driven projects) for a long time. Just because you funneled money at them doesn't mean you are legally entitled to get what you want. If you disagree, then leave and start your own MWO game.

I'd like to see how far you get.

Yes and they had a plan for the last year and a half, do tell how that worked out.

[Chronojam]

Biglead, on 17 August 2013 - 01:34 PM, said:

Comments like these are why PGI ignores the suggestions of forum users. You think after a straight year of being bashed, threatened and harassed at every step, turn and decision that they are going to suddenly open up to diplomatic talks for change?

This implies the game has been broken for a year, and that everybody here was negative for a year. That's sorta disingenuous!

[redacted]

Edited by miSs, 18 August 2013 - 07:40 AM.
inappropriate

[Noesis]

Chronojam, on 16 August 2013 - 02:01 PM, said:

EA's been far more receptive to feedback and fan concerns, coming from playing Battlefield or C&C.

Electronic Arts: Video games firm wants to stop being 'hated'

[Wales Grey]

Biglead, on 17 August 2013 - 01:34 PM, said:

Comments like these are why PGI ignores the suggestions of forum users. You think after a straight year of being bashed, threatened and harassed at every step, turn and decision that they are going to suddenly open up to diplomatic talks for change?

Your disloyalty and thoughtcrime have been noted, citizen. This is going on your permanent record.

[Victor Morson]

Chronojam, on 14 August 2013 - 11:40 PM, said:

I like the part where you compare platinum AAA million-dollar franchise Call of Duty with yearly releases, to a free to play title by like a thirty-man development team. You're comparing a game with 40 million monthly players, to MechWarrior Online's tiny community, as if the public relations situations are the same. This is adorable.

I think no one can argue that during the real Infinity Ward run (before they got replaced with Treyarch employees and the real Infinity Ward formed Respawn, for those that follow the game industry - i.e. the last two IW CoD games were only made by IW in name only), despite all of the conditions you have explained, their community support was way, way better.

Constant twitter updates. A community manager that was actively involved in talking to teams and forwarding balance feedback, etc. I'm talking about the Call of Duty 1/2/4 era, for the record. They were even known for it.

While I can't speak of how they were today, it proves it can be done even there.... so doing it here should not be a problem.

Biglead, on 17 August 2013 - 06:47 PM, said:

Your pitchfork and torch approach got you no where. Sitting here playing forum warrior and attempting to get the devs to answer your loaded questions will get you no where. If you're unhappy with this game you and your flock of "skwawk sheep" can bounce. No one but you will miss your voice.

I miss the voices of the thousands of people who quit over this stuff. Because they have.

[Havok1978]

couple of little known facts....

#1 making a game isnt as hard as people think... true story.
people often say its more difficult than it looks or than you think, but these people havent even tried...
I have many times in these forums stepped forth and said, pick up a crysis SDK and give it a whirl.. most people wont cuz they would rather whine "but its too hard" .. its NOT hard.. its a learning process... final part of this paragraph.. IF ITS YOUR JOB TO MAKE GAMES... YOU SHOULD PROLLY KNOW HOW TO ALREADY...

#2.. sizing of hardpoints is too OP to try out cuz the community suggested this and PGI doesnt consider community suggestions..

at no point has PGI ever listened to us nor will they.. they may give the illusion that they have listened but I'm betting it was already brought up during a meeting beforehand..
It's like saying "here are your choices..." then later saying "but we listened to your ideas!" .. No, you did NOT listen to our ideas... Its the same thing parents do to thier kids to give them the illusion of some sort of form of control to appease them.

#3 3rd person view... nuff said... but, i will elaborate a bit here anyways..

implementing 3rd person view makes the game more appealing to console kiddies, these are the demographs they are pulling from, NOT from what the franchise supporters want. this is how a license and fanbase is destroyed ala mech assault or microsofts attempt at shadowrun the CTF game...
the FASA licenses have been so mishandled by greedy cash grabs trying to cash in on a cult fanbase its not even funny...
the ideal behind this whole burst income scheme is ppl come they buy, they leave, new crop comes in buys and leaves till the franchise is played out..

#4 tabletop purists cant support a game..

really? has anyone that hasnt played tabletop games actually looked into the cost of tabletop gaming? how about what an average tabletop gamer spends on thier beloved game? there is a balance to be had here between FPS and tabletop but the direction PGI is going with it is NOT it.. this could be fixed if they listened to thier community... in order to support micro-transactions a constant flow of NEW material needs to occur.. it doesnt have to be sweeping next best things.. it just needs to be different things with different cosmetics at a REASONABLE price... instead PGI opts for "burst" income of a larger investment

#5 a polished **** is still a ****...
this game is becomeing a short term instant gratification **** that once the gratification and newness wears off.. people realize its a **** and leave.

I loved this game and now I can barely play it, the only thing that keeps me here is the community and hope that PGI will wake up.. but this hope is dwindling rapidly.

Edited by Havok1978, 18 August 2013 - 06:42 AM.

[Noesis]

Havok1978, on 18 August 2013 - 06:39 AM, said:

Spoiler

couple of little known facts....

#1 making a game isnt as hard as people think... true story.
people often say its more difficult than it looks or than you think, but these people havent even tried...
I have many times in these forums stepped forth and said, pick up a crysis SDK and give it a whirl.. most people wont cuz they would rather whine "but its too hard" .. its NOT hard.. its a learning process... final part of this paragraph.. IF ITS YOUR JOB TO MAKE GAMES... YOU SHOULD PROLLY KNOW HOW TO ALREADY...

#2.. sizing of hardpoints is too OP to try out cuz the community suggested this and PGI doesnt consider community suggestions..

at no point has PGI ever listened to us nor will they.. they may give the illusion that they have listened but I'm betting it was already brought up during a meeting beforehand..
It's like saying "here are your choices..." then later saying "but we listened to your ideas!" .. No, you did NOT listen to our ideas... Its the same thing parents do to thier kids to give them the illusion of some sort of form of control to appease them.

#3 3rd person view... nuff said... but, i will elaborate a bit here anyways..

implementing 3rd person view makes the game more appealing to console kiddies, these are the demographs they are pulling from, NOT from what the franchise supporters want. this is how a license and fanbase is destroyed ala mech assault or microsofts attempt at shadowrun the CTF game...
the FASA licenses have been so mishandled by greedy cash grabs trying to cash in on a cult fanbase its not even funny...
the ideal behind this whole burst income scheme is ppl come they buy, they leave, new crop comes in buys and leaves till the franchise is played out..

#4 tabletop purists cant support a game..

really? has anyone that hasnt played tabletop games actually looked into the cost of tabletop gaming? how about what an average tabletop gamer spends on thier beloved game? there is a balance to be had here between FPS and tabletop but the direction PGI is going with it is NOT it.. this could be fixed if they listened to thier community... in order to support micro-transactions a constant flow of NEW material needs to occur.. it doesnt have to be sweeping next best things.. it just needs to be different things with different cosmetics at a REASONABLE price... instead PGI opts for "burst" income of a larger investment

#5 a polished **** is still a ****...
this game is becomeing a short term instant gratification **** that once the gratification and newness wears off.. people realize its a **** and leave.

I loved this game and now I can barely play it, the only thing that keeps me here is the community and hope that PGI will wake up.. but this hope is dwindling rapidly.

1) Do it then. Tell us all about it when you have applied yourself to managing an MMO with any serious investment.

2) Good, since judging from the maturity on this forum the child analogy seems beneficial then. But oh dear the Devs didn't select and apply your suggestion but instead wanted to keep more flexibility and options for the Mech building process, so now they are wrong for having a certain direction for the game. And you wonder why they treat you like a child? Read Kiplings "IF" about being a man, it isn't about always getting your way.

3) Why are more players not desired, why should adopting the next generation be problematic, especially when there is a mature and loyal player base representing the community to help instill the right ideals into them for the benefit of things. Oh wait .... maybe not. But at least I'm not personally "afraid" of inviting and embracing new blood into the MWO experience.

3rd person as has been presented makes a compromise with its use where if anything the 1st person simulated view is better to apply. So guess what, they "listened" to the player base in their commentary about unfair advantages and made extra effort to apply initiatives to reduce these concerns, flashing camera to give position away, slower aim twitch, reduce Intel on the hud, locked arms and a slower transition time between modes to reduce on the hop awareness. Had they not listened to these concerns then 3rd person may have been more of a problem. And guess what, now the audience of MWO might expand inducing more resources to be applied back into the game, and now propels the interest of BT for a new generation, why should they be excluded from the BT universe?

4) TT is a different animal to a Big Stompy Robot simulator, sorry you cannot appreciate this. And I really try not to spend other peoples money for them, especially when there is a "free" option also. Needless to say I've contributed a sizeable sum into MWO and I quite happy with how they present their interpretation of the "precidents" of BT but realise they cannot be an exact interpretation to make things actually work. But then, I'm a realist not a purist, which gives me more of a flexible mindset in trying to accomodate interests and opinion.

5) Projecting your view onto others isn't a good way to represent factual content, I knew I was in for a long haul when I signed up as a founder. From what I understand however accounts are continuing to grow with now over a million even before the launch date (and from your own points a new generation is being invited to play MWO) and the phoenix package continues to grow with the added loyalty rewards now being applied, and as I understand from InnerSphereNews: "Project Phoenix has exceeded our wildest expectations in popularity". This would suggest an expansive trend not a dwindling one. But I guess if you listen to a tin foil hat minority voice who wants to try and control MWO for their own benefit then you might believe otherwise.

If you think that strongly about things Havoc then I sympathise, but I don't share the same interpretation of events as yourself and would suggest you need to listen to less scare mongering commentary. I see PGI as being wide awake personally but it is members of the community who actually refuse to open their eyes to what is actually happening and placing their own out of proportion perspective on events. And if playing with **** isnt hyperbole, I would suggest seeking help about this habit.

[101011]

Erata, on 17 August 2013 - 05:00 PM, said:

It's not as though revealing the long term plans is going to bring ruin down unto this fair game.

In fairness, if they do reveal long-term plans, they most likely won't meet them (see: Big Things in July, CW by Open Beta, etc.), and the community will be on their case yet again. This community doesn't really like being let down (me included).

[darkfall13]

ackstorm, on 16 August 2013 - 08:42 PM, said:

PGI has plans mapped out for the next 2 years no doubt

NamesAreStupid, on 17 August 2013 - 09:41 PM, said:

Yes and they had a plan for the last year and a half, do tell how that worked out.

oooh oooh me me! I can do it! The last year and a half plan has been translated along the timeline to be the new plan map for the next 2 years right!? Now about that extra credit Mr. Teacher...

[Erata]

101011, on 18 August 2013 - 11:21 AM, said:

In fairness, if they do reveal long-term plans, they most likely won't meet them (see: Big Things in July, CW by Open Beta, etc.), and the community will be on their case yet again. This community doesn't really like being let down (me included).

You could say that disappointment is a part of every single game development endeavor ever though, especially this deep into it and how the internet's enabled games to evolve over time. Look at STALKER as a quick snapshot. The original design idea was not met in the first game. Eventually it was, but was held back by various delays and budgetary roadblocks.

All I want the roadmap for is to see what's up with CW's ideas when launch is only just around the corner.

[Wales Grey]

Havok1978, on 18 August 2013 - 06:39 AM, said:

couple of little known facts....

#1 making a game isnt as hard as people think... true story.
people often say its more difficult than it looks or than you think, but these people havent even tried...
I have many times in these forums stepped forth and said, pick up a crysis SDK and give it a whirl.. most people wont cuz they would rather whine "but its too hard" .. its NOT hard.. its a learning process... final part of this paragraph.. IF ITS YOUR JOB TO MAKE GAMES... YOU SHOULD PROLLY KNOW HOW TO ALREADY...

#2.. sizing of hardpoints is too OP to try out cuz the community suggested this and PGI doesnt consider community suggestions..

at no point has PGI ever listened to us nor will they.. they may give the illusion that they have listened but I'm betting it was already brought up during a meeting beforehand..
It's like saying "here are your choices..." then later saying "but we listened to your ideas!" .. No, you did NOT listen to our ideas... Its the same thing parents do to thier kids to give them the illusion of some sort of form of control to appease them.

#3 3rd person view... nuff said... but, i will elaborate a bit here anyways..

implementing 3rd person view makes the game more appealing to console kiddies, these are the demographs they are pulling from, NOT from what the franchise supporters want. this is how a license and fanbase is destroyed ala mech assault or microsofts attempt at shadowrun the CTF game...
the FASA licenses have been so mishandled by greedy cash grabs trying to cash in on a cult fanbase its not even funny...
the ideal behind this whole burst income scheme is ppl come they buy, they leave, new crop comes in buys and leaves till the franchise is played out..

#4 tabletop purists cant support a game..

really? has anyone that hasnt played tabletop games actually looked into the cost of tabletop gaming? how about what an average tabletop gamer spends on thier beloved game? there is a balance to be had here between FPS and tabletop but the direction PGI is going with it is NOT it.. this could be fixed if they listened to thier community... in order to support micro-transactions a constant flow of NEW material needs to occur.. it doesnt have to be sweeping next best things.. it just needs to be different things with different cosmetics at a REASONABLE price... instead PGI opts for "burst" income of a larger investment

#5 a polished **** is still a ****...
this game is becomeing a short term instant gratification **** that once the gratification and newness wears off.. people realize its a **** and leave.

I loved this game and now I can barely play it, the only thing that keeps me here is the community and hope that PGI will wake up.. but this hope is dwindling rapidly.

• Making a game is very easy, just look at this selection of game maker games. Making a good game? That's hard.
  
• ???
  
• Third person view, while irritating, is a key feature to implement. Not for players, but for spectating.
  
• If Battletech was the size of 40k, "tabletop purists" still wouldn't be enough to support the game. (I agree with the point, but your reasons are a bit difficult to parse.)
  
• I agree, but the thing here is that PGI had the frame and body of a beautiful car, but then realized they didn't have enough time to make the rest of the parts, let alone make the rest of the parts work together, and just sort of jammed a lawnmower engine in, stuffed the airbags full of leaves, put adjustable spinners on the wheels, and tossed a selection of paint cans in the trunk. The game was good, but is just sort of... dull and lifeless. The game has been in roughly the same state since closed beta began. PGI will be launching this game as an unfinished product, dependent on the faith of consumers to trust them to make the game.

I think you've got some good points, but your wording and sentence structure is hard to decipher.

Edited by Wales Grey, 18 August 2013 - 03:57 PM.

[Chronojam]

Noesis, on 18 August 2013 - 08:24 AM, said:

1) Do it then. Tell us all about it when you have applied yourself to managing an MMO with any serious investment.

So, what's your least favorite movie, and why do you feel like you can criticize that movie despite not being a director?

[Noesis]

Chronojam, on 18 August 2013 - 06:10 PM, said:

So, what's your least favorite movie, and why do you feel like you can criticize that movie despite not being a director?

I have worked in the past as a project manager in the IT industry with the implementation of multi-million pound projects including both software and hardware whilst managing numerous interests that support that process. This with note worthy clients like McDonalds, International law firms, British NHS and Council organisations and the Reserve Bank of Zimbabwe.

Whilst maybe not the gaming industry I think I might have some insight into the management of IT projects.

None of this suggests that I understand or have any exceptional insight into the actual details going on with PGI/IGP.

[N0MAD]

Noesis.
Couple of questions for you.
Why did you buy Kali?
If you played MW3-4, where did you play it.
Youre a Templar?, where in MW3-4 did you and the Templars play or organised your games if you played competative games? (leagues).
TY.

[Noesis]

I used Kali 95 back with MW2 and Mercs series of games where I was a member of clan Nova Cats. This was at a time when US times where the norm and laser lag training was in the program by default.

MW4 I only played solo as due to career and personal interests I couldn't devote the time to these interests.

I have only recently joined the Templars and have not been a part of competitive leagues with the MW series.

My game play style is more fun orientated than totally serious competition. Purpose and interest then for myself I see as being with the Community Warfare game play with MWO.

I hope that the advent of the use of a lobby for private contests and other arrangements will be forthcoming for others as needs however, but it isn't a priority concern for myself atm.

Why do you ask?

[N0MAD]

I also had Kali, was a bit of a challenge buying it as i am an Aussie, but i needed it to play PvP, MW2-3-4 were primarily PvE games. I needed Kali for 2 primary reasons as i see it, to play PvP, and secondly and i think most importantly so i could communicate with the MW2 community. Here i was recruited by SJ (i stayed an SJ thru Mw2-3-4 and was hoping to be one in MWO)
With MW3-4 the place for matchmaking/chatting was the MS Zone, you should be familiar with that as you would most likely of used it for playing right?. Without Kali/MS Zone there would not of been a community, MW would of ended up being a small niche game people like myself would of dropped in about 2 weeks.
So what have we got in MWO? i mean to chat/matchmake or grow the community, where can I and my large group of MW friends interact with the rest of you guys, set up games competitions etc?. Lets face it not all of us are lone wolfs and the game is set as a team oriented game ( hence the Factions/Houses/Clans etc).
Yet after repeated request suggestions etc we have none.
This is purely one reason I and many more are not satisfied with the game and its direction, should we not complain?
Numbers, numbers mean different things to different people, numbers can be thrown around and really they mean nothing to alot of people. They can state that 1 million accounts, or 5000 in a movement or that purchases for an item are over whelming and in reality theres no proof no meaning. The numbers that count for me are numbers i see as fact every day, an empty friends list, dozens of personal friends (all MW fans) gone, and nothing PGI has done over the last 6 months are changing those numbers, so i need to conclude that things are not improving.
Since i have invested in this game (time and money) I have a right to complain and point the finger.
OK you are happy with the game, im pleased for you, others arent, debating numbers is pointless, debating Features/balance isnt pointless and people should be able to without being hampered or muted.

[Havok1978]

AS for my hand in this, I do many things, I dont claim to be an expert in anything persay but I have a VAST amount of knowledge when it comes to things I speak up about, or I go to seek the information I need.

Noesis, my gaming and game building experience comes from modding, I do 3D graphics with texture work, meshes and etc. I also write modules, create new assets. scripting is not a strong point with me, nor is coding... however when using a prebuilt game engine you dont have to know those things. also, I am a single person.. not a full on development studio...

so could I write and create MWO single handedly from scratch? no, I could not. but I can recognize that they arent either and I can also recognize they are doing a very poor job of it with the resources they DO have...

they didnt create thier own game engine, they are modifying one. so in this case yes i can critque them pretty accurately...

next, IF you were really a project manager then you should also realize that managing your assets correctly is key to successful project, but a successful project does not promise a successful product.

P.S. I have also invested a great deal of money into this game, I dont have a founder tag but I have infact invested right at 550$ into it

implmenting how a tool is used has varying degrees of effciency and this game is NOT efficient by any means.
these things I have said arent scare tactic hyperbole, it is an assesment of the majority of the communities feelings and what PGI has done.

I invested in it becuse at the time I liked it and it was going well, now I would wish for a refund on alot of my purchases due to the games changes... had the changes not effected those purchases i wouldnt have a problem with it.

Edited by Havok1978, 18 August 2013 - 08:05 PM.