2021 replies to this topic

[L A V A]

Played a game today.

The last guy on the losing team was standing on his base in 3rd person view... oblivious to all the mechs converging on him.

Don't think this is a very good "new guy" mode.

You're going to need a video tutorial to say the least.

[Maxx Blue]

It's not that PGI changed their minds about the queues. I could understand that. It's that they changed their minds after making a point of strongly stating that no one would ever have to fight a 3PV player if they didn't want to, and then changed their minds without telling anyone ahead of time or even explaining why when they actually released the change. That is just terrible communication. If the Brian Eckman post had come out BEFORE, or at least along with the patch notes, it might have been ok. Not good (there was always going to be forum rage over this change), but ok. But instead, they go back on what was said with no explanation or warning. Terrible, terrible job on community communication there guys.

I guess the test-server should have been a clue that there were not going to be any queues, but I figured that was just mixed-POV-only since they were explicitly trying to get feedback on 3PV, so what would be the point in letting folks drop 1PV-only matches? Instead, it is mixed-POV all the time without any explanation. Just drop it on us without a major component of the 3PV changes that everyone who reads the forums was expecting, and let everyone speculate about what the hell that means.

Look, I LIKE this game, still spend money on it, and I don't think mixed-POV is going to be a huge game-changer, so I don't have any e-Rage over that. I'm generally happy with the game, but even I got annoyed when, with no warning or explanation, I found out that there was no separation between first and third POV. It doesn't matter if 3PV is an advantage or not. What matters is that PGI repeatedly assured us that no one would need to play mixed-POV if they didn't want to, then completely changed their stance without telling any of the players. Dumb move guys, dumb move.

[Thosarmer]

Wickedj, on 21 August 2013 - 07:35 AM, said:

Then y do you care?

To force your low post count to go up and trick you into debating when all I'm going to do is argue my point then you argue yours then a mod is going to tell us to back off then it spills over into the game where we shoot each other and damn everyone else until the final epic conclusion where we become best friends and draw ponies on the sidewalk.

Edited by Thosarmer, 21 August 2013 - 07:47 AM.

[1nferno]

Implementation of a 3rd person view that you can freely toggle adds a lot of flavor to current gameplay. I can enjoy my mechs exterior aesthetics now, which is a really nice feature! I've heard a lot of negative feedback about it but in my humble opinion I think it was a good move!

As far as functionality is concerned I am definitely better at aiming in first person view.
third person views camera is too shaky for me to be proficient in combat, which is a good thing! I think it's a good idea to give 1st person "hardcore" players to have the upper hand when it comes to placing effective fires on targets, while 3rd person can be used more for visual value.

So far the camera is very nice!! Keep up the good work and thanks, mwo is quite the videogame.

[DeathofSelf]

Renaissance, on 21 August 2013 - 07:41 AM, said:

How about a nice game of chess?

no, let's play thermonuclear war

[Doomstryke]

bit sad I haven't seen any alt+F4 jokes based around the fact that PGI picked F4 as a toggle...

[Barrett]

Quote

It's a game some people spend mony for while others just play it for free. But those who spent money on that game has a right to complain. An that IS grown up.

...throwing money at something that does not perform to your requirements and then complaining.
OK, soooo... did you keep the receipt?
Personally I spent cash on this game with the mindset:"It can go bellyup tomorrow, enjoy whatever is left today"

Third person view did not wow me, but for the new players I am tutoring at the moment it makes their life a little bit easier when it comes to piloting. So I am for that and when they get their first kill I will enjoy the warm fuzzy joy that comes with knowing that my teaching has paid off.

<p>I have been playing in first person view for so long that when I loaded in third person it felt like my mind shifting without a clutch. Thank you PGI for the mind reset, but I'll stick to first person.

Edited by Barrett, 21 August 2013 - 07:53 AM.

[Woska]

In my opinion the third person view does not add any value to the game experience. You get a slightly wider view angle, but lose the visual cues on where your torso is pointed relative to your legs, and you lose the extra arc of fire due to the arm lock. On one hand I congratulate the development team on finding a way to introduce a third person view that doesn't give any advantage in game play. But on the other hand I can't help but wonder if those resources couldn't have been put to better use.

[Vamboozle]

I see the rage and I see the anger on this forum so I feel the need to add my voice but hopefully in a measured way.

Having been a fan of Battletech and the Mechwarrior games for many years I was overjoyed to stumble across MWO.

To find that it was free to play and offered a 1PV “simulation-like” experience just increased that joy and led to many happy hours playing the game (yes there were issues & problems but then it’s a Beta). In fact it was such fun that I invested some of my hard earned cash into it as I believed in the vision.

Then 3PV was first proposed – I, like many other members of this community, registered my objections as I didn’t want to play 3PV and play against people using 3PV. Also it appeared to go against the core principles that PGI had outlined for the game and one of the things that had attracted me in.

Then 3PV was being developed – like many I was concerned that nobody wanted this and that there were many other things that we felt would be a better spend of time (like Community Warfare or UI2.0). However my concerns were somewhat allayed by the clear statement from PGI that no one would be forced to play 3PV or against 3PV – even though I did wonder what the splintering would do to the community.

Then 3PV was in test – still I and many others didn’t want it. However there appeared to be separate queues for 1PV & 3PV – so even though I did object slightly to being described as “hardcore” with its implications of gaming nerd-dom, I thought well at least I can continue to play in 1PV (which meant regardless of how good / bad / advantageous 3PV might be, it wasn’t going to be my problem).

Now 3PV is live – hmm the 1PV versions are greyed out? Not too happy about that but I figure that maybe they want to stress test it for a few weeks and they’ll put it back later. So I think maybe I’ll put up with it or maybe take a break for a few weeks. But then we heard that they’re not going to put back in 1PV only….what the……?

So now I find myself seriously having to consider whether to continue or not……….and having signed up for Mechwarrior Tactics I now wonder if I can be bothered….

All in all I’d like to pass the following message onto the PGI management team:

I’ve worked in IT for over 28 years – starting as a developer and working up to a Programme Manager looking after multi year projects with budgets in the £ Millions – and if there is one thing I’ve learnt is that you ALWAYS manage the expectations of your Key Business Stakeholders and you NEVER mislead them because once you’ve lost that trust it never comes back.

And sadly PGI you’ve lost the trust of your Key Business Stakeholders – the community that has supported you in vision, spirit and with hard cash.

And the really sad irony in all of this is that you appear to have lost that trust by implementing something that doesn’t do the one thing it was supposed to do – help new players access the game.

So in summary:

will 3PV stop me from playing MWO? Not sure yet
would I recommend MWO to a friend? Probably not
will I ever believe a word PGI say to me again? Probably not
will I invest anymore money into MWO? Probably not
will I invest anymore money into a PGI games? Probably not
do I think this post or the hundreds before it will make a blind bit of difference to PGI? Probably not
is this the start of the end for MWO? I hope not but I suspect it might be

Edited by Vamboozle, 21 August 2013 - 07:52 AM.

[Effectz]

67 pages of outrage and no response from PGI.

[DisasterMedic]

I don't know which I find more amusing: that only Reno Blade out of DHB seems to be willing to shamelessly shill for PGI anymore, or that Colonic Panda Venison is still white knighting despite the fact that he was wholly, completely, and unceremoniously discredited when PGI announced there would be no 1st person view only queue.

:allears:

[1nferno]

Oh! Almost forgot to mention an idea I had last night.
imagine being able to shoot the 3rd person camera drone out of the sky, destroying it, thereby rendering it unuseable for the rest of the match. Perhaps you can add a C-Bill penalty for losing such sophisticated equipment, making it less of a "go-to" for people trying to take advantage of its... Advantages! Just an idea

[Raistlic]

Quote

throwing money at something that does not perform to your requirements and then complaining.

That is what funding includes.

[Blackfang]

Effectz, on 21 August 2013 - 07:52 AM, said:

67 pages of outrage and no response from PGI.

And I don't blame them one iota for not responding here either.

[MechFrog1]

Effectz, on 21 August 2013 - 07:52 AM, said:

67 pages of outrage and no response from PGI.

Don't worry, i'm sure the noise will die down soon and they can move onto the next insulting waste of development time.

To those who are saying, "Hey 3PV sucks so stop whining"

You really think they're going to leave it that way? They have their foot in the door now. Just wait until the next iteration. Eventually they'll get around to putting in something you don't like, and by then it will be too late.

Edited by mint frog, 21 August 2013 - 07:59 AM.

[Tragos]

The problem is not "disabling" 3rd person view. Just implement the ******* 1pv queue and the problem is solved - AFTERWARDS you can "buff" 3rd person view without any problems.




You could even show legs.


Edit: @Charlie Brumfield: Please bother to look one of the many "3pv advantages" posts up, like the pictures I posted myself. Afterwards feel free to redact your previous statement.

Edit 2:

here.

http://mwomercs.com/...21#entry2674821

Edited by Tragos, 21 August 2013 - 08:01 AM.

[Corwin Maxwell]

I posted this gem back on April 18 2013 showing the state of the game. The white knights came to the defense of pgi just like the band played on as the ship sank. Seems i was correct then as i am now, these white knights and pgi devs are in a state of denial.

http://www.youtube.c...d&v=iHsx1cvACkY

Edited by Corwin Maxwell, 21 August 2013 - 08:01 AM.

[Metafox]

Doomstryke, on 21 August 2013 - 07:49 AM, said:

bit sad I haven't seen any alt+F4 jokes based around the fact that PGI picked F4 as a toggle...

It's funny you should mention that. Just last night a pug asked how to toggle 3PV and was met with a shower of alt+F4s. He disconnected shortly afterwards.

As for 3PV itself, I haven't tried sniping or scouting with it yet, but I can definitely see the "appeal" of observing the enemy team without exposing yourself to their fire. This could be remedied by removing the toggle, so perhaps the viewpoint should get locked after the first 30 seconds of gameplay.

[3rdworld]

Edited by 3rdworld, 21 August 2013 - 08:02 AM.

[FlipOver]

Scarcer, on 21 August 2013 - 07:44 AM, said:

It's man-child comments like this that's creating noise for the legitimate issues at stake here.
The crosshair snapping isn't auto-aim, in the cockpit, the raytrace for the crosshair travels directly from the center of the screen, so it's always in the center on any surface directly in front of you.

In third person, the ray-trace is still traveling from the cockpit, but your viewing it from another angle. If there is terrain or a mech in your way, it 'snaps' to that object because it's in your line of sight. Look at the terrain, up down, side to side and you'll see it.

Don't just play a game or two and see the cross-hair move and come complain about auto-aim when you don't understand it...

There have been tests playing with an AC20 eqquiped, distributing head-shots like crazy because "what you say it's not auto-aim" was locking for half a second on the enemies cockpit. All it needs to be done is to fire at the right moment and correctly positioning the mech to ensure a clean line (which isn't hard with increasingly large and great new maps).

Could be coincidence it snaps right on the cockpit, but try looking for the critical points on the enemy and see how it behaves when you use 3PV.

And the amount of headshots increasing since the patch is also a coincidence. Sorry but I do not share your pov and have seen & experienced enough to understand how you can take advantage of 3PV.