88 replies to this topic

[SPencil]

I only put it through testing grounds, haven't dropped with it yet but two RAC5s on my K2 seems like it could be a lot of fun. At least at the time, there didn't seem a feasible way to run two RAC5s with PPC; I also have zero reference about how much ammo I need, and when I have no clue I default to filling the legs and working from there (50% of the time, it works every time ) I'm getting the vibe from this thread that I can lose some ammo and have space for the PPC again.

The K2 build before was 2xAC5, 2xPPC, XL300, and some mixture of ammo and heatsinks. This thing already had no place in a brawl, but it's hilariously effective at mid-range peek, shoot'n'scoot tactics. My guess initial guess is that replacing the AC5s with RAC5s will reduce how much damage I can throw down range (my fire pattern of 'ppc', 'ppc', '2xAC5' won't work well anymore), but rapid ballistic fire stands a much better chance at making someone back off if / when they get close.

I have the feeling that losing 10 damage off the mid-range poke is a deal breaker, exceeding the utility compared to an improved point-defense to what is otherwise a fragile mech anyways. Either way, just like everything else we gotta shoot and get shot at to really test this stuff out

[Ruccus]

I just tried out dual RAC5s on a Bushwacker for three games and I personally think they're okay, though I find myself pigeonholed a bit into a heavy/assault mech suppressor role for the match. In my three games I did about 550 damage once and 650 twice, but I only got one kill. It seems good at making assists though, as in my two wins I got 21 assists. I also ran out of ammo near the end of two of the three matches (2 tons per RAC5) so I think I may have to budget 2 1/2 tons per RAC5.

I think using a 50-60 ton mech with dual RAC5s to harass and suppress heavier mechs so that your teammates are more free to pick targets makes it a useful (if limited) tool, and the Bushwacker seems a good platform for them because of its hardpoint placement and quirks so it's able to take a few hits from a heavier opponent and can stand in the open and play 'chicken' with a heavier mech for a few seconds. It's just when multiple mechs start targeting you where you have to retreat to cover before the RAC5's jams or weapon heat forces you to cover.

As an aside, if you have a couple unused missile hardpoints a pair of RL10s are a good compliment to the RAC5s in case they jam at the wrong time (though I may end up having to dump my two RL10s to add that extra ton of ammo).

[Red Shrike]

SPencil, on 19 July 2017 - 04:30 AM, said:

I also have zero reference about how much ammo I need

My Uziel has 300 rounds, which means I either die in battle or live long enough to run out of ammo. The build on Sarna dictates 3 tons of ammo (450 rounds), and I'm thinking 450 is the sweet spot.

[Natred]

Not enough ammo per ton to make it worth it in my opinion. It seems like a gatling gun, cool concept but not that useful. Found the inner sphere uac 20 to be much more useful. Its way to heavy for what it accomplishes. I think they missed the point. Its supposed to fire as soon as you hit the button and than gradually increase the firing speed. That was their original scope of the weapon.. guess they changed their minds?

Edited by Natred, 19 July 2017 - 05:31 AM.

[SPencil]

Red Shrike, on 19 July 2017 - 05:07 AM, said:

My Uziel has 300 rounds, which means I either die in battle or live long enough to run out of ammo. The build on Sarna dictates 3 tons of ammo (450 rounds), and I'm thinking 450 is the sweet spot.

Damn, because 3 tons of ammo is one ton too heavy to run PPC and keep the same engine size. XL280 in there now while I experimented, and I'm already at the lower end of how fast (69.8 km/h) and maneuverable I like my mechs. Two tons of ammo means PPC but risking the 90m deadzone in the late game. Definitely not a FW mech lol

Appreciate the input, ty

[Bersercker]

Btw, does anyone know if the ballistic cooldown quirks affect racs? Seems like it would make sense for them to increase the rate of fire but i wouldn't be surprised if they do nothing.

[HGAK47]

Not really used rac2`s much but RAC5`s seem to be quite a nice alternative option on the right mechs.

If you use them smartly, get them winding up before you poke so your ready to shoot fast they work pretty ok. Also ive found when using two of them il let one go cool once it gets about 50-75% of the way so that when the remaining one gets hot / jams, I can shoot with the second and swap over as needed.

They are a great supression weapon.

Bersercker, on 19 July 2017 - 02:04 PM, said:

Btw, does anyone know if the ballistic cooldown quirks affect racs? Seems like it would make sense for them to increase the rate of fire but i wouldn't be surprised if they do nothing.

Seems to do nothing right now.

[MarineErrant]

I've round the RAC5 to be pretty solid. I rebuilt one of my BSW with the following:
RAC5, 2 MRM 10, 2 medium pulse, 2 machine guns. It's been really fun. Wind up before going around corners, the noise and blast of the MRM's. You just hammer opponents.

I've taken a RFL and removed the 2 AC5 and replaced them with RAC2. The heat and face time kills it though.

[Gas Guzzler]

Khobai, on 18 July 2017 - 07:00 PM, said:

better than letting comp players balance the game

then wed only have 3 different weapons

Actually no, comp players would want all weapons to be balanced and have times when they shine.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Khobai, on 18 July 2017 - 07:05 PM, said:

yes. remember when PGI had all their secret meetings with top comp players on how to balance the game? remember how that turned out? lol... comp players arnt any better at balancing this game than potatos. because it turned out comp players had their own agendas for balancing. go figure.

When was this exactly? Pretty sure the only time this actually happened was in setting up quirks for IS mechs after Clans were released and even then they only helped rate mechs at the time, they didn't have input into what mechs got what quirks or anything like that.

[The6thMessenger]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 19 July 2017 - 03:06 PM, said:

When was this exactly? Pretty sure the only time this actually happened was in setting up quirks for IS mechs after Clans were released and even then they only helped rate mechs at the time, they didn't have input into what mechs got what quirks or anything like that.

Could we get back to RACs?

Here's a video from HPG Uplink.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 19 July 2017 - 04:09 PM.

[Unnatural Growth]

I'm enjoying the RAC 5's, but haven't tried the RAC 2's. I'm running a RAC 5 on my Urbie w/ 2 ER smalls. Purely a "fun" build, piloted by a potato (me). If I know I have a "shot" around a corner, I've been hitting the fire button to start the spin up as I round the corner. I do wish the spin up didn't progress the jam bar, as that seems counter intuitive. I also wish they didn't run so hot. But they are fun, and enemy mechs are quick to change course and duck into cover when you start fire hosing them with RAC shells.

I ran a couple of twin RAC 5 builds on the test server, Jager, Marauder, Hammer, K Crab, but haven't put one of those together on the live server yet. Keep hoping they'll buff the spin up and heat first.

[The6thMessenger]

OldOrgandonor, on 19 July 2017 - 04:18 PM, said:

I'm enjoying the RAC 5's, but haven't tried the RAC 2's. I'm running a RAC 5 on my Urbie w/ 2 ER smalls. Purely a "fun" build, piloted by a potato (me). If I know I have a "shot" around a corner, I've been hitting the fire button to start the spin up as I round the corner. I do wish the spin up didn't progress the jam bar, as that seems counter intuitive. I also wish they didn't run so hot. But they are fun, and enemy mechs are quick to change course and duck into cover when you start fire hosing them with RAC shells.

I ran a couple of twin RAC 5 builds on the test server, Jager, Marauder, Hammer, K Crab, but haven't put one of those together on the live server yet. Keep hoping they'll buff the spin up and heat first.

Yeah, RACs do run pretty hot, lol. Although you should go 2x ERMLs. But damn the RAC2 needs damage buff, and the RACs just need rework as a whole, even extra projectile speed. Cause the RACs are realistically weak against people who actually know how to play the game.

These are my go-to Urbie builds. Really cool cause I don't usually get the attention when i hang round my team upon pushes.

UM-R60L RAC2 Dakka - 4x ERML + RAC2 [600]
UM-R63 RAC5 Dakka - RAC5 [450] + 2x ERML

SPencil, on 19 July 2017 - 04:30 AM, said:

... I also have zero reference about how much ammo I need...

I made do with 3 tons of ammo for a single RAC5, it seems to be enough for the entire match, realistically there's also cover and jamming that hampers too much ammunition use. I already did around 550 damage once ammo was gone anyways, so it's kind of enough.

As for the RAC2, i'd give it only 1.5 tons, for the same duration of as the RAC5, since at 450 ammo and 8 RPS that seemed enough for me at the entire match. But realistically you're not gonna do good damage with just 1 RAC2, so focus on getting 2 RAC2 instead, and have 3 tons of ammo.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 19 July 2017 - 10:48 PM.

[East Indy]

I'm already seeing a little too much double RAC/5 cheese — especially with so many new weapons in the mix — for it not to raise an eyebrow.

[Nebuchadnezzar2]

My only problem with them is that we can only fire the for very limited of time due to either overheat or jam. I can live with even less damage, i accept it will not be a competitive weapon but at least it should sate our DAKKA need.
If it is up to me i will reduce the heat and remove jam, but firing over the threshold limit will directly damage the gun

[STEF_]

The6thMessenger, on 19 July 2017 - 03:19 PM, said:

Could we get back to RACs?

OK, here my 2 cents

I dropped only once with double rac5 phract(+3erml), hyper-pumped with armor (so I can expose and facetank) and I did 790 dmg. (only 1k tho..... 2 much spread....)

TBH, I feel rac5 better than in the PTS.

[Punk Oblivion]

So after spending all day playing various builds on various mechs, I keep coming back to RAC builds for some fun (And some good Cbill making) matches! I guess the only immediate change I would like to see is ghost heat on RAC2's moving up to 3.

Duel RAC 5's are always great. But I also feel like bringing a single RAC5 (Or a single RAC2) is almost useless...

Really I just want PGI to allow me to put two RAC5's and a RAC2 on my Ilya!

[The6thMessenger]

So far, the best RAC setup i tried was 2 RAC2, cause it's easier to land and have higher range -- range which makes staring a bit less dangerous, also lower spin-up time.

The RAC5 just had far too terrible velocity and spin-up. The RAC2 simply feels a lot better to shoot if only it had better damage.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 19 July 2017 - 10:42 PM.

[AppleseeN]

WHM-6R with TwinRAC's-5 are actually a midged assault mek. The problem with RAC users are that they try to grind from AC5 ranges forgetting that RAC's are mostly CQB weapon. TwinRAC's-5 in some 300-400 metres it's a flat pinpoint 150 damage to location litteraly ignoring any "heavy duty" quirks. Worstest off-meta I saw now was KGC-000 with 2xRAC5+2xHPPC... it just walk through 2 MK2C and Atlas contineously ripping them apart straight into the face.

So, please, remember cause it's MANDATORY - RACs ARE CQB WEAPON!

[The6thMessenger]

AppleseeN, on 20 July 2017 - 12:18 AM, said:

So, please, remember cause it's MANDATORY - RACs ARE CQB WEAPON!

I kinda noticed that with the Urbanmech and the RAC5. I started doing stable 450 damage once i employed it at 350 meters or so. The RAC2 could take 450 meters easy.

But then honestly, a long deathly stare at short-range is why it's so risky, that's why RAC should have been best employed at mid-range than short-range.