536 replies to this topic

[Jun Watarase]

Votanin FleshRender, on 25 April 2014 - 09:51 AM, said:

A new player question about R&R... didn't that lead to problems with players hanging back, not wanting to fight for fear of damage costs?

Or tons and tons of sniper builds? I can't imagine there was much brawling at all.

People quickly realised they had to boat energy weapons as they were the cheapest, and you had a lot of players running and hiding when low on health. Back then there was a significant delay before firing your weapons (some supposed anti-cheat measure lol), so hitting anything at long range was extremely difficult when your weapons had this firing delay. Weapons other than med lasers only became popular after the delay was removed. There was no DHS either so most weapons were far too hot.

[Roland]

Jun Watarase, on 25 April 2014 - 10:27 AM, said:

Ever tried to headshot a AFK mech? You would have noticed that the damage spreads all over the torso or mostly on the CT.

Err.. I can reliably headshot AFK mechs pretty much 100% of the time unless they've disconnected and are de-synched from the server.

If a mech isn't moving, headshotting it is pretty much trivial.

[Joseph Mallan]

Roland, on 25 April 2014 - 10:33 AM, said:

Err.. I can reliably headshot AFK mechs pretty much 100% of the time unless they've disconnected and are de-synched from the server.

If a mech isn't moving, headshotting it is pretty much trivial.

Take the trial Jenner into the play ground and see just how easy it is. One Alpha and 3 Smalls again and POP!

[RAM]

I always thought it was because you constantly disconnected.

Jun Watarase, on 23 April 2014 - 08:42 AM, said:

and i'm not sure if you are allowed to quit a match if it's being ruined by certain types of behaviour.

Yet that is exactly what you do.

Junning: alive and well in table top too!


RAM
ELH

[Triordinant]

Alexandrix, on 23 April 2014 - 02:17 PM, said:

Groups should face groups and solo's should face solo's.plain and simple.
No one should have to join a clan and get on team speak just to have a chance at fair play.

This easily beats any argument to the contrary.

[Fuggles]

how on earth is there a 11 page discussion about the MM when its being changed in 4 days?

im not saying the new launch module will magically fix everything, but seriously, how about we wait until we see how the new MM system turns out?

[Triordinant]

Fuggles, on 25 April 2014 - 11:06 AM, said:

how on earth is there a 11 page discussion about the MM when its being changed in 4 days?

im not saying the new launch module will magically fix everything, but seriously, how about we wait until we see how the new MM system turns out?

It's less about the MM and more about separating veteran premades from PUGs. The April 29 changes might help, but not completely. The only real solution is a premade-free, PUG-only queue and a separate queue for premades and possibly PUGs who might want to join them.

[Joseph Mallan]

Then phase 3 of operation nobody loses will begin!

Phase 3:
Getting rid of Seasoned PUGs cause THEY are ROFLStomping New PUGs!

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 25 April 2014 - 11:16 AM.

[Deathlike]

MischiefSC, on 25 April 2014 - 09:33 AM, said:

New players won't drop with vets after 4/29. The point of matching into tiers is 1000-1500 Elo drops in one pool, 1500 and up in another. Sub-1000 drops in a third. This gives a wide range of potentials for each drop but that 1500 mark is literally the indicator for 'above average'. This will literally mean that people in their cadet matches will never drop with veterans - unless it's really crappy ones.

Without grouping in a range in that 1500+ bucket you also avoid the 'Elo hell' of being just below that huge gap that will split top tier from upper tier players and serving, essentially, as food for top tier players. They'll get mixed in with everyone one who's 1500 or higher.

3/3/3/3 and 1 premade per team is going to largely gut syncdropping, especially if they're filling matches round-robin instead of FCFS (first come first served) which, with 3/3/3/3, would be more logical and result in total matches filled more quickly.

I'm eager to see how it works out.

Unfortunately, what I saw on the test server were 2 premades on each side (not sure of every match I was in, but there were matches that it was blatantly obvious).

If left changed, syncdropping is alive and well.

[Fuggles]

Deathlike, on 25 April 2014 - 11:18 AM, said:

Unfortunately, what I saw on the test server were 2 premades on each side (not sure of every match I was in, but there were matches that it was blatantly obvious).

If left changed, syncdropping is alive and well.

i saw this as well, but honestly its hard to say how that will translate to live considering they were also turning 3/3/3/3 on and off. it could simply have been to get people into games (i know i was waiting 10-15min sometimes)

[MischiefSC]

Fuggles, on 25 April 2014 - 11:59 AM, said:

i saw this as well, but honestly its hard to say how that will translate to live considering they were also turning 3/3/3/3 on and off. it could simply have been to get people into games (i know i was waiting 10-15min sometimes)

I suspect the test server saw at best 10% of the population, thus requiring a lot of wiggling with the mm parameters to fill matches.

Or so I hope. The concept behind it; matching to range and not high/low on Elo with 1000 and 1500 cutoffs and then 3/3/3/3.... that's an excellent and elegant solution to a wide range of game issues. As someone who plays with analytics for a living I have a great deal of respect for that sort of solution. It handles a lot of meta issues, matchmaker issues, new and experienced player issues, I mean as far as solutions go it's got to be on par with best possible bang for the buck in terms of effort/cost/investment in pushing the changes live vs positive over negative customer impact.

All due props on it, I really want to see it work and work well. I haven't been this hopeful for an impending change in MW:O since.... gah, I don't know when.

Fingers crossed.

[Flaming oblivion]

I hope it does work im tired of playing in pre made hours where the only ones having fun are 4-8/24.

[BARBAR0SSA]

PropagandaWar, on 24 April 2014 - 10:53 AM, said:

some of those games have a die once mode too. Sooo move on. Thing is learn the game. I don't cry when I pug, I don't cry when I lose. I just try different strategies. I do get pissed that so many people love to single file and die when they are clearly being focused fired instead of pushing in to nail em back. Hesitance is the Mudderfudder that kills. I had a silly mofo laugh at me yesterday for dying. See thing is we won and turning the morons to focus on me was part of that. and we weren't running meta in our pug.

Seriously
"some of those games have a die once mode too"

They aren't restricted to ONLY that 1 mode. Holy hell man stop being a stubborn kid.

[Odins Fist]

shad0w4life, on 25 April 2014 - 12:50 PM, said:

Seriously
"some of those games have a die once mode too"

They aren't restricted to ONLY that 1 mode. Holy hell man stop being a stubborn kid.

Yeah but all the little kids can't take the heartbreak of being killed once and done, they crave the participation trophies they get from being able to magically respawn and go back to fight.

If those children were made to have 1 life and done, they would all go crying to mommy.
The Server list for those type of First Person Shooters are jammed full of nothing but respawn mode gameplay, the twitch shooting crowd would have a collective stroke if they were made to do anything else.

Try renting a server for a F.P.S, setup a game mode that is hardcore 1 life mode, and watch NOBODY populate your server.
I have been part of renting many servers, and the game modes that get played are the Normal-hardcore with respawn, the 1 life match modes are ghost towns, especially because once EACH side has enough players to start the match, the match starts, and to join you have to wait in a queue until the next match starts, and hope somone leaves.

[Justy Starflare]

ive gotten about 15 people to play this game not counting myself of those that still play im the
only one and what the OP is writing about is exactly why they all quit playing. i play because im
sick of mmorpgs and need an outlet. ive seen the matches where vet players are matched against a bunch of newbs and im on the newbs team its fun getting killed and then viewing them to see how they are doing they cannot shoot dont know how to move or twist and dont know how to lock a target. ive been in matches where one team gets 2-3 d-dc's several missile boats and a couple of scouts with ecm while the other team gets nothing with ecm no missiles or maybe 1 missile boat only to get obliterated by the well equiped team. btw the stick fig cartoon is hillarious.

[Triordinant]

Justy Starflare, on 25 April 2014 - 02:10 PM, said:

btw the stick fig cartoon is hillarious.

The whole point of the cartoon is: just as in the real world, we should be able to decide to NOT play with griefers if we don't want to -while still being able to play our favorite game.

[NeonKnight]

Jun Watarase, on 24 April 2014 - 10:58 AM, said:

I dont see how bragging about your unit's supposed skill is relevant to this thread...

But Kvetching, moaning and blaming others for your inabilities apparently IS relevant to the thread.

[NeonKnight]

Justy Starflare, on 25 April 2014 - 02:10 PM, said:

ive gotten about 15 people to play this game not counting myself of those that still play im the
only one and what the OP is writing about is exactly why they all quit playing. i play because im
sick of mmorpgs and need an outlet. ive seen the matches where vet players are matched against a bunch of newbs and im on the newbs team its fun getting killed and then viewing them to see how they are doing they cannot shoot dont know how to move or twist and dont know how to lock a target. ive been in matches where one team gets 2-3 d-dc's several missile boats and a couple of scouts with ecm while the other team gets nothing with ecm no missiles or maybe 1 missile boat only to get obliterated by the well equiped team. btw the stick fig cartoon is hillarious.

You know, I'm gonna grab this post (out of ALL the others, just cause), and use to emphasize something.

Jun, and all the other crybabies out there state:

• I persuaded X number of my friends to play, but they all complained we got our collective tushies handed to us, so we/they stopped playing.

Now, am I missing something here? But, to me that statement implies they must somehow be *gasp*....wait for it.....Playing as a premade! The same thing they are complaining about!

I don't know about you, but every one of my friends I have persuaded to try the game, tried it while I was online. Most of the conversations went like this:

ME: Hey Bob, you should try MWO, it's lots of fun!
BOB: OK, I'll try it, when do you play?
ME: I play at such-and-such a time, my online name is NeonKnight. Download the game, send me a friend request, and we'll drop together.
BOB: OK

Bob, goes home downloads game, we get on phone/TS/VENT and I walk him through starting up & MECHLAB, we then form a group and drop.

Sure, Bob will likely die, but Bob is mature, (because 99% of my friends are not in Highschool, 99% of my friends have KIDS in Highschool), and so we laugh, we cry, we drop again, and again. We have fun.

I certainly don't say to Bob: "I only solo drop, so learn the game without my help!" Because then Bob would say to me: "Get bent" and certainly not download/play the game.

But apparently people like the quoted person above, and the OP all have 0 friends on their friends list, because to have a friend on their friend's list is to ADMIT they form groups and drop as such, or *shudder* try and SYNC DROP.

So, the point being...every single person here who points to the OP comic, applauds it for thruth it portrays, that they say they've experienced, is thus a hypocrite if they think otherwise.

EVERY

SINGLE
ONE

You can't complain: "my friends and I dropped and got beat, so premades are the death of the game", because obviously Premades are not uber powerful, because your Premade lost, maybe you lost because of a multitude of other factors.

Yes, I play premade
Yes, Sometimes I win
Yes, sometimes they are total massacares.

But wait!

Yes, Sometimes I lose
and Yes, sometimes they are total massacares.

If I want to win every single drop I do, I'll just play training grounds or someother game where I can put on a "God Mode"

[Demuder]

NeonKnight, on 25 April 2014 - 03:47 PM, said:

But Kvetching, moaning and blaming others for your inabilities apparently IS relevant to the thread.

(I am not quoting your next post because frankly, I would be ashamed to repost something like that)

I gather that with the advent of the new MM, you and your mature friends that have kids in high school, will drop with your elite unit in private matches only so that you can hone your elite skills against other mature people with elite skills that have kids in high school, right ?

Or are you gonna drop in pugs as well, from time to time, just to roflstomp some other, immature, anti social guys that don't have kids in high school and just want to have a fair chance at shooting robots among THEMSELVES ? How can those guys protect themselves from you and your friends ?

Because that's what the original post was about.

[Craig Steele]

Triordinant, on 25 April 2014 - 11:11 AM, said:

It's less about the MM and more about separating veteran premades from PUGs. The April 29 changes might help, but not completely. The only real solution is a premade-free, PUG-only queue and a separate queue for premades and possibly PUGs who might want to join them.

It's not the only "real" solution, but it certainly fits the calls of the players that play in larger groups (Guilds etc)