717 replies to this topic

[RG Notch]

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 09:09 AM, said:

I read it. I don't think it means what you think it does.

Too bad PGI support has documented in this very thread that it does. I'm thinking you're the one who has a problem with understanding what it means. Feel free to contact support and they can set you straight or you can read the e mail posted in this thread. See post #387 I believe.

[Ghogiel]

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 09:09 AM, said:

I read it. I don't think it means what you think it does.

Quote

Hi there!
Thank you for your feedback and our apologies we could not reach your earlier. If the player B is still actively playing it is not considered non-participation.
For us powering down your mech for the purpose of letting the clock run out and maintaining your K/D ratio does not fall within the intended spirit of the shutdown mechanic, and is considered an act of non-participation.
Regards

GM_Patience
Piranha Games

[Joseph Mallan]

RG Notch, on 12 February 2015 - 09:14 AM, said:

Too bad PGI support has documented in this very thread that it does. I'm thinking you're the one who has a problem with understanding what it means. Feel free to contact support and they can set you straight or you can read the e mail posted in this thread. See post #387 I believe.

Ok we'll just play the game reporting everyone who does things we don't like. Lets see if we can completely backlog Support then shall we. If I read a "Player hiding in D4" I'll report them for treason.

[Kjudoon]

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 09:16 AM, said:

Ok we'll just play the game reporting everyone who does things we don't like. Lets see if we can completely backlog Support then shall we. If I read a "Player hiding in D4" I'll report them for treason.

Why aren't you already?

[Ghogiel]

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 09:16 AM, said:

Ok we'll just play the game reporting everyone who does things we don't like. Lets see if we can completely backlog Support then shall we. If I read a "Player hiding in D4" I'll report them for treason.

Yep. Just make sure to be reporting the shutdown player as well as that is who is the cause of the problem.

[RG Notch]

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 09:16 AM, said:

Ok we'll just play the game reporting everyone who does things we don't like. Lets see if we can completely backlog Support then shall we. If I read a "Player hiding in D4" I'll report them for treason.

IF they are doing things that violate the CoC as clearly stated by a PGI support staff member feel free. I don't get what the issue is. If you don't understand or like the rules that's one thing, but when you interpreted the rules to be on your side you seemed ok with them.
Anyways, feel free to do what you like within the CoC and let PGI decide who is sanctionable.

[Creovex]

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 09:16 AM, said:

Ok we'll just play the game reporting everyone who does things we don't like. Lets see if we can completely backlog Support then shall we. If I read a "Player hiding in D4" I'll report them for treason.

Unsure why you are upset by this, you have been here long enough and should know better. Also, remember It really only applies to CW and Skirmish mode.... Assault and Conquest have independent win objectives that allow completion without all enemy mechs to be killed.

Time Griefing (which this is) is a total ass move, and should ALWAYS be reported. It makes the playerbase look like a bunch of whiny, spoiled kids who pout when they lose.

Edited by Creovex, 12 February 2015 - 09:22 AM.

[MechWarrior3671771]

"If the player B is still actively playing it is not considered non-participation."

Shutting down to get the drop on someone = actively playing

"powering down your mech for the purpose of letting the clock run out and maintaining your K/D ratio does not fall within the intended spirit of the shutdown mechanic, and is considered an act of non-participation."

Which makes perfect sense, if you can show he's shutting down to maintain a K/D ratio. How are you guys doing that again? Telepathy?

Joseph is correct - your "evidence" doesn't mean what you think it means.

[Joseph Mallan]

Ghogiel, on 12 February 2015 - 09:19 AM, said:

Yep. Just make sure to be reporting the shutdown player as well as that is who is the cause of the problem.

Nope. That player was likely already reported. If others can pick and choose which rules they will follow I am allowed the same freedom. As I don't have a problem with those who want to be difficult to find.

[Ghogiel]

Fenrisulvyn, on 12 February 2015 - 09:20 AM, said:

"If the player B is still actively playing it is not considered non-participation."

Shutting down to get the drop on someone = actively playing

"powering down your mech for the purpose of letting the clock run out and maintaining your K/D ratio does not fall within the intended spirit of the shutdown mechanic, and is considered an act of non-participation."

Which makes perfect sense, if you can show he's shutting down to maintain a K/D ratio. How are you guys doing that again? Telepathy?

Joseph is correct - your "evidence" doesn't mean what you think it means.

We don't determine anything. Our job is to not shutdown and hide and to report player that do. Support sorts it out.

[990Dreams]

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 09:16 AM, said:

If I read a "Player hiding in D4" I'll report them for treason.

Yeah, another valid thing to report.

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 08:54 AM, said:

Then your objective is to FIND that shut down player. I see no fault in making you work for your kill. If you cannot find him then you don'rt deserve teh honor of the the kill. I see nothing wrong with making someone work a little.

Did you read anything I posted?

[Dock Steward]

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 09:16 AM, said:

Ok we'll just play the game reporting everyone who does things we don't like. Lets see if we can completely backlog Support then shall we. If I read a "Player hiding in D4" I'll report them for treason.

Ghogiel, on 12 February 2015 - 09:19 AM, said:

Yep. Just make sure to be reporting the shutdown player as well as that is who is the cause of the problem.

Seems like we're all arguing 2 different things: A) A shutdown player vs B} a player who is evading the enemy.

Let's be clear about what we're arguing here, guys. And also, "the spirit" of the game mode is INTENTIONALLY VAGUE. PGI hasn't clarified anything with those words...

Edited by Dock Steward, 12 February 2015 - 09:27 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

RG Notch, on 12 February 2015 - 09:19 AM, said:

IF they are doing things that violate the CoC as clearly stated by a PGI support staff member feel free. I don't get what the issue is. If you don't understand or like the rules that's one thing, but when you interpreted the rules to be on your side you seemed ok with them.
Anyways, feel free to do what you like within the CoC and let PGI decide who is sanctionable.

It isn't something I do. I have no problem with it being done. I try to find the guy hiding, and want to see the guy on my side evade detection.

[Ghogiel]

Dock Steward, on 12 February 2015 - 09:23 AM, said:

Seems like we're all arguing 2 different things: A) A shutdown player vs a player who is evading the enemy.

Both can be violations.

Quote

Let's be clear about what we're arguing here, guys. And also, "the spirit" of the game mode is INTENTIONALLY VAGUE. PGI hasn't clarified anything with those words...

Indeed. That's where support comes in to make a ruling on each case

[Krivvan]

It's the same reason why players in Starcraft that continue playing on after the outcome of the game is completely determined are considered players exercising bad manners.

It's the equivalent to lifting buildings into the corner of maps. You're not trying to win the game anymore, you're just making the game last longer out of spite. One may try to justify it (in MWO and Starcraft) as a last ditch attempt to win, but the majority view it as simple griefing.

Having a mech run off in a 11-7 with the winning team having heavily damaged mechs isn't seen in the same light because winning is still an actual possibility. Running off and hiding in an 11-0 match is hard to justify as a legitimate attempt at winning though.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Joseph Mallan, on 12 February 2015 - 09:01 AM, said:

And we are. That you are unable to accept those rules is what is irrelevant. They participated, they are the last man standing, taking a kill away from you is a worthy goal. It is also not against the rules as written.

Wrong, it is against the rules as they are written, there's multiple citations in this very thread from PGI showing this to be so, continuing to defend it shows you are clearly not following the rules set forth by PGI and are trying to force people to play by your rules, which is oddly enough, exactly what people defending this clear violation of the rules claim WE, the people who follow the rules, are doing.

If you get reported for this, Support will contact you and let you know you've been reported and they are investigating, they'll even let you see screenshots if they were included, because they ASK for your side of the story. I know, I was reported constantly by the Goonies, as were many others at one time. Those Goonies are gone,they found out PGI isn't CCP, they'll permban despite you having spent money on the game.

Fenrisulyn, there is no tactical reason to shut down as the last man standing and totally avoid engagement with the enemy. You can't get a win, you can't get a draw, you are doing it to either protect your KDR(against the CoC) or you are doing it in spite/to grief(against the CoC). There's no need to read someone's mind here, there's NO OTHER REASON TO DO THIS. We report them, PGI deals with it.

Joseph, you don't have to report the shutdown avoiding engagement player if you don't want to, that's fine and you know it. You should be reporting it but you don't HAVE to. Funny that you will report the team treason player but not the griefer...makes no sense to me, but it's your call on who you report for violations of the CoC. Personally, I'd report em both, violations of the CoC need to be addressed with a quickness so people don't develop bad habits or so griefers can be removed before they cause too much grief.

[990Dreams]

Look, I want someone to prove to me that shutting down/not fighting isn't motivated or caused one of the following things:

• Pride
  
• Spite
  
• Cowardice
  
• Stupidity (lack of skills)

No one has yet. I don't think anyone will (of course I'm probably wrong, but so far there hasn't been a good track record).

Edited by DavidHurricane, 12 February 2015 - 09:32 AM.

[Kjudoon]

Ghogiel, on 12 February 2015 - 09:27 AM, said:

Both can be violations.


Indeed. That's where support comes in to make a ruling on each case

Then I guess shutdown must be removed from the game since using it is a violation of the rules.

[MechWarrior5152251]

Jetfire, on 12 February 2015 - 08:46 AM, said:

Happens more than you would think.

I wouldn't know, I only play Skirmish...
I prefer battle to hide and seek...

Edited by MechWarrior5152251, 12 February 2015 - 09:33 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Kristov Kerensky, on 12 February 2015 - 09:28 AM, said:

Wrong, it is against the rules as they are written, there's multiple citations in this very thread from PGI showing this to be so, continuing to defend it shows you are clearly not following the rules set forth by PGI and are trying to force people to play by your rules, which is oddly enough, exactly what people defending this clear violation of the rules claim WE, the people who follow the rules, are doing.

If you get reported for this, Support will contact you and let you know you've been reported and they are investigating, they'll even let you see screenshots if they were included, because they ASK for your side of the story. I know, I was reported constantly by the Goonies, as were many others at one time. Those Goonies are gone,they found out PGI isn't CCP, they'll permban despite you having spent money on the game.

Fenrisulyn, there is no tactical reason to shut down as the last man standing and totally avoid engagement with the enemy. You can't get a win, you can't get a draw, you are doing it to either protect your KDR(against the CoC) or you are doing it in spite/to grief(against the CoC). There's no need to read someone's mind here, there's NO OTHER REASON TO DO THIS. We report them, PGI deals with it.

Joseph, you don't have to report the shutdown avoiding engagement player if you don't want to, that's fine and you know it. You should be reporting it but you don't HAVE to. Funny that you will report the team treason player but not the griefer...makes no sense to me, but it's your call on who you report for violations of the CoC. Personally, I'd report em both, violations of the CoC need to be addressed with a quickness so people don't develop bad habits or so griefers can be removed before they cause too much grief.

Its not grieving if I am not disturbed by it. Treason is treason, trying to stay alive is human nature. Even if it is just a game.