555 replies to this topic

[Gyrok]

MischiefSC, on 28 March 2016 - 06:44 PM, said:

@Gyrok;

Genuinely and truly. Please. I'm totally serious here -

drop tags for a bit and go run with AWOL or MS. Put your ego aside for a bit. Those guys dominate in Clan mechs. My concern is that the underlying problem is that you don't do that well in Clan mechs. Not intended as an insult. I'm horrible in brawler lights - like insanely bad in them. If you asked me I'd say the Firestarter is crap; I could even give you numbers to 'prove it'. I'd be wrong though. The problem is that I'm terrible in lights. Just ******* terrible. I'm at peace with that and I've got a couple that work OK-ish.

This is not an ego issue...

CW is ******** for balance. If you base all your criteria for balance on CW, then you are trying to base balance decisions on a mode that 90% of the player base does not care at all about.

I will not play CW to try to get an idea of balance in this game. I am amazing in clan mechs...in fact...my HBR and DWs have some of my highest all time KDRs.

You need to accept that IS is strong right now. It is what it is...

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That's just me though.

Yep, still trying to have a balance discussion over a broken mode nobody cares about...that is completely irrelevant.

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TBR is strong. Incredibly strong. So is the HBR and EBJ.

Hands down the best part of taking a mech bay tour and hopping from faction to faction, seeking out units to mooch off of/spy on/hang out with has been a huge boon for my understanding of mechs, builds and the game.

From what you're saying about your impressions of the TBR I think the problem is that you need to get better with it. In CW especially as it's a good place to see specific IS/Clan balance. I think you'll benefit a lot from it.

Ever considered that you are doing it wrong?

Do you even play clan mechs any more?? Have you even played clan mechs since the last few patches?

I ask because every person with your perspective/attitude on the matter I have had a legitimate discussion with has not played clan mechs extensively in quite a while.

So, I ask them to go play clan mechs in whatever game mode they usually play.

Do you know what all of them to a man have told me so far???

"You are right...they are not what I thought anymore..."

I had one guy that went IS after running with us for a while because he said part of him died after playing IS because he felt clans were so strong.

Then he played clan mechs after playing IS for mostly a year...and he told me that it was soul crushing to play clan mechs because they were so weak compared to IS mechs. He talked about how his unit was convinced that clan mechs were stronger and talking about how they were "sticking it to the OP crutch using clanners"...and he literally quit the game because he was so upset that clan mechs were not what people said...and all of the people talking about IS being weak are using the crutches.

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Just stay quiet, don't try to 'sell' anyone on anything, just drop with them. Put your ego aside - if you had nothing to learn from other units then your unit would be winning non-stop and crushing all opposition. You're not and that's okay. Really nobody is except 2 or 3 groups.

I have nothing to learn from playing CW. There is nothing to learn in CW. Balance discussions do not happen regarding CW because the mode is fukt to begin with.

Any time you can take mechs that are slightly OP, and bring 12 of them...then things become massively OP.

You should go bring your clan drop deck to CW, and see 228th or someone like that run an Atlas wall and crush 2 full waves of PUGs. If you want to have a discussion about CW...you need to be on that end of it as well.

Still means nothing about balance though.

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Go travel a bit and see how that plays out. I make that recommendation to anyone and everyone, no matter how good they are. Scrub to golden tier elite. It's a great way to learn how to play the game better.

I play the game well enough.

Thanks for the advice, but I am going to pass that up...I do not play CW much anymore these days for several reasons:

1.) It is boring

2.) It means nothing

3.) There is no way to properly balance the mode

4.) No way to incentivize organized units to do it

5.) You cannot guarantee strong competition

TexAce, on 29 March 2016 - 02:14 AM, said:

Every time I read that thread title in the forum my brain automatically changes it to

"bohooo qq why are clan mechs balanced with IS mechs now, change it NAO! Bohooohoo qq"

Every time you ever post anything at all...my brain automatically changes it to:

"WAHH!!! MY IS MECHS ARE A CRUTCH, DO NOT TAKE IT AWAY!!!!! 25 YEARS AGO A CLAN MECH TOUCHED MY COMMANDO IN THAT SPECIAL NO NO PLACE AND I HATE CLANS SINCE!!!!!!!"

QQ

[Gyrok]

clownwarlord, on 29 March 2016 - 12:47 AM, said:

@Gyrok

Cherry picking information one point at a time may be helpful for your argument, but it still shows that you are not looking at the bigger picture. Again I ask you read my statement as a whole instead of snipping at it.

All of the points I bring up about the nerfings have to be taken into account as well as the buffs to help counter balance because they build what we are at today. To discount one (even if it is 2 years ago) is not taking in the entire discussion and is cherry picking facts (like in politics putting spin on the subject).

Along with the point of just looking at clans being nerfed or buffed through out their time you also have to look at the continual nerfings and buffs that the IS mechs have had. Because again if you do not then you again are cherry picking facts.

Now for my opinion which is worth gold to me but maybe dust to you:

What is the best mech in the game? TBR or HBR, not just because of chassis but also because of clan weapons and their hard points.

Worst mech in game? Vindicator. How useless is this mech is shown by how few you see being played.

Also if you are just trying to get clans to be OP because of "lore" then this is a mute argument because this isn't a book or Table Top (which had its own way of handling the balance). This is a Online Shooter where having unbalanced "items and tools" while do happen are not good because eventually you will see the majority float to that "tool". This will ruin the game for a lot because it will then just be a simulator of the game where everyone gets in that chassis, everyone gets out the same build, and everyone starts getting bored. So balance is needed or at least sought after.

So good luck with your argument but I have to disagree with you because you keep cherry picking your facts, but I leave with these questions for you on the subject.

If you think IS are over powering, in what way? Is it a specific chassis? A specific weapon? Hard points? A specific set of quirks/buffs? Or specific set of nerfings for the clan mechs?

Personally, I feel the IS is too strong because:

1.) Laser duration is too short...seriously too short

2.) Skill tree blanket nerfs to clans (yes IS was nerfed, but all were buffed back up to where they were...which is ********)

3.) Speed loss penalty for ST destruction on Clan XL.

If those 3 things were adjusted, I think balance would probably be pretty close...

[Dimento Graven]

Gyrok, on 29 March 2016 - 06:10 AM, said:

Personally, I feel the IS is too strong because:

1.) Laser duration is too short...seriously too short

Opinion. There are those that would argue the Clan weapons are too strong with their superior damage, range, and smaller size and weight.

If all you have to nitpick on is duration, we're back to my comment from WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY back that there are those out there who unreasonably begrudge the IS having any stat that matches, or slightly exceeding the Clans'.

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2.) Skill tree blanket nerfs to clans (yes IS was nerfed, but all were buffed back up to where they were...which is ********)

I'm not sure where you're going there. If you're talking the skill tree nerfs put in place so the Steam crowd wouldn't have to work so hard, those hit the IS AT LEAST as hard as they hit the Clans. There's been no buff/quirk to bring IS 'mechs back to the original speed tweak speeds, or start up speed, or firing speed, or heat capacity, etc., etc., etc., AND, as a matter of fact a LOT of IS 'mechs were further nerfed by having their range quirks significantly curtailed so that it's not possible for ANY IS 'mech (that I am aware of at least) to have ANY energy weapon range exceed Clan energy weapons.

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3.) Speed loss penalty for ST destruction on Clan XL.

I actually believe that's a lore based hit. Now, while I totally acknowledge that BT lore can't be followed at all times in this iteration of the game, it's a penalty that makes sense, and AGAIN, something the IS can't even come close to with their own ST's as, mentioned ad nausea, when an IS XL loses an ST the penalty is DEATH.

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If those 3 things were adjusted, I think balance would probably be pretty close...

Well, your opinion is noted.

It's wrong, but we acknowledge your opinion and your right to it.

[Dimento Graven]

Gyrok, on 29 March 2016 - 06:06 AM, said:

...

Every time you ever post anything at all...my brain automatically changes it to:

"WAHH!!! MY IS MECHS ARE A CRUTCH, DO NOT TAKE IT AWAY!!!!! 25 YEARS AGO A CLAN MECH TOUCHED MY COMMANDO IN THAT SPECIAL NO NO PLACE AND I HATE CLANS SINCE!!!!!!!"

QQ

And comments like these show every other reasonable person just exactly where your perspective is based and why it should have limited (at best) consideration.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Dimento Graven, on 29 March 2016 - 06:22 AM, said:

Opinion. There are those that would argue the Clan weapons are too strong with their superior damage, range, and smaller size and weight.

He actually isn't wrong here, the BK is fairly strong because of its ability to do a bunch of damage in less than a second, and the range advantage of the Clan lasers isn't as huge as it used to be. That said, if anything the iLPL could use a minor duration nerf (0.75-0.8 maybe?) while the cLPL could use a range nerf slightly (to maintain parity). It won't fix the problem of the BKs powerful alpha completely, but it may help a little bit by spreading out the initial damage per tick.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 29 March 2016 - 06:41 AM.

[Dimento Graven]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 29 March 2016 - 06:39 AM, said:

He actually isn't wrong here, the BK is fairly strong because of its ability to do a bunch of damage in less than a second, and the range advantage of the Clan lasers isn't as huge as it used to be. That said, if anything the iLPL could use a minor duration nerf (0.75-0.8 maybe?) while the cLPL could use a range nerf slightly (to maintain parity). It won't fix the problem of the BKs powerful alpha completely, but it may help a little bit by spreading out the initial damage per tick.

Then his arguments need to be against the quirks the BK has, NOT, that the entirety of the IS 'mech base is OP because the duration of weapons happens to be shorter than that of Clans.

You mention ONE outlier 'mech, and while yeah the BK can be a beast, it is NOT the only IS 'mech brought to the game and the majority that are don't have the 'one second' capability that the BK does.

Attempting to balance an entire weapon system based on ONE 'mech is incredibly short sighted. Perhaps ask for specific changes on that ONE 'mech instead?

[Ace Selin]

Gyrok, on 29 March 2016 - 06:10 AM, said:

so much rubbish its not worth quoting

Playing solo Q i play Clan mechs 80% of the time, and mostly Direwolf, Timberwolf and Jenner IIC because they are just so Strong. Nothing can stand up to my Dire (exception Brawler Atlas under 300m), Timber ranks with the top mechs in the game equal to BK / Hopper in IS but more mobile / more firepower so i use it instead. In the IS mechs losing a ST is death and yet in my Timber i have half my firepower left and have made many kills with one side torso loss, which is so much of a benefit. Jenner IIC is strong but fragile but too fun not to play. I look at the majority of other players i see doing well in solo Q and at least 50% if not more play Clan mechs too and many of the well known players too. Clan mechs are definitely strong, the good ones (the bad ones are like the IS bad mechs, no one plays them or they dont do much). If youre having difficulty in top end Clan mechs, like the Timberwolf, Hellbringer, Ebon, Dire are, then the problem really is you.

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 29 March 2016 - 06:39 AM, said:

He actually isn't wrong here, the BK is fairly strong because of its ability to do a bunch of damage in less than a second, and the range advantage of the Clan lasers isn't as huge as it used to be. That said, if anything the iLPL could use a minor duration nerf (0.75-0.8 maybe?) while the cLPL could use a range nerf slightly (to maintain parity). It won't fix the problem of the BKs powerful alpha completely, but it may help a little bit by spreading out the initial damage per tick.

My meta Timberwolf - alpha 61, heat mgmt - 1.12, speed 87kph, has JJ, has high mounted weapons.
My meta Black Knight - alpha 58, heat mgmt - 1.11, speed 81kp, no JJ, low mounted weapons, dies to ST loss.

Edited by Ace Selin, 29 March 2016 - 06:59 AM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Dimento Graven, on 29 March 2016 - 06:47 AM, said:

Then his arguments need to be against the quirks the BK has, NOT, that the entirety of the IS 'mech base is OP because the duration of weapons happens to be shorter than that of Clans.

It isn't the only one.

Currently within the current meta, the top lights/mediums are often Clan (minus the Griffin) whereas the Heavies/Assaults, the IS have an advantage. The assault area is because the amount of high mounts or massive short duration lasers. The balance is fickle, so it wouldn't take a major change to sort of ease the problem. Same with fixing why IS lights/mediums are considered less useful.

Ace Selin, on 29 March 2016 - 06:52 AM, said:

My meta Timberwolf - alpha 61, heat mgmt - 1.12, speed 87kph, has JJ, has high mounted weapons.
My meta Black Knight - alpha 58, heat mgmt - 1.11, speed 81kp, no JJ, low mounted weapons, dies to ST loss.

And yet one sees more use in comp right now, I wonder if it is because the stats you listed are not the full picture.....look, Im certainly not saying the Timby isn't a solid mech but the BK doing a majority of its damage within a half a second is probably not helping the perceived laser alpha problem and really isn't necessary for it to be useful. For reference, the 7-L does around 45 damage within half a second.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 29 March 2016 - 07:15 AM.

[iLLcapitan]

Incredible this threat is still alive and going. Then again, clan-not-op-anymore whinehard threats are always popular.
It ends up with some people who played both sides and do that constantly try to explain to some faction loyalist that balance is rather good now. But of course reason is out of the picture here. Still I lift my hat to the ones, who still try to convince the believers.

Gyrok, on 29 March 2016 - 06:10 AM, said:

Personally, I feel the IS is too strong because:

And we all got by now that some bad mechs touched you in bad spots in the CW playground, that's why the gamemode is utter garbage, alrighty

[Gyrok]

Ace Selin, on 29 March 2016 - 06:52 AM, said:

Playing solo Q i play Clan mechs 80% of the time, and mostly Direwolf, Timberwolf and Jenner IIC because they are just so Strong. Nothing can stand up to my Dire (exception Brawler Atlas under 300m), Timber ranks with the top mechs in the game equal to BK / Hopper in IS but more mobile / more firepower so i use it instead. In the IS mechs losing a ST is death and yet in my Timber i have half my firepower left and have made many kills with one side torso loss, which is so much of a benefit. Jenner IIC is strong but fragile but too fun not to play. I look at the majority of other players i see doing well in solo Q and at least 50% if not more play Clan mechs too and many of the well known players too. Clan mechs are definitely strong, the good ones (the bad ones are like the IS bad mechs, no one plays them or they dont do much). If youre having difficulty in top end Clan mechs, like the Timberwolf, Hellbringer, Ebon, Dire are, then the problem really is you.




My meta Timberwolf - alpha 61, heat mgmt - 1.12, speed 87kph, has JJ, has high mounted weapons.
My meta Black Knight - alpha 58, heat mgmt - 1.11, speed 81kp, no JJ, low mounted weapons, dies to ST loss.

Trolololol

Top players know I am telling the truth...

I know what I am doing...and I know what I am talking about.

Troll on

[iLLcapitan]

Gyrok, on 29 March 2016 - 07:11 AM, said:

Trolololol

Top players know I am telling the truth...

I know what I am doing...and I know what I am talking about.

Troll on

I honestly think you are the troll or just really, really hurt deep down for no reason.

[Ace Selin]

Gyrok, on 29 March 2016 - 07:11 AM, said:

Trolololol

Top players know I am telling the truth...

I know what I am doing...and I know what I am talking about.

Troll on

You clearly dont know what you're talking about, its plain for all to see. You sprout so much Clan biased rubbish if there is ever a honest point you make its missed with all the tripe you spit out. My "proof" is just as good as yours, probably better as i at least play with other tier 1 players and you play against Tier 5/4?, LRMers OP too are they?

So yes keep trolling on.

Edited by Ace Selin, 29 March 2016 - 07:20 AM.

[Gyrok]

Dimento Graven, on 29 March 2016 - 06:22 AM, said:

Opinion. There are those that would argue the Clan weapons are too strong with their superior damage, range, and smaller size and weight.

If all you have to nitpick on is duration, we're back to my comment from WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY back that there are those out there who unreasonably begrudge the IS having any stat that matches, or slightly exceeding the Clans'.

No, the IS LPL is the strongest energy weapon in the game for a reason...duration gap is too big. Needs to close a bit...does not need to be even, but the gap needs to get smaller than it is.

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I'm not sure where you're going there. If you're talking the skill tree nerfs put in place so the Steam crowd wouldn't have to work so hard, those hit the IS AT LEAST as hard as they hit the Clans. There's been no buff/quirk to bring IS 'mechs back to the original speed tweak speeds, or start up speed, or firing speed, or heat capacity, etc., etc., etc., AND, as a matter of fact a LOT of IS 'mechs were further nerfed by having their range quirks significantly curtailed so that it's not possible for ANY IS 'mech (that I am aware of at least) to have ANY energy weapon range exceed Clan energy weapons.

So all those accel/decel quirks for IS mechs, + torso twist speed quirks + reverse speed quirks, are not buffing the blanket mobility nerfs that nerfed accel/decel speed, torso twist speed, etc.

Wait...those are buffing everything that was nerfed!!!!!

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I actually believe that's a lore based hit. Now, while I totally acknowledge that BT lore can't be followed at all times in this iteration of the game, it's a penalty that makes sense, and AGAIN, something the IS can't even come close to with their own ST's as, mentioned ad nausea, when an IS XL loses an ST the penalty is DEATH.

No, it is actually not. For each engine crit in lore, you gain a heat penalty of 5.

2 crits is a heat penalty of 10.

In TT, a mech with 20 DHS could afford to lose 10 DHS, take a 5 heat penalty, and still soak it and fire a few weapons before any heat penalty would ever come into play at all

Just walking around, there would be no heat penalty ever incurred at all in TT.

This penalty is BS invented by grognards and has no bearing on lore, TT, or anything else like that. If you doubt me, check the core rules.

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Well, your opinion is noted.

It's wrong, but we acknowledge your opinion and your right to it.

Apparently you were missing some facts.

Ace Selin, on 29 March 2016 - 07:18 AM, said:

You clearly dont know what you're talking about, its plain for all to see. You sprout so much Clan biased rubbish if there is ever a honest point you make its missed with all the trip you spit out. My "proof" is just as good as yours, probably better as i at least play with other tier 1 players and you play against Tier 5/4?, LRMers OP too are they?

So yes keep trolling on.

Oh...insult me because I am not showing my tier??

Ask Quicksilver how often he sees me in the queue...he is clearly tier 1.

[Monodominant]

Ok...

Back with some personal opionion based on empirical data.

In the recent sale I bought the Heavy Steam package. I originally considered it a very bad deal (36 euro for 2 mechs) but the fact that it had 30 days premium + some colors + 3000 MC + 5 million cbills tipped the scale. If I was going to buy something, might as well do that.

As I am a primarily IS player I started with the Thunderbolt. The mech comes basically as you see the 'best Thunderbolt 9SE' in metamechs optimisation thread. Triple LPL, 1 jump jet for a bit of maneuverability etc. etc.

I did... average with the mech. Nothing special and though I dont regret the purchase I would say its underwhelming.

And then... magic happened.

I tried the TBR C that comes with the pack.

Keep in mind its my first clan mech. I have Quickdraws, Banshees, Blackjacks, Commandos and have tried Jagers and a few other IS mechs but this was the first time I did more than a few matches in a clan mech.

Also keep in mind I am currently T4 final stretch (almost T3) and I consider myself an average - casual player.

Lastly keep in mind the mech is not mastered or even elited and although its a good build (2 x CLPL , 3 x CMPL) its not the 'optimised' from meta mechs due to me not having any other omnimech sides to add.

Well, in 2-3 hours of playing I had made 3-4 million CBills, I had gotten all the basic abilities unlocked and had an extra 11k xp on it and...

MY K/D ratio after 25 or so games is 1.79... now that might not mean a lot to you... but my favorite nd most played mechs before now have been my BJ-1 (K/D ration 1.51) , my Quickdraw 4H (K/D ratio 1.15) and my Banshee 3M (K/D 1.16).

Similarly the Games Won/ Games lost ratio for the TBR is better for it than for my long running mechs.

Every time I run the TBR I feel as if I am playing easy mode. Sure, I die and sure I overheat as I get to learn how to effectively use it but oh my god is there a difference. Its more durable than the Quickdraw but not more than the Banshee and its definetly more killy than both. Its fast (81 KMPH currently) and its sturdy. Oh and off course... LPL shooting out to 640 meters optimal is also amazing... thats longer than my LL on my Quickdraw!

So here you have it... I have been playing this game for 2-3 months and had focused on IS only... but the amount of awesome this mech has delivered in the 2 days I have played it is beyond any other mech. I am fully ready to accept I am a sucky player but then I cant explain how suddenly I became 'better' just by dropping in a TBR.

The though of doing CW with 3 x TBR and I guess a Jenner or a AC makes me giggle...

Edited by Monodominant, 29 March 2016 - 07:29 AM.

[Mystere]

Eider, on 28 March 2016 - 07:56 PM, said:

oh and spare me the lore defense on why they should be stronger, that went out the window when pgi decided to stick with 12 vs 12 .

And that I think is one of the most ridiculous and ultimately money-losing decisions ever made. Clan Mechs being equal to IS Mechs performance-wise many can accept. But organizing Clans into companies(?!) of 3 lances (??!!) with 4 Mechs(???!!!) each was just too much to stomach for long durations.

Edited by Mystere, 29 March 2016 - 07:23 AM.

[Dimento Graven]

Gyrok, on 29 March 2016 - 07:20 AM, said:

No, the IS LPL is the strongest energy weapon in the game for a reason...duration gap is too big. Needs to close a bit...does not need to be even, but the gap needs to get smaller than it is.

The IS LPL is strong on a few 'mechs. Not EVERY 'mech. Perhaps those specific 'mechs need their quirks looked at, but the IS LPL as is, is in a pretty good playce.

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So all those accel/decel quirks for IS mechs, + torso twist speed quirks + reverse speed quirks, are not buffing the blanket mobility nerfs that nerfed accel/decel speed, torso twist speed, etc.

Wait...those are buffing everything that was nerfed!!!!!

Hold on, now I think you're being a bit disingenuous and a bit 'loose' with the facts there. MOST of the 'mechs that have those quirks have had them since LONG BEFORE the nerf to the skill tree, PLUS, those particular quirks are only a small portion of the skill tree, not the entire skill tree, and as I vaguely recall only a few pre-existing 'mechs received updates to those quirks post the skill tree nerf, among them, Clan 'mechs too.

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No, it is actually not. For each engine crit in lore, you gain a heat penalty of 5.

2 crits is a heat penalty of 10.

In TT, a mech with 20 DHS could afford to lose 10 DHS, take a 5 heat penalty, and still soak it and fire a few weapons before any heat penalty would ever come into play at all

Just walking around, there would be no heat penalty ever incurred at all in TT.

This penalty is BS invented by grognards and has no bearing on lore, TT, or anything else like that. If you doubt me, check the core rules.

You're probably right, I haven't looked at the rules in a long time, I just had some vague remembrance of speed taking hit with engine crit. If I am remembering incorrectly, I acknowledge that, BUT, as stated before PGI can't stick with Lore, and in this case hasn't, and it makes sense.

Again you're talking an issue where the ONLY penalties Clan 'mechs are receiving for ST loss is speed reduction and heat increases, while the IS when losing an ST on an XL engine receive DEATH.

It's really hard to take any discussion on reducing the Clan penalty further when there's absolutely ZERO give in the IS side of that balance equation.

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Apparently you were missing some facts.

At least as many you are missing.

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Oh...insult me because I am not showing my tier??

Ask Quicksilver how often he sees me in the queue...he is clearly tier 1.

The player experience for a Tier 3 player vs. a Tier 1 player can be quite different, EVEN THOUGH the Tier 1 and Tier 3 player may often see each other in the public queues...

While insulting you for your lack of Tier disclosure isn't necessary, I think it's valid to be curious as your player experience seems to be so different from what known Tier 1 players have been reporting in this thread.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Ace Selin, on 29 March 2016 - 07:18 AM, said:

probably better as i at least play with other tier 1 players

SO do I, and the fact you posted trying to make the Timby look better than the BK is a bit disturbing, the BK beats the Timby at the mid range laser vomit. The only advantage of the Timby is that the LPL are still solid poke weapons that it can abuse, but competing at the same thing, sorry the BK is just better. Last night we had 5 BKs when MM decided to be drunk and stack SJR and EmP on the same team, we only had 2 Timbys and that was because I was being a hipster taking a Timby instead of yet another BK. That isn't an isolated incident either, it is common to take BKs or Grasshoppers for the mid range laser vomit.

Gyrok, on 29 March 2016 - 07:20 AM, said:

No, the IS LPL is the strongest energy weapon in the game for a reason...duration gap is too big.

I wouldn't go that far, if ghost heat weren't a thing the cLPL would actually be better imo, but the ghost heat being 3 for the iLPL allows it to be abused more in better circumstances, as well as the fact the iML combine better with the iLPL than cERML do with cLPL currently (due to the max range nerf on the cERML).

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 29 March 2016 - 07:36 AM.

[Mystere]

Dimento Graven, on 29 March 2016 - 06:22 AM, said:

Opinion. There are those that would argue the Clan weapons are too strong with their superior damage, range, and smaller size and weight.

If all you have to nitpick on is duration, we're back to my comment from WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY back that there are those out there who unreasonably begrudge the IS having any stat that matches, or slightly exceeding the Clans'.

Actually, I would not mind all laser durations significantly lengthened and/or turned into on/off weapons (i.e. lasers keep firing until button is released).

[Dimento Graven]

Mystere, on 29 March 2016 - 07:22 AM, said:

And that I think is one of the most ridiculous and ultimately money-losing decisions ever made. Clan Mechs being equal to IS Mechs performance-wise many can accept. But organizing Clans into companies(?!) of 3 lances (??!!) with 4 Mechs(???!!!) each was just too much to stomach for long durations.

I've long stated that Clans could be the original OP Lore values, IF, CW would support 10v12 drops in Clan vs. IS.

Of course the "stop gap" game modes of the Public Queue have since become the "main stay" of MWO and because of that we can't have an ACTUAL BT face off of 10v12.

The whole concept of balance in BT was Clan Tech vs. IS numbers.

<sigh> It saddens me to think of the game we could have had...

[Mystere]

Dimento Graven, on 29 March 2016 - 06:47 AM, said:

Attempting to balance an entire weapon system based on ONE 'mech is incredibly short sighted. Perhaps ask for specific changes on that ONE 'mech instead?

But a Clan-wide nerf because the TBR came out extremely good was not? The Suckoner moniker did not come out of a vacuum.