284 replies to this topic

[Dimento Graven]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 December 2015 - 12:50 PM, said:

sci fi in general seems to attract people who are better with ideas and imagination than writing and understanding how to be socially engaging. So a lot of "pulp" writing, but often still fun. I'd label most of Battletech novels as such.

What blows my mind is how universally owful the White Wolf "World of Darkness" novels were, or pretty much any Warhammer literature. (or how 90% of D&D books not part of the Dragonlance Chronicles or Dragonlance Legends were just.... kind of bad..but usually still readable. Greenwood and Gygax taking the forefront of monty hall adventures...)

I have to admit, there's nothing I would argue with in any of these statements.

[Barantor]

The Tempest is also the mech with the most amount of energy and the least amount of missile slots.

If the fear it is going to be invisibly launching LRMs (laughable as that is) then it will be limited to two launchers.

If the fear is it is going to do something the others dont, the only thing it can do is add two more medium pulse and be some sort of weird Medium Pulse boat, which you could probably do on the Jester too, but it wouldn't be done as well as a Thunderbolt, even with ECM.

We have already had an ECM hero and we have tons of c-bill ECM mechs in all IS weight classes now so I don't see a problem.

[CDLord HHGD]

It is a thin line but ECM is no longer the "I WIN" button it was back in closed beta. Remember those Ravens?? One good thing to come about is not only the proliferation and subsequent nerfing of ECM, but also the development and proliferation of ways to counter it.

[Pjwned]

How about we just properly fix ECM instead of it being a jesus box?

Guess that makes too much sense.

[Gas Guzzler]

Pjwned, on 17 December 2015 - 01:37 PM, said:

How about we just properly fix ECM instead of it being a jesus box?

Guess that makes too much sense.

That is the long term solution.

The short term solution is to get over it.

[TWIAFU]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 December 2015 - 12:50 PM, said:

sci fi in general seems to attract people who are better with ideas and imagination than writing and understanding how to be socially engaging. So a lot of "pulp" writing, but often still fun. I'd label most of Battletech novels as such.

What blows my mind is how universally owful the White Wolf "World of Darkness" novels were, or pretty much any Warhammer literature. (or how 90% of D&D books not part of the Dragonlance Chronicles or Dragonlance Legends were just.... kind of bad..but usually still readable. Greenwood and Gygax taking the forefront of monty hall adventures...)

I still re-read Gygax's Gord the Rogue series.

[Bishop Steiner]

TWIAFU, on 17 December 2015 - 02:18 PM, said:

I still re-read Gygax's Gord the Rogue series.

first 2 books were OK, actually liked the first one... but the rest? UGH. Of course, the whole point o fold D&D was to become a demigod...but too monty hall to be interesting. The Beggar stuff in the first one was pretty good though.

[Wales Grey]

Gas Guzzler, on 17 December 2015 - 12:00 PM, said:

Thanks for naming two mechs that are completely irrelevant at competitive play to show us how rampant the P2W trend is in MWO.

"Competitive" is not a word that belongs in the same sentence as "MWO", unless directly preceded by a negation such as "not". Or you're describing the general game being player versus player; I'm assuming you're using it in the sense of "DOTA/CS/Smash/MLG is competitive".

[Tombstoner]

Prosperity Park, on 16 December 2015 - 03:56 PM, said:

I don't like how we have more Mechs coming out where the Hero is the only version that has ECM. I think many of us will agree that ECM is still worth more than 1.5 tons, so giving only the Heo Mech ECM without assigning any significant drawbacks makes me unsettled.

I think that Mech chassis that offer an ECM Hero should also offer a ECM Standard Variant. So, instead of just the Archer Tempest getting ECM, one of the standard variants should also get ECM.

Do others feel this way, too?

its not pay to win... its pay to have a competitive advantage or early access to tech that turns the game into clubbing seals.... i' referring to clan tech... nerfed the day its available for in game cash.

[Viges]

I feel like game went P2W long time ago and nothing will change that.

[Nightmare1]

Prosperity Park, on 16 December 2015 - 03:56 PM, said:

I don't like how we have more Mechs coming out where the Hero is the only version that has ECM. I think many of us will agree that ECM is still worth more than 1.5 tons, so giving only the Heo Mech ECM without assigning any significant drawbacks makes me unsettled.

I think that Mech chassis that offer an ECM Hero should also offer a ECM Standard Variant. So, instead of just the Archer Tempest getting ECM, one of the standard variants should also get ECM.

Do others feel this way, too?

What are you talking about?

The MAD doesn't have an ECM Hero.
The Rifleman doesn't have an ECM Hero.
The Warhammer doesn't have an ECM Hero.
Resistance I and II didn't have ECM Heroes.
Origins IIC didn't have ECM Heroes.
The Urby pack didn't have an ECM Hero.
The Phoenix pack didn't have an ECM Hero.

The Archer is the first IS pack to have a Hero-only ECM variant, and it's actually justifiable given the Lore behind the Tempest. If you had read any of the BT novels, you'd understand about the Phantom Mech phenomenon and Morgan Kell. Since we can't have a Phantom Mech ability, ECM is the next best thing to approximate it.

Personally speaking, I find the ECM on the Tempest to be a nice, unique feature, especially for a missile Mech, and like that PGI is designing special Mech features like this based on the Lore. So please, stop making weird and ridiculous statements like this, with complaints that are totally unfounded.

Also, regarding "drawbacks," the quirks aren't even out yet, so you're automatically assuming this Mech will be overpowered without even waiting to see how it handles or what it's complete specs are. Quit jumping to conclusions and show some patience.

Good grief.

Viges, on 17 December 2015 - 04:17 PM, said:

I feel like game went P2W long time ago and nothing will change that.

Another inane opinion.

How on earth did it go P2W? I don't even have Premium Time right now, and nearly all the Mechs I own can be purchased for C-bills, yet I have no problem holding my own against any Hero Mech.

I suppose that some people just can't help griefing. It must be in their blood.

[Andi Nagasia]

Nightmare1, on 17 December 2015 - 04:42 PM, said:

The Archer is the first IS pack to have a Hero-only ECM variant, and it's actually justifiable given the Lore behind the Tempest. If you had read any of the BT novels, you'd understand about the Phantom Mech phenomenon and Morgan Kell. Since we can't have a Phantom Mech ability, ECM is the next best thing to approximate it.

didnt we cover this already with the Pirates Bane LCT-ECM-Hero?

[Dimento Graven]

Andi Nagasia, on 17 December 2015 - 04:45 PM, said:

didnt we cover this already with the Pirates Bane LCT-ECM-Hero?

LOL!

A 'mech so damned insignificant we all forgot about it!

Hahahahahahahahahaahahahahaha!

[AEgg]

Nightmare1, on 17 December 2015 - 04:42 PM, said:

-snip-

Another inane opinion.

How on earth did it go P2W? I don't even have Premium Time right now, and nearly all the Mechs I own can be purchased for C-bills, yet I have no problem holding my own against any Hero Mech.

I suppose that some people just can't help griefing. It must be in their blood.

This has come up dozens of times before and it's always the same answer. Some people define pay to win literally, in that if it isn't basically an insta win button it doesn't exist. Others (including myself) consider anything that's gameplay affecting (i.e. heroes) and only available for real money pay to win since you're paying for a potential advantage (no matter how insignificant).

It's just semantics.

Edited by AEgg, 17 December 2015 - 04:50 PM.

[DAYLEET]

Dimento Graven, on 17 December 2015 - 04:47 PM, said:

LOL!

A 'mech so damned insignificant we all forgot about it!

Hahahahahahahahahaahahahahaha!

While the ecm make the Pirates Bane disappear from radar, the 2 mgs makes the world disappear from the Pirates Bane. wth did they put in the powder to make those huge blinding flames for such a small gun?

Flash hider, lostech.

Edited by DAYLEET, 17 December 2015 - 04:55 PM.

[Nightmare1]

AEgg, on 17 December 2015 - 04:48 PM, said:

This has come up dozens of times before and it's always the same answer. Some people define pay to win literally, in that if it isn't basically an insta win button it doesn't exist. Others (including myself) consider anything that's gameplay affecting (i.e. heroes) and only available for real money pay to win since you're paying for a potential advantage (no matter how insignificant).

It's just semantics.

That's pay for content then, or pay for booster; not pay to win.

How can you define pay to win as anything other than "Pay" to "Win?"

[Nightmare1]

Andi Nagasia, on 17 December 2015 - 04:45 PM, said:

didnt we cover this already with the Pirates Bane LCT-ECM-Hero?

*Rolls eyes*

Riiiight, because the Pirate's Bane is terribly OP.

Sheesh, the ECM on the Pirate's Bane is about the only reason why anyone would purchase it. If you look at the Death's Knell, a comparable Light Mech, you'll notice that it doesn't have ECM.

So...let's see...you've got the Locust and the Tempest as Heroes that are the only ECM-equippable Mechs in their chassis type.

The Anasi, Ember, Oxide, and Huginn don't have Hero-only ECM variants.

Let's look at Mediums then.

Well...I'm not even going to bother listing the Mediums since none of them have Hero-only ECM variants. Funny thing about that too; the Gray Death was released at the same time as the Pirate's Bane, but it doesn't have ECM...

What about Heavies then?

Well I'll be! Sure 'nuff, Heavies, like their Medium counterparts, don't have any Hero-only ECM variants either, not even among the snazzy new Marauders and Warhammers! Huh...how 'bout that?

It must be in the Assaults then! That's where this evil must surely lie!

...But wait! It appears that the Archer is the only Assault Mech that is going to have a Hero-only ECM variant!

So, just to make sure that I understand you properly, the concern of yours and the OP's that PGI is embarking on a new, Hero-only ECM trend is based entirely on the fact that only two (mark it: TWO!) Hero Mechs, out of all the all the Heroes in the game, are Hero-only ECM variants for their chassis?

What a travesty! I hope the entire community takes up their torches and pitchforks over this because we certainly can't allow PGI to get away with such nonsense! It doesn't matter that there are only two such Mechs, or that they weren't even released consecutively to each other; their very existence is a harbinger of worse to come!

...
...
...

Seriously dude, you two are nitpicking over nothing. Get over it.

[Mcgral18]

Gas Guzzler, on 16 December 2015 - 05:14 PM, said:

Yeah, I have warmed up to the ~3 second Dorito delay mechanic they mentioned instead of the indefinite dorito deprivation that it currently has.

It is still useful at that point, but not such a hard counter.

It wasn't a dorito delay, it was a Paperdoll info delay.

Instant Dorito at max sensor range, because they removed the 'targetingfactor' penalty, which cuts range by whatever percentage.

Live is 25%, PTS1-3 was 100%, or not affected.


Ideally, it would be set to 50%ish.

[Gas Guzzler]

Wales Grey, on 17 December 2015 - 03:13 PM, said:

"Competitive" is not a word that belongs in the same sentence as "MWO", unless directly preceded by a negation such as "not". Or you're describing the general game being player versus player; I'm assuming you're using it in the sense of "DOTA/CS/Smash/MLG is competitive".

No idea what you are talking about. Competitive matches are a thing in MWO.

The point is, this mech is not going to be the best competitive option to take, therefore it is not P2W. Its incredibly simple.

[Koniving]

Prosperity Park, on 16 December 2015 - 03:56 PM, said:

I don't like how we have more Mechs coming out where the Hero is the only version that has ECM. I think many of us will agree that ECM is still worth more than 1.5 tons, so giving only the Heo Mech ECM without assigning any significant drawbacks makes me unsettled.

I think that Mech chassis that offer an ECM Hero should also offer a ECM Standard Variant. So, instead of just the Archer Tempest getting ECM, one of the standard variants should also get ECM.

Do others feel this way, too?

I think at the very least each weight should have one ECM that isn't a paywall. Even if not in the same chassis as a paywall hero.
Or better, remove the ECM hardpoint, remove the "Cloaking device," have ECM jam within 180 meters of itself and only that space (not just enemy launchers but any missiles within 180 meters that have Artemis -- jam the Artemis quirks.). And allow anyone to use it.

If someone has Artemis, great! You have a useful defense. What's that, no one has Artemis? You wasted 1.5 tons of equipment. We won't be seeing a craze of ECM.