1579 replies to this topic

[Alreech]

After action report, first day of "ZMG!!! Solo Quickplay Apocalypse by Groups!!!"
I dropped first alone, later with friends as a 2 & 3 player group during european prime time (19.00 - 20.00 - 24.00 CET).
Didn't used up the full tonnage first as group (55 tons & 65 tons), went to (65/95/90) later (friend got a shine new Rifleman IIC to play, so the 65 tons havent been skilled much).

Pro:
Compared to Group Match Making before we get much faster a match.
We won some, we lost some.
We stomped, and getting stomped.
Most matches were close (11:10) or as excepted for those Map & Mechs (12 :6).
And it was fun.

But it's still quickplay.
Our Lance of Assault (Alpha) gets left behind on first drop on Tourmaline (Skirmish).
Charlie Lance run off, made quick contact with the enemy and got killed, Alpha Lance was NARCED by a cicada and LRMd to death in the middle of the map (have not met a NARC Scout in quickplay since 2014/16?).
That was the reason to get the Corsair with 4 AMS out of the hangar ;-)

Next drop on Tourmaline (Skirmish):
Got a Solo player to our Lance who was AFK the the match starts...
Told that via VOIP to the team, get a Kit Fox as support.
AFK Player joins, we team up via VOIP on a Grid, when moved in center.
Made a bad move with my assault & get killed, but the team won.

Last drop on Tourmaline (Conquest)
Got a solo player in a Daishi as Lance Member.
So i decided to take lance command and use the Menue to tell him that we move to Theta.
He stays away from Theta, walked around the big hole and goes solo up one of the hills and starts to sniping with 8 AC2.
We lost 10:11, he was last Mech standing with a positive K/D (2 kills, 0 death), so I think he is one of the "good players" with good stats who carrys the whole team.
Can't blame him, he even tried to capture on of the 5 enemy control points after the rest of the team was dead...

Most of the matches I got killed or survived (regardless of win/loss) depended on the Mech.
Did massive damage with a MRM 80 / 6 Heavy MG Mauler in River City and HPG network, got smoked up on Tourmaline & Canyon Network.

Conclusion and my Opinion:
For small groups it's a drastic improvement in waiting time.

Tonnage is still a problem:
as 3 player group we have to choose between using as much tonnage (250 tons) as possible and be slow.
Or to go below tonnage and go faster.
Yes, we could have used 3 Timber Wolfs - Mechs we all have fully skilled and in Meta builds - and played them, but thats the point if one of us wanted to play his new Mech?

Mech & Map selection:
Still the most important thing in win/loss.

Teamwork:
Good, may be more. VOIP Channel is still to big / extra Channel for Lance Leaders is missing.

IMHO:
possible Short term improvments:
Go for the 2 -4 Player Group Size in any mode, let Solo Players join to fill up.

Use small drop decks with 3 Mechs and 150 - 165 tons per player (Clan/IS):
That allows Mech selection for Map and removes tonnage balancing from the match maker.

The 2 respawns will also prevent an early "Game Over Reward" for players who get killed for scouting or supporting, improving team work ("Help him", instead of "Let him die") and information warfare ("don't scout don't die" vs "if you die, respawn with a bigger Mech")

Middle term:
Change single Team VOIP channel to one sub channels for each lance in the Team Channel, set it to "Talk to speak".
Use the Team Channel with "push to talk" for Lance Leaders only.
Lance Members must vote for a Leader at match start (done by server script?), lance leader gets Match score for succesfull orders (capture a Control Point x seconds after the order, ect...)

Long term Matchmaking:
4 vs 4
8 vs 8
12 vs 12
depending of number of groups in queue and groups "skill/stats" the match maker will move a group in one of those queues

Long term GUI changes:
Show Mechs speed in Score Screen at the Match start (so Lance Leaders know how fast their team mates are and consider that then giving orders).

Use the "Mech unknow" function from Faction play score board to reward scouting.
After first succesfull "Scouting" reward (getting target info) the Mechs Variant & Target Designation is shown, like A: MAD 5D.

Edited by Alreech, 29 April 2020 - 01:07 AM.

[Magic Pain Glove]

Anomalocaris, on 28 April 2020 - 11:52 PM, said:

Hope PGI listens to you.

I highly doubt it , nor do I think that pgi needs to listen to "me" . I don't think they will revert the changes even if the overwhelming majority of the comments are against the change. Because ultimately I believe that they think the game is bleeding players because of inability to play together and they are correct . However by compromising the solo queue match balance I do believe they are digging a deeper hole . From which I am not sure there will be a recovery. We had FP die , then GQ die and there is a decent chance this might finish off the solo queue . Once puggies get tired of being stomped and inability to have ANY counter to them,other than to happen to be on their team they will leave. Funnily enough even getting gud wont help in this case , it might help , but it clearly will not help enough .

I've seen it happen today already ... People rage quiting from matches when they see composition of the enemy team and conclude that their chances of winning are slim . The same way you see someone feed the enemy team in Faction play when they realize their chances of winning are slim and just want to get the match over with. If you witnessed this in FP well we now have that in regular queue as well.

Whether this was a good or a bad change will be easily determined in player counts after a 3 month period. For those who got what you wanted , I am happy for you . If you dont mind getting stomped in to the ground or matchmaker group dicerolls thats fine . Just convince the rest of the pugies in the same thing so the numbers stay the same . And people will happily farm you and you will be happily farmed and population will keep increasing . Because everyone will be happy.

[Andrzej Lechrenski]

99% percent of the comments against this experiment are the same 5 egos crying and trying to scare the pugs. Y'all have been farming them for years, and yet now you think they'll side with you just because you slap your man-salami on the table and say "I don't like change, and I'm going to abuse the hell out of this until I either break the game or they revert it." Sad.

[Sniper09121986]

Magic Pain Glove, on 29 April 2020 - 12:38 AM, said:

I've seen it happen today already ... People rage quiting from matches when they see composition of the enemy team and conclude that their chances of winning are slim . The same way you see someone feed the enemy team in Faction play when they realize their chances of winning are slim and just want to get the match over with. If you witnessed this in FP well we now have that in regular queue as well.

You have seen today what had been the case long ago before the solo and group queues were separated. That decision was made by the same people who have now decided to revert it. Repeating the same action in the hopes of getting a different result - you tell me what that means.

[Anomalocaris]

Andrzej Lechrenski, on 29 April 2020 - 12:45 AM, said:

99% percent of the comments against this experiment are the same 5 egos crying and trying to scare the pugs. Y'all have been farming them for years, and yet now you think they'll side with you just because you slap your man-salami on the table and say "I don't like change, and I'm going to abuse the hell out of this until I either break the game or they revert it." Sad.

Oh sod off. I'm not even playing because I only play solo and I have no desire to get rolled by a group of high skill players (like Magic Pain Glove did today when he dropped solo) or simply be along for the ride if they drop on my team. Solo queue is no longer solo queue so there is nothing left for me to play. Yeah, you took the one area of MWO I like to play in and made it like one of the areas I don't. No wait, you made it like one of the areas that no one was playing anymore. Why do you think it will be any different? Group queue died for a reason, and making solo like group and expecting it to go any differently is the very definition of insanity.

[Kamikaze Viking]

justcallme A S H, on 28 April 2020 - 09:49 PM, said:

Incorrect.

It has been +/- 2 since May 2018. It was not turned off, I tested it

just logged into a tier 4 alt account to test this and instantly dropped with tier 1 mates. So this may no longer be true. Even though paul had not stated it in his listed changes. the 'Blow off valves' seem open.

Edited by Kamikaze Viking, 29 April 2020 - 01:17 AM.

[General Solo]

Andrzej Lechrenski, on 29 April 2020 - 12:45 AM, said:

99% percent of the comments against this experiment are the same 5 egos crying and trying to scare the pugs. Y'all have been farming them for years, and yet now you think they'll side with you just because you slap your man-salami on the table and say "I don't like change, and I'm going to abuse the hell out of this until I either break the game or they revert it." Sad.

You will get your change
Ghost Town
Part IV (Faction, Group, Faction Again, Solo Queue)

[Sjorpha]

I thought it would be terrible but after playing last night with mj12 it was the opposite, a huge improvement over what I'm used to. The groups seemed to anchor the teams so there was less nascaring. It also felt less stompy than before.

Could just be luck though, we didn't really face any super strong groups I think.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

Kamikaze Viking, on 29 April 2020 - 01:16 AM, said:

just logged into a tier 4 alt account to test this and instantly dropped with tier 1 mates. So this may no longer be true. Even though paul had not stated it in his listed changes. the 'Blow off valves' seem open.

This is my impression as well, so far. Could use some official clarification on the matchmaking process.

Edited by Aidan Crenshaw, 29 April 2020 - 01:37 AM.

[Dee Eight]

Aidan Crenshaw, on 29 April 2020 - 01:37 AM, said:

This is my impression as well, so far. Could use some official clarification on the matchmaking process.

It depends who you get as the "group" and which team they are on.

[Aidan Crenshaw]

No, I'm talking about those players not in a group. We were dropping as a 3-man yesterday and where matched with pretty much a mixed bag of T1's I know and very fresh players. Still got no solid data, though.
But we definitely once had another 2-man-group along with our 3-man.

[Alreech]

Sniper09121986, on 29 April 2020 - 12:01 AM, said:

Will not stop alt accounts.

Generate Hardware Hash for each accout to find alt accounts.

[The Reaper Beckons]

Been back for a week from a 2 year hiatus. The nascar was annoying but I was having closer matches than I have the last 24 hours. Win or lose it just seems horribly one sided now.

*Edit*

If I can figure to how to upload an image I'll show you 6 assaults versus 2, or one match where one side had 3 and the other none. Golf clap PGI. Way to go *facepalm*.

Edited by The Reaper Beckons, 29 April 2020 - 02:37 AM.

[Paul Meyers DEST]

So weird matches.

[BALIander]

:thumbsup:
:thumbsup:
:thumbsup:

[Thorqemada]

Well, i am surprised to read this announcement bcs it inherently carries the risk of finishing the game off for good as it drives away Solo-Player who make up usually most of Playerbase albeit a mostly silent one part.

As i experienced combined Group-Solo-Queue- Play in the beginning of this game i can only imagine how horrible the experience must be for anyone not in a Group and as MWO has really next to no intuitive/convenient "Ingame Socializing Tool" it only can lead to the downfall of Soloplay thus in the end in a typical PGI move driving away another this time Major part of the Playerbase effectively killing the game off for good as there is eventually almost no playerbase left and in the end Wolves dont hunt Wolves but they migrate to where the Prey is.

Edited by Thorqemada, 29 April 2020 - 03:56 AM.

[Anomalocaris]

Alreech, on 29 April 2020 - 01:59 AM, said:

Generate Hardware Hash for each accout to find alt accounts.

Alt accounts are not illegal

Sniper09121986, on 29 April 2020 - 01:16 AM, said:

[Redacted]

clip no longer available....

[Bud Crue]

Observations from matches last night from a tier-3 player stuck in a tier-1 world:

We were sync dropping two 4-mans in an attempt to play each other as often as possible. I think we managed that three times. Most matches were frankly, awful. In two hours of play I got only four wins.

Yes, folks like the GOONs and their comrades were dominant in the matches we ended up playing against them, nothing unusual there. What stood out to me was that there seemed to be a lot of folks playing provocatively bad last night, to a degree and frequency far greater than normal. I assume the MM is now wide open, but even that I don't think accounts for it. The amount of squirrel chasing, idiots doing their own thing, multiple mechs just wandering off, folks seeming inability to shoot toward the enemy, firing and shutting down despite being WAY out of range, shot blocking, etc. was off the charts. Also, the wanna be heroes were frequent too; doing the whole, hang back until most of the team was dead thing, only to come lumbering in from across thee map, and in one instance...on polar...with medium pulse lasers impotently blazing.

So yeah the matches were bad, but not bad in the way I expected. While I had expected us to be absolutely demolished by the elites, I hadn't counted on being as frustrated as I was by so many people who were joining matches but who didn't seem to want to be playing (edit) the game.

Edited by Bud Crue, 29 April 2020 - 04:55 AM.

[Cletus the Fighting Fetus]

I'm just speaking for myself here as I am primarily a solo player but do occasionally play with friends. It is my perception (since I don't have access to the actual data) that this change has pros and cons.

Pros
1) I have the option of playing with friends and actually being in the same matches on the same team. In the recent past, if we went into the group queue, sometimes we couldn't get matches or had wait times in excess of 10 minutes.
2) This could mostly eliminate trying to 'sync drop' which often results in us being in seperate matches or in the same match but on opposite teams.


Cons
1) Some 'elite' players as others have called them, may group up and lay waste to less experienced solo and group players.
2) Some matches will, in part due to grouping, lead to very inexperienced players being in matches with very experienced players and may lead to them feeling frustrated. This could in turn lead to them being less interested in playing.

Additionally, one thing I thought this would improve but (in my perception) has not is wait times since both group and solo players are in the same queue now. This is improved compared to the group queue but hasn't seemed to improve wait times for solo players. Once again, I do not have the data so this is purely based on what I've experienced so far.

For those of us who have been around a while, we've seen how each and every change results in forum posts that contain whining, change hating, etc. I would just like to ask that people be more objective in their feedback. I realize that there are plenty of miserable people out there who like to spew their vitriol any place they can online but I would like to see more people posting like constructive adults rather than impudent children.

If I owned PGI, read and took to heart all the whiny commentary, I would likely turn MechWarrior into a PvE game that was moddable and sell that instead of dealing with all the griping...........oh wait........MW5.

[R Valentine]

From the "group" side of the change, everything seems ok... but not really. When I have my normal teammates on, or even just one or two of them, winning matches is almost a breeze. I can play more like I did in group queue or FP. Even as a duo, I saw other 4 man premades on my team and then I struggled to even find enemies to kill. Most things evaporated before I could engage. Lance placements make absolutely no sense now. We beat more than one other premade on Canyon who had annihilators spawn in alpha lance, where they start in the valley with no ramps in sight. Those poor schmucks never made it out of that valley. They were swarmed by mediums and lights before they ever had a chance to play.

From the "solo" side, everything sucks. LOL. I know there was a big hoo ha about "I'll get to do teamwork with the elites!", but having already played with the elites, I knew that wasn't going to be the case at all. They're more than happy to let you die so they can go on to win the match on their own. Premade teams are all in their own Discord and largely ignore VOIP if they even have it turned on. My contribution as a solo player was mostly erased in any match with a half decent premade. Either they went on to slaughter the enemy so quickly that I couldn't even get in damage, or I was the one being slaughtered quickly. Again, match quality was non-existent. So many 12-0 matches, when before a match had to be exceptionally bad to hit 12-0. My desire to play the game solo at all is pretty much zero. It's either group or get farmed. That kinda sucks.