423 replies to this topic

[Mister Bob Dobalina]

Javin, on 01 December 2016 - 06:06 PM, said:

IS Lights might be viable again if they were reduced in size. I do not think I should be towering over mediums and some heavies in my lights.

I get the volumetric argument by a strictly physical standpoint. But it stlll feels kinda stupid to look down to a catapult sitting in a Wolfhound or Panther. The frontfacing silouette is the main influence on how "targetable" I am. Panther and Wolfhound gained around 20-25% height. Less cover = more vulnerability. My numbers dropped about the same amount as the height got up. I played hundreds of games in my 5xMPL WLF-1B and now I can't get near enough fast enough to do real damage. Size DOES matter :-)

Edited by Thomster, 02 December 2016 - 05:43 AM.

[Karl Streiger]

the problem is that volumetric scaling doesn't seem to be used.
Considering the size of the Locust when compared with the Cicade (i might be wrong but it almost looked like that the Cicada is twice as big as the Locust:

And volume vs area don't scale proportional

here a quick n dirty sketch: 20m³ vs 40m³ (with the same density 20t vs 40t)


or when you want a shell analogy, a 150mm (Super Heavy AC20 shell) has half the volume of a 185mm (Chem Set AC20)

Edited by Karl Streiger, 02 December 2016 - 02:30 AM.

[DivBy0]

Do you really exspect the PGI will undone the Rescale-Nerf?
Since the Rescale-Nerf most IS-Lights are complete crap in QP and in CW (thanks to the Clan-Only SSRM 4 and SSRM 6) nearly complete gone. Only LCT-PB, the ECM-Spider, the Oxide and the ECM-Raven have sometime some little use as a fill up in the Drop Deck or in the Group Queue.

So... If you want to play Light Mechs and not be a liability for your team then go for the (not really rescalenerfed!) SPL-Cheetah, the (nerfed but still usefull) Jumping-SRM4-Clan-Oxide or the underscaled (and so buffed) LCT-PB. To have fun you can play the the effective (and rescalebuffed) Purifier ECM-Cute-Fox (ML + MG seems to work out). Forget the rest. IMHO

[Mister Bob Dobalina]

von Haudegen, on 02 December 2016 - 02:55 AM, said:

Do you really exspect the PGI will undone the Rescale-Nerf?
Since the Rescale-Nerf most IS-Lights are complete crap in QP and in CW (thanks to the Clan-Only SSRM 4 and SSRM 6) nearly complete gone. Only LCT-PB, the ECM-Spider, the Oxide and the ECM-Raven have sometime some little use as a fill up in the Drop Deck or in the Group Queue.
...

We don't and they won't. Little concered they are going to size up the Locust because people think it's OP. I stopped using the 5MPL Wolfhound altogether. Running the Pirates Bane and a 4MG/LPL Spider mainly, rather rarely the ECM Raven (1 ERPPC, 2xMPL).

von Haudegen, on 02 December 2016 - 02:55 AM, said:

...
So... If you want to play Light Mechs and not be a liability for your team then go for the (not really rescalenerfed!) SPL-Cheetah, the (nerfed but still usefull) Jumping-SRM4-Clan-Oxide or the underscaled (and so buffed) LCT-PB. To have fun you can play the the effective (and rescalebuffed) Purifier ECM-Cute-Fox (ML + MG seems to work out). Forget the rest. IMHO

Funny how your Clan (4) vs IS (1) ratio is pretty much representative for the Clan dominance in CW/FP ;-)

[Blind Baku]

Raven didn't get hit too hard and the 4x is still pretty legit, depending on what you want to do.

That aside... I used to run panthers all the time, now I'm stuck with only the 10K being worth trying to use, all others are too big ESPECIALLY when you have 3+ weapons in the arm.

Half tempted to get a Firestarter though (because um I dunno, it did get hurt in the rescale). And I just mastered the Mist Lynx which is good fun. I hear the Commando isn't total garbage because rescale wasn't too hard on it.

[DAEDALOS513]

Blind Baku, on 02 December 2016 - 06:20 AM, said:

Half tempted to get a Firestarter though (because um I dunno, it did get hurt in the rescale). And I just mastered the Mist Lynx which is good fun. I hear the Commando isn't total garbage because rescale wasn't too hard on it.

Firestarter is trash.. it has the movement quirks of a medium.. zero fun. Same with Jenner... only oxide is decent.
Commando, spider, lct, ach, rvn, urbie (need skill for this mech), are worth buying still.. even wlf isn't too too bad only cuz it's tanky.. which sorta makes up for it's huge size.

[Leopardo]

I really want get back the spider size!!!!

[Blind Baku]

DAEDALOS513, on 02 December 2016 - 07:19 AM, said:

Firestarter is trash.. it has the movement quirks of a medium.. zero fun. Same with Jenner... only oxide is decent.
Commando, spider, lct, ach, rvn, urbie (need skill for this mech), are worth buying still.. even wlf isn't too too bad only cuz it's tanky.. which sorta makes up for it's huge size.

Yeah, probably going to hold out for the Assassin @ CBills. But watched a guy having some fun in the Firestarter made me wonder about it.

LORD knows I have enough other mechs to work through, I don't need to pick up another light just yet.

[DAEDALOS513]

Blind Baku, on 02 December 2016 - 02:01 PM, said:

But watched a guy having some fun in the Firestarter made me wonder about it.

Might be ok in a tier 3 or 4 drop..

[SlightlyMobileTurret]

As someone that LOVED the firestarter pre-rescale (no quirks and all), I wanted to jump off a cliff when I tried it after.

It's....barely playable, but it's far worse than a spider or a cheetah.

[DAEDALOS513]

Keshav Murali, on 02 December 2016 - 03:44 PM, said:

As someone that LOVED the firestarter pre-rescale (no quirks and all), I wanted to jump off a cliff when I tried it after.

It's....barely playable, but it's far worse than a spider or a cheetah.

Spider is amazing.

[Wraith 1]

I don't think anyone's realistically expecting PGI to re-rescale lights. It'd be a lot of work for minimal payoff, and it would also be admitting that our glorious balance overlords made a mistake.

I'm really wishing right now that they hadn't taken such a hard stance against all the superhuge quirks. Yes, they were sorta broken, but some mechs need sorta broken stuff like 30% energy range/heat gen to be even somewhat worthwhile.

*Glances at my SDR-5V rusting out in mechbay #15*

[DivBy0]

And I fear the humanoid Assassin (I know.. not a light but 40 tons) will be the next useless tall giant mech like the Phoenix Hawk.
After the event and leaderboard he will be buried in the hangar :-( like the PHX
The Rescale was for the greater part a faliure. I can´t see the logic behind many of the changes.
I see it more as an another great IS-Nerf than what ever PGI try to archive

Edited by von Haudegen, 02 December 2016 - 06:36 PM.

[Karl Streiger]

von Haudegen, on 02 December 2016 - 06:10 PM, said:

And I fear the humanoid Assassin (I know.. not a light but 40 tons) will be the next useless tall giant mech like the Phoenix Hawk.
After the event and leaderboard he will be buried in the hangar :-( like the PHX
The Rescale was for the greater part a faliure. I can´t see the logic behind many of the changes.
I see it more as an another great IS-Nerf than what ever PGI try to archive

was it a IS - NERF? Maybe not
was it a failure - for sure.
A change don't have to be realistic, it need to meet the needs of the game.

[Genesis23]

This rescaling is mostly a joke. To cripple the least played weightclass even more is plain stupid. i didnt know about this rescale for a few weeks (but noticed i cant go benath the ramps of HPG Manifold as easily as before) and now that ive seen it in detail its just ridiclous. its obvious that PGI wants to convert us to clantech, or at least wants the light Players to do so.

compaire the spider and the arctic cheetah: yes, they share the same Tonnage but the difference in firepower is giantic, where the mobility is just a bit better on a Spider. the structure quirks help a bit, but dont Change the fact that the Spider and other IS lights just lost every right to be played, especially since backstabbing is way more dangerous because of the mobility quirks of the higher weight classes.

how the hell should i justify choosing a SDR over an ACH? apart from being my first and favorite mech?

[SlightlyMobileTurret]

Genesis23, on 15 December 2016 - 01:20 AM, said:

This rescaling is mostly a joke. To cripple the least played weightclass even more is plain stupid. i didnt know about this rescale for a few weeks (but noticed i cant go benath the ramps of HPG Manifold as easily as before) and now that ive seen it in detail its just ridiclous. its obvious that PGI wants to convert us to clantech, or at least wants the light Players to do so.

compaire the spider and the arctic cheetah: yes, they share the same Tonnage but the difference in firepower is giantic, where the mobility is just a bit better on a Spider. the structure quirks help a bit, but dont Change the fact that the Spider and other IS lights just lost every right to be played, especially since backstabbing is way more dangerous because of the mobility quirks of the higher weight classes.

how the hell should i justify choosing a SDR over an ACH? apart from being my first and favorite mech?

How long were you gone, good sir? Nearly six months gone after rescale, and we tried very hard to flood the forums with salt. (check out "IS light rescales" thread)

But PGI will probably not fix this. I hope otherwise, but it looks bleak.

[DivBy0]

Yes, the Rescale was are great failure and PGI loves to make great mistakes and don´t fix it for a long time or even never (MiniMap, Long Tom, Kodiak 3 .........)
Forget the lights!

[Blind Baku]

von Haudegen, on 15 December 2016 - 03:08 AM, said:

...Forget the lights!

Edited by Blind Baku, 15 December 2016 - 07:05 AM.

[Drunk Canuck]

This rescale was quite possibly the worst way to balance light Mech's in the history of the game. There is no forgiveness for playing them now, one mistake and you can consider yourself dead because they can't take damage, their agility has been reduced and they are easier to hit.

[DivBy0]

As Clan you can bring the Artic Cheeter, the Jenner IIC and maybe the purifier.
As IS you better bring no lights at all. They are not worth their weight and only fill up. IMHO

Edited by von Haudegen, 20 December 2016 - 04:44 AM.