142 replies to this topic

[ShiverMeRivets]

The up-to-4 men groups are fine in QP.
I say that as a solo player that was in a group exactly 1 time since I started playing. I often see groups of the same unit name on the opposing team and go “we are doomed”, but then we roll over them.
This is my tier 2 experience at least.

[MrMadguy]

You just don't understand, how MM works. PSR change was made to make MM more flexible. If group do well - it's rating rises. Therefore at some point groups would play with groups. If solo player plays badly against groups - his rating drops. Therefore at some point solo players will play against solo players. But if there are not enough solo/group players - they have to be mixed together. And in this case knowing their ratings is extremely important for proper team balancing. As always, if you see 3 Assaults vs 3 Lights, then may be this 3 Assaults are noobs and this 3 Lights are pro players.

P.S. Time to carry Tier 4 matches! The best quality of match and result within may be several years.

Edited by MrMadguy, 23 August 2020 - 01:35 AM.

[LordNothing]

there are 2 things killing this game

1. its age
2. a lot of mismanagement

[Willard Phule]

Welcome to Paul's newly designed "Quick Play." If you want to win, join a group. If you don't join a group, accept that you will be farmed. Just like Faction play, only quicker. And without the cool maps.

[Nesutizale]

Willard Phule, on 23 August 2020 - 01:42 PM, said:

Welcome to Paul's newly designed "Quick Play." If you want to win, join a group. If you don't join a group, accept that you will be farmed. Just like Faction play, only quicker. And without the cool maps.

That is simply not true. Groups can be good or bad. Sometimes you get a group of noobs, sometimes you get a group of the 1%. Most of the time you get a group that is around T3 and they don't have the impact everyone claims they have.

[Zirconium Kaze]

Bigbacon, on 16 July 2020 - 05:52 AM, said:

I like this game, been playing for years now but recombining the queues has absolutely killed the MM and the game is so lopsided now it isn't fun.

Soon as the other side has a group its game over almost always unless they are some kind of troll squad.

you need to either limit groups to 2 people OR limit group tonnage so that they can't all go in assaults and destroy the MMs chance at a decent game.

not that you care, because this game is dead to you.

Hasn't been my experience.

[Zirconium Kaze]

OneTeamPlayer, on 16 July 2020 - 05:59 AM, said:

Funny thing is that we were given the opportunity to vote on a complex algorithm that most people didn't understand when we "voted" on the PSR change, but we weren't given the opportunity to vote on whether or not Solo and Group queue should be merged, a change of which every gamer understands the ramifications.

Solo players didn't want the change, the best of group players didn't want the change, honest average group players didn't want the change.

Group players make up less than 10% of the population.

So obviously it was logical that we'd get this merge that most people said was a bad idea then deal with three months of the the worst MWO gameplay seen in ages for the benefit of <5% of the game most of whom hit the queue, saw themselves still losing to elite groups (instead of stomping on solo players like they expected) and left immediately leaving the rest of us to deal with the mess they championed.

I wanted the change.

OneTeamPlayer, on 16 July 2020 - 06:24 AM, said:

Agreed, and it's wild to see people claim group tonnage and weight balance are unconnected when we rarely saw slightly unbalanced matches before (more than 1 extra assault or light on a side) let alone the 9 assaults versus 2 foolishness Baradul saw in one of his videos and players are seeing every day now in solo queue.

Some of these changes are indefensible and have an obvious source, i just can't fathom what is gained by refusing to acknowledge the root of the issue?

I have been in winning matches where my team didn't even have a single assault. The issue is how people are playing.

[OneTeamPlayer]

I honestly don't care anymore.

Since i've firestarted my way down in rank and played a few T2 mixed matches with nary a T1 in sight the matches have been more enjoyable and the groups larger than 2 much less frequent.

Matches are taking place all over the map (okay, well maybe not all over) and instead of turning left in an unending circle.

I hear people on their mic trying new strategies and calling targets.

Should be T3 in a week or two and that's likely where i'll force placement for the forseeable future.

My mistake was the belief that higher tier = better play when in actuality higher tier just = different play priorities.

[Willard Phule]

Nesutizale, on 23 August 2020 - 02:12 PM, said:

That is simply not true. Groups can be good or bad. Sometimes you get a group of noobs, sometimes you get a group of the 1%. Most of the time you get a group that is around T3 and they don't have the impact everyone claims they have.

Explain to me how a T3 group can end up against a T1 group with Paul's +/- 1 tier thing.

Again, if winning is important to you, then join a group. If you only care about farming cbills and matchscore, then who cares?

[Nesutizale]

Very easy to explain..not enough people.

Also again...haveing a group isn't a garantie to win. Its a "more likely" to win but you can still either face better enemys overall or a better group on the other side.

[GARION26]

Willard Phule, on 24 August 2020 - 09:12 AM, said:

Explain to me how a T3 group can end up against a T1 group with Paul's +/- 1 tier thing.

Again, if winning is important to you, then join a group. If you only care about farming cbills and matchscore, then who cares?

To my understanding if the first player to 'seed' the drop is T2 then you can get anyone from Tier 1 to tier 3.
In any case the floodgates can open if the population is low so you could get all 5 tiers in a match.

[Willard Phule]

GARION26, on 24 August 2020 - 10:28 AM, said:

To my understanding if the first player to 'seed' the drop is T2 then you can get anyone from Tier 1 to tier 3.
In any case the floodgates can open if the population is low so you could get all 5 tiers in a match.

I've seen it. It's quite gratifying to be on the team with the T1 premade harvesting T4s and T5s on the other team. Granted, it sucks to be them, but since they're not in a premade group, who cares? They simply need to accept that they're there for no other reason but to provide targets for the premade players to shoot at. And there's nothing wrong with that. That's the entire concept that Faction Play was designed around.

[R Valentine]

Nesutizale, on 23 August 2020 - 02:12 PM, said:

That is simply not true. Groups can be good or bad. Sometimes you get a group of noobs, sometimes you get a group of the 1%. Most of the time you get a group that is around T3 and they don't have the impact everyone claims they have.

A bad group stacks the match just as much as a 1% group does. Only the team that's guaranteed to lose is the team with the group. Either way, the group determines the match outcome. That sucks.

[Nesutizale]

To my observation groups only have a heavy impact if they are completly stupid or of the 1% kind. For everything else its how the entire team plays vs how the enemy plays.

I would like people to prove with evidance that groups make that kind of impact over at least 50 games.
When the PSR change came I made a list about my W/L and PSR changes and while it feelt quite different I actualy was around a 1.0 W/L over 50 games but thought I would do much worse then before.

[Brauer]

Nesutizale, on 26 August 2020 - 09:05 AM, said:

To my observation groups only have a heavy impact if they are completly stupid or of the 1% kind. For everything else its how the entire team plays vs how the enemy plays.

I would like people to prove with evidance that groups make that kind of impact over at least 50 games.
When the PSR change came I made a list about my W/L and PSR changes and while it feelt quite different I actualy was around a 1.0 W/L over 50 games but thought I would do much worse then before.

A fair number of people were able to put up double digit WLRs. I tracked somewhere around 200 group drops and as I recall I was able to easily maintain a double digits WLR even when dropping with a group of mixed skill or mixed dedication to stacking wins.

[John Bronco]

All you have to do is sort the leaderboard by WLR to see the impact of groups. Numbers like that were simply not possible in old solo queue.

[Monkey Lover]

Brauer, on 26 August 2020 - 12:56 PM, said:

A fair number of people were able to put up double digit WLRs. I tracked somewhere around 200 group drops and as I recall I was able to easily maintain a double digits WLR even when dropping with a group of mixed skill or mixed dedication to stacking wins.

Lol then we must really suck, because i drop with a 3 or 4 group every time . My win ratio is only 1.26. Only people getting high win ratio I have seen are the 99.9% groups and maybe groups playing in off times where they don't fight tier1 players with other groups.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 26 August 2020 - 01:01 PM.

[CFC Conky]

Monkey Lover, on 26 August 2020 - 01:01 PM, said:

Lol then we must really suck, because i drop with a 3 or 4 group every time . My win ratio is only 1.26. Only people getting high win ratio I have seen are the 99.9% groups and maybe groups playing in off times where they don't fight tier1 players with other groups.

You should also look at the number of games played. Some of the high scorers haven't played all that many games this season. I've had good runs at the beginning of a season giving me high numbers but things would even out as the season wore on.

Some players have over 1600 games played this season. How the heck do you do that?

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

Edited by CFC Conky, 26 August 2020 - 01:17 PM.

[S t P a u l y]

ggclose

[Brauer]

CFC Conky, on 26 August 2020 - 01:17 PM, said:

You should also look at the number of games played. Some of the high scorers haven't played all that many games this season. I've had good runs at the beginning of a season giving me high numbers but things would even out as the season wore on.

Some players have over 1600 games played this season. How the heck do you do that?

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

While it is true that some people didn't play a ton and were able to protect higher WLRs we've always had that problem. In my case, I didn't play much from Season 46 to Season 48 because I played exclusively in groups during a couple of the merged queue seasons. Because we could put up a WLR over 10.00 over some 200 games the only difficulty in putting that WLR up over a longer period of time would be getting our group together often enough to farm the queue.

Even if the difference is that groups of competent players are able to put up WLRs of 3.00+ or 5.00+ consistently that is a pretty huge change in the nature of QP. In the past a QP WLR of over 3.00 over a significant number of games was a marker of an exceptional player, today that isn't even close to the truth.