318 replies to this topic

[Sybreed]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 02 May 2013 - 07:12 PM, said:

I'm quite sure that if we did have a stock mech mode I'd be playing this game a LOT more right now.

yup... yup yup yup, no discussion here.

[Lucky 7]

I would enjoy a stock only mode.
There would be certain stock Mechs that dominate there of course but it would be enjoyable.

[Hyperman]

Hell Yes! I was thinking about this for a long time. I am really bored of the actual ppc (+gauss) meta.

Maybe a "no endo, no dhs, no xl engine, no ferro" option (aka anything what gives you free tonnage) would be nice too, and this way the hero mechs were playable too.

[ClaymoreReIIik]

Hi,

as mentioned before the german community organized a 3025 Stock mechs tournament.

A lot of people here mentioned that if you put forth a stock mech mode, there will only be a viable amount of chassis.

We won the german community tournament so obviously we cheesed the most out of the stock mechs. Guess what: there are more viable stock mech variants for a competitive environment then there are viable full mod mechs for a competitive environment.

Funny enough the "best" stock mechs are quite cheap.

A lot of people here have been talking about PGI not doing it because there is no need for customisation in stock. Honestly said that is quite huge ********.

In the finals we pretty much had a similar load out to our opponents. They had a Hunchback 4P we had a hunchback 4H. Apart from that it was pretty much identical. (When we play full mod leagues the setups are pretty much identical too, so no difference in that.)

We had different setups when it comes to modules though. Modules require either GXP (mostly aquired through MC) or MC. Same as full mod mechs.

Cockpit items in stock mechs are same as cockpit items in full mod mechs. Colors is the same.

The only difference between full mod mechs and stock mechs is buying different reactors, upgrades and weapons. None of which are aquired through MC directly....or did I miss a memo on that? I always thought you spend c-bills on those....

So the MC heavy part of customisation is exactly the same for both worlds.

The seperation of the player base that people are afraid of....are you playing the same game I am? When we drop in the 8 player queue its basically the same teams every evening. Outside of the few player-organised leagues there is no player base to seperate.

Know what we do when we want to play 8 player conquest and find no opponents on the 2nd launch? We switch game mode to assault and hit launch again. Having stock as an option, does not disable the existing game modes at all. It just puts more players in a position to hit that launch button again, because they have not quit for good.

ELO has done little to make PUGing fun. You only suffer your way through the different chassis.

If your honest there is no role available in the game right now that you can not cover with an existing chassis. The only reason to keep buying mechs is if your a collector.

A stock only mode where a mech you launch in is reverted to its stock load out automatically would still let you customize it and play full mod, if you like. It would give an incentive to keep buying mechs though, because that one version of that one mech might be the viable one to fullfill a certain role in stock matches.

I think its a good point that a lot of bored people might come back for stock queues, because I see it in my unit. It was no problem to motivate pilots to play in the 3025 stock mechs tournament. Its a much bigger issue to get them to play another round in their 6 PPC stalker, no matter how much we win/lose.

I think we all agree that launching new players into the full mod world in their trial mechs is bad design that does not bring much fun to the new players.

So to summarize a long post: I do not see stock taking away options, I see stock bringing options. I do not see less MC being spent when stock mechs are in, I see more MC being spent. I do not see stock costing players, I see it bringing in new players.

Edited by ClaymoreReIIik, 09 July 2013 - 06:02 AM.

[Lord of All]

ClaymoreReIIik, on 09 July 2013 - 05:59 AM, said:

Great Post

What were the teams comprised of? BTW did you guys discuss using overpowered modules like seismic before hand for this tourney?

[ClaymoreReIIik]

Lord of All, on 09 July 2013 - 06:43 AM, said:

What were the teams comprised of? BTW did you guys discuss using overpowered modules like seismic before hand for this tourney?

We agreed before hand that the usage of modules was completely allowed because its too hard to control. If you can not effectivly make sure its according to rules, do not limit it by rules and you have no troubles...

The tonnage limit was 450 tons, maximum 2 assault mechs per team. Only 1 mech of each variant allowed. (only 1 AWS-8Q for example.)

Team setups were pretty mixed throughout the tournament. In the group phase and quarter finals we saw a lot of atlas being used, we had none.

Scouts were pretty much the Jenner 7F and Spider 5V. The jenner because its fast and heavily armored while the spider simply outruns everything. This setup was seen quite often.

Pretty much all hunchbacks are good in stock. Really good armor, the energy heavy ones have quite a lot of heat sinks. Teams usually had between 2 and 3 of those. Some teams brought Centurions instead, who are good as well. The Yen Lo Wang is pretty decent in 3025 Stocks because it actually has ammunition for the AC20. Its not such a strong zombie because of the heatsinks though.

In the heavy slots we saw Catapults mostly. C1 was good, lot of K2s though. Its really good in stock 3025.

The assault slots on our side were a STK-3F. Its an incredibly hard to pilot mech because you need so many weapon groups, if you know how to play it, its a real game changer though.

The AWS-8Q is pure win in 3025 Stock mechs. (3 PPCs and the heatsinks to keep 2 coming constantly.)

The Highlander with the AC20 (not sure which one it is) was pretty strong too. Good armor and a lot of bang.

Atlas RS and Atlas D are difficult opponents as well. We decided against them because of tonnage constraints and PPCs being insanely strong at the moment.

We saw a lot of successfull teams go with 2 lights, 4 mediums, 2 assaults. We had a lot of trouble with a team that brought like 4 hunchbacks, 3 centurions and an atlas. We ran 2 lights, 3 mediums, 1 heavy an Awesome and a Stalker.

We primarily used ACs and PPCs as main weaponry but quite a few teams opted for a LRM heavy load-out with the 4J Hunchback, a C1 Catapult and a stalker. LRMs are really good in stock mechs 3025.

You see there is a lot of possibilities here and each one has its own merits and downsides. In the end for us the Mech choices were dictated by what pilots I had for what type of mech....

Edited by ClaymoreReIIik, 09 July 2013 - 07:00 AM.

[TheForce]

i really like your idea of a stock tourney, but when you can't really enforce the rules, weren't there problems with people accusing others of cheating? also its a real pain in the @$$ to prepare all your mechs back to stock

not being able to enforce rules is why i tried to get semi-stock going (http://mwomercs.com/...mech-saturdays/), but i'd still prefer full stock where hunchbacks didn't go 90kph like they do in semi-stock.

do you have a link to the tournament rules thats in english?

Edited by TheForce, 09 July 2013 - 08:17 AM.

[Lord of All]

ClaymoreReIIik, on 09 July 2013 - 06:59 AM, said:

Another excellent post

Sounds like a real blast! Are there any AARs? Or Vids of the matches?

[TheForce]

Lord of All, on 09 July 2013 - 08:35 AM, said:

Sounds like a real blast! Are there any AARs? Or Vids of the matches?

Yes I would love to watch some stock battles!

[Rushin Roulette]

TheForce, on 09 July 2013 - 08:16 AM, said:

i really like your idea of a stock tourney, but when you can't really enforce the rules, weren't there problems with people accusing others of cheating? also its a real pain in the @$$ to prepare all your mechs back to stock

not being able to enforce rules is why i tried to get semi-stock going (http://mwomercs.com/...mech-saturdays/), but i'd still prefer full stock where hunchbacks didn't go 90kph like they do in semi-stock.

do you have a link to the tournament rules thats in english?

The rules were simple. Clay posted most of them already in his last post. in summary the rules were:

• 450 Tons per Team maximum
  
• No more than 2 Assault Mechs per Team
  
• Only one mech per variant allowed per team (no 2 Jenner K, but a Jenner K and a Jenner D is allowed)
  
• Minimum of 12 players in a team (8 players + at least 4 reserve members)
  
• Teammembers must be registered per team by name
  
• Comsumables, modules and pilot skills are allowed and unrestricted
  
• Mechs must be completely stock (Ammunition, heatsink, weapon and armor placement included)
  
• Only stock mechs with tier 1 technology allowed (no FF, ES, DHS, ER weapons, ECM and so on. A list of allowed mechs was agreed on before the start of the tournament, so mechs which were added after the start of the tournament like the Blackjack were therfore dissalowed of that particular tournament but will be included in the next tournaments if the prerequisites are fulfilled).

Lord of All, on 09 July 2013 - 08:35 AM, said:

Sounds like a real blast! Are there any AARs? Or Vids of the matches?

There are videos from the second placed already up and videos of the first placed are being uploaded (probably needing editing to remove (or beep out) the voicecoms at the end where it all went haywire for us as the opponents were really good);

http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__2536302

All videos from the 36th Dieron Regulars
http://www.youtube.c...2FkxlQlS6aBWTng


EDIT: The stock fights were really fun. no PPC Snipefest, the re-introduction of brawling and the need to keep a close eye on your heat and ammunition. Tactical positioning before and during a fight was really important.

Edited by Rushin Roulette, 09 July 2013 - 11:02 AM.

[TheForce]

thanks i'll check out those vids

[Lord of All]

Rushin Roulette, on 09 July 2013 - 09:20 AM, said:

...
All videos from the 36th Dieron Regulars
http://www.youtube.c...2FkxlQlS6aBWTng...

Nice! But did you notice those guys are speaking some weird tongue!

[ClaymoreReIIik]

Lord of All, on 09 July 2013 - 02:26 PM, said:

Nice! But did you notice those guys are speaking some weird tongue!

If you need a rough summary of the voice chat: The 36th has a very competent drop lead who never loses his calm.

[Lord of All]

ClaymoreReIIik, on 10 July 2013 - 02:22 AM, said:

If you need a rough summary of the voice chat: The 36th has a very competent drop lead who never loses his calm.

I was trying to make a funny! I assumed it would be in german as the threads are.

A translated voice over on one, the final maybe would be nice though.

[Wreknar Temper]

This isn't the hallmark of a serious thread when I don't have the option to vote no.

Concerning the topic at hand (if at all serious), please no. Until MM is fined tuned so that I'm not playing with/against the same 15 other people and in blatantly unbalanced mechs, do not fragment the population anymore.

When the game matures a bit more, I would support this option as a custom game mode only when the lobby system is in place.

[paxmortis]

ClaymoreReIIik, on 10 July 2013 - 02:22 AM, said:

If you need a rough summary of the voice chat: The 36th has a very competent drop lead who never loses his calm.

Big compliment for Storyteller. I think he would say the same about you.

If one unit wants to play a 3025 stockmech 8 men drop, feel free to ask. Most of the german units enjoy playing 3025. Like explain above, it is harder to bring them back in the cockpit of the 3050 custom mech.

If you need help to make contact feel free to ask me.

For the most german units this 3025 tournament was a rebirth. Many member came back to play that tournament, mostly to many member to give all a place.

At the moment the germans are really sure to continue that way. In october season 2 will start and due the waiting time they will play 3025 on their own. I am really sure, their is a place and time, to bring that fun to other players, too.

Edit:
It could be hat we use next time our self create MBV 1.7.2 (Mechwarrior Online Battle Value). This need to be discussed with the units.

If you interessed in that too. You can find it on my google drive.

https://docs.google....GpBQ01Hemc/edit

It is not complete still yet. We discuss in a thread how we continue. next part should be weapon location / hit zones and booting parameters.

Nothing we need really for 3025 but i wants not to stop there and it is in english

You need to download the zip. it contain a html file with the informations and all stock mechs.

Edited by paxmortis, 11 July 2013 - 09:25 AM.

[Crashingmail]

One of our members is building up a video with english subtitle, because Garth ask for it
And regarding cheating, all groups played very well and no one was accused to cheat or anything else.

I think for most of them was this something that Mechwarrior should to be.

@TheForce
You are right, rebuild the required Mech/s is expensive, but for those wanted to play they did it and some kept the build also.

[paxmortis]

So stay tune. The 331st and we will translate some vids with the weird tongues

Edited by paxmortis, 11 July 2013 - 09:51 AM.

[Xenroth]

Half way is done for the first vid (2nd game)
It was the closest of the final games. I will go on translating our weird tongue when the test servers went down

[Quardak]

Yeah. This is was the Game we knew from the books! Mechs with heatproblems. Raw Firepower but only few ammo.

It was FUN ... not more not less

Try it and you will like it!