819 replies to this topic

[Andi Nagasia]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 11 August 2016 - 03:57 PM, said:

I dunno; I think the island has gotten bigger than the mainland at this point

would that make it a continent? Are we all on an Island? isnt the Planet just an Island in space?
(yes Buddah ill go sit in the corner and think about what ive done now)
Edit- Spelling

Edited by Andi Nagasia, 11 August 2016 - 05:57 PM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Andi Nagasia, on 11 August 2016 - 05:56 PM, said:

would that make it a continent? Are we all on an Island? isnt the Planet just an Island in space?
(yes Buddah ill go sit in the corner and think about what ive done now)
Edit- Spelling

dude you made me shoot Moxie out my nose and that **** hurts

[Hotthedd]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 11 August 2016 - 12:25 PM, said:

I fixed something for you. To make up for the lack of PPFLD behavior that Gauss and PPCs enjoy, a weapon has to be able to make up for it with damage in some way, whether it means it gets to be more accurate, cooler overall, shoot faster, have better burst potential, etc; it has to make up for that deficit in someway otherwise it will fall short, so factors like AC bursts, laser durations, LBX spread HAVE to be taken into account when creating some system meant to balance group firing otherwise one group WILL be penalized more than the other and may result in either overly niche weapons or weapons that are absolutely worthless in some situations and absolutely ridiculous in others (Rocket Launchers in a certain MW4 mod were this way).

Unless all ACs are changed to burst fire, they will still be PPFLD.
But, of course, you are correct, all of the balancing tools should be used.

[JC Daxion]

Gas Guzzler, on 13 June 2016 - 09:41 PM, said:

People who want energy draw:

1) Terribads
2) People who are perfectly fine with Long range PPFLD and ballistic boats (low alpha, high DPS) being the only viable loadouts

Literally the stupidest waste of time I have ever seen.

way to paint a broad brush....


How about those that are into the BT world, a place that was never about boating alpha warrior for the most part.. A place that multiple weapon systems, and ranges was typically a good way to go..

Some how peaking around a corner and instant hits with high alpha's make a good pilot/warrior? Maybe good aim, but peaking around a corner and falling back, or pop tarting was never about pilot skill... aim skill yes, but certainly not piloting.

Making attacks take place over a period of time, that piloting comes into play to me will make the game far better. It will also help those mechs that can't high alpha boat, are are much more about DPS, that people complain all the time about how X, y z mech need more hard points to keep up.


I am really hoping this system helps with that a bit.. outside of going with Sized hard points, i think this has the possibility of being one of the better balances that have hit the game. Ghost heat while not perfect, did help in many ways. It's nice not getting blasted by quad PPC mechs, and these days if you do, you get a huge advantage if you can survive, and then pour on the DPS at closer ranges.

Edited by JC Daxion, 12 August 2016 - 04:31 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

JC Daxion, on 12 August 2016 - 04:24 AM, said:

way to paint a broad brush....


How about those that are into the BT world, a place that was never about boating alpha warrior for the most part.. A place that multiple weapon systems, and ranges was typically a good way to go..

Some how peaking around a corner and instant hits with high alpha's make a good pilot/warrior? Maybe good aim, but peaking around a corner and falling back, or pop tarting was never about pilot skill... aim skill yes, but certainly not piloting.

Making attacks take place over a period of time, that piloting comes into play to me will make the game far better. It will also help those mechs that can't high alpha boat, are are much more about DPS, that people complain all the time about how X, y z mech need more hard points to keep up.


I am really hoping this system helps with that a bit.. outside of going with Sized hard points, i think this has the possibility of being one of the better balances that have hit the game. Ghost heat while not perfect, did help in many ways. It's nice not getting blasted by quad PPC mechs, and these days if you do, you get a huge advantage if you can survive, and then pour on the DPS at closer ranges.

Did it ever occur to some of you people just how ridiculous the BT world is? And that it's just not really possible to make a good real-time game that operates that way?

[Hotthedd]

Yeonne Greene, on 12 August 2016 - 05:07 AM, said:

Did it ever occur to some of you people just how ridiculous the BT world is? And that it's just not really possible to make a good real-time game that operates that way?

Ridiculous or not, it is the universe in which PGI chose to make the game.

And I believe that it is possible to make a MechWarrior game that is both "good" and much closer to the original rules. There will always be some things that do not translate perfectly, but that does not mean it is impossible to capture the spirit of the game.

Of course there are many who like to say it isn't possible, because they do not want to see an attempt at it.

[Gas Guzzler]

JC Daxion, on 12 August 2016 - 04:24 AM, said:

way to paint a broad brush....


How about those that are into the BT world, a place that was never about boating alpha warrior for the most part.. A place that multiple weapon systems, and ranges was typically a good way to go..

Some how peaking around a corner and instant hits with high alpha's make a good pilot/warrior? Maybe good aim, but peaking around a corner and falling back, or pop tarting was never about pilot skill... aim skill yes, but certainly not piloting.

Making attacks take place over a period of time, that piloting comes into play to me will make the game far better. It will also help those mechs that can't high alpha boat, are are much more about DPS, that people complain all the time about how X, y z mech need more hard points to keep up.


I am really hoping this system helps with that a bit.. outside of going with Sized hard points, i think this has the possibility of being one of the better balances that have hit the game. Ghost heat while not perfect, did help in many ways. It's nice not getting blasted by quad PPC mechs, and these days if you do, you get a huge advantage if you can survive, and then pour on the DPS at closer ranges.

Its more about maneuvering and positioning than aiming. Its a terrible balance tool, that will not affect weapon loadouts equally. Loadouts that are already top loadouts do not get touched, while only laser based loadouts get crushed. If you think this is balance then you don't know what balance is. Its a terrible, not well thought out, solution to a "problem" that is only believed to exist by a small subset of the player base that wants to cling to BT in every way, and doesn't understand positioning and torso twisting. Anytime someone says "This game is all peak alpha and hide" and then insists that running around in the open like a chicken with its head cut off firing small groups of weapons all of a sudden makes the game require more skill I have to question their thought process.

Besides, do you think a Kodiak with 2 UAC10s and 2 UAC5s or a Black Widow with 4 AC5s is going to have any issue nuking a mech out in the open with high DPS? Those builds are "Energy Draw" legal because they don't do more than 30 damage at once. TTK isn't going to change, people who don't understand piloting and positioning are still going to die extremely quickly.

Its funny you talk about DPS, because the best mechs in the game are more about DPS than they are about high alphas.

Hotthedd, on 12 August 2016 - 06:59 AM, said:

Ridiculous or not, it is the universe in which PGI chose to make the game.

This argument has got to go. They chose to make a MechWarrior game, and this game is 100% MechWarrior.

Hotthedd, on 12 August 2016 - 06:59 AM, said:

Of course there are many who like to say it isn't possible, because they do not want to see an attempt at it.

Yeah, because it wouldn't make for an exciting game. The slow paced lumbering mech crowd can look forward to BattleTech to get that fix, because you know, its turn-based, so everyone can think about their next move for 15 minutes.

[Hotthedd]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 07:16 AM, said:

This argument has got to go. They chose to make a MechWarrior game, and this game is 100% MechWarrior.

The argument can go if it is ever refuted by facts instead of opinions.
You can have the opinion that taking the most arcade-like aspects of SP games is "MechWarrior", and that is fine. I believe that the only reason previous MechWarrior games were as simple as they were is due to the limitations of the times they were created, and the fact that they were never built to be PvP games.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 07:16 AM, said:

Yeah, because it wouldn't make for an exciting game. The slow paced lumbering mech crowd can look forward to BattleTech to get that fix, because you know, its turn-based, so everyone can think about their next move for 15 minutes.

Perhaps you do not think it would be exciting to you, but your opinion is not shared by all. Personally, I believe the vast majority of the players who have left the game were looking forward to a game with more sim-like qualities, and actual immersion in the BT universe.

[Gas Guzzler]

Hotthedd, on 12 August 2016 - 07:34 AM, said:

The argument can go if it is ever refuted by facts instead of opinions.
You can have the opinion that taking the most arcade-like aspects of SP games is "MechWarrior", and that is fine. I believe that the only reason previous MechWarrior games were as simple as they were is due to the limitations of the times they were created, and the fact that they were never built to be PvP games.


Perhaps you do not think it would be exciting to you, but your opinion is not shared by all. Personally, I believe the vast majority of the players who have left the game were looking forward to a game with more sim-like qualities, and actual immersion in the BT universe.

The argument itself is an opinion, so.... but the fact is, MechWarrior does not NEED to cater to every detail of BattleTech.

Arcadey? This doesn't feel like an arcade game to me. Chainfiring a couple of weapons feels more arcadey to me, kind of like Hawken.

I think the vast majority of players left the game because there isn't a lot of worthwhile gamemodes and other missing content. Not to mention, nobody plays a game for 4-5 years straight or however long it has existed.

I would love more immersion into the BattleTech universe, just not the slow as molasses stop and sweat after every shot combat scheme that is described in the lore. I mean I wish I actually felt like I was fighting for/against a certain faction in FW, or that there was more of a "backdrop" so I actually felt like we were in the universe and not just completely disconnected. But that's a completely different discussion that has nothing to do with "Energy Draw" other than it is what they should have been spending time developing instead of energy draw.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 12 August 2016 - 07:50 AM.

[Hotthedd]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 07:50 AM, said:

The argument itself is an opinion, so.... but the fact is, MechWarrior does not NEED to cater to every detail of BattleTech.

Fair enough, it is just as valid an opinion as the next, especially since "A BattleTech Game" is on the Marquee, and MechWarrior was born from BattleTech. It is not a separate entity.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 07:50 AM, said:

Arcadey? This doesn't feel like an arcade game to me. Chainfiring a couple of weapons feels more arcadey to me, kind of like Hawken.

Yes, arcadey. Firing multiple weapons simultaneously with perfect precision is an arcade-like remnant of the limitations of computer games in the '80's and 90's, as well as a device to allow a single player to survive waves of AI 'mechs.
Those limitations no longer apply.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 07:50 AM, said:

I think the vast majority of players left the game because there isn't a lot of worthwhile gamemodes and other missing content. Not to mention, nobody plays a game for 4-5 years straight or however long it has existed.

Those are reasons as well, but most of the people I know that have quit MW:O quit because it was a shadow of the game that was promised.
...BattleTech fans do. Just look at how long MWLL survived.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 07:50 AM, said:

I would love more immersion into the BattleTech universe, just not the slow as molasses stop and sweat after every shot combat scheme that is described in the lore. I mean I wish I actually felt like I was fighting for/against a certain faction in FW, or that there was more of a "backdrop" so I actually felt like we were in the universe and not just completely disconnected. But that's a completely different discussion that has nothing to do with "Energy Draw" other than it is what they should have been spending time developing instead of energy draw.

All of those things are part of immersion, but so is making a game closer to the sim it set out to be.
And we really are not talking about Energy Draw at this point.

[Gas Guzzler]

Hotthedd, on 12 August 2016 - 08:38 AM, said:

Fair enough, it is just as valid an opinion as the next, especially since "A BattleTech Game" is on the Marquee, and MechWarrior was born from BattleTech. It is not a separate entity.

Yes, arcadey. Firing multiple weapons simultaneously with perfect precision is an arcade-like remnant of the limitations of computer games in the '80's and 90's, as well as a device to allow a single player to survive waves of AI 'mechs.
Those limitations no longer apply.

Those are reasons as well, but most of the people I know that have quit MW:O quit because it was a shadow of the game that was promised.
...BattleTech fans do. Just look at how long MWLL survived.

All of those things are part of immersion, but so is making a game closer to the sim it set out to be.
And we really are not talking about Energy Draw at this point.

Actually, chain firing was due to the limitations of old games. Being able to set up weapon groups is more technically complex in a programming sense, so the opposite point is true, that's why more modern MechWarrior games facilitate alpha strikes and group fire more easily.

That may be true, but "enforced chain-fire" was never promised. And seriously, yeah some people may have stopped playing the game, because they wanted a MechWarrior game, but not a PvP game. In fact, I guarantee that is what most people wanted, but came to realize that MechWarrior Online wasn't going to feed their desire to stomp around in a storyline against waves of AI, feeling like an unstoppable juggernaut.

Its like the same people that just play single player Halo but don't like the multiplayer. Dominating waves of AI is an ego boost. Struggling to compete with people is not, unless you succeed.

You're right, we have left Energy Draw, and are simply arguing over our opinion on how this game should be. It sounds like it is FAR away from what you are looking for, but pretty close for me, and neither one of our opinions are unsupported by others, at least not in a quantifiable sense where we can say "More people want what I want then what you want". So at the end of the day, if they continue to improve balance little by little, add some more maps and game modes, and add some more BT universe immersion (not the slow paces sim stuff you are talking about), then I'll be happy. You kind of have to realize at some point, that this is never going to be the sim you are looking for. No matter how hard you try to dress up your cat to look like a dog, its still a cat.

Regarding this thread, Energy Draw is a step back in balance, so I don't want it in any form. Ghost heat, while hindering in some cases (3 PPCs ), at least just limits the use of highly synergistic weapons to the point where it is very costly to get large alphas. Either in heat, range, tonnage, etc, you have to give up something, and I think it is in a reasonable state right now. Tweaks to balance would be great to help the underperforming weapons (IS SLs, MGs, AC2s, LRMs, IS AC10)

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 12 August 2016 - 08:58 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

Hotthedd, on 12 August 2016 - 06:59 AM, said:

Ridiculous or not, it is the universe in which PGI chose to make the game.

And the universe can be changed. It's not like Battlefront is an accurate implementation of Star Wars, or that Shadow of Mordor is an accurate implementation of Middle Earth. Shoot, look at Battlestar Galactica; the newer one is far-and-away more popular and critically acclaimed than the original ever was. Why? Because children fighting robots on unicorns in space with serious intent is f*cking stupid. Good for comedy value, bad for grave space opera.

Quote

And I believe that it is possible to make a MechWarrior game that is both "good" and much closer to the original rules. There will always be some things that do not translate perfectly, but that does not mean it is impossible to capture the spirit of the game.

Of course there are many who like to say it isn't possible, because they do not want to see an attempt at it.

I'm willing to entertain the thought that it is possible, but I'm really not willing to play it. I came to this game because the core play was good, and continues to be good. It just lacks for extra features.

Edited by Yeonne Greene, 12 August 2016 - 09:00 AM.

[Hotthedd]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 08:57 AM, said:

Actually, chain firing was due to the limitations of old games. Being able to set up weapon groups is more technically complex in a programming sense, so the opposite point is true, that's why more modern MechWarrior games facilitate alpha strikes and group fire more easily.

Precise group fire was the limitation. In order to group fire weapons, the older games had to use that mechanic, both to save programming and disk space, and to make it possible to kill all of the bad guys and finish the game.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 08:57 AM, said:

That may be true, but "enforced chain-fire" was never promised.

Who is asking for "enforced chain-fire"?

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 08:57 AM, said:

And seriously, yeah some people may have stopped playing the game, because they wanted a MechWarrior game, but not a PvP game. In fact, I guarantee that is what most people wanted, but came to realize that MechWarrior Online wasn't going to feed their desire to stomp around in a storyline against waves of AI, feeling like an unstoppable juggernaut.

No. People who signed up for this game as far back as closed beta knew this was going to be a PvP game. People who joined the game since then KNEW it was a PvP game. So your assertion that people left the game because it wasn't MechWarrior V is baseless.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 08:57 AM, said:

You're right, we have left Energy Draw, and are simply arguing over our opinion on how this game should be. It sounds like it is FAR away from what you are looking for, but pretty close for me, and neither one of our opinions are unsupported by others, at least not in a quantifiable sense where we can say "More people want what I want then what you want". So at the end of the day, if they continue to improve balance little by little, add some more maps and game modes, and add some more BT universe immersion (not the slow paces sim stuff you are talking about), then I'll be happy. You kind of have to realize at some point, that this is never going to be the sim you are looking for. No matter how hard you try to dress up your cat to look like a dog, its still a cat.

You may be right about where the game is headed, but I will not stop advocating my position. I'm not quite ready to join the masses of former players who are just waiting for PGI's MechWarrior experiment to die so that a better company can finally make the MechWarrior sim that was promised.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 08:57 AM, said:

Regarding this thread, Energy Draw is a step back in balance, so I don't want it in any form. Ghost heat, while hindering in some cases (3 PPCs ), at least just limits the use of highly synergistic weapons to the point where it is very costly to get large alphas. Either in heat, range, tonnage, etc, you have to give up something, and I think it is in a reasonable state right now. Tweaks to balance would be great to help the underperforming weapons (IS SLs, MGs, AC2s, LRMs, IS AC10)

Meh. I think it is another band-aid, but I am willing to test it out before I condemn it.

Yeonne Greene, on 12 August 2016 - 08:58 AM, said:

And the universe can be changed. It's not like Battlefront is an accurate implementation of Star Wars, or that Shadow of Mordor is an accurate implementation of Middle Earth. Shoot, look at Battlestar Galactica; the newer one is far-and-away more popular and critically acclaimed than the original ever was. Why? Because children fighting robots on unicorns in space with serious intent is f*cking stupid. Good for comedy value, bad for grave space opera.

It can be changed, but change for the sake of change is a bad idea. There is no reason to change the BT universe to suit this game, other than to try to appeal to players who like other games better.

Yeonne Greene, on 12 August 2016 - 08:58 AM, said:

I'm willing to entertain the thought that it is possible, but I'm really not willing to play it. I came to this game because the core play was good, and continues to be good. It just lacks for extra features.

You are welcome to hold the opinion that the core play in MW:O is good. My opinion is that it is too arcade like, and much less than the sim it was sold to be.

[Gas Guzzler]

Hotthedd, on 12 August 2016 - 09:55 AM, said:

Precise group fire was the limitation. In order to group fire weapons, the older games had to use that mechanic, both to save programming and disk space, and to make it possible to kill all of the bad guys and finish the game.

Who is asking for "enforced chain-fire"?

No. People who signed up for this game as far back as closed beta knew this was going to be a PvP game. People who joined the game since then KNEW it was a PvP game. So your assertion that people left the game because it wasn't MechWarrior V is baseless.

Group fire... no, old MechWarrior games did not make group firing easy. There wasn't a nice easy system of specifying what weapons were tied to which group, and there were no 4-button mice to manage all of those groups. It was fire, or alpha strike.

You want chainfire to be a strong part of this game, punishing accuracy for firing more than one weapon at once.

Dude... we are talking about people here, and not the most logic type either. We aren't computers. Unrealistic expectations are a thing. They may not have knew that PVP meant a completely different ball game than single player games, but they saw MechWarrior and thought fondly on their BattleTech and old MechWarrior single player games (maybe they never played multiplayer MW3 and MW4) and thought this would be the same. You are also taking on a whole other array of PVP game damning opinions. Many old BT and MW fans want lights to be useless when it comes to combat, for example.

[Hotthedd]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 10:07 AM, said:

Group fire... no, old MechWarrior games did not make group firing easy. There wasn't a nice easy system of specifying what weapons were tied to which group, and there were no 4-button mice to manage all of those groups. It was fire, or alpha strike.

Alpha strikes ARE a part of group fire, it just has every weapon in one group. And having them be perfectly precise was due to limitations of the game.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 10:07 AM, said:

You want chainfire to be a strong part of this game, punishing accuracy for firing more than one weapon at once.

Yes. I want there to be more than one viable way of playing the game, and for the game to try to remain true to the BT universe. What is wrong with that?

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 10:07 AM, said:

Dude... we are talking about people here, and not the most logic type either. We aren't computers. Unrealistic expectations are a thing. They may not have knew that PVP meant a completely different ball game than single player games, but they saw MechWarrior and thought fondly on their BattleTech and old MechWarrior single player games (maybe they never played multiplayer MW3 and MW4) and thought this would be the same. You are also taking on a whole other array of PVP game damning opinions. Many old BT and MW fans want lights to be useless when it comes to combat, for example.

Dude, we are talking about adults who have the ability to read. Who downloads a game that they have not bothered to find out anything about?

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Hotthedd, on 12 August 2016 - 10:24 AM, said:

Dude, we are talking about adults who have the ability to read. Who downloads a game that they have not bothered to find out anything about?

Because they have said ability, does not mean they use said ability.

[Deathlike]

Saint Scarlett Johan, on 12 August 2016 - 10:36 AM, said:

Because they have said ability, does not mean they use said ability.

Whaaa? Things are not what that seem? NOOOOOOOOO WAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII!!!!!!!!!!!!11111111!!

[Gas Guzzler]

Hotthedd, on 12 August 2016 - 10:24 AM, said:

Alpha strikes ARE a part of group fire, it just has every weapon in one group. And having them be perfectly precise was due to limitations of the game.

Yes. I want there to be more than one viable way of playing the game, and for the game to try to remain true to the BT universe. What is wrong with that?

Dude, we are talking about adults who have the ability to read. Who downloads a game that they have not bothered to find out anything about?

Alpha strike key was back slash. Spacebar fires one weapon at a time. Navigate through selecting the next weapon to fire with the arrow keys. Simple rudimentary controls, no specific firing groups, etc.

There are multiple ways to play the game... Not all of them will ever be viable. STD 400 Small Laser boating Charger will never be viable in MechWarrior, for example.

I can't believe you are arguing this. People read patch notes and news announcements to this day, and construe incorrect information from them all the time. You are vastly over exaggerating the attention to detail of the populous. People make decisions by feel all the time. I'm not saying they didn't know that it was a PVP game, I'm saying they didn't actually think out what that meant in terms of how the game plays. There is no way that people buying into this game had any idea what playing the game would feel like. They saw a new MechWarrior game and hopped into it. No MechWarrior fan would pass up giving the game a try, regardless of knowing that it is a PVP game and there won't be a storyline. But after while they realize, hmm this game is missing something, or they realize they aren't getting gratification out of it, because frankly, PVP is too hard. And it is. You can play through the campaign in almost any game and then get to PVP and get absolutely rolled. Not faulting anyone, some people just don't have the reflexes and coordination to do real time PVP shooter games. That said, this game is actually pretty benign when it comes to reflexes and hand-eye coordination. The thought process and positioning is extremely important, but some people can't be bothered to take the time to think things out and would rather not have to (like in Singleplayer... Nav Point Alpha, Nav Point Beta, Proceed to dustoff site for extraction). Its a different experience. One may KNOW that it is a PVP only game, without actually thinking about all the side effects of that fact.

[Y E O N N E]

Hotthedd, on 12 August 2016 - 09:55 AM, said:

It can be changed, but change for the sake of change is a bad idea. There is no reason to change the BT universe to suit this game, other than to try to appeal to players who like other games better.

Is it change for the sake of change, though? I think it isn't. It is change because the original is non-viable as both a story and a game.

Quote

You are welcome to hold the opinion that the core play in MW:O is good. My opinion is that it is too arcade like, and much less than the sim it was sold to be.

Making us fire one weapon at a time is not very sim-like. Sim implies a certain level of realism, and if we're going there then realistically, the engineers of the world would be developing 'Mechs (accepting that 'Mechs will be a thing) that can punch through other 'Mechs in as little time as possible...meaning either group fire or supremely effective single weapons.

What makes MWO un sim-like is the fact that physics is ignored more often than it is simulated.

[Hotthedd]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 11:10 AM, said:

Alpha strike key was back slash. Spacebar fires one weapon at a time. Navigate through selecting the next weapon to fire with the arrow keys. Simple rudimentary controls, no specific firing groups, etc.

Right. And in TT, alpha striking just meant firing all of your weapons over 10 seconds, and in the BT universe, alpha striking was firing all of your weapons at once, knowing that the damage would be all over the place, and some weapons would not hit at all. The video games couldn't approximate that, so they dumbed it down.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 11:10 AM, said:

There are multiple ways to play the game... Not all of them will ever be viable. STD 400 Small Laser boating Charger will never be viable in MechWarrior, for example.

Straw man.
Saying that a Std 400 charger with small lasers isn't viable does not mean that chain fired weapons shouldn't.

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 11:10 AM, said:

I can't believe you are arguing this. People read patch notes and news announcements to this day, and construe incorrect information from them all the time. You are vastly over exaggerating the attention to detail of the populous. People make decisions by feel all the time.

...so PGI should cater to this crowd?

Gas Guzzler, on 12 August 2016 - 11:10 AM, said:

I'm not saying they didn't know that it was a PVP game, I'm saying they didn't actually think out what that meant in terms of how the game plays. There is no way that people buying into this game had any idea what playing the game would feel like. They saw a new MechWarrior game and hopped into it. No MechWarrior fan would pass up giving the game a try, regardless of knowing that it is a PVP game and there won't be a storyline. But after while they realize, hmm this game is missing something, or they realize they aren't getting gratification out of it, because frankly, PVP is too hard. And it is. You can play through the campaign in almost any game and then get to PVP and get absolutely rolled. Not faulting anyone, some people just don't have the reflexes and coordination to do real time PVP shooter games. That said, this game is actually pretty benign when it comes to reflexes and hand-eye coordination. The thought process and positioning is extremely important, but some people can't be bothered to take the time to think things out and would rather not have to (like in Singleplayer... Nav Point Alpha, Nav Point Beta, Proceed to dustoff site for extraction). Its a different experience. One may KNOW that it is a PVP only game, without actually thinking about all the side effects of that fact.

You asserted that most of the BT fans that originally backed MW:O, but have since left, left because they didn't research the game and expected something different.
That is simply hard to believe. It would make more sense to say they left because they DID research the game, and got something different than was sold to them.