80 replies to this topic

[Vonbach]

Yes I am well aware of the Battletech lore of ablative armor and its laughable.

[pattonesque]

Vonbach, on 22 June 2022 - 02:47 PM, said:

Yes I am well aware of the Battletech lore of ablative armor and its laughable.

As always, when the light shoots you with its horrid machine guns, just shoot it back

[Meep Meep]

Vonbach, on 22 June 2022 - 02:47 PM, said:

Yes I am well aware of the Battletech lore of ablative armor and its laughable.

If the mg mechanic is to wear down armor till it fails then even the lowly .50 cal can do that now.



Now imagine an array of 8 or 12 of them firing full auto at that tank at close range and I don't even think .50 cal are the BT lmg equivalent either.

Maybe the russian DSHK or KPV would be entry level BT lmg?

[pattonesque]

Meep Meep, on 22 June 2022 - 04:07 PM, said:

If the mg mechanic is to wear down armor till it fails then even the lowly .50 cal can do that now.



Now imagine an array of 8 or 12 of them firing full auto at that tank at close range and I don't even think .50 cal are the BT lmg equivalent either.

Maybe the russian DSHK or KPV would be entry level BT lmg?

yeah exactly like, it's not like you have a single M249 plinking at it, it's 12 half-ton machine guns chattering away

Here let's make it easier -- why don't we think of "machine guns" as like I dunno, "rapid-fire unobtanium mass drivers". Same mechanic but it doesn't violate the lore I've made up in my head canon

[Nightbird]

Lord Sevenous, on 22 June 2022 - 02:45 PM, said:

People this is Battletech logic...
A half ton MG (roughly the weight of an GAU-8) that can hurt armored ordinance is atleast more realistic than an AC 20 that has a max range shorter than 800m...

I explain it to myself as mechs having terrific reflexes, so that for slower large caliber projectiles, they will never hit past a certain distance because the mech will automatically dodge the shot. None of the weapons have such low max/optimal range, but rather the game's range system is simulating the mech's automatic defense at work.

Edited by Nightbird, 22 June 2022 - 05:04 PM.

[pattonesque]

Nightbird, on 22 June 2022 - 05:04 PM, said:

I explain it to myself as mechs having terrific reflexes, so that for slower large caliber projectiles, they will never hit past a certain distance because the mech will automatically dodge the shot. None of the weapons have such low max/optimal range, but rather the game's range system is simulating the mech's automatic defense at work.

IIRC every mech is running a crazy ECM system as part of their basic sensor package. the ECM we know and love is an upgrade on that but all mechs are good at scrambling enemy weapons systems to some degree

[Nightbird]

pattonesque, on 22 June 2022 - 05:21 PM, said:

IIRC every mech is running a crazy ECM system as part of their basic sensor package. the ECM we know and love is an upgrade on that but all mechs are good at scrambling enemy weapons systems to some degree

Yep, which is why mechs aren't just sniped from orbit with satellites.

[YueFei]

The appeals to "realism" ring hollow and hypocritical when the whole idea of Mech combat is ridiculous to begin with.

If you refuse to play the game because "MGs not realistic", then in fact if you want to be consistent and actually principled about it, you shouldn't have ever played the game at all in the first place, because Battletech Mechs aren't plausible as combat vehicles to begin with.

Nah, the truth is the whole schtick about "MGs not realistic" is merely an attempt to salve bruised egos, nothing more, nothing less.

Realism shouldn't enter into game balance arguments in a video game that features inherently unrealistic combat platforms. Game balance is game balance. If you have a problem with MGs in terms of game balance, make a cogent argument based on game balance, not on realism.

Edited by YueFei, 22 June 2022 - 09:52 PM.

[sosegado]

YueFei, on 22 June 2022 - 09:51 PM, said:

The appeals to "realism" ring hollow and hypocritical when the whole idea of Mech combat is ridiculous to begin with.

If you refuse to play the game because "MGs not realistic", then in fact if you want to be consistent and actually principled about it, you shouldn't have ever played the game at all in the first place, because Battletech Mechs aren't plausible as combat vehicles to begin with.

Nah, the truth is the whole schtick about "MGs not realistic" is merely an attempt to salve bruised egos, nothing more, nothing less.

Realism shouldn't enter into game balance arguments in a video game that features inherently unrealistic combat platforms. Game balance is game balance. If you have a problem with MGs in terms of game balance, make a cogent argument based on game balance, not on realism.

OMG! Somebody finally said it!

<Eats popcorn faster!>

Honey, will you pop me another bowl? This is gittin gud!!

[BWS2K]

Mist Lynx pilot here. If you can't shoot us, take seismic and use the buddy system. Call out when you here that tink-tink-tink - perhaps even consider shouting for your own Lights to come chase it away! Keep your position in mind at all times and don't get tunnel vision. MGs are really great but teamwork is OP.

#mistlynx4life

[LordNothing]

YueFei, on 22 June 2022 - 09:51 PM, said:

The appeals to "realism" ring hollow and hypocritical when the whole idea of Mech combat is ridiculous to begin with.

If you refuse to play the game because "MGs not realistic", then in fact if you want to be consistent and actually principled about it, you shouldn't have ever played the game at all in the first place, because Battletech Mechs aren't plausible as combat vehicles to begin with.

Nah, the truth is the whole schtick about "MGs not realistic" is merely an attempt to salve bruised egos, nothing more, nothing less.

Realism shouldn't enter into game balance arguments in a video game that features inherently unrealistic combat platforms. Game balance is game balance. If you have a problem with MGs in terms of game balance, make a cogent argument based on game balance, not on realism.

if a game tried to reflect the real life brutality of military combat, everything would be op and nobody would want to play it.

still waiting for instagib stock urbie arena though.

Edited by LordNothing, 23 June 2022 - 11:51 AM.

[caravann]

2 heavy machine gun + ammo bin = 3ton, 3dps

6 Light machine guns + ammo bin = 4ton, 5.5dps

5 chain fired small pulse lasers = 5ton, 4dps

4 heavy machineguns +ammo bin = 5 ton , 6dps

1 RAC2+ammo bin = 9 ton, 6dps

5 chain fired medium pulse lasers = 10 ton, 6dps

1 RAC5+ammo bin= 11 ton, 10 dps

Edited by caravann, 23 June 2022 - 09:17 PM.

[sosegado]

wait..wait..wait...

I got this..

I don't know why I didn't think of this sooner..

So I hope this idea doesn't get this thread moved to the 'Feature Suggestion'

Ok PGI the time has come, Whenever a mech is getting hit with machinegun fire you have to program Bitchin Betty to say one of the following...

"Warning incoming machinegun fire!"

Or..

"Shoot the Light!"

[LordNothing]

Stab Wound, on 23 June 2022 - 12:46 PM, said:

wait..wait..wait...

I got this..

I don't know why I didn't think of this sooner..

So I hope this idea doesn't get this thread moved to the 'Feature Suggestion'

Ok PGI the time has come, Whenever a mech is getting hit with machinegun fire you have to program Bitchin Betty to say one of the following...

"Warning incoming machinegun fire!"

Or..

"Shoot the Light!"

for each bullet.

[sosegado]

LordNothing, on 23 June 2022 - 12:59 PM, said:

for each bullet.

Hah! That would be so cool! The match would be over for like 5 minutes and you're in the mechlab still listening to Bitchin Betty saying...Shoot the Light!...Shoot the Light!..Shoot the Light!

Edited by Stab Wound, 23 June 2022 - 01:31 PM.

[Kanil]

Honestly, I'd really be okay with a "You are being shot in the back." Betty line that goes off every time you take rear torso damage, and can't be turned off until you're like tier 1 or something.

[Meep Meep]

Hehehe.. The new lmg are silly good now and pair with er meds perfectly. Pir-a with three er meds and eight lmg can sit back and farm damage from 414m for full effect since lmg spread got tightened up nicely too. So basically you get a rac2 with no heat or bar or cooldown and hitscan to boot with a 400m+ optimal. Plus since crits are the same regardless of range you can crit farm at 650~700m depending on quirks. Giggity indeed and the fle-fa is super fun now as a fast flanker and skirmisher. They survive so much longer when you don't have to go into knife fighting range to be effective.

[Nightbird]

Kanil, on 23 June 2022 - 04:58 PM, said:

Honestly, I'd really be okay with a "You are being shot in the back." Betty line that goes off every time you take rear torso damage, and can't be turned off until you're like tier 1 or something.

Great idea, my vote is for "Rear Penetration" with flashing text "WARNING: Rear Penetration"

[LordNothing]

just show an animation of an atlas bending over. im not too sure these kids can read.

Edited by LordNothing, 23 June 2022 - 06:45 PM.

[sosegado]

Nightbird, on 23 June 2022 - 05:30 PM, said:

Great idea, my vote is for "Rear Penetration" with flashing text "WARNING: Rear Penetration"

Well, it should definitely be something short and to the point if we really want a warning, because these days mechs can pile so much damage so quickly that you'll be dead before Bitchin Betty finishes saying it.

I've consulted the Bones and the Bones say that the 3 most obvious choices for a short message are:

1::: Rear Damage!

2::: Butt Hurt!

3::: Listen, I don't know who you are used to dealing with, but I can assure you that I am Not that kind of mech!!