129 replies to this topic

[Daak Gelrin]

Basically, any weapon system NOT used by a particular person is OP. So, everyone who hates Streaks right now, just do us a favor and save some time. Please post your preferred weapons so the Devs can nerf all the others, and you will be content to wreck everyone else on the field with what YOU deem is a proper setup...

Seriously, why is there constant screaming for NERF this, NERF that? Baby steps to balance things out is the way, and until those small balance tweaks are done, just be patient and develop tactics to counter what you think is OP. There's plenty of things that need fixed, that should be higher priority than a weapon system that takes 37 seconds to kill an already damaged hunchback.

[Arumi Ornaught]

Daak Gelrin, on 22 November 2012 - 05:25 AM, said:

Basically, any weapon system NOT used by a particular person is OP. So, everyone who hates Streaks right now, just do us a favor and save some time. Please post your preferred weapons so the Devs can nerf all the others, and you will be content to wreck everyone else on the field with what YOU deem is a proper setup...

Seriously, why is there constant screaming for NERF this, NERF that? Baby steps to balance things out is the way, and until those small balance tweaks are done, just be patient and develop tactics to counter what you think is OP. There's plenty of things that need fixed, that should be higher priority than a weapon system that takes 37 seconds to kill an already damaged hunchback.

I completely agree with you and I hope everyone follows your approach. But I'm hoping, not expecting. Also on another note I'm actually in a merc group with iceman. I'm proud of him.

[Anastasius]

Tone the screen shake down a little.

Other than that alot of us cry like 10 year olds.

Pathetic.

[Allekatrase]

Daak Gelrin, on 22 November 2012 - 05:25 AM, said:

Basically, any weapon system NOT used by a particular person is OP. So, everyone who hates Streaks right now, just do us a favor and save some time. Please post your preferred weapons so the Devs can nerf all the others, and you will be content to wreck everyone else on the field with what YOU deem is a proper setup...

Seriously, why is there constant screaming for NERF this, NERF that? Baby steps to balance things out is the way, and until those small balance tweaks are done, just be patient and develop tactics to counter what you think is OP. There's plenty of things that need fixed, that should be higher priority than a weapon system that takes 37 seconds to kill an already damaged hunchback.

6 PPC Awesome. Please nerf everything else so that I can dominate with this build. Also, if you could adjust heat so I can fire continuously it would be appreciated. Thanks!

[Terror Teddy]

Allekatrase, on 22 November 2012 - 06:25 AM, said:

6 PPC Awesome. Please nerf everything else so that I can dominate with this build. Also, if you could adjust heat so I can fire continuously it would be appreciated. Thanks!

So...what did you call your mech now again? Meltdown? This, let me guess, your third one now?

[Stone Wall]

Rat of the Legion Vega, on 22 November 2012 - 12:03 AM, said:

Starting at 56:06: http://www.twitch.tv/igp/b/342004325

Calls them "frustrating, annoying"

Total time for his full health hunchback to be killed by the streakcat: approximately 37 seconds.


.

so the guy stayed within 270 meters and is mad he died?

[Terror Teddy]

Stone Wall, on 22 November 2012 - 06:28 AM, said:

so the guy stayed within 270 meters and is mad he died?

To be fair, the Hunchbacks effective range IS 270 meters with AC/20 and medium lasers.

[Vila deVere]

One streak cat? A threat, but can be death with. 4 streak cats? Ridiculous ssrm spammage. I had three matches yesterday where 4 man teams were all driving streak cats. Those games where the definition of unfun.

The problem isn't ssrms, per se, but the fact that an A1 can fit 6 of them.

Edited by Vila deVere, 22 November 2012 - 06:37 AM.

[MustrumRidcully]

Terror Teddy, on 22 November 2012 - 05:23 AM, said:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/OmniMech

under "limitations"

Does it say there that it's much easier for non-Omnis to perform such changes?

And yes, I am honestly asking. I only own the Starter Set of the Battletech rules, it doesn't contain such information. Modding a mech isn't in there, just mech construction rules (when you start from scratch, anything goes...)

Edited by MustrumRidcully, 22 November 2012 - 07:01 AM.

[nitra]

lets all please remember that streak cats have 2 large target boxes one on their right and one on their left . removing one of the boxes will effectively increase your longevity when facing a streak cat . and if you do it early enough you will almost always cripple the load out early enough to a more manageable heavy sporting a few lasers.

I know its easier said than done and instinct is to try and core that kitty but instead focus on his 2 large target boxes first and you will soon find that kitty more akin to a ...

Edited by nitra, 22 November 2012 - 07:01 AM.

[siLve00]

ohh every mech can die in less then 10 seconds to a skilled and maxed loadout mech.

before the CT hit patch you didnt need much skill.. you just needed to know where to wait and what target to chose first.

right now.. well its getting harder but its still not the fault of streakusers that random idiots running to them just to get killed.

[Terror Teddy]

MustrumRidcully, on 22 November 2012 - 06:59 AM, said:

Does it say there that it's much easier for non-Omnis to perform such changes?

Not explicitly no. That part could be up to either personal opinion or discussion. I cant really find anything about bonus and drawbacks about standard mechs since there is no explicit article about their bonuses and drawbacks like the Omnimechs (that I could find that is). Well, found this, lots to read though.http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Essay:_BattleMech_Technology

Endo Steel construction is the basic inner skeleton and to me that sounds like something you add during construction - after all, everything else is added TO that main structure. But the difference is that the Clan cannot make one without it AT ALL if they just want to save some internal space.

Ferro Fibrous is basically outer armor and can be switched and changed as well but not on Clan Chassis - or for that matter reduce the armor to a lower or higher value on the clan chassis.

Engines should be easier to lift out and insert from the chassis itself for the IS but on Clan chassis these seems to be more integrated within the Endo steel chassis in combination with the armor.

At the same time we CAN as the game is designed actually MAKE factory design IS with Endo Steel structure but I have a hard time seeing that one should easily be able to swap IS equipment for Clan equipment that easily.

EDIT:

At the same time that IS mechs seems to have more internal flexibility I'm starting to wonder if Clan mechs wouldn't be cheaper to repair - simply due to their modular design where they can just swap another modular limb from a similar mech - it is at least described as being more easily and quickly done than IS mechs.

Edited by Terror Teddy, 22 November 2012 - 07:18 AM.

[Schrottfrosch]

I just watched the video:

Hunchback comes out of cave together with a Jenner and targets the Streak-Cat - he even gets the detailed readout (6 SSRMs 2).

Now instead of backing off into the cave and eventually tell your team what is going on there, the Hunchback decides to engage the Atlas that comes around the corner. He suffers 2 direct frontal hits by dual Large Lasers, and dual Medium Pulse lasers while being stuck at that rock formation, then decides to trun around while the Atlas strikes him again which leads to an overheat shutdown for the Atlas. All the while this happened the streak-cat became aware of the sitation and jumps in to eliminate the now heavily damaged Hunchie.

It wasnt really the streak-cat that killed him, but a piloting error due to a bad evaluation of the situation and being stuck at that rock. Any mech could have killed him there actually. Even if the streak-cat woulnt have been there, I bet the Atlas could have finished him after powering up again.

I am of the opinion, that streak-cats are OP, dont misunderstand me there! This video though doesnt proof it.

It only proofs, that the devs had a good time, obviously, even though being killed in their horribly fitted mechs

[Esk]

Personally streaks are fine, but yes the S-Cat is worse the a G-cat..
It has to be the most frustrating build to deal with of any mech as its a easy mode killing spree to any 1/2 decent pilot. (though spotting one calling him and then him getting lrm'd and complaining about them really made me lol to hard
I'm not going to get involved about the Vid or Dev's it's just a balance issue atm, this is still a beta so meh.
People will use any advantage they can to win, and a S-cat is a valid method, the same as the jenna lag, and a few other things.
I'm hopfull it'll all get balanced without a the nurf bat going crazy

The problem is mech fits, slot size and the balance of them..
Maybe we need another method/controle adding to fittings.
Something along the line of S/M/L hard points (yes it seems a silly solution but its just a thought), if a slot will only fit M/L or S/M this would effect both builds, if done right, maybe just maybe mech types and variants would still have a lot of options, but the more OP builds could be pushed out without the nurf bat effecting a "issue" weapon and making it useless in other mechs types.

Edited by Esk, 22 November 2012 - 07:54 AM.

[Lord Rip]

Rat of the Legion Vega, on 22 November 2012 - 12:03 AM, said:

Starting at 56:06: http://www.twitch.tv/igp/b/342004325

Calls them "frustrating, annoying"

Total time for his full health hunchback to be killed by the streakcat: approximately 37 seconds.


.

He wasn't full health, the Atlas put some on him as well.

Really poor build and bad tactics to boot.

That said the Streak Cat wasn't that good, I would have take him out and taken less damage doing it.

Don't hate the game. Hate the player!

[Lord Rip]

xRaeder, on 22 November 2012 - 12:15 AM, said:

Stop saying stupid crap like this. I poured AC/10, LL, and ML, fire into the arms of one of them and all he kept doing was using his JJs to keep out of my torso arc.

It has nothing to do with piloting. Every pre-made I see now has 2-3 Streakcats in it. In fact I think the netcode issue has gotten worse with this last patch as even Jenners standing still are ignoring my AC/10 shots. This has prevented me from degunning them.

I used to be able to degun Cats pretty easily, now people have figured out how to fight with them... using JJs you negate most people's firepower while they continue to launch at you.

Sorry... but the Cat A1 is broken. It has too many missile points. Remove two of them. The other varients of the Cat have to either go just long range support and barely have enough ammo (or mount two SRM6s which AT least have to be aimed) or strip themselves of armor to mount two large weapons to be competative. My Cat-3D gets killed by these things in 20 seconds.

See the problem is that there is nothing that can kill them now that people have figured out what to do and premades are rolling with them in force.

PGI. Stop nerfing and buffing the Streak as a weapon. Instead look at the Mechs that are causing the imbalance.

I do more damage and get more kills in my C4 build and can reach out farther with the 4 medium lasers.

A lot of things would be much less of a problem if you actually had to take more than one JJ. Every heavy mech you see jumping around out there is doing it with four tons of weight they shouldn't have.

[hanitora]

My favorite defense of the streak cat is the anecdotal evidence.
I have some of my own.

A few dozen games after the patch hit, I almost soloed a streak cat with a Raven. They are fine if a Raven can almost solo them.

[Troggy]

A whole group of streak cats?!?! This all comes down to matchmaking again. If a group of four people have enough organization to put together a group of 4 logically identical builds, and fight together, knowing their limitations, they will be hard to beat - And should be. Teamwork is a fundamental pillar of this sort of game.

As for when fighting an equally organized group with mixed weaponry, the Stk Cats would stand a very high risk of being annihilated. While they are the perfectly designed group for rapidly crushing isolated mechs and small mechs, they would be less effective against a team of mechs with long range weaponry. But I will grant that they are pretty close to the perfect set of mechs for the current 4 vs. 4 + 8 environment - Especially with weight class matching minimizing the number of assaults they will meet. In short, an uncoordinated team runs a huge risk of going down by 2, 3 or even 4 mechs before they know what is going on (if they cannot communicate the problem by voice).

An isolated single streak cat? A couple salvos to the side torso, core the XL engine (and reduce its firepower on the way). Any other decent heavy or assault mech build will do just fine - from outside the engagement range, especially mechs working in pairs. Never mind something like a 4xAC cataphract, or a 2xUAC5, 2xLL Atlas.

--
Troggy

[Karl Marlow]

Ok. I watched the relevant scene. Here are my thoughts.

You got caught. First off that Atlas hurt you a bit. Additionally that Cat was pummeling you in the back before you even saw him. THAT is why you lost.

This is not a case of Streaks being Overpowered. It's PEBKAC.

Edited by ThomasMarik, 22 November 2012 - 08:17 AM.

[Felbombling]

The safest place to be on the battlefield is right next to a friendly streakcat. People sometimes ask, “Why do Mechs have hand actuators?” It is so that the wise player can use that hand actuator to quickly point to the streakcat as they engage enemy Mechs.