724 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

Assiah, on 27 October 2014 - 09:36 AM, said:

Did I claim it wasn't a valid tactic? No I claimed that it was not the only valid tactic. But as usual you put up a straw man to knock down rather than refute my actual claim. Imagine that.

I put my Infantry training to the argument. It is a combat game, so I use some of the combat training I have. I make less money fighting apart form the whole, and trying to go it alone. and I get paid appropriately. Some tactics make better money than others cause they work better. Imagine that! Better success earns better money.

[Alexander MacTaggart]

KraftySOT, on 27 October 2014 - 09:36 AM, said:

Man if you cant do that for those people, all the new players in the world dont amount to a hill of beans.

Except you just said that PGI doesn't care about you, PGI only cares that you're playing the game and spending money. We already know the population is low, so their potential pool of money-spenders is capped. Their next move is to concentrate on getting new people into the game and spending money on it. Because that's what PGI is here for.

[KraftySOT]

People listen to Vassago, Bishop, Left, Koni...they do streams, memes, artwork, write enjoyable stories, have personality, add to the community, add to the games draw, they help immeasurably in growing the community, and thats why many were invited back.

Thats who PGI is focused on.


And this STILL has nothing to do, other than in a general sense, with CBill payouts of the grind.

Other than that people who are experienced, arent having a problem with the grind. Its newer players and thats your whole slant. Is that newer players avoid this place because of the grind.

Even if that were true...GOOD. The last thing we need right now, is a **** ton of players clogging up the forums, servers, and leading games to more one sided stomps because they have no idea what theyre doing, shortening the grnd for htem so the hardcore crowd no longer has to pay money, then the game dies screaming.

No, you have to please these hardcore fans, these loyal fans, and get them out there pulling in new people. But first, you really need CW.

Thats our white whale...our white elephant...all rolled into one. Cbill payouts are secondary, new player experience is secondary.

And the fact remains, that RIGHT NOW, you CAN get, more cbills than ever before. You knuckleheads are just refusing to do it. Because.

Reasons.

[Joseph Mallan]

Vassago Rain, on 27 October 2014 - 09:37 AM, said:

Just imagine. You go up against me and the rest of Kong in community warfare, with your account that was made in march this year. I personally have masteries on every IS mech released, excluding vindicators, jenners, and dragons, practically limitless c-bills, every module ever released unlocked, 39 mechbays, and it's largely the same for the rest of my guys.

Right now I only need 4 Mechs like that Vass and I'll drop against Kong anytime. And you know that the guys from Murphys can drop against you cause may of them have equal Elos.

[KraftySOT]

Vassago Rain, on 27 October 2014 - 09:37 AM, said:

Everything's overcosted in the game, anyway, and they need to overhaul the whole system for CW to work.

Or we're gonna have the lovely scenario where you farm freeplayer scum all day, because they don't have full masteries on everything, a bucket of modules, mechbays to house 30 mechs, or 2 years to farm GXP.

Just imagine. You go up against me and the rest of Kong in community warfare, with your account that was made in march this year. I personally have masteries on every IS mech released, excluding vindicators, jenners, and dragons, practically limitless c-bills, every module ever released unlocked, 39 mechbays, and it's largely the same for the rest of my guys.

How many c-bills total can you cram into your dropships? It's just unsustainable, and you can't even hope to stand against people possessing star league caches of equipment. It's like, PGI's expecting freeplayers to bring trialmechs in their dropships. How mad are you gonna be when freeplayers like that cost you planets, because they're too undergeared to fight properly?

As for casual freeplayers, without them, whales have no one to shoot. They're just as important as the whales. If you only have whales, you're no longer making a game, but a toy for a handful of rich, old men, who want to pretend they're mechwarriors from their childhood favorite IP.

Its going to be hilarious though when Kong wins every match on a planet, and still loses the planet because everyone else failed miserably to defend it. But thats another thread...

Also, do you WANT people who just started playing n March in CW?

And hey for what its worth, ive been here barely over a year, and have made 310 million cbills over 1700 matches. They should not suck?

Its not that I totally disagree with you, its just not as doom and gloom as you think it is. There will always be people for whales to shoot at. We certainly arent going to shrink again in this community, unless theres some massive magic jesus box/3PV type fiasco again, and PGI knows that.

Edited by KraftySOT, 27 October 2014 - 09:44 AM.

[Alexander MacTaggart]

KraftySOT, on 27 October 2014 - 09:40 AM, said:

Other than that people who are experienced, arent having a problem with the grind. Its newer players and thats your whole slant. Is that newer players avoid this place because of the grind.

Even if that were true...GOOD. The last thing we need right now, is a **** ton of players clogging up the forums, servers, and leading games to more one sided stomps because they have no idea what theyre doing, shortening the grnd for htem so the hardcore crowd no longer has to pay money, then the game dies screaming.

You are so wrong it's mind-boggling. But I guess my posts don't matter because I'm not posting from my beta account. I am one of those filthy newbies after all.

[Assiah]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 October 2014 - 09:39 AM, said:

I put my Infantry training to the argument. It is a combat game, so I use some of the combat training I have. I make less money fighting apart form the whole, and trying to go it alone. and I get paid appropriately. Some tactics make better money than others cause they work better. Imagine that! Better success earns better money.

Watch out everyone, we have a tactical genius here who thinks his infantry training makes him a good business man.

But sarcasm aside, Mallan you have shockingly low standards for what is acceptable in this game, and you practice doublethink when confronted with this. So lets get back on target, the issue is not about tactics used in game, its about is the rate of progression so slow that it is driving players away.

[KraftySOT]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 October 2014 - 09:42 AM, said:

Right now I only need 4 Mechs like that Vass and I'll drop against Kong anytime. And you know that the guys from Murphys can drop against you cause may of them have equal Elos.

Yeah I mean I have 6 mechbays.

5 of them are Metamechs.

Ill tag along with Joe, Johnny, or Bishop, and eat you guys for lunch, not having ever spent a dime.

I just wont look all swaggy in my bland Blue and Red paint job while doing it.

[Mr Beefy]

KraftySOT, on 27 October 2014 - 09:01 AM, said:

Yeah, he makes statement about WoT, then goes on to say he never actually played WoT.

Troooooooll




Nope. Go to a con and ask them. Its resoundingly apparent what drives them away.

Time to kill.

Board game players are not into action games. Period.


By the way I was JUST at Dragon*Con two months ago talking about this with a room full of battletech players.

Its time to kill. They can speak for themselves on the issue. Go to the next big Con and ask them yourself.

I have spent my life from age 5 up going to big gaming conventions.... I have seen and played and supported a very wide range from historical gaming... to sci-fi, fantasy. The money I have blown in my life time, games I have supported even when not liking the very high cost to do so is a very large amount. Between my Father who is the one that got me into gaming, all of his friends that have blown god only knows how much on war gaming, it would be a very large sum. With me always being a very big Games workshop fan, love 40K, love DOW, I think one can safely assume while I might not be alright with extreme prices for toys....I will open my wallet and continue to support even a over priced game if certain enjoyment levels are given by the company. I think this Logic would stand for many that are into gaming.

I find it hard to believe what you are claiming, that the KILL TIME in this game is the main reason this magical 10000 man strong group has gone away from this game. In fact, as one has spent a majority of my younger years and years in general I would say you are pulling that out of your..... fill in the rest.

At Historicon, back in 97 i believe, I spent the whole weekend painting a Blood angel army, 5000 points trying to finish it up so I could sell it. I entered into only one game, Duke Seigfreds. My Dad ran his Arrowdrome game he designed, and I entered into a painting contest. After taking first place in the painting contest I was offered at the age of 15 to go to New York and join a painters guild with Ralpartha.....

ha ha... KILL time is what is keeping this player base so small....right.

[SpeedingBus]

KraftySOT, on 27 October 2014 - 09:36 AM, said:

Yeah feel free to worry about new players next year after CW.

You have guys who have been here for THREE YEARS with CW "released in a few months"

Man if you cant do that for those people, all the new players in the world dont amount to a hill of beans.



Are you hosting leagues? Fan websites? Do you have a unit? Do you guys have unit nights? Make artwork? How are you supporting the community.

Thats my point. It doesnt matter if youre a founder, you can still be a casual player.

Pleasing the "core" is what grows the game. Not pleasing casual fans. They arent the ones out there writing reviews, working for websites, gaming mags, at cons, etc.

Thats a fact of life.

How is giving your money to company for game you never played before just on your love of mechwarrior franchise consider to be a causal player? While I may not be hosting tournaments or make artwork those things would mean nothing if they didn't have people like to me participate in tournaments and appreciate the art ect.

Also every heard of dodgeball in MW4? I have but wait I shouldn't know about dodge ball because I am just a casual player who plays MWO only a few hours a week and never played any of the old ones.

[Vassago Rain]

KraftySOT, on 27 October 2014 - 09:43 AM, said:

Its going to be hilarious though when Kong wins every match on a planet, and still loses the planet because everyone else failed miserably to defend it. But thats another thread...

Also, do you WANT people who just started playing n March in CW?

And hey for what its worth, ive been here barely over a year, and have made 310 million cbills over 1700 matches. They should not suck?

Its not that I totally disagree with you, its just not as doom and gloom as you think it is. There will always be people for whales to shoot at. We certainly arent going to shrink again in this community, unless theres some massive magic jesus box/3PV type fiasco again, and PGI knows that.

The entire reason the game was made, and the pitch, was mega battles across a galaxy map. Yes, new players should be in it.

No, under PGI's current system, they can't realistically participate, and even if they do, they're just gonna be fodder and liabilities.

[Joseph Mallan]

KraftySOT, on 27 October 2014 - 09:45 AM, said:

Yeah I mean I have 6 mechbays.

5 of them are Metamechs.

Ill tag along with Joe, Johnny, or Bishop, and eat you guys for lunch, not having ever spent a dime.

I just wont look all swaggy in my bland Blue and Red paint job while doing it.

I actually have 13 bays but only 7 Mechs.

[KraftySOT]

Mr Beefy, on 27 October 2014 - 09:45 AM, said:

I have spent my life from age 5 up going to big gaming conventions.... I have seen and played and supported a very wide range from historical gaming... to sci-fi, fantasy. The money I have blown in my life time, games I have supported even when not liking the very high cost to do so is a very large amount. Between my Father who is the one that got me into gaming, all of his friends that have blown god only knows how much on war gaming, it would be a very large sum. With me always being a very big Games workshop fan, love 40K, love DOW, I think one can safely assume while I might not be alright with extreme prices for toys....I will open my wallet and continue to support even a over priced game if certain enjoyment levels are given by the company. I think this Logic would stand for many that are into gaming.

I find it hard to believe what you are claiming, that the KILL TIME in this game is the main reason this magical 10000 man strong group has gone away from this game. In fact, as one has spent a majority of my younger years and years in general I would say you are pulling that out of your..... fill in the rest.

At Historicon, back in 97 i believe, I spent the whole weekend painting a Blood angel army, 5000 points trying to finish it up so I could sell it. I entered into only one game, Duke Seigfreds. My Dad ran his Arrowdrome game he designed, and I entered into a painting contest. After taking first place in the painting contest I was offered at the age of 15 to go to New York and join a painters guild with Ralpartha.....

ha ha... KILL time is what is keeping this player base so small....right.

Yeah its time to kill/pin point convergence/ppfld whatever you want to call it.

Everyone of the Neckbeards I asked about why they dont play MWO, said its because they die instantly. It doesnt meet their expectations of what a game about Battletech should be like.

They never even experience the grind to have an opinion on it. They play that first game, and thats it. They get blowed up instantly, they dont come back.

Would they eventually be upset about the grind? I doubt it...ive known Grognards all my life, and I know better. Just like I know youre not a grognard despite your application.

[Ryllynyth]

Alexander MacTaggart, on 27 October 2014 - 09:43 AM, said:

You are so wrong it's mind-boggling. But I guess my posts don't matter because I'm not posting from my beta account. I am one of those filthy newbies after all.

Oh hey May 2012, I forgot this account was that old. Don't mind me, just a dumb newbie...

[KraftySOT]

Vassago Rain, on 27 October 2014 - 09:47 AM, said:

The entire reason the game was made, and the pitch, was mega battles across a galaxy map. Yes, new players should be in it.

No, under PGI's current system, they can't realistically participate, and even if they do, they're just gonna be fodder and liabilities.

Well theres where we disagree. I agree theres a barrier of entry to CW, and thats good. I dont want new players clogging it up and being the reason planets change hands. Which is what will happen. Kongs going to lose its **** when you win every match, but keep losing planets because youre in a popular faction.

Why else be Laio? Its not attractive to noobs or recent afficianados of the lore. So its left with whales and comps. Were going to stomp face because we arent laden with noobs.

The barrier to entry there is good. No they dont belong in CW other than fillers who dont matter.

Thats clearly how PGI feels, and I think thats the right course of action. Please the founders. Please the people who been asking for CW for THREE YEARS.

New players who havent experienced this fiasco for the bredth of its existence, arent really a concern nor should they be. They need to buy some damned mechbays with cash, and participate.

OR

They need to do what *I* did, and earn it all the Freeloader way.

And I earned it while Cbill payouts were at their worst. I started in the middle of the depression. Im space rich. More so under the new rewards because I farm them.

If you dont, thats your problem.

[Joseph Mallan]

Assiah, on 27 October 2014 - 09:44 AM, said:

Watch out everyone, we have a tactical genius here who thinks his infantry training makes him a good business man.

But sarcasm aside, Mallan you have shockingly low standards for what is acceptable in this game, and you practice doublethink when confronted with this. So lets get back on target, the issue is not about tactics used in game, its about is the rate of progression so slow that it is driving players away.

Tactical genius? no. solid knowledge of combat tactics in and out of gaming from 35 years of gaming and a few years in Service... yes.

The rate of progression in what game prey-tell? Have you captured a Planet I don't know about? Did you defend Yori Mechworks from a Murphy's Law Raid? No? The you haven't made a speck of progress have you?

[KraftySOT]

Its going to be super important that Kong can say "were the ones who took this planet" in CW.

Noobs clogging that up, not aligned to units, with no concern for hte faction, are going to ruin it if you let them in, en masse.

The whole reason CW will work, is because units can banter with each other and build up a history of fighting each other. They can trash talk and create more "meta" which directly leads to more websites, units, and participation.

Its better if you find a good noob, take him under your wing, convince him to spend $$$ and then bring him into CW, than to just open the flood gates.

[Alexander MacTaggart]

KraftySOT, on 27 October 2014 - 09:52 AM, said:

Why else be Laio? Its not attractive to noobs or recent afficianados of the lore. So its left with whales and comps. Were going to stomp face because we arent laden with noobs.

To be fair, you are also going to have to put up with the Word of Lowtax.

And trust me, if PGI actually gets CW off the ground, you are going to see Anders and Chronojam and all the real tryhard WoL crew come back. It's not like the rest of us that just get drunk and shoot robits.

e: I just wish G1mmel hadn't made that drunk joke threat and gotten banned, that dude was fun as hell to drop with.

Edited by Alexander MacTaggart, 27 October 2014 - 09:59 AM.

[KraftySOT]

I mean look at how they treat solos in CW as it stands.

We're filler. Even if were in a unit, but its small and im the only one on. I end up with an 11 man group in CW. That sucks.

However, I realize thats good for the game as a whole. Its not about my own personal preference. Id love MOAR CBILLS and to be showcased as important in CW.

But I realize the draw backs and that I only want that because im greedy, not because its actually good for the game.

[Assiah]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 October 2014 - 09:52 AM, said:

Tactical genius? no. solid knowledge of combat tactics in and out of gaming from 35 years of gaming and a few years in Service... yes.

The rate of progression in what game prey-tell? Have you captured a Planet I don't know about? Did you defend Yori Mechworks from a Murphy's Law Raid? No? The you haven't made a speck of progress have you?

*slow clap* I'm going to have to give you a 8/10 for mental gymnastics there, wonderful use of doublethink, BB would be pleased.