869 replies to this topic

[Stormbringer13]

you know what else may actually help? more info about Faction Play in the game.

When you are on the quick play end, the only thing you get is a warning that Faction PLay may be too intense and difficult for the casual player. That you need tons of experience in order to appreciate it.
Then, most players probably either ignore that warning, or just don't read it- because nobody really reads warnings or suggestions in this day and age anyway- and they try it once. They PUG it up on a quick drop on a planet, because that is how they play on the other side. They build a drop deck from the lame mechs suggested, and proceed to have no idea what the hell to do or what is going on.
Generators, turrets and cannons? what are those. I'm just going to go solo like I do in Quickplay because I'm an awesome pilot in my mind. I get 2 or 3 kills a match.....

and then they get soundly beat down, many times being the reason their team gets beat because of poor mechs and a numbers disadvantage. Then they get no rewards for it, and told they have to get their *** kicked 9 more times to win anything. And straight back to Quickplay they go.


Hell, I read about it first, checked forums, bing and google. Honestly, what I encountered was different than what the game described.
I was under the assumption that every player got 15 MC if their unit held a planet.
I was also under the assumption form descriptions in your interface that each faction would limit the types of mechs you could drop with. Yes IS and Clan are understandable, but your description makes it sound like there are House and Factions limits as well, and taking certain planets would expand those options.

[quantaca]

to all the people wanting to put limiters on unit size ... we actually need to get people joining units not leaving them, CW/FP is a lot more fun when doing it as a group, and to reliably have a decent sized group you need a whole lot of players, just look at the tournament and how many teams have forfeited already, with just 12 people its really hard to get 8 together on a day for 30 minutes even with the added benefit of rescheduling and sharing agenda's and that is with people who knew that they where going to have to dedicate a lot of time to it,

now if you are talking randomly logging in and having people to play with ... at mercstar we've learned that it takes about 100 ACTIVE people in that timezone to be able to do this and (between 8 to 15 people wanting to play) and those numbers were at the hight of CW (not special events those always draw more people) now a lot of units battle this by saying that day between x and y hour we are going to play CW/FP, and i have to be honest if i didn't have that capability at that time with mercstar i would have left this game a looong time ago, like i'm actually doing atm, oh i still log in from time to time but even we as a big merc unit barely have players, and that just sucks the fun out of it.

now onto some thing constructive for CW/FP
i often read about people wanting to limit when other people can start playing FW/CW like no trail mechs or something like that...
but i actually believe that you shouldn't be allowed to play FW if you are not in a unit (and 1 man units should be excluded as well for obvious reasons), this I HOPE would push players into a unit and from there into actual teamplay, resulting in a better game experience for everyone with hopefully an end to 90% solo droppers and a shift to atleast 3-4 man size groups dropping, to me a player dropping in trials but sticking with his friends is of more value than a solo player with mastered mechs off on his own somewhere. (with the odd exception ofcourse).

also get rid of that ridiculous payment you have to make for inviting somebody into a unit. just to make my point, we (MS) used to accept everybody who was willing to learn the game (people would join and leave all the time), which obviously made for an overall lower skill level, sure you'd still fight a organized unit but they where not all tier 1 and 2 there where plenty of tier 4 and 5 mixed in with each group, now if you'd want to join MS you would either have to know someone or be invited based on skill lvl, and one usually follows the other, we still have some sort of training program with our MS-R unit but that effort is a lot lower than it used to be

[J0anna]

The thought that a game company would actually be doing ANYTHING to discourage people joining together and playing their game is absurd. Especially a game where people are supposed to join together. If PGI is so upset at MS (or any large group) ruining their "end game" content, then perhaps they should change their end game content such that large groups can't impact it that much.

Faction Warfare needs to be significantly more lucrative than Quick Play, the rewards need to be much better due to the time invested, and levels need to get much higher than 20...

[JaxRiot]

Johnny Z, on 27 July 2016 - 01:36 AM, said:

Worthless. This above statement is about as accurate as anyones guess as to how many alts have replied here.

I always forget about Alts. And ya, they can easily skew or alter a suggestion thread.

Hunka Junk, on 27 July 2016 - 01:39 AM, said:

Worthless because you think presenting all the commentary here as a qualitative data set is bad or because you think no one will listen anyway?

Ignore the above (you added to your previous message while I was writing this one).

While it's possible that alts might skew the data, how many alts can one person have? Up to now, do you think someone who dislikes the long tom got on this thread, wrote bad things about it, and then logged onto one or more other accounts to post the same thing again and again? Moreover, this would be a far greater concern if this had been a survey sent to each player account or handled in some other way like a poll.

I acknowledge your concern, but I still see worth in the original proposition.

To be fair, one person could easily have 2 accounts that could seem legit, and possibly a 3rd fluffy account that would act as a newish player.

But now take 3 or 4 people from (as an example) the same Unit trying to push an agenda, and suddenly there are what appears to be 12 people in agreement.

They could easily landslide a thread.

Edited by JaxRiot, 27 July 2016 - 10:00 AM.

[JaxRiot]

quantaca, on 27 July 2016 - 09:40 AM, said:

to all the people wanting to put limiters on unit size ... we actually need to get people joining units not leaving them, CW/FP is a lot more fun when doing it as a group, and to reliably have a decent sized group you need a whole lot of players, just look at the tournament and how many teams have forfeited already, with just 12 people its really hard to get 8 together on a day for 30 minutes even with the added benefit of rescheduling and sharing agenda's and that is with people who knew that they where going to have to dedicate a lot of time to it,

now if you are talking randomly logging in and having people to play with ... at mercstar we've learned that it takes about 100 ACTIVE people in that timezone to be able to do this and (between 8 to 15 people wanting to play) and those numbers were at the hight of CW (not special events those always draw more people) now a lot of units battle this by saying that day between x and y hour we are going to play CW/FP, and i have to be honest if i didn't have that capability at that time with mercstar i would have left this game a looong time ago, like i'm actually doing atm, oh i still log in from time to time but even we as a big merc unit barely have players, and that just sucks the fun out of it.

Ok, so the problem with mega Units, and especially mega Merc Units is that the population (currently anyway) can not support them.

Their size and ability to switch sides en mass just magnify the problems that FP already has and contributes to its own demise.

Whenever those mega Merc Units jump to Clan (or IS) when a Mech Pack comes out, their sheer numbers cause population imbalance, longer wait times, more ghost drops, more pug stomps, and the ability to take planets because of sheer lopsided numbers.

All of those problems listed above have been major complaining points for a long time, and mega units contribute to them.

This makes the opposition not want to play. Why bother? They dont stand a chance anyway. So it drives them away and FPs population is decreased.

So then, the mega Units start dying off too. They log in and try to play the game but have a hard time getting matches.

Why? Because such a hefty chunk of the already limited population is already in their ranks. So they slowly stop playing too, and the active population decreases even more.

So what ends up happening is what you have now. Mega Units having to have hundreds of members just to have enough people interested FP to keep dropping as a Unit, and they have to Keep mass recruiting to replace the ones that keep dying off.

They become a Black Hole. Trying to suck up as many players as they can just to even exist, but in doing so, they suck up much of the potential opposition.

Mega Units, and especially Mega Merc Units are just slowly killing themselves.

Edited by JaxRiot, 27 July 2016 - 10:43 AM.

[AngelusDD]

what some people dont seem to understand:

large units have the same problems as small units => they hardly have enough players active in FP at a certain time. (only exception are special FP events)

i am in a unit with just under 200 players, and only a few times i see a company dropping into FP. not to mention several consecutive drops. with the current state of LT, and the problems with scouting, especially IS units have immense problems motivating enough players to drop in FP.
does anyone really think a 200-man unit has 200 players playing FP all the time?

large units also have other things to do.
they engage in leagues like MRBC or BWO, or training for other formats like 1vs1, 4vs4 etc as used in several small scale tournaments. that means, a certain part of the online time, quite some people train in the lobby.
(there is a reason why many units engage in league play instead of FP or QP => it is much more interesting!)

also large units don´t "suck up" players. i guess most have hardly any recruits at all. since most units look for a certain skill and manners, typically units select recruits quite rigorously.
also don´t underestimate the number of members just leaving (usually by stopping play MWO)

what is a fun fact (or rather a sad fact), playing FP against a 12 pug drop is so disappointing, that there are even strategies to let the 12 pug group win, just to NOT Drive them away from MWO.
does anyone really think large units want to drop against 12 pug-groups? the Match maker and the overall FP strategic gameplay forces us to do so! we have literally fingers crossed to get a 12 premade group!

if people here want to criticize large units, they should drop with large units and get their facts straight.
most units take non-unit folks along.
just join their ts, and ask! you can learn a lot about the reality of a large unit

Edited by AngelusDD, 27 July 2016 - 12:06 PM.

[Khalcruth]

Maybe I've missed something, but I have not been able to find the information anywhere. Have they announced yet the participants in the Round Table? As far as I can tell, it's about 29 hours away, and that's still up in the air. It's hard to take the whole thing very seriously when even that detail hasn't been taken care of yet.

[Dlor]

I'm a solo player, and my issue with faction play is the fact that it takes 10 minutes or more to usually get into a match. Now if my team sucks and we get stomped, that takes usually around 15 minutes of game time. I then proceed to get 0 rewards except for what I get for getting stomped in 4 different mechs. Now instead, I could play 2-4 quick matches in this time and get the same if not greater rewards. Currently there is almost zero incentive for me as a solo player to go play in FW and join up in a drop that only needs a few more players. This is why people don't join FW, the reward to time investment is less then that of just quickmatch play. Also in FW if you team is getting wrecked, it will usually keep getting wrecked (with very little chance to bring the game back) where as in quickmatch you can just go on to join a new match and hopefully have a more equal game.

[AphexTwin11]

AngelusDD, on 27 July 2016 - 11:57 AM, said:

what is a fun fact (or rather a sad fact), playing FP against a 12 pug drop is so disappointing, that there are even strategies to let the 12 pug group win, just to NOT Drive them away from MWO.

LMAO that's a first. Step 1. Log into Teamspeak with 12 Unit players ready to go, Step 2. purposefully let the enemy team win to "keep players in MWO", Step 3. Profit!!!!

Edited by AphexTwin11, 27 July 2016 - 12:39 PM.

[Biclor Moban]

JaxRiot, on 27 July 2016 - 10:00 AM, said:

I always forget about Alts. And ya, they can easily skew or alter a suggestion thread.



To be fair, one person could easily have 2 accounts that could seem legit, and possibly a 3rd fluffy account that would act as a newish player.

But now take 3 or 4 people from (as an example) the same Unit trying to push an agenda, and suddenly there are what appears to be 12 people in agreement.

They could easily landslide a thread.

Do we assume ALTs only exist on one side of any argument? Your statement is only true if one side of the argument is denied ALTs and the other is not. Besides PGI knows who has ALTs and can remove them. I assume a statistician can solve for noise as well.

I guess I should have directed this towards JohnnyZ as well since his original criticism was what sparked my response. All data has worth even if it's data you don't like. If half those comments where alts there are still 4 times the number of Anti Long Tom people as other solutions.

Edited by Biclor Moban, 27 July 2016 - 01:26 PM.

[AngelusDD]

"deleted"

Edited by AngelusDD, 27 July 2016 - 01:24 PM.

[Oldbob10025]

WHEN WILL LORE BE IN FACTION WARFARE?
SO far there is no reason any planet should be called anything but Planet 1 planet 2 etc.. There is no reason to defend or attack a planet.

Why engage in FW if only the big units get all the MC for holding a planet and none of the pugs or smaller units that helped get NOTHING!!!

Just some thoughts I will make more on a special youtube video later on...

Oldbob10025

[cazidin]

AnTi90d, on 27 July 2016 - 03:59 AM, said:

In the poll that I created..

http://mwomercs.com/...ce-your-opinion

62.4% (229 players) voted to have Long John Thomas removed entirely.
37.6% (138 players) voted to keep Tommy Boy, but have him nerfed.

(If you read the thread, though, almost all of the pro-Tom people were Jade Falcon gobblers..)

The Long Tom should NOT be removed. If PGI has many, many ways to fix it while keeping it a powerful and useful weapon against the enemy forces. A majority of players want the Long Tom removed as it is and their hatred was generated from a CW event.

[Eiswolf]

Attention wall of text

This text should only be a food for thought

No tactical depth

The maps are very one-sided. Therefore, the tactical depth is more like a puddle as an ocean of possibilities. The tactical depth in QuickPlay Group Drops is considerably higher than in Factionplay.

The Invasion mode is boring. Out of every planet is an orbital cannon with an orbital cannon is ineffective and expensive anyway. The planet has a rotation, why it makes even more sense to install and operate orbital cannons on moons. (Orbital cannons only on maps similar settings of HPG Manifold which provides logic and humor)

No mixing of Mechs drop deck. There are Lightrushes still possible and Assault turrets in Counterattack for the Defender.
Both are legitimate tactics although demolish the game immensely. Lightrushes, because you fought very well and still lose. Assault turret tactics, because you can never get the kill lead when the opponent is in perfect position.

Both are BORING and produces FRUSTRATION by long games.


Possible solution

Spoiler

The victory conditions should be linked to points which the teams can accumulate during the game. The team with the most points wins at the end of the game. A game lasts 30 minutes. Respawn, Ticket System without drop decks. (For details see item strategic depth)

Maps and mission design with multiple destinations. Higher Time to Kill (perhaps a doubling of armor and structure only in FP?) So you can develop tactical depth and generate exciting games.

There should be several possible targets for maps. The maps should be more like the huge maps in QuickPlay such as Polar, Forest, et. al.

There should be only one primary goal:

The primary objectives (which happen randomly in every match) could be Conquer and hold a position (land zone for reinforcement? As a conclusion a video sequence with unions vessels landing in this zone)
A specific number of zones is distributed randomly on the map and must be defended or conquered. As long as the campaign lasts, the opponent team has the chance to conquer the areas back again.

Search and Destroy.
A number of bases is distributed on the map. These look different and are secured with turrets. The attacker must search and destroy or conquer. The defender must defend the bases or get them back. If a base is destroyed, whether by the defenders or attackers there is a point penalty and ticket loss.

Escape.
A team needs to survive (less tickets) for 15 minutes unless seinforcements are coming
The other team must hunt. If the reinforcements arrive you gain tickets and the hunters have to survive the next 15 minutes.

There are many more options but that would result in a thread burst.

There should be at least 2 up to 4 Secondary objectives on the maps.

Secondary goals might include:

Destroy the generator for the turrets of the base X.
Capture the field repair unit
Find the Satellite Tower and conquer it
Secure landing zone X (new spawn point for the conquered.)

Etc.

The number of tertiary goals is irrelevant.

Tertiary objectives could be:
Destroy 12 medium.
Kill 12 heavies.
Keep bridge XY for 1 minute.
Capture the resource point A

All fulfilled mission objectives give points.

In total there are 1000 Poiunts. These 1000 points are all in possesion of the the team that has the defense.
Whenever a secondary objective is fulfilled for example, the defending team loses 100 points and the attacker gets 100 points. When the defenders gain control of the objective again, the defender is getting his 100 points back and the attacker loses 100 points, etc.

Additionally, when the owner destroys a base by fault it could lose 50 points for example.

Clear the mapcycle. Each sector receives a random map.

No more drop decks.

Each player should drop with only one Mech. But with Respawn. There is a ticket system similar to the system from the group queue and a tonnage restriction within the group.
Both must be flexible (for details under strategic depth)

Strategic depth

There is no strategic depth. One does not necessarily feel to have influence to what happens on the galactic map. Although the Vote System is a nice approach but in this sense totally useless.

Possible solution

Spoiler

The planets are no longer divided into sectors but on a map similar to the tabletop game "Risiko" represented by territories. Each unit gets a Loyal home planet as a base.

This base is used to produce regiments or galaxies. A home planet can not be attacked (a bit further away from the border)
These regiments have influence on the tickets and the available group tonnage.
Production for regiments costs C-Bills or MC and are tonnage staggered. The production must be staggered days way. There are following galaxies or regiments L, M, H, A.

L costs as 30 million C-bills or 500 MC
M cost as 60 million C-bills or 1000 MC
H costs as 90 million C-bills or 1500 MC
A cost example 120 million C-bills or 2000 MC

L give 1000 Tickets
M give 1500 Tickets
H give 2000 Tickets
A give 2500 tickets

in addition there is a tonnage limitation in the group

L of 300 to 400 tons
M from 350 to 500 tons
H 400-600 tons
A of 450 to 650 tons

Production times should be:

L = 2 days
M = 4 days
H = 6 days
A = 7 days

During an attack the following classes use the following number of tickets:
L = 4 tickets
M = 6 Tickets
H = 8 tickets
A = 10 Tickets

No matter where the regiments are produced they take a week through its own territory and one week each through the territory of another faction (only neutral and friendly possible)

On the target planet units can deploy its regiments and place them on the sectors.
If an attack takes place the MM chooses randomly the regiment for the attacker and the defender.

A maximum of 4 regiments can be stationed on one sector.
The units need to win an action that lasts one day where the units try to buy the sector, in order to get a sector.

A sector gives C-Bills. The more regiments of the unit are stationed the higher the C-Bills yield.

Each sector basically has a M and H Regiment as militia. However, this disappears as soon as a regiment of possessive Unit is stationed in this sector. If there is no regiment stationed within a month, the militia is cleared and the sector is defenseless and easy to conquer.

Attack on enemy planets

Each unit can start scout missions. However, only with L and M regiments. (more about this can be read under the item scout missions) The Scout missions can travel instantly within 60 LJ of the planet on which the scout regiments are stationed.

Impact of successful Scouting:
Size of the deployed regiments on the planet.
In which sector which regiments
Is the Planet target of reinforcements (enemy regiments go to the planet?)
Possibly a ticket reduction
Which units are on the planet.

Each unit has a maximum of 4 dropships (group size in the queue in FP)
The attack is carried out without delay within the 60 LJ with a maximum of 8 regiments. However, only 4 regiments may be determined that attack one sector. The other 4 regiments remain around the planet in orbit as reinforcement. If a sector is successfully conquered they must remain in the sector with at least 2 regiments. The rest must attack other sectors. The waiting in orbit can move up and there can be more regiments fetched of planets within the 60 LJ. Until there is a maximum of 8 regiments in orbit again. Reinforcement is only possible if less than 4 regiments are in a sector and only until it contains 4 full regiments again.

Damaged regiments (tickets not used)

Each regiment has more than enough tickets. For a fight only 1/4 of the tickets are used. So even regiments which have not full strength can be withdrawn to recover or continue their attack.
It is important, when a damaged regiment is pulled back and is set to rest, it cant be moved for one week, except for an attack on the sector where the regiment is stationed. In this case the regiment has to choose the next friendly planet for resting or stay in the defense.

Purpose of conquering a planet

If a Planet was successfully conquered or defended, all involved units get a single payment on account of their services and activity.

The formula should consider all UNITs no matter how large, so an average value is calculated, and the reward calculated to this average value.
e.g. matchscore of all players of a Unit tallied by carried Drops.

The unit with stationed regiments gains MCs and/or CBills per sector they are holding. The sectors are divided based on the performance formula among participating Units (as described above).


Each loyal unit may drop on each planet with faction owned regiments on it. However, the pilots of the Unit which has stationed regiments is preferred by the MM.

Mercenary:
Mercenaries are hired like now but no treaty can be made when the fraction got more than 2% of the population of the smallest fraction.

Mercenaries can be hired within a fraction by Units and obtain thereby the same advantage as units players when droping with regiments of the Unit.

But mercenaries have also regiments with a maximum 8 regiments which they can buy and a maximum of 4 dropships.
Damaged regiments must be repaired by C-Bills or MC (staggered price due to corruption of regiments and the tonnage limits)
Through unit orders mercenaries can get C-bills and MC, paid by the unit (negotiating with the Mercenary Unit InGame via interface)

The orders can be selected by following:
Attack on xy xy and z conquer sector
Defense of Planet xy with b regiments

Length of the contract and any bonus if successful.

Salvage? (Reduction of repair costs to a maximum of 90%)

Dropships:
Maximum 4 queues per Unit, no matter how big the unit is and there is no subsequent purchasing of dropships.
Moving Unit of regiments / hired mercenary with Unit Contract
then foreign Unit (Group Intern) / mercenary without Unit Contract

Call to Arms (Freelancer)
Can be triggered by units or mercenarys to fill their own drops with freelancers.

Comprehensive faction alliances

All Units of an friendly faction can build alliances and drop for the Allies. In attack and defense. They can drop only with regiments of the allied unit!
However, it should be a list indicating which units are searching allies. Contact via ingame mailing or chatting or interface as the contracts of mercenaries.

Retain the vote system to make diplomacy with factions

The following should be selected:
Union - Alliances are possible.
Peace- Neutral no attack only Scouting
Ceasefire- for a limited period no attacks are possible, scouting possible
War - attack at any time

When a faction selects ceasefire when in war, the other faction can agree or decline during the next vote.


There is many more to make the game more strategic and diverse...

However, this text should be only one food for thought, and not a complete concept. I get no money for it: D: D: D

No atmosphere

Each planet got a naturally unified heaven and a solar system has only one sun which should have the same color. I'm concerned that they are binaries or Trinärsterne or how whatever ...
But it really destroys the atmosphere when a fight is going on and the temperature and sky is changing match to match.

Each planet has a population info like, Water Surface, Gravity, Temperature
As this information has no impact on the fight ...

Possible solution

Spoiler

Each planet receives according to his description, a mapset.
A hot planet with little population should have a mapset similar or tourmaline Teratherma or Caustic Vally.
A planet with a high population but which is cold, should have more city maps such as River City just snowy.
A planet with moderate population but normal Temeperatur should have maps which seem rather Agriculture or reminiscent industry planets.

Each planet should get a unique skybox or should have several skyboxes are then assigned to the planet.

The influence of gravity on weapons and Mech (range of motion.)

New players against veterans

This destroys FP! New players leave Factionplay when they shlaugtert one attackphase by veterans, premades and tier1 players. They will never come back or they will go for long time befor the come back to Factionplay

Possible solution

Spoiler

FP only unlock after Cadet Bonus + FP tutorial.

Large Units dominate FP and time zones

Possible solution

Spoiler

Maximum 4 Dropships per Unit no matter how large, no purchse possible.

No effect on profit or loss of the planet

Possible solution

Spoiler

No idea. Ye yourselves because sometimes think of something: D: D: D

Factionplay population unbalanced.

Possible solution

Spoiler

Use data how many loyalists units there.
Confirm blank. All other released from the contract.
Offer loyalist treaty only dan when a fraction less population than other groups. addictive Best time zones. I mean, in Europe there are loyalists lot Steiner. In the US, no. In Europe, there are few or no previous Davion loyalists in the US already. Therefore, in prime time in Europe offer loyalists contract with Davion Offer and in primetime USA loyalists contract Steiner. Until there is a balancing.

In addition still query where the large part of the Unit members come and take the prime time for loyalist contracts from this time zone.

Mercenaries can within one month stay in a group then has to be changed. Exchange only possible to understaffed fractions! turn make timezones Depending contracts.

Scout Mode the goodies and Long Tom the planet and Queue Killer.

The Scout can use only one Skirmisch 4.0 ... scouting With this mode has nothing to do.
The Longtom is a planet and Queue Killer.

Possible solution

Spoiler

All scouting goodies delete!

The Scout mode would have if the proposal of the Strategic gameplay depth is implemented a major asset but not serious game immersion Schei Dent (as the Longtom)

The mode should be more like scouting.
Large Maps alá Forest, Polar, etc.
Several intelligence targets (random spawns on the map)
The spotter must as scan of the base for a longer time.

Meaning Target Lock. In Lock keep for about a minute or two. The least 300 m to the target zoom. There are several objectives for scanning on the map.

The defense must take place waypoints or Find reconnaissance. The defender gets the intelligence targets shown on the map.

The rewards should be calculated:

Scan per target por% 1 point
Launch of the Enlightenment by the defender (+10 points)
Launch the defense by the Enlightenment (+5 points)
Reconnaissance in Lock the defense (-10 points for the reconnaissance. The next 10 points are deducted only after 2 minutes.)
Defenders in the lock of the Enlightenment (+10 points for the reconnaissance. The next 10 points are added after 2 minutes.)

Per taken waypoint shutdown of ECM for both sides for one minute.

Defenders damage done Normal calculation + 50%
Reconnaissance damage done Normal calculation -50%
Escape of the Recons 1 = + 15% points = 2 + 20% points 3 = 45% points 4 = 60% points.
The points are displayed and the higher the difference of reconnaissance to defending the higher detection rate.
It is cleared only one sector.

Calculation detection rate

if all 4 reconnaissance escape, they get + 60% of all accumulated points. The defender has e.g. 100 points that have as reconnaissance 90 points scored but 60% to 90 points well written that is 90 + 54 = 44 points difference.
Thus, they have 44 points for this sector. Totaly the spotter can e.g. collect 1000 points per sector.
The higher the score the more is brought in experience.

0-250 points = Unit Name in the sector
251-400 points = number of regiments
401-600 Puntke = tonnage and Drop Limit
601-750 points = gain in orbit?

Etc. Etc.


Scanning

The scan runs as long as one has the object in target lock. 100% mindestes 1-2 minutes.
If you stand quietly so the scan will run faster one moves as the scan runs slower.
If one is getting shot it stops the scan.

No difference between Inner Sphere and Clan.

Possible solution

Spoiler

introduce Clan honor system.
The sectors are not bought in the clan, it is therefore necessary to bid,who can occupie the sctor.
e.g. Unit A and Unit B both want the adjacent sector.
Unit A has 3x A galaxy
Unit B has 1xA Galaxy 2x H Galaxy
Unit A below provides 2x H galaxies
Unit B matches.

To make the bidding mor interesting, you could display the strength of the galaxys in tickets.

Unit A may occupy the sector with 2xH galaxies or fewer, lighter galaxies. However, this sector will be blocked for 2 weeks and it allowed for two weeks no further regiments there are erected. In case of an attack the defender may draw on the final bid back and refill the galaxies. However, that's consistent with a loss of honor.
A withdrawal of Clan galaxies is always associated with a loss of honor.

The higher the honor the more tickets (only for this sector), there is a bonus in case of attack. With loss of honor the tickets will be recalculated and deleted for this sector.

Possession test(of a sector)

Bidding a sector or galaxy or planet between the clan factions and units.

introduce Vote system for the ownership test of planets among the clan factions.
Attackers must offer = same strength or less than defenders

Insert the other communities tests.
No idea how. But since then are you sure of something.

Houses differences.

Possible solution

Spoiler

Housemechs cost less tickets
Neutral and allied housemechs cost normally.
Enemy housemechs cost more tickets.

Ticket System see tactical depth.

SLDF / iLKeshik

Possible solution

Spoiler

Let fraction Cross groups (IS and Clan Intern course)
These groups can only defend on the Clan border.

No marketing

Possible solution

Spoiler

No advertising no players no money.
Unfortunately, this issue concerns not only FP but MWO total.
It needs more advertising on various gaming sites, PC magazines and possibly made in TV.

NO BT ambience.

Possible solution

Spoiler

Perform fictitious News in MWO. in which attacks and their results are reported in a BT manner.

Let the defenders of planets start of Hanger and not jump to the Dropship or leave to start of Union Drops chips in the hangar and they go out of these ships.
More ambience can not hurt.

The last point.

Look at other games with Clan Wars. As these have been styled and get inspiration. Buy scenario and campaign books and get inspiration for missions and objectives.
Read the novels and get your inspiration there.

There would be many more points that interfere or could change. However, there is not enough space here. I hope my points and my explanations could give some ideas and food for thought.

Leveraging the capabilities of the Battletech universe. It offers so much and it is not even 1% for used for MWO ... Mechs, weapons system and the names of the factions are not all about it rotates at BT.

Edited by Eiswolf, 27 July 2016 - 01:50 PM.

[Johnny Z]

Eiswolf, on 27 July 2016 - 01:45 PM, said:

Attention wall of text

This text should only be a food for thought

No tactical depth

The maps are very one-sided. Therefore, the tactical depth is more like a puddle as an ocean of possibilities. The tactical depth in QuickPlay Group Drops is considerably higher than in Factionplay.

The Invasion mode is boring. Out of every planet is an orbital cannon with an orbital cannon is ineffective and expensive anyway. The planet has a rotation, why it makes even more sense to install and operate orbital cannons on moons. (Orbital cannons only on maps similar settings of HPG Manifold which provides logic and humor)

No mixing of Mechs drop deck. There are Lightrushes still possible and Assault turrets in Counterattack for the Defender.
Both are legitimate tactics although demolish the game immensely. Lightrushes, because you fought very well and still lose. Assault turret tactics, because you can never get the kill lead when the opponent is in perfect position.

Both are BORING and produces FRUSTRATION by long games.


Possible solution

Spoiler

The victory conditions should be linked to points which the teams can accumulate during the game. The team with the most points wins at the end of the game. A game lasts 30 minutes. Respawn, Ticket System without drop decks. (For details see item strategic depth)

Maps and mission design with multiple destinations. Higher Time to Kill (perhaps a doubling of armor and structure only in FP?) So you can develop tactical depth and generate exciting games.

There should be several possible targets for maps. The maps should be more like the huge maps in QuickPlay such as Polar, Forest, et. al.

There should be only one primary goal:

The primary objectives (which happen randomly in every match) could be Conquer and hold a position (land zone for reinforcement? As a conclusion a video sequence with unions vessels landing in this zone)
A specific number of zones is distributed randomly on the map and must be defended or conquered. As long as the campaign lasts, the opponent team has the chance to conquer the areas back again.

Search and Destroy.
A number of bases is distributed on the map. These look different and are secured with turrets. The attacker must search and destroy or conquer. The defender must defend the bases or get them back. If a base is destroyed, whether by the defenders or attackers there is a point penalty and ticket loss.

Escape.
A team needs to survive (less tickets) for 15 minutes unless seinforcements are coming
The other team must hunt. If the reinforcements arrive you gain tickets and the hunters have to survive the next 15 minutes.

There are many more options but that would result in a thread burst.

There should be at least 2 up to 4 Secondary objectives on the maps.

Secondary goals might include:

Destroy the generator for the turrets of the base X.
Capture the field repair unit
Find the Satellite Tower and conquer it
Secure landing zone X (new spawn point for the conquered.)

Etc.

The number of tertiary goals is irrelevant.

Tertiary objectives could be:
Destroy 12 medium.
Kill 12 heavies.
Keep bridge XY for 1 minute.
Capture the resource point A

All fulfilled mission objectives give points.

In total there are 1000 Poiunts. These 1000 points are all in possesion of the the team that has the defense.
Whenever a secondary objective is fulfilled for example, the defending team loses 100 points and the attacker gets 100 points. When the defenders gain control of the objective again, the defender is getting his 100 points back and the attacker loses 100 points, etc.

Additionally, when the owner destroys a base by fault it could lose 50 points for example.

Clear the mapcycle. Each sector receives a random map.

No more drop decks.

Each player should drop with only one Mech. But with Respawn. There is a ticket system similar to the system from the group queue and a tonnage restriction within the group.
Both must be flexible (for details under strategic depth)

Strategic depth

There is no strategic depth. One does not necessarily feel to have influence to what happens on the galactic map. Although the Vote System is a nice approach but in this sense totally useless.

Possible solution

Spoiler

The planets are no longer divided into sectors but on a map similar to the tabletop game "Risiko" represented by territories. Each unit gets a Loyal home planet as a base.

This base is used to produce regiments or galaxies. A home planet can not be attacked (a bit further away from the border)
These regiments have influence on the tickets and the available group tonnage.
Production for regiments costs C-Bills or MC and are tonnage staggered. The production must be staggered days way. There are following galaxies or regiments L, M, H, A.

L costs as 30 million C-bills or 500 MC
M cost as 60 million C-bills or 1000 MC
H costs as 90 million C-bills or 1500 MC
A cost example 120 million C-bills or 2000 MC

L give 1000 Tickets
M give 1500 Tickets
H give 2000 Tickets
A give 2500 tickets

in addition there is a tonnage limitation in the group

L of 300 to 400 tons
M from 350 to 500 tons
H 400-600 tons
A of 450 to 650 tons

Production times should be:

L = 2 days
M = 4 days
H = 6 days
A = 7 days

During an attack the following classes use the following number of tickets:
L = 4 tickets
M = 6 Tickets
H = 8 tickets
A = 10 Tickets

No matter where the regiments are produced they take a week through its own territory and one week each through the territory of another faction (only neutral and friendly possible)

On the target planet units can deploy its regiments and place them on the sectors.
If an attack takes place the MM chooses randomly the regiment for the attacker and the defender.

A maximum of 4 regiments can be stationed on one sector.
The units need to win an action that lasts one day where the units try to buy the sector, in order to get a sector.

A sector gives C-Bills. The more regiments of the unit are stationed the higher the C-Bills yield.

Each sector basically has a M and H Regiment as militia. However, this disappears as soon as a regiment of possessive Unit is stationed in this sector. If there is no regiment stationed within a month, the militia is cleared and the sector is defenseless and easy to conquer.

Attack on enemy planets

Each unit can start scout missions. However, only with L and M regiments. (more about this can be read under the item scout missions) The Scout missions can travel instantly within 60 LJ of the planet on which the scout regiments are stationed.

Impact of successful Scouting:
Size of the deployed regiments on the planet.
In which sector which regiments
Is the Planet target of reinforcements (enemy regiments go to the planet?)
Possibly a ticket reduction
Which units are on the planet.

Each unit has a maximum of 4 dropships (group size in the queue in FP)
The attack is carried out without delay within the 60 LJ with a maximum of 8 regiments. However, only 4 regiments may be determined that attack one sector. The other 4 regiments remain around the planet in orbit as reinforcement. If a sector is successfully conquered they must remain in the sector with at least 2 regiments. The rest must attack other sectors. The waiting in orbit can move up and there can be more regiments fetched of planets within the 60 LJ. Until there is a maximum of 8 regiments in orbit again. Reinforcement is only possible if less than 4 regiments are in a sector and only until it contains 4 full regiments again.

Damaged regiments (tickets not used)

Each regiment has more than enough tickets. For a fight only 1/4 of the tickets are used. So even regiments which have not full strength can be withdrawn to recover or continue their attack.
It is important, when a damaged regiment is pulled back and is set to rest, it cant be moved for one week, except for an attack on the sector where the regiment is stationed. In this case the regiment has to choose the next friendly planet for resting or stay in the defense.

Purpose of conquering a planet

If a Planet was successfully conquered or defended, all involved units get a single payment on account of their services and activity.

The formula should consider all UNITs no matter how large, so an average value is calculated, and the reward calculated to this average value.
e.g. matchscore of all players of a Unit tallied by carried Drops.

The unit with stationed regiments gains MCs and/or CBills per sector they are holding. The sectors are divided based on the performance formula among participating Units (as described above).


Each loyal unit may drop on each planet with faction owned regiments on it. However, the pilots of the Unit which has stationed regiments is preferred by the MM.

Mercenary:
Mercenaries are hired like now but no treaty can be made when the fraction got more than 2% of the population of the smallest fraction.

Mercenaries can be hired within a fraction by Units and obtain thereby the same advantage as units players when droping with regiments of the Unit.

But mercenaries have also regiments with a maximum 8 regiments which they can buy and a maximum of 4 dropships.
Damaged regiments must be repaired by C-Bills or MC (staggered price due to corruption of regiments and the tonnage limits)
Through unit orders mercenaries can get C-bills and MC, paid by the unit (negotiating with the Mercenary Unit InGame via interface)

The orders can be selected by following:
Attack on xy xy and z conquer sector
Defense of Planet xy with b regiments

Length of the contract and any bonus if successful.

Salvage? (Reduction of repair costs to a maximum of 90%)

Dropships:
Maximum 4 queues per Unit, no matter how big the unit is and there is no subsequent purchasing of dropships.
Moving Unit of regiments / hired mercenary with Unit Contract
then foreign Unit (Group Intern) / mercenary without Unit Contract

Call to Arms (Freelancer)
Can be triggered by units or mercenarys to fill their own drops with freelancers.

Comprehensive faction alliances

All Units of an friendly faction can build alliances and drop for the Allies. In attack and defense. They can drop only with regiments of the allied unit!
However, it should be a list indicating which units are searching allies. Contact via ingame mailing or chatting or interface as the contracts of mercenaries.

Retain the vote system to make diplomacy with factions

The following should be selected:
Union - Alliances are possible.
Peace- Neutral no attack only Scouting
Ceasefire- for a limited period no attacks are possible, scouting possible
War - attack at any time

When a faction selects ceasefire when in war, the other faction can agree or decline during the next vote.


There is many more to make the game more strategic and diverse...

However, this text should be only one food for thought, and not a complete concept. I get no money for it: D: D: D

No atmosphere

Each planet got a naturally unified heaven and a solar system has only one sun which should have the same color. I'm concerned that they are binaries or Trinärsterne or how whatever ...
But it really destroys the atmosphere when a fight is going on and the temperature and sky is changing match to match.

Each planet has a population info like, Water Surface, Gravity, Temperature
As this information has no impact on the fight ...

Possible solution

Spoiler

Each planet receives according to his description, a mapset.
A hot planet with little population should have a mapset similar or tourmaline Teratherma or Caustic Vally.
A planet with a high population but which is cold, should have more city maps such as River City just snowy.
A planet with moderate population but normal Temeperatur should have maps which seem rather Agriculture or reminiscent industry planets.

Each planet should get a unique skybox or should have several skyboxes are then assigned to the planet.

The influence of gravity on weapons and Mech (range of motion.)

New players against veterans

This destroys FP! New players leave Factionplay when they shlaugtert one attackphase by veterans, premades and tier1 players. They will never come back or they will go for long time befor the come back to Factionplay

Possible solution

Spoiler

FP only unlock after Cadet Bonus + FP tutorial.

Large Units dominate FP and time zones

Possible solution

Spoiler

Maximum 4 Dropships per Unit no matter how large, no purchse possible.

No effect on profit or loss of the planet

Possible solution

Spoiler

No idea. Ye yourselves because sometimes think of something: D: D: D

Factionplay population unbalanced.

Possible solution

Spoiler

Use data how many loyalists units there.
Confirm blank. All other released from the contract.
Offer loyalist treaty only dan when a fraction less population than other groups. addictive Best time zones. I mean, in Europe there are loyalists lot Steiner. In the US, no. In Europe, there are few or no previous Davion loyalists in the US already. Therefore, in prime time in Europe offer loyalists contract with Davion Offer and in primetime USA loyalists contract Steiner. Until there is a balancing.

In addition still query where the large part of the Unit members come and take the prime time for loyalist contracts from this time zone.

Mercenaries can within one month stay in a group then has to be changed. Exchange only possible to understaffed fractions! turn make timezones Depending contracts.

Scout Mode the goodies and Long Tom the planet and Queue Killer.

The Scout can use only one Skirmisch 4.0 ... scouting With this mode has nothing to do.
The Longtom is a planet and Queue Killer.

Possible solution

Spoiler

All scouting goodies delete!

The Scout mode would have if the proposal of the Strategic gameplay depth is implemented a major asset but not serious game immersion Schei Dent (as the Longtom)

The mode should be more like scouting.
Large Maps alá Forest, Polar, etc.
Several intelligence targets (random spawns on the map)
The spotter must as scan of the base for a longer time.

Meaning Target Lock. In Lock keep for about a minute or two. The least 300 m to the target zoom. There are several objectives for scanning on the map.

The defense must take place waypoints or Find reconnaissance. The defender gets the intelligence targets shown on the map.

The rewards should be calculated:

Scan per target por% 1 point
Launch of the Enlightenment by the defender (+10 points)
Launch the defense by the Enlightenment (+5 points)
Reconnaissance in Lock the defense (-10 points for the reconnaissance. The next 10 points are deducted only after 2 minutes.)
Defenders in the lock of the Enlightenment (+10 points for the reconnaissance. The next 10 points are added after 2 minutes.)

Per taken waypoint shutdown of ECM for both sides for one minute.

Defenders damage done Normal calculation + 50%
Reconnaissance damage done Normal calculation -50%
Escape of the Recons 1 = + 15% points = 2 + 20% points 3 = 45% points 4 = 60% points.
The points are displayed and the higher the difference of reconnaissance to defending the higher detection rate.
It is cleared only one sector.

Calculation detection rate

if all 4 reconnaissance escape, they get + 60% of all accumulated points. The defender has e.g. 100 points that have as reconnaissance 90 points scored but 60% to 90 points well written that is 90 + 54 = 44 points difference.
Thus, they have 44 points for this sector. Totaly the spotter can e.g. collect 1000 points per sector.
The higher the score the more is brought in experience.

0-250 points = Unit Name in the sector
251-400 points = number of regiments
401-600 Puntke = tonnage and Drop Limit
601-750 points = gain in orbit?

Etc. Etc.


Scanning

The scan runs as long as one has the object in target lock. 100% mindestes 1-2 minutes.
If you stand quietly so the scan will run faster one moves as the scan runs slower.
If one is getting shot it stops the scan.

No difference between Inner Sphere and Clan.

Possible solution

Spoiler

introduce Clan honor system.
The sectors are not bought in the clan, it is therefore necessary to bid,who can occupie the sctor.
e.g. Unit A and Unit B both want the adjacent sector.
Unit A has 3x A galaxy
Unit B has 1xA Galaxy 2x H Galaxy
Unit A below provides 2x H galaxies
Unit B matches.

To make the bidding mor interesting, you could display the strength of the galaxys in tickets.

Unit A may occupy the sector with 2xH galaxies or fewer, lighter galaxies. However, this sector will be blocked for 2 weeks and it allowed for two weeks no further regiments there are erected. In case of an attack the defender may draw on the final bid back and refill the galaxies. However, that's consistent with a loss of honor.
A withdrawal of Clan galaxies is always associated with a loss of honor.

The higher the honor the more tickets (only for this sector), there is a bonus in case of attack. With loss of honor the tickets will be recalculated and deleted for this sector.

Possession test(of a sector)

Bidding a sector or galaxy or planet between the clan factions and units.

introduce Vote system for the ownership test of planets among the clan factions.
Attackers must offer = same strength or less than defenders

Insert the other communities tests.
No idea how. But since then are you sure of something.

Houses differences.

Possible solution

Spoiler

Housemechs cost less tickets
Neutral and allied housemechs cost normally.
Enemy housemechs cost more tickets.

Ticket System see tactical depth.

SLDF / iLKeshik

Possible solution

Spoiler

Let fraction Cross groups (IS and Clan Intern course)
These groups can only defend on the Clan border.

No marketing

Possible solution

Spoiler

No advertising no players no money.
Unfortunately, this issue concerns not only FP but MWO total.
It needs more advertising on various gaming sites, PC magazines and possibly made in TV.

NO BT ambience.

Possible solution

Spoiler

Perform fictitious News in MWO. in which attacks and their results are reported in a BT manner.

Let the defenders of planets start of Hanger and not jump to the Dropship or leave to start of Union Drops chips in the hangar and they go out of these ships.
More ambience can not hurt.

The last point.

Look at other games with Clan Wars. As these have been styled and get inspiration. Buy scenario and campaign books and get inspiration for missions and objectives.
Read the novels and get your inspiration there.

There would be many more points that interfere or could change. However, there is not enough space here. I hope my points and my explanations could give some ideas and food for thought.

Leveraging the capabilities of the Battletech universe. It offers so much and it is not even 1% for used for MWO ... Mechs, weapons system and the names of the factions are not all about it rotates at BT.

Nice. I would have given a like if I agreed with it all. Not that I didn't agree with some.

Edited by Johnny Z, 27 July 2016 - 01:59 PM.

[Johnny Z]

Drenath, on 27 July 2016 - 07:35 AM, said:

Get rid of the rigid drop size lobbies/queue times and go with a persistent open galaxy model. Something more like Planetside. Integrate a Faction option into the PUG/Solo queues that drop players near the faction action.

Yep. Units can get together and do their thing when they want and everyone else and units not doing anything can get into the game. Basically leaving current faction play match maker as is(current fp match maker is lobbies) and adding a match maker queue(like quick play).

I just realized how serious and how long they have been working on making faction play awesome. That's why there was mode selection for quick play before... so it could be used in the faction play queue. Select player faction only battles or battles with allies like Inner Sphere Vrs clan, etc.

The big question in this is Galactic war map logistics.

Edited by Johnny Z, 27 July 2016 - 02:29 PM.

[MovinTarget]

JaxRiot, on 27 July 2016 - 10:32 AM, said:

Ok, so the problem with mega Units, and especially mega Merc Units is that the population (currently anyway) can not support them.

Their size and ability to switch sides en mass just magnify the problems that FP already has and contributes to its own demise.

Whenever those mega Merc Units jump to Clan (or IS) when a Mech Pack comes out, their sheer numbers cause population imbalance, longer wait times, more ghost drops, more pug stomps, and the ability to take planets because of sheer lopsided numbers.

All of those problems listed above have been major complaining points for a long time, and mega units contribute to them.

This makes the opposition not want to play. Why bother? They dont stand a chance anyway. So it drives them away and FPs population is decreased.

So then, the mega Units start dying off too. They log in and try to play the game but have a hard time getting matches.

Why? Because such a hefty chunk of the already limited population is already in their ranks. So they slowly stop playing too, and the active population decreases even more.

So what ends up happening is what you have now. Mega Units having to have hundreds of members just to have enough people interested FP to keep dropping as a Unit, and they have to Keep mass recruiting to replace the ones that keep dying off.

They become a Black Hole. Trying to suck up as many players as they can just to even exist, but in doing so, they suck up much of the potential opposition.

Mega Units, and especially Mega Merc Units are just slowly killing themselves.

The problem is the perceived potential not the reality.

Does it happen that occasionally there is an influx? sure. But pinning the imbalance entirely on merc units silly and short sighted. PGI made a system that has attractive facet to mercs. If you take it away completely, you risk losing players that like playing this way.

JaxRiot, on 25 July 2016 - 09:43 AM, said:

Its my belief that Merc Units (not only the big ones) are a cancer on FP, There are far too many benefits for being a Merc over any of the other Careers with no downside. Plus, they dont even function at all like they do in Lore.

By the way referring to us as cancer and laying the blame at our feet with no apparent interest in our side... not very endearing...

I will offer this: Let units have "sub units" and these units are what drop in FP. Let sub units have caps (no more than 15-18). On top of that make it that no two sub units can drop in the same faction meaning the only way they could drop on the same planet is for defense. You could also for them to adhere to balancing requirements so that you couldn't have one subunit from each merc company would necessarily be able to go to the same faction unless its incredibly underpopulated.

I don't know if merc companies had subunits split up in lore, or even if they ever faced one another but that could be a way to balance things.

That way big units have no way to overwhelm, yet get to keep their players/identity under the umbrella of their main unit tag.

I'll keep coming up with ideas because I honestly want this to work and agree population stability would help, however, I cannot help but worry that heavy-handed concepts like unit caps will have negative consequences that should not be ignored..

[_Jefe_]

Count Zero 74, on 26 July 2016 - 01:47 PM, said:

So many people with so many opinions. looks like a lot of people care about CW. Why don't I see most of you on the battlefield?

Because when I waited for 45 minutes staring at the drop screen, you apparently didn't show up. Not that I would know, since there is absolutely no interaction possible on the drop screen.

They could at least let us conduct other business while we wait. Adjust our builds, shop for new stuff, buy skills, etc.... But once you select attack/defend, you are locked into a dull lobby, listening to soothing music while nothing happens.

There was once a Saturday Night Live sketch where Paul Simon was in the elevator to Hell with Jon Lovitz playing the devil. As Simon's songs played one after the other in Muzac form, he eventually asks when they're going to arrive, and is told he's already there. I am reminded of this sketch every time I try FP.

[sparkomech66]

Additional Thoughts,

For an imeadiate quick fix to wait times make the FP queue allow for variable size drop groups of 4v4 to 12 v 12 depending upon the number of players in the queue.

Everything else needs more depth and new game modes to make FP work.

[benben10]

I think Faction Play needs to attract more players.

My suggestion is to have some new kinds of rewards since new players are risking a lot of time for a small chance at winning. For Invasion mode (or a new +8 vs +8 mode) there should be intermediate objectives that give some significant reward and some kind of confirmation of how many of those objectives the team achieved at the end of drop screen.

There needs to be some small reward even if you team loses a match to create a sense of accomplishment. For a new player joining FP has i high chance of losing and feeling like a waste of time.

Another thing could also be to simply have more events to encourage people to try FP.