309 replies to this topic

[Ultimax]

CaliburZero, on 21 March 2015 - 03:35 PM, said:

Thanks for the reply (as well as Numnuts). Good to know. Honestly, I'm not looking for the FoTM per se, just so as long as it is pretty good/decent. My main interest was because I think its a very sexy mech. I'm vain, and have to look good while shooting things

I think it looks fantastic.

Bishop Steiner, on 21 March 2015 - 03:50 PM, said:

never have understood how a well supported ac10 is a waste, but you and I have always played a very different game, apparently.

I don't know if I'd say it's a waste, it's just a hard sell for me.

2 tons more and it could be an AC 20 for double the damage.
3 tons more and it's a Gauss, which is much, much better at ranged play.


If it was 1 ton less, basically LB10 weight, I think id like it more.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Ultimatum X, on 21 March 2015 - 03:54 PM, said:

I think it looks fantastic.





I don't know if I'd say it's a waste, it's just a hard sell for me.

2 tons more and it could be an AC 20 for double the damage.
3 tons more and it's a Gauss, which is much, much better at ranged play.


If it was 1 ton less, basically LB10 weight, I think id like it more.

I like the AC10 cuz its alot smaller in weight and pod space then AC20s and Gauss. It has better range then a AC20 and better velocity, so its a bit easier to aim with. Plus, it doesnt have a Charge time like the Gauss. It has more ammo then an AC20. AC10 is more a generalist weapon, decent in alot of situations, over the specialized AC20 and Gauss, one being more CQC, Gauss more longer range. BUt meh.

Take away x2 ranges and the AC10 becomes even nicer.

[Lightfoot]

CaliburZero, on 21 March 2015 - 01:57 PM, said:

My IS account i've been debating A La Carting the Zeus, and after reading what most have said... is it really worth it? Reading this thread there doesn't seem to be a clear answer. I looked at the hardpoints, and I'd like it alot more if those silly 1 Missile hardpoint arms got upped to 2 or 3.

If nothing else though, I think its very sexy aesthetically.

I like the Zeus aesthetically also so I pilot it. The 6T and 9S hit hard, but no where near as tough as a Victor or Highlander or Mad Cat which all mount roughly the same thing. The trick to doing well in a Zeus is never face more than one at a time and try not to snipe-duel with anyone because the Zeus will take the worse end due to the CT size being easy to snipe.

But I recommend the Zeus. Like the Awesome, Mad Cat, and Thor, the Zeus has the Lore.

Edited by Lightfoot, 21 March 2015 - 04:32 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Ultimatum X, on 21 March 2015 - 03:54 PM, said:

I think it looks fantastic.





I don't know if I'd say it's a waste, it's just a hard sell for me.

2 tons more and it could be an AC 20 for double the damage.
3 tons more and it's a Gauss, which is much, much better at ranged play.


If it was 1 ton less, basically LB10 weight, I think id like it more.

yes, except ac10 has better range and almost half the recycle time. For less than half the heat.
Over the Gauss, no charge mechanic (not a big deal, but I don't like it when I brawl) better RoF.

A well supported ac10 is much more versatile, and you are talking to a guy who's favorite gun IS the ac20.
it's between the Gauss and AC20 for it's usefulness, as far as I'm concerned. But maybe because of my love of CN9s and other mechs that basically had no choice but to use a 10, I came to understand it and embrace it more than most. I have always found that people do a cursory look at the smurfy number and not really plot it out all the way.

Anyhow, I find that most things don't like it when I touch off my 4 MPL and ac10 into the same spot. And if it's internal, it falls off. *shrugs* Good enough for me.

Ultimatum X, on 21 March 2015 - 03:54 PM, said:

I think it looks fantastic.

I do think it looks good, and the ® model even has vestigial "X" fins. The arms are very barbie doll stiff looking though, which kinda bugs me.

[MischiefSC]

You can XL in a Zeus but you need to know how to swing. It spreads damage like crazy. The ST are huge but that lets you stick your OTHER ST in place of it. With a bigger XL you swing pretty fast.

[Lightfoot]

LordKnightFandragon, on 21 March 2015 - 04:21 PM, said:

I like the AC10 cuz its alot smaller in weight and pod space then AC20s and Gauss. It has better range then a AC20 and better velocity, so its a bit easier to aim with. Plus, it doesnt have a Charge time like the Gauss. It has more ammo then an AC20. AC10 is more a generalist weapon, decent in alot of situations, over the specialized AC20 and Gauss, one being more CQC, Gauss more longer range. BUt meh.

Take away x2 ranges and the AC10 becomes even nicer.

The Battle Tech Gauss Rifle doesn't have a charge time. PGI broke it so it wouldn't work right. TRUE.

The Zeus is crippled by that decision while the King Crab, Daishi, Jagermech, CPLT-K2, can fuse 2X Gauss together to become the 'uber-sniper rifle from another game' not related to Battle Tech.

[Ens]

After intensive testing ( believe it or not ) i came up with the following:

First i tried the obvious 2xAC/5 Build,+ 2LL 2ML. Very nice but the higher Firerate for me is an invitation to have more facetime in order to get more damage on the enemy....which often resulted in a horrible death....silly me

Then i had very good matches with Gauss instead of double AC/5.
BUT something was missing.
Now i came up with this:
ZEU-6S
And with the proper modules it´s working like a miracle <3


My 9S Build is also a pretty fair 3 ERLL, 3 ML Build with a max Engine. Use the ERLL in the arm for some scalpel work.

The 6T however needs testing for me. I´m to lazy to LRM with it and i don´t think the Zeus brawls good enough to go 3xSRM6 and 4xMPL

[Ultimax]

Bishop Steiner, on 21 March 2015 - 04:33 PM, said:

yes, except ac10 has better range and almost half the recycle time. For less than half the heat.
Over the Gauss, no charge mechanic (not a big deal, but I don't like it when I brawl) better RoF.

A well supported ac10 is much more versatile, and you are talking to a guy who's favorite gun IS the ac20.
it's between the Gauss and AC20 for it's usefulness, as far as I'm concerned. But maybe because of my love of CN9s and other mechs that basically had no choice but to use a 10, I came to understand it and embrace it more than most. I have always found that people do a cursory look at the smurfy number and not really plot it out all the way.

Yeah a lot of those things are true, but I suppose I'm not looking for versatility as much.

I think if I could have 2 AC 10s on a build, that I quite like (One of my old Jager builds, R.I.P.).

I can usually hit relatively slow movers out to about 400m with the AC 20, which at that range is about 10 damage after drop off.

When things get close though, I find few weapons have the same killing power.

Just a preference really.

Bishop Steiner, on 21 March 2015 - 04:33 PM, said:

I do think it looks good, and the ® model even has vestigial "X" fins. The arms are very barbie doll stiff looking though, which kinda bugs me.

It's a great looking model, and it does some amazing justice to the faction skins IMO.

That huge rectangle might not be the most ideal hitbox, but it makes for a great canvas!

[Corbenik]

My Builds(6s) http://mwo.smurfy-ne...8121db74952c93b

(6t)http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d83900551f2b664

(9s)http://mwo.smurfy-ne...de018c1ad732c84
I put double ams ammo because I was in Lurmageddon zone, can probably switch the ammo now for more lrm ammo .

Engine wise those are just engines i had in stock, most of those builds did pretty well as long as i didnt get focused off the bat i'm pretty sure you guys can do better..

[Bishop Steiner]

Bishop's ZEU-6S
So far, this is my "go-to" Build, I love that it has the type of tactical flexibility I build my Mediums for. I've only had one "good" Game (by my standards) so far in it, but it has been amazingly consistent, with most matches in the high 500 dmg range, with 2 kills. Top so far was a little shy of 900 dmg, 5 kills, on one of the ugliest Viridian Bog brawls ever. Even included me doing a John Woo style two fisted (well fist and torso) shooting of an Ice Ferret to death while leaping backwards off a mountain to avoid getting killed by a Stormcrow. Games that fun are few and far between.

One nice thing I like, is much like the HBK, you can actually build some surprisingly diverse set ups on this mech.
Fire Support ZEU-9S
Brawler ZEU-6T

Though I'm not 100% in love with the 6T and might swap it to fire support in place of the 9S.

[InRev]

I haven't gotten around to working on my Zeuses yet but my question is: does it carry hard enough to be worth a Dire Wolf or King Crab spot? That's the problem I have in 80-tonners. Yeah, they may be good ton for ton, but, with a matchmaker based around class rather than raw weight, how much are you gimping the team by taking that spot which could be used by a 100-tonner?

Genuine question.

[Bishop Steiner]

InRev, on 21 March 2015 - 06:51 PM, said:

I haven't gotten around to working on my Zeuses yet but my question is: does it carry hard enough to be worth a Dire Wolf or King Crab spot? That's the problem I have in 80-tonners. Yeah, they may be good ton for ton, but, with a matchmaker based around class rather than raw weight, how much are you gimping the team by taking that spot which could be used by a 100-tonner?

Genuine question.

Since I don't do well in immobile mechs? For me, yes. But then I would take a BMaster over a DWF or KGC most times. I need some degree of agility.

If you are comfortable and do well in big Mech Turrets? The Answer is no. If, like me, you are a Medium Jockey at heart, then yes. But with the Caveat that much like the Panther is not a "Light Pilot's Light Mech", I don't feel the Zeus is your typical Assault Pilots Assault Mech. It's more to me for when I have to fill a weight class I don't normally run, I will be less a liability to the team in it, but still not as effective as if we had a real Assault Pilot in a Real Assault Mech.

[Wildstreak]

El Bandito, on 21 March 2015 - 08:03 AM, said:

If that's all you have then you really shouldn't be overheating too much. In Smurfy it has 50% heat efficiency, plenty enough.

Smurfy heat is not always indicative of in game heat.
I had Smurfy builds that looked good only get hot in game and reverse.
If I can afford to experiment, I build then test on Terra Therma before using, nothing like the hottest map to show me hot it will be.

[Bishop Steiner]

Wildstreak, on 21 March 2015 - 07:17 PM, said:

Smurfy heat is not always indicative of in game heat.
I had Smurfy builds that looked good only get hot in game and reverse.
If I can afford to experiment, I build then test on Terra Therma before using, nothing like the hottest map to show me hot it will be.

Very true. I dunno if Smurfy is not good at tracking HPS or what, but I have found when it comes ot listed heat efficiency, YMMV.

[MischiefSC]

Caustic. If a build pre-unlocks can kill all 8 on caustic in less than 3:30, it's solid enough to try. After double-basics it needs to go under 3 minutes. A rock solid build runs 2:45. Means it's got a good balance of speed and firepower.

[Wintersdark]

MischiefSC, on 21 March 2015 - 08:00 PM, said:

Caustic. If a build pre-unlocks can kill all 8 on caustic in less than 3:30, it's solid enough to try. After double-basics it needs to go under 3 minutes. A rock solid build runs 2:45. Means it's got a good balance of speed and firepower.

That's... kind of brilliant, actually. While I spend a bit of time with new mechs in testing grounds to feel em out, I've never really looked at timed runs killing stuff. It's a hot map, so heat is tested, but all the mechs are positioned fairly evenly around the caldera so you can run around ganking stuff.


As to Smurfy's... It's very accurate, but you need to understand what exactly the number means. It's purely a measure of your rate of dissipation vs. generation. Where it tends to fall down, though, is when you've got low heat generation and low dissipation. Your ratio may be good (giving you a high percentage) but your actual dissipation rate is still low, so once you've built up heat, it takes forever to get rid of it. It also, of course, doesn't consider heat cap, which can be very significant.

Personally, I tend to Smurfy-Evaluate based on mostly time to overheat. All mechs (or very nearly all mechs) shed heat at the same rate and have the same capacity for a given number of DHS, so I know roughly how fast my heat will go down for various amounts of DHS. I generally don't field mechs where TtOH is <20s using all my primary weapons, and prefer around 25s. I want to know, when I want to push, I can push. Sucks to push and hit your heat cap pretty much instantly.

Also, Smurfy doesn't really quirk, so depending on the mech it can be horrifically wrong.

[Malleus011]

I'd been struggling with the ZEU-6S ® - couldn't manage a damage over 250 or match score over 30 for a string of six matches.. Switched to Bishop's AC/10, quad MPL, LRM15 build (dropped Artemis for AMS, since I am likely in a lower ELO which sees lots of LRM use). 350 damage, match score 60. Next match 450 damage, match score 49. Big improvement.

Strange thing though - maybe it's because I'm playing from Korea right now, but the CT and LT Pulse lasers don't always shoot the crosshairs. Sometimes they land to the right or left if I'm torso twisting. What's up with that?

Edited by Malleus011, 21 March 2015 - 11:40 PM.

[STEF_]

Bishop Steiner, on 21 March 2015 - 07:33 AM, said:

PROS:
-Good Hitboxes
-Good Speed and Mobility
-Tough

CONS:
-Needs 2nd Missile Hardpoint on 2 variants
-Runs a little hot
-Waist high weaponry.

Any particular builds or insight from those who have used them more?

Bishop's ZEU-6S



*All results and impressions may change as I unlock Skills and refine builds, and YMMV.

Man, we are quite always agree..... how's that?

Anyway this is my build: I solve that arm problem in this way:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c5f1892d31aae52


I really would like to have a 2ac/5 build that works...but I couldn't find it. ac/5 rate make the mech expose too long and I saw I died too much.

Then, my other 2 Zeus:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...40698fa16f0f859 plain simple.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...eccc427aaae9103

As you can see, I'm enjoying the good work PGI has done with hitboxes. No reason not to mount XL.

Very fun mechs.

Once levelled I'll try some long range builds

[EnochsBook]

Here is my humble contribution to this thread:

Zeus-6S

I've found this build works very well for me. It's competent at long range, although since the hardpoints are quite low I'd say it's more of a support-fire than a real sniper. It has good mobility and the Med Pulse Lasers help when things get messy at close range. Not really a brawler but will do in a pinch.

[Grey Ghost]

Bishop Steiner, on 21 March 2015 - 07:58 PM, said:

Very true. I dunno if Smurfy is not good at tracking HPS or what, but I have found when it comes ot listed heat efficiency, YMMV.

Smufy's doesn't use Quirks, Modules, or the Fast Fire skill in any of it's calculations.