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Re: Centurion, Is It Just Me Or...


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#41 Pharoah85

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:01 AM

adding to this again before i play a match.. all this started with my disappointment in the wang. From what I can tell, the Wang can fit an AC20 and has about 8 kph faster speed potential. Other than that it is inferior to the other cents, with the cents being inferior to a lot of other stuff.

#42 RoboticRooster

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:03 AM

Different people like and dislike different mechs for different reasons. It doesn't make one better or worse than the other.

I love my CN9-A, D, and YLW. I first thought that having the left arm not have any hardpoints was a waste, but it quickly became my favorite part of the mech. Having an entire side of the mech be completely expendable makes it hard as hell to kill. If you play it right, the enemy pretty much has to chew their way through your left arm and torso before they can finally kill you, and even though you've lost pieces, you still have all your weapons(depending on your variant, the YLW has the advantage here because its lack of missiles in the LT, and assuming you are using a standard engine.) In my CN9-A, I'm the first mech in, and the last to go down, and having lasers in the center torso means you are effective until they put you down for good. I've won plenty of matches because my cent simply would...not...die.. and I bought enough time for a cap, teammates to arrive, etc. Learn to use your shield and you'll swear you're harder to kill than an atlas. I will say that the default variants are garbage though.

As far as the dragon being flat out better, I would disagree. Its easy to disarm, and the CT is a gigantic target. I personally hated the way that I had to aim the same reticule in different places to get hits with the arm weapons(On the cent, I can put my cross right on a mech, lead my arm reticule, and hit with both, rather than moving my aim based on if I was firing the lasers or ballistics) Losing your arms means once you are out of missile ammo the other team can just ignore you, that is if you don't just get blasted in that over sized beer belly of a CT that is an enormous target. It does have the advantage in speed though, so it can always run away with its tail between its legs :P Jokes aside, I play with a guy who loves the dragon, and he tears people up with it. It's a matter of preference.

Its the same thing with standard vs XL engines.Since I've been comparing the cent and the dragon I'll keep with that. On a cent, your side torsos are prominent and easy to hit, running an XL will free up tonnage, or make you faster, but you trade off being easier to kill. On the other hand, I know quite a few people who run an XL in a dragon, because of the prominent center torso, and somewhat harder to hit side torsos, comparatively you gain more than you sacrifice. Some people like the XL in the cent, and there's nothing wrong with that, I'll keep my unkillable zombie mech though. <3

TLDR: You will love some designs, you will hate others, It doesn't mean there's something wrong with it.

#43 Pharoah85

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:04 AM

I can tell you this.. the wang ain't worth 3750 MC unless you really dig the skin and/or you want somethin decent to farm CBs. But really.. that's even bad because the 30% bonus is quickly gone if you end up losing more due to your ****** mech lol. I don't know if it's true but for example 7 wins out of 10 games with no boost I'm 99% certain is more money than if you went 4 or 5 out of 10 with the boost.

#44 xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:06 AM

View PostPharoah85, on 27 November 2012 - 03:01 AM, said:

adding to this again before i play a match.. all this started with my disappointment in the wang. From what I can tell, the Wang can fit an AC20 and has about 8 kph faster speed potential. Other than that it is inferior to the other cents, with the cents being inferior to a lot of other stuff.


The AC 20 in the arm is a unique new feature that only this variant can do. It was built around this fact and that's why it has fewer total hardpoints. It's basically an alternative Hunchback 4G but puts the AC 20 in an arm instead of its lasers. The downside is that if you downgrade the gun, you can't upgrade the lasers because they are limited to 2 slots in CT. Of course there is also the boost to consider.

#45 Pharoah85

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:10 AM

View PostRoboticRooster, on 27 November 2012 - 03:03 AM, said:

stuff + stuff about dragon


I don't know anything about dragon I have no clue it's standing in the heavy category. As far as other stuff you said.. I'll personally try to practice using the left arm better because it has helped me in the past a few times. I just hate that IF the right arm goes half your arsenal is gone because there's nothing anywhere else cept those 2 torso lasers. Lose 1 weapon out of 4 not so bad or lose 2 out of 5-8. But to lose 2 of 4 or 1 ac20 of 3 total weapons is a big damage dump.

#46 Dremster

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:11 AM

View PostBluten, on 27 November 2012 - 02:16 AM, said:

The Dragon is flat out better though. The Hunchback isn't "better" but actually has unique hardpoints to play with so you aren't just wasting your time. The Centurion however brings nothing to the table unless you want the YLW boost or the super speed of the D variant... and if you want that, you're probably just going to play a Dragon anyway and get the speed with all 3 variants. I suppose if I was trying to dig for an Centurion perk here it'd be the fact that you don't have a treetrunk in your HUD. Take that for whatever it is worth... The boost is the only thing that really makes that Mech worth anything now. If you aren't buying a YLW... I'd suggest forgetting the entire Mech.


Ok lets talk about the Dragon then..
Weapon wise it has nothing on the Centurion every variant has exactly 6 hardpoints of various types same as the Centurion with the exception of the Yen-Lo-Wang. So lets compare the Centurion 9A with the Dragon 1N very similar hardpoints the Dragon has 2 of each, the Centurion sacrifices 1 ballistic and picks up 1 missile. Stock without any weapons or heatsinks "outside of the engine minimum" the Centurion has 23 tons free for weapons and heatsinks, the Dragon has 19. With endo steel your looking at 25.5 and 22 respectively. Not a whole lot of difference but the Centurion can mount more firepower because the Dragon sacrifices for its speed.

So the only thing the Dragon has going for it is more speed and a little more armor. Lets talk about that speed, the Dragon is heavy it has a lot of momentum at top speed so it takes longer to stop accelerate and it doesn't turn as sharply as a lighter mech. Also the Dragon is fat and its center torso takes more of a beating than an Awesome because of it. Then there is the Centurion shield arm, why people think it's useless is beyond me, if you die and you didn't lose that arm first you are doing it wrong. Ok sure the dragon can use its arms as well but the dragon will either lose 1 energy or 2 ballistic hardpoints while the centurion loses no weapons at all.

So effectively the Centurion has 68 armor and the left arm structure to chew through before you get to internals on its engine, with room for 14 more points of armor. The Dragon has no shield arm and 54 points of armor on its center with room for 2 more.

so TL:DR...
The Dragon has less firepower for more top speed and slightly more armor.
The Centurion has a slimmer profile, a shield arm, and maneuvers better.
So in other words the Dragon is NOT flat out better than the Centurion it has different strengths sure but the difference between the 2 of them is tiny and entirely subjective.

#47 Pharoah85

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:12 AM

View PostBluten, on 27 November 2012 - 03:06 AM, said:

The AC 20 in the arm is a unique new feature that only this variant can do. It was built around this fact and that's why it has fewer total hardpoints. It's basically an alternative Hunchback 4G but puts the AC 20 in an arm instead of its lasers. The downside is that if you downgrade the gun, you can't upgrade the lasers because they are limited to 2 slots in CT. Of course there is also the boost to consider.


Boost is nice but I mentioned a few posts ago it's luck dependent. If you own a mech that you know you perform well in and it leads to mostly victories then you swap to YLW and it leads to mostly defeat.. your boost ends up being even less CB than what u woulda earned with your old mech.

#48 Pharoah85

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:15 AM

ok going to play now fo'real LOL. I don't even know how this dragon vs cent stuff started I guess it's somewhere back there. I have like 0 knowledge of the dragon if I were going to play a heavy I'd be ballistic cata (either of them, pult or phract idc).

#49 Vassago Rain

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:15 AM

View PostPharoah85, on 27 November 2012 - 03:01 AM, said:

adding to this again before i play a match.. all this started with my disappointment in the wang. From what I can tell, the Wang can fit an AC20 and has about 8 kph faster speed potential. Other than that it is inferior to the other cents, with the cents being inferior to a lot of other stuff.


It's a workable mech. You get the slightly bigger engine, a more stable fapping arm, and there's nothing preventing you from taking the usual two medium pulse/gauss rifle combo.

I would take it over the other cents, honestly. At least it makes more money. The actual firepower doesn't drop that much.
Pretty sad.

#50 RoboticRooster

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:16 AM

View PostPharoah85, on 27 November 2012 - 03:10 AM, said:


I don't know anything about dragon I have no clue it's standing in the heavy category. As far as other stuff you said.. I'll personally try to practice using the left arm better because it has helped me in the past a few times. I just hate that IF the right arm goes half your arsenal is gone because there's nothing anywhere else cept those 2 torso lasers. Lose 1 weapon out of 4 not so bad or lose 2 out of 5-8. But to lose 2 of 4 or 1 ac20 of 3 total weapons is a big damage dump.


This is part of why I like my CN9-A a bit more than the wang. If you lose the arm you still have your lasers and missiles, so it isn't quite as much of a loss as losing an AC-20. If you are piloting a YLW you absolutely have to protect the arm. By twisting and only showing them your left, you force them to either try to chew through the arm, or just wait til you twist back around and put another slug into them. A wang pilot who cant protect his right arm is easier to gimp than a Hunchie-4G

Edited by RoboticRooster, 27 November 2012 - 03:22 AM.


#51 Ewigan

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:17 AM

@Bluten: Seriously? all those mechs are "useless" ?

Despite of being a commandop pilot, every mech has its uses. And can be great, depending on the pilot.
Even the raven! ( i guess.... )

#52 Dremster

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:18 AM

View PostPharoah85, on 27 November 2012 - 03:01 AM, said:

adding to this again before i play a match.. all this started with my disappointment in the wang. From what I can tell, the Wang can fit an AC20 and has about 8 kph faster speed potential. Other than that it is inferior to the other cents, with the cents being inferior to a lot of other stuff.


The problem is you are really underestimating the power of an AC/20. Great dps, you don't have to keep it on the target constantly like AC/2s, meaning you can use that shield arm between shots "hint hint", and it does all that damage in one spot. with consistent center torso shots using that arm in between you can brawl a dragon right in front of his face and win easily.

Edited by Dremster, 27 November 2012 - 03:19 AM.


#53 Vassago Rain

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:21 AM

View PostDremster, on 27 November 2012 - 03:18 AM, said:


The problem is you are really underestimating the power of an AC/20. Great dps, you don't have to keep it on the target constantly like AC/2s, meaning you can use that shield arm between shots "hint hint", and it does all that damage in one spot. with consistent center torso shots using that arm in between you can brawl a dragon right in front of his face and win easily.


It runs too hot, has too little ammo, and a silly range. Gauss all day, every day. The bullets move much faster, too.

#54 Slanski

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:22 AM

Dragon and Centurion are similar in hardpoints and fundamentally different in deployment. The Centurion is a line mech which with a skilled pilot can fight in between the heavies and assaults, while using its ruggedness and slender CT to take punishment beyond its size class.
The Dragon is a heavy cruiser which surfs in and out at the edge of battle, keeping a low profile and engages in guerilla warfare. Its hugecenter torso means that in any stand up fight with an assault it will get instantly pulverized and cored. The Dragon begs for a big XL engine to even more capitalize on its speed and almost invisible side torsos. The Centurion is the worst mech to mount an XL bar none.

Yes, the current matchmaker is poor design and a Cataphract is so much better than fielding a Centurion that I wouldn't handicap my team by going for the lighter mech. I think total weight based MM would be a great progress over pretending we have role warfare in which bigger isn't better (this is not EVE-online with all its complexities).

#55 xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:23 AM

View PostEwigan, on 27 November 2012 - 03:17 AM, said:

@Bluten: Seriously? all those mechs are "useless" ?

Despite of being a commandop pilot, every mech has its uses. And can be great, depending on the pilot.
Even the raven! ( i guess.... )


Seriously I regret saying "useless". It's too harsh a word(And perhaps why people get buttt hurt) and not really true either since they can technically get kills/wins. But they are definitely inferior to alternate options in the current state of the game. "Pointless" is what I should go with. :P At least with the Centurion you might get a boost or the ability not to have a tree trunch on your screen. The Commando however... is literally u... pointless.

Edited by Bluten, 27 November 2012 - 03:28 AM.


#56 Roadbuster

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:25 AM

View PostPharoah85, on 27 November 2012 - 12:31 AM, said:

... are most mechs just filler BS to burn time and possibly money until you figure out what the good stuff is? I have 3 owned mechs so far in this order > Wang > CN9-AL > CN9-A. I got the other two so I could maximize the potential of my Wang.......................... ........... ...... ok I'm done. Anyway I bought the other two to get the Elite stuff etc. Even though I've learned how to make the centurion work for me I can't help but feel it is outclassed by other mechs in various ways.

TLDR: I'm a Centurion variant, my speed is as slow as a heavy but I'm not as strong as one. If I build for damage I lack the armor to stand up to HBK/heavy/assault in a close and personal battle. If I build armor I lack the damage. I can't really stack/boat anything and my weapon variety is greatly limited due to slots and hardpoint locations combined with a useless limb. It just seems like other mechs are going "anything you can do I can do better" lalalaalaaa.... yea. What do? Matter of factiveness.. why do medium mechs even exist.. really.. ?


Medium mechs, especially the Hunchback and Centurion, are very versatile.
They are not meant to stand face to face with an assault mech, but compared to an assault, they are not such an easy target for light mechs.

The question is, what do you want from your mech?
Do you want speed? Take a light or medium.
Do you want firepower and armor? Take an assault or heavy.
Do you want a mix of everything? Take a medium or heavy.

I like my Centurions (CN9-A, CN9-D, CN9-AL). I can be a light mech hunter, a fast brawler, long range supporter,...
No, you won't turn a medium mech in a heavy mech. But you're still faster than a heavy mech with the same engine. And if you want to go at the same speed with a heavy (most can't go that fast) you have to reduce your loadout.
I didn't like the Centurion alot when I started playing, but now I even prefer it over the Hunchback.

Heavy mechs have more potential, but that doesn't mean they are better or that medium mechs don't have their place.

CN9-A: UAC/5, 2MPL, 3SSRM2, AMS, 260XL, DHS, Endo
CN9-D: 2MG, 2MPL, SRM4+Artemis, SRM6+Artemis, AMS, 300XL, DHS, Endo
CN9-AL: ER LL, 2SL, 2LRM5, AMS, 260XL

Edited by Roadbuster, 27 November 2012 - 03:32 AM.


#57 Dremster

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:27 AM

View PostVassago Rain, on 27 November 2012 - 03:21 AM, said:


It runs too hot, has too little ammo, and a silly range. Gauss all day, every day. The bullets move much faster, too.

Very true mostly a flavor thing for me I like the AC/20.

However, AC/20 will hit at a tiny bit over 500 meters more than enough on most maps. But the YLW is very limited by the placement of the 2 energy hardpoints in the CT. Because of that it is a straight damage loss to use gauss over the AC/20. Even with 2 mpulse lasers your doing less damage. now on any mech with more than 3 hardpoints gauss all day!

#58 Martini Henrie

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:31 AM

It's horses for courses. I like both the Dragon and the Cent, both are perfect when used in team play as they fulfill separate tasks to other mechs in their weight classes. It is more difficult to pug with them as they are more specialised than the other mechs.

The Cent is the ultimate zombie if you are competent at damage spreading, with decent weapons in good locations. I view the arms as shields, and they work well for it. Yeah, the Alpha isn't huge if you are using streaks, but you can always swap out for 6 packs if you wanted more thump.

Some mechs work better for loners, some better for team players...

#59 Vassago Rain

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:31 AM

View PostSlanski, on 27 November 2012 - 03:22 AM, said:

Dragon and Centurion are similar in hardpoints and fundamentally different in deployment. The Centurion is a line mech which with a skilled pilot can fight in between the heavies and assaults, while using its ruggedness and slender CT to take punishment beyond its size class.
The Dragon is a heavy cruiser which surfs in and out at the edge of battle, keeping a low profile and engages in guerilla warfare. Its hugecenter torso means that in any stand up fight with an assault it will get instantly pulverized and cored. The Dragon begs for a big XL engine to even more capitalize on its speed and almost invisible side torsos. The Centurion is the worst mech to mount an XL bar none.

Yes, the current matchmaker is poor design and a Cataphract is so much better than fielding a Centurion that I wouldn't handicap my team by going for the lighter mech. I think total weight based MM would be a great progress over pretending we have role warfare in which bigger isn't better (this is not EVE-online with all its complexities).


I hate the dragon, and haven't used one since closed beta. It really is just a fat cent, that moves significantly faster. Now with the endo, poordubs, artemis, engine limits, improved ballistics...I would trade my three cents in for three dragons. You have the tonnage to put something in your arm, without it gimping your performance.

Basically, both meches need love. I suspected this is what would happen to the 'big gun on arm, stupid helmet/fat torso/pointy bit'-mechs.

#60 Pharoah85

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 03:44 AM

View PostSlanski, on 27 November 2012 - 03:22 AM, said:

The Centurion is the worst mech to mount an XL bar none.


Why? in the mech bay they look the same regardless of engine. Does it affect your torso size in-game? If it does.. did not know that.





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