894 replies to this topic

[Black Templar]

Targetloc, on 22 June 2014 - 12:11 PM, said:

We really don't need more ghost heat mechanics. PGI already had to put medium and small lasers into the same ghost heat group. Now people are calling for EPPPCs to ghost heat at 2, and some are even calling for ballistics and PPC's to be linked on ghost heat.

The answer is to remove Heatsinks adding to your heat capacity. Dissipation is its own virtue.

The problem with HS adding to capacity has been evident since they first introduce DHS back in closed beta. Not only are you able to produce builds that can core a mech before reaching heat capacity, but additional heatsinks have disproportionate value because instead of just getting 1 additional shot, you get 2 or more because the heat from the first shot is bled off by the time you reach your third consecutive alpha.

We wouldn't have to keep adding ghost heat to everything if you had to wait to cool off after an alpha strike, and low-heat weapons had their recycle time adjusted to compensate for their higher DPS/heat.

Maybe PGI will pick up this thought and work something out =)

edit: Please take note that I will remove unconstructive posts without further notice...don't make me deploy the anti-hate shields.

Edited by Black Templar, 24 June 2014 - 11:55 AM.

[JohnnyWayne]

Allright everyone, since I had not the time to awnser this morning, I will do so now.

I think you have created a pretty good writeup. But I also think differently in 2 topics:

• The Timberwolf: It is a fast Mech, but has compared to IS mechs "only" the same firepower than IS mechs (even with higher DPS, but way less pinpoint as the cataphract with ACs, Gauss see below). Thats solely based on the huge engine that it has. Compared to Clan mechs, it is fine and I think it is also overall well balanced. The Summoner on the other hand needs a role it fits in.
  
• C-ERPPCs:Even though I like the conecpt of heat penalties, I don't think it is fitting for already hot as **** weapons like the ERPPC. 20 alpha strike on ERPPCs is ok, the 10 followup damage are random and therefore only marginal considerable.

My ideas to balance pinpoint damage of the clans:


Time to Kill is, as you stated, too low. This can be countered by either increased cooldowns for pinpoint weapons or something that takes things more from the root, instead of the symptoms. Something that bothers me a long time: Synergy between ballistic and energy pinpoint weapons (Clans: ERPPC and Gauss).

• First idea: Increase the cooldown on ERPPCs and Gauss by 2 seconds. This decreases the overall DPS and also increases the time 1.4 DHS have to cool down ERPPCs. Less damage longer uptimes in fights would be the result. Still the same pinpoint damage though.
  
• Second idea: Counter synergies between CGauss and CERPPC. If you fire ERPPCs you instantly lose your gauss charge.Might even give the gauss a chance to mailfunction and explode if its fired within 0.5 seconds of a PPC (also applyable for IS). When Gauss is fired before PPCs, the PPCs go in a 2 second cooldown to restore the highpowerstate that is needed for the weapon to function.

PPCs / ballistics combinations on all factions have beeen a huge problem since the implementation of heat penalties. This has to end. Even with the jumpjet nerfs, this kind of battle will be waged further on.Only by giving people the choice between tradeoffs instead an obvious cookiecutter loadout you will achive A) more balanced loadouts and B ) more variety between loadouts.



Edit: because I saw it floating around, ACs and PPCs could also be linked with a new mechanic, like the 0.5 Second thing. Let the electronic charge within air set off the AC projectiles (they are explosive afterall; when fired within 0.5 seconds after a PPC) and give 10% damage of the projectile damage to the component it originated from. Only applies if 2 or more PPCs have been fired.

To heatsystem changes: I agree I always was for a true DHS system, but I also don't want the aim to become more random. Also you have to see, that in TT heat was literally negated by DHS, so you could fire 2 ERPPCs without overheating. Therefore I would set the max heat to... Well 35-40.

Edited by JohnnyWayne, 23 June 2014 - 03:35 AM.

[AussieGiant]

"Only by giving people the choice between tradeoffs instead an obvious cookiecutter loadout you will achive A) more balanced loadouts and B ) more variety between loadouts."

That's a piece of gold right there!!

That's a principle which will make the whole thing go well. Small trick...how to make it work in practice?! This is becoming an hellishly complicated game.

The genius will come from converting brilliant theory into workable and practical implementation.

I'd love to have Einstein on this game for just a week ;-)

Edited by AussieGiant, 23 June 2014 - 04:45 AM.

[K1ttykat]

Oooh man some of the posts in this thread are really funny. People are all "noooo el presidente" and leaping up in defense of the timberwolf.

Immediately the clan gauss felt out of place. You have all these dot weapons that one could argue are balanced, and then a 12t gauss rifle surrounded by free CASE. Just not 100% sure about that. When you take a better weapon and put it in a mech with better internals, better heatsinks, better engine, you get a mech that's just better.

Clans have felt pretty balanced down in the scrub league where there are lots of different weapons going on. The damage-duration tradeoff feels reasonable even with some of the direwolfs that have been floating around.

Something I thought they could do: hardwire 2JJ in each S torso AND give the S torsos a set bonus that is required for the JJ to work/work at full capacity. They already have the set bonus system in the game, why not use its power for good. Of course then you still have these same builds walking around without JJ

Edited by K1ttykat, 23 June 2014 - 04:50 AM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

I still love that the only recommended nerfs from the "Elite" folks, involve direct nerfs to a chassis or things that really won't keep them from poptarting.

[KGB GRU]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 23 June 2014 - 05:24 AM, said:

I still love that the only recommended nerfs from the "Elite" folks, involve direct nerfs to a chassis or things that really won't keep them from poptarting.

God I hate poptarting. Anyway Im not sure what all the fuss is about. In watching the scoreboards matches typically flow and work like they did previously. Its common to see 600-800 dmg games from good players but I still havent seen any crazy consistant dmg games with certain builds. Even the common Double Gauss/PPC build ive seen 1100 in one match which you can do just the same in IS mechs( Im looking at you Muromets) but falls to most games 600ish. Given all the crap you have to deal with, speed, crap turn and a poor CT hitbox its fine.

On the subject of the Madcat well the tallest tree gets the most wind. Yeah theres a bunch of them, an influx of nimble heavy mechs running around. No doubt theyre good mechss however they carry average weapons for their weight, so whats the big deal? Big picture here people will play other mechs and over time it will smooth out. If you want to complain then lets discuss their JJs. Yeah they shouldnt have gotten a varient with them as it invalidates the Summoner and adds another mech to add to the poptart madness.

Clans have been out for a week, hardly enough time to judge these things past the obvious. Again I dont see any game breaking outcomes due to clan tech. Matches still flow the same as they did previously. Flame on!

Edited by KGB GRU, 23 June 2014 - 06:00 AM.

[Vassago Rain]

K1ttykat, on 23 June 2014 - 04:49 AM, said:

Oooh man some of the posts in this thread are really funny. People are all "noooo el presidente" and leaping up in defense of the timberwolf.

Immediately the clan gauss felt out of place. You have all these dot weapons that one could argue are balanced, and then a 12t gauss rifle surrounded by free CASE. Just not 100% sure about that. When you take a better weapon and put it in a mech with better internals, better heatsinks, better engine, you get a mech that's just better.

Clans have felt pretty balanced down in the scrub league where there are lots of different weapons going on. The damage-duration tradeoff feels reasonable even with some of the direwolfs that have been floating around.

Something I thought they could do: hardwire 2JJ in each S torso AND give the S torsos a set bonus that is required for the JJ to work/work at full capacity. They already have the set bonus system in the game, why not use its power for good. Of course then you still have these same builds walking around without JJ

It was an expected reaction when the most common purchase is the 210 dollar madcat package.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Vassago Rain, on 23 June 2014 - 05:31 AM, said:

It was an expected reaction when the most common purchase is the 210 dollar madcat package.

That, and direct chassis nerfs really haven't accomplished anything in this game. All a direct chassis nerf does is move it from one chassis to another.

The underlying mechanics are the problem more than anything else.

The best example is the Highlander nerfs...instead of fixing anything, we ended up with a huge shift over to the Victor.

If PGI took a huge nerf bat to the Victor...then they join the 3D group.

Nerf the Timberwolf? They'll shift to the Summoner, or completely away from Clan mechs, since the Timberwolf is the only mech that really fits into the games stupid Meta.

[B0oN]

I´m still in favor of disbanding the current Meta by making IS AC´s burst fire as well as the Clan ones, then re-implement the glorious JJ-shake in an even heavier version to diminish the overabundance of JJ´s on the field.

Poptarting + Ac´ing gets harder while the benefits of IS/Clans still stay largely as it is (Clans=DOT/DPS, IS=PP FLD/Speed).

2€cents ...

[Gyrok]

GreyGriffin, on 22 June 2014 - 10:27 PM, said:

How is RNG inherently bad for an FPS title? Most FPS titles only have a bare handful of weapons with pixel perfect accuracy. Reducing the impact of marksmanship increases the impact of strategic skills like heat management, throttle management, and team maneuvering, since you can't just count on blowing out an entire torso in one massive alpha strike shot. Killing an enemy 'mech would require a commitment to engage and a calculated risk. Light 'mechs (which are sufferers according to the OP) would get an enormous buff to their durability through damage spread. Ridiculous mechanics like ghost heat and gauss charge could be ramped down or even eliminated, and a whole new axis of balance would be created through accuracy from both chassis, movement type and speed, and weapon type.

The downside? Sometimes you hit CT on the Atlas at 200m instead of right torso. Should have throttled down if you really needed to make that shot.

No, RNG is inherently bad, there are other ways to balance this game...like making PP FLD weapons DoT. About the only thing you could not/should not have as DoT would be SRMs. Notice with ripple fire CLRMs, even that itself is DoT...?

RNG can be poorly executed, and you can end up with "random" results across a group, but one person can have LONG streaks of bad RNG, then you have to introduce things like streak breakers and other complex mechanics to override those supposedly random RNGs to ensure fairness across all players. The check systems put in place for that get complex....

Just NO! You guys think it is a really simple thing to implement, and it is not at all that simple...plus poorly done it would drive people away. Well done it would anger a lot of people who have twitch skill.

I want to see the meta change as much or more than any of you guys, I like to brawl, but that is absolutely NOT the way to go about it.

[Reno Blade]

Game balance needs to consider all faces of the game.
Be it high accuracy competitive game, or spread fire by the average player (or lower PUGs).
The high PP FLD are most deadly in the hands of competitive players, because their accuracy will lead to very fast results.
One side will oneshot the other = one side unhappy.

Reducing the potency of "skill shots" with FLD doesn't make skill useless, but instead increase the skill needed to core someone out even with spread damage.
At the same time, it gives the target player enough time to react and play the game instead of getting instant-killed.

Adding a reticule bloom would reduce the effect of your accuracy skill.
Changing FLD weapons to spread the damage like CERPPC and CUACs on the other hand lets you keep the gain by your skills, but will give your target the ability to USE his/her skills to twist and mitigate damage.
Two parties can use their skill = both happy.

Now the Clantech was partly balanced by using these mechanics. What would happen to IS tech?
Would it all be useless, would everyone want clanmechs, or only pilot LRM mechs?
IS mechs can be customized and with the reduction of FLD in the WHOLE game, the IS XL engines are not as deadly as they are now.

So what could we change?
I will just give some values where I think it would balance out better than now.
First, PPCs:
CERPPC 7 + 4 +4 dmg /15 heat
ISERPPC 7 +1.5 +1.5 dmg / 14 heat
ISPPC 6 +2 +2 dmg / 10 heat

Compared to ERLL with 8.5heat and 9 damage for 1 full second burn time (no FLD, 1 sec out of cover and 1 full second of perfect aiming required) the PPCs would all still do slightly better than the Laser.
Why I think so?
Because 0 beam time and getting back to cover, or twisting away from incomming damage is more important than raw damage.
PLUS you would still do your 10 damage (15 for Clans)

If you want to use your accuracy skills, you COULD get better damage for heat out of a Laser or Pulse Laser IF you were good enough !

Second, ACs:
Simply use the same mechanics for the IS.
Similar to Lasers and Gauss, the burst changed the way the ACs handle for the Clans.
A fast target or someone who can twist, is harder to hit and you need all your skill to land the full bust and then your target needs to make a mistake (not twisting) to land all these shots on the same spot.

Now, obviously the Clan Pulse laser duration and its range need some reduction.

As an endresult we have:
Gauss as the long range FLD slug weapon
PPC as the med-long range FLD splash weapon (Energy)
LRMs as the guided long range splash weapon (Missile)
LBX as the short-med range FLD splash weapon (Balistic)
UACs/ACs as the short-long range short-burst weapon (Balistic)
Lasers as the short-long range long-burst weapon (Energy)
Pulse Lasers as the short-med range short-burst weapon (Energy)
SSRMs as the guided short-med range splash weapons (Missile)
SRMs as the short range FLD splash weapons (Missile)

High skilled aiming would use Laser/ACs and Gauss for best damage to one spot.
Everyone would be equally usefull taking any of the weapons if their aiming is not constantly hitting one spot (>80% of the time).
There would be no "obvious meta" anymore and even Jumpsniping would be a lot less potent.

Edited by Reno Blade, 23 June 2014 - 06:22 AM.

[TexAce]

How about a cone of fire that gets bigger the more (non-laser-)weapons you fire at the same time.
1 weapon fired = pinpoint,
2 weapons = no piinpoint but still so close together you can pinpoint it up to 500m
3 weapons = no pinpoint but enough to place all shots somewhere on a mech at 500m
4 weapons = relatively big cone of fire like in a FPS shooter

??
could be something useful as long as PGI gets someone who can actually code stuff like convergence effects

Edited by TexAss, 23 June 2014 - 06:30 AM.

[Galenit]

Adiuvo, on 22 June 2014 - 03:37 PM, said:

Regarding HoL specifically, our actual comp team isn't like that. We don't ggclose unless there are people on the enemy team that we know and are messing around with, or (at least for me) when people complain about someone saying gg. Personally I try being pretty open and friendly to any questions people have. However, I won't be nice when people are {Richard Cameron} to me or my friends, insult what I do, call me names, and other general unpleasantness.

Some individuals can easy give a group a bad reputation.
Seems that not all HoLs are like most ones i have seen until now.


About communication: Its on the transmitter that the recipient understands the message.

In simple words, think you down and allways remember that most people out there have a very short attention span.

The o.p. is to much a "wall of text" for a lot of people that are proud that they never had read a book.
If they read that much text, they will only remember some words that work like buzzwords for them, but dont get what you want to tell them.

In germany we say, read the "Bild" for a week and maybe you can talk with them ...

Edited by Galenit, 23 June 2014 - 06:35 AM.

[Cpt Zaepp]

+1 to the OP

I agree to most of his points. The Timberwolf is just ludicrous right now. It outmaneuvers every other heavy/assault and even some mediums, provides a hell of a punch and has JJs. You just can't have it all. Since the stat-wipe I played IS mediums (Wolverines, Shadowhawks, Griffins) exclusively and that Timberwolf feels almost like a best-of-all-mixture of these three combined with the armor of a Phract and the firepower of a Victor plus more survivability thanks to clan-XL.

It's like a wet, dirty dream.

But I have to say that overall clan-balancing is pretty good. At least the Summoner, Nova and Kit-Fox are. But I can only speak from a perspective as a solo-pug player from steering wheel underhive (or slightly above).

I think MW:O is incredible difficult to balance. If you nerf a weapon in order to nerf a specific, totally broken load-out on one chassis, you could severely hurt another, pretty balanced load-out on another chassis. Therefore I think putting 2x ERPPC on ghost-heat is not a good idea. Unless someone thinks a 2x ERPPC Summoner/Nova/Adder/Kit Fox is broken? Powerful in the right hands, yes, broken, IMO not.

I also totally do NOT agree to any of these fancy ideas to decouple Gauss and ERPPC some people suggested here. I think ONE Gauss and ONE ERPPC is a legit combination and it takes a decent amount of skill to perform appropriate.

But maybe it takes more skill to face-plant-*****-slap somebody with a crap-load of SRM6+A? TBH, I don't know.


Suggestions to nerf the Timberwolf

1. Agility

- Slightly nerf its agility, but not too much because we don't want to upset our brawling friends out there. I think torso/mech-turn-rate and acceleration/deceleration are good points to start with.

2. Jump-Jets

- Just nerf the JJs hard. A pilot should have to equip at least 3 JJs in order to achieve the same performance as one JJ provides right now. If you have to equip 3 JJs to get a decent performance for poptarting, a load-out like 1x Gauss + 2x ERPPC is out of the picture unless somebody wants severely spare on ammo and armor. Since both TBW-S side-torsos have to be installed to fit 3 JJs in, the negative quirks of both side torsos would be applied as well. Also the performance of JJs should increase rather exponentially with the number of JJs equipped, hence fully committing to JJs would be more rewarding.

- Another approach would be simply hard-wiring the JJs (4-5 of them) to the TBW-S exclusively, similar to the Summoner/Nova (IMO, the Summoner is, load-out-wise, heavily restricted because of its hard-wired JJs)

Furthermore, I think the Quirk-system that has been attached to the Omni-pods would be also a good point to start balancing out clans. Sadly, I'm just not smart enough to come up with something usable.


Best regards,

zaepp

Edited by zaepp, 23 June 2014 - 09:14 AM.

[maniacos]

I like to complain but here I must say... my Lights are still doing quite well. The other day my 5D 1erl 2medl was last mech alife at our base and killed an almost healthy (just some armor orange) TW, a crippled Treb and just got stopped by a Jaeger (not the AC20 version of course) eventually when I made the mistake to stop running a circle around the JM. OK, the mechs arrived one after another but I think that's still pretty OK for a Spider. Also the JR7-D with SRM does a good job, over all I am not dieing much more than before CI.
I actually thought, when Clans get released, I will only eat dust on the battlefield with my lights, and yes maybe some balance has to be done (4 Gauss on DW, seriously?), however it is not as bad as said ("lights are meaningless").
The greater problem remains the Matchmaker and it's funny interpretation of one's ELO when you get streaks of tard teams after being droped into a few ubergood teams...
I can imagine though, that slow mediums suffer much more from clanners than the 4 stronger (SDR, RVN, JR7, FS) lights do. An Ember or a Jenner can still pretty well mess with a KitWolf or a Puma. We will see however what happens, when the first elite Clans appear. This could change the cards a bit.

Edited by Jherek C, 23 June 2014 - 06:58 AM.

[Kh0rn]

Serpieri, on 22 June 2014 - 12:11 PM, said:

Now that would of been a tournament - I would have watched.

The Balance problem is all too do with the great feature of this game. The mechlab. Remove it. Role warfare returns as shown in the stock mech matches. But we remove that and we will have a almighty **** storm. It would not affect me since I love stock, it goes with the lore, but yes If the comp's were decided by Stock battles that would be the test of skill and something I would watch and possibly enter. I myself am Anti Meta and still stuck with IS tech but it does not phase me. So far the clans seem alright just some really crazy builds coming into play. I.E. 4 Gauss DW , 4 ER PPC 2 Gauss DW. 6UAC5 DW and ofc it was bound too happen the 2 ERPPC 1 Gauss Timbertarts.

"Atlas! The sugar sweet piss of heavy ordinance"

[VIPER2207]

What i ask myself: Did anyone of the so-called "competitive players" who are now pressing the "please nerf" button, ever try to run a balanced loadout, just to have some fun playing the game?
While i totaly understand the view of a competitive player "it's not about fun, it's about winning and being the number one", you guys should maybe think of the other part of the community who just wants to have fun playing the game. I for myself run pretty balanced loadouts on all of my timberwolfs, it's fun and it doesn't feel OP.... until i drop with some certain guys from my unit and end up in some kind of all-star-game deep down in elo hell, with nothing but players from HOL, Blackspikes, SJR and so on... then the fun ends, and the game becomes a pain within seconds, while i read through the team's players. Dropping against 12 timbertarts/dragon slayers/3Ds? Yeah, you are right, that's not fun, and pinpoint-damage is not fun. You are tired of this? Well, do something else maybe?
The hardpoints and/or mechs are not the biggest problem in this game, it's the players who are dropping in min-max-builds all the time. The guys who fitted all their three timberwolfs with jumpjets, 2 ERPPCs and a gauss? Yeah great, you won... have fun grinding these things with as less diversity as possible.
And guess what? Even if PGI nerfs the clans to oblivion now, and point the nerfbat to the dragon slayer and 3D afterwards, the next "meta" will rise, which will be nerfed again. Almost a year ago, i did some kind of sarcastic post about this vicious circle that i call "the game of nerves". I said "now we nerf this, and then we nerf that, and at some point in the future, machineguns will be called OP and they will be nerfed". Half a year later, machineguns got nerfed. Funny story, isn't it? I'm still waiting for the flamer-nerf though...

I'm totaly aware that i'm not making myself any friends with this statement, neither with anyone in the comp. area nor within my unit, but i will take that.

[Damocles69]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 23 June 2014 - 05:24 AM, said:

I still love that the only recommended nerfs from the "Elite" folks, involve direct nerfs to a chassis or things that really won't keep them from poptarting.

Look I get it. The big bad pop tarts touched in naughty places. Us comp people dont like it either. I would gladly trade my pop tarts for game balance and I have stated so on these forums time after time.

This is not a reason to leave mechs with extream advantages broken. Take pop tarts away ( and they should) and the timber wolf rains unchallenged as the best mech in the game by light years.

All mech chassis need some form of balance. This goes for the extinct IS mechs as well

[Damocles69]

Kh0rn, on 23 June 2014 - 07:05 AM, said:

The Balance problem is all too do with the great feature of this game. The mechlab. Remove it. Role warfare returns as shown in the stock mech matches. But we remove that and we will have a almighty **** storm. It would not affect me since I love stock, it goes with the lore, but yes If the comp's were decided by Stock battles that would be the test of skill and something I would watch and possibly enter. I myself am Anti Meta and still stuck with IS tech but it does not phase me. So far the clans seem alright just some really crazy builds coming into play. I.E. 4 Gauss DW , 4 ER PPC 2 Gauss DW. 6UAC5 DW and ofc it was bound too happen the 2 ERPPC 1 Gauss Timbertarts.

"Atlas! The sugar sweet piss of heavy ordinance"

The mechlab has always simultainiouly the best and worst thing about MW games

Edited by Damocles69, 23 June 2014 - 07:59 AM.

[Ultimax]

heimdelight, on 22 June 2014 - 11:30 AM, said:

For example, we have learned, that in an FPS game, pinpoint weapons are inherently overpowering. The Gauss, AC5s, and PPCs are the best weapons in the game due to that.

The existence of Inner Sphere AutoCannons as it stands, being pinpoint, are inherently better than the Clan AutoCannons. Gauss, both as an IS and Clan weapon, performs better than other Clan ballistics and equal to Inner Sphere ballistics.


the solution is rather to nerf the current pinpoint weapons to decrease DPS, increase TTK, and make 'Mechs with less armor more viable.

Summary of your primary points:

FLD Pinpoint is overpowered.

PPCs/Gauss/AC 5s are the best weapons.

IS ACs are superior.

heimdelight, on 22 June 2014 - 11:30 AM, said:

2xClan ERPPCs is ridiculously overpowered. Following the current implemented Ghost Heat rule, firing two should cause Ghost Heat. This will require two separate shots, and if you want pinpoint, it's at the penalty of quite a bit of heat.

With the introduction of longer range engagements, Clan laser duration needs to be increased. Clan pulse laser duration needs to be decreased.

This may be the one change that is opposite to my philosophy, but I feel the current IS AC5s are in a good place.

Your Conclusions:

Nerf 1 of only 2 Clan FLD Pinpoint options, leave all IS pinpoint options in-tact.

Nerf clan Lasers.

Overpowered & superior to Clan Mech (your words) IS AC5s are in a good place.


Most of your conclusions are at odds with your main points.

You say FLD Pinpoint is OP, but then go on to only suggest a nerf to cER PPCs which is not coincidentally 1 of only 2 options even available to clan mechs.

FLD Pinpoint is OP, but because TTK is lower your suggestion is to nerf Clan lasers while IS AC/PPC/Gauss combos remain untouched?

That doesn't make sense, and leaves out a major issue that was here before the Clans arrived.

heimdelight, on 22 June 2014 - 11:30 AM, said:

Also, since I believe this 'Mech deserves it's own section, the Timberwolf is an atrocity on balance in this game and needs to be nerfed. It is 75tons, goes 89kph, and is better than all of Clan Assaults, Heavys, Mediums, and Lights at literally everything. It can loadout nearly anything, and can out maneuver anything. This is a massive issue.

It has 28 to 30 tons of available tonnage for weapons.

It can't actually load 2x PPCs + 2x AC 5s in a practical way.

That is to say it can load them, but you'd only have 3 tons of ammo and one jump jet at 364 total armor.

If you want 5 tons of ammo you need to shave down to 288 armor, which is extremely low for a 75 ton mech.

heimdelight, on 22 June 2014 - 11:30 AM, said:

For the Timberwolf: The acceleration, twist rate, jumpjet speed, the whole nine yards needs to hit it. It has above average hitboxes which make it difficult to hit when moving quickly or torso twisting fast.

This sounds like a request to nerf all of the things that make it a good brawler, and help it close the gap vs. long range units.

Extreme mobility is kind of the point of an extreme Engine. So you want to nerf that, so it has a giant engine without the benefits?

Those aspects are also useful for poptarts, but they are more important to brawlers and skirmish builds.

Basically it sounds like a request to nerf the TW the same way the VTR was nerfed, which again hurt VTR brawlers in a game that does not favor brawling - not coincidentally the VTR is still the #1 IS chassis for poptarting.