281 replies to this topic

[Divenity]

vandalhooch, on 12 January 2018 - 05:28 PM, said:

Poor sport quitter. Save time for what?

The next match.

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Newsflash, you are playing the game.

The game mode was siege, my team decided they would rather play skirmish and not even attempt to attack the base.

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Of course not. You've already demonstrated you haven't the slightest interest in questioning anything you already think is true.

And so have you.

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Based on everything I've seen in this thread so far, I's say the game was ruined the moment you hit the launch button.

I will fight, if my team fights, if 10/11 of them quit, I'd rather just move on to the next match, 1-2v12 is a waste of time... Give me an 8v12, a 6v12, and I'll still fight, because there's a chance, there is no chance in 1v12.

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Except you are only fighting for your Faction if you don't have to fight against the hard opponents from other Factions.

insinuating that there would be 0 hard opponents in solo queue... Your logic is undeniably broken.

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Except you aren't proposing that they drop in Faction Play. Faction Play is you facing ANY AND ALL comers.

Right now it is, but it wasn't always, it could be again. Even the devs themselves demonstrated a desire to split the queues in the past, and only didn't because the war at the time couldn't support it, so even they disagree with you to an extent.

Just because something is one way right now doesn't mean it should stay that way.

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You are a poor sport quitter.

The rest of my team quit first, I was just saving time, but no, keep repeating yourself so I can keep repeating myself, I'm sure something constructive will come of it eventually.

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This is you trying to rationalize your choice to quit playing. It doesn't matter whether you could have won or not. You chose to quit. You are a quitter. It's that simple.

I never said I wasn't a quitter in this scenario, so why do you keep repeating this as if it means something?

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Tell me that you would support PGI putting Invasion mode, scouting, and dropdecks into regular Quick Play without LP and Faction Ranks.

I don't care if they do or not, this isn't about quickplay. Hell to be honest, I'd rather quickplay didn't exist at all, everyone in every game mode (except comp) should be participating in the faction war.

If someone is participating in the faction war, they should get faction war rewards.

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Poor sports only play when they think they'll win. Good sports play their best at all times because they love playing and they know that the game experience is about more than just their own enjoyment.

Guess I'm a neutral sport then, because neither of those define me.

I don't only play when I think I'll win, I'll play as long as there is ANY chance at all, even if I'm pretty sure I'll lose, but there's a tiny chance to pull out a win, I'll try for it. If there is 0 chance, if a win is actually impossible, I'm not going to bother... I'm just going to bow out, say GG, and move on to the next game.

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And neither were you. You quit.

Only after the point at which a win became completely impossible, I was interested in trying until my team abandoned me.. Show me a person who can win a 1v12 against a premade of non-mouth breathers and I'll change my mind.

The difference between them and me is this: they abandoned me, I didn't abandon anyone, because there was no one left to abandon. At the point where I threw in the towel, I was the only one left playing Siege.

Edited by Divenity, 12 January 2018 - 06:08 PM.

[Vagosei]

OMG. Too funny. Listen to drop calling. Follow directions and for the love of God. Push W when asked. And no lrms. Easy fix.

[Divenity]

Vagosei, on 12 January 2018 - 06:06 PM, said:

OMG. Too funny. Listen to drop calling. Follow directions and for the love of God. Push W when asked. And no lrms. Easy fix.

If only everyone did that, but they don't and won't.

[justcallme A S H]

Divenity, on 12 January 2018 - 05:20 PM, said:

I have not avoided the question, I have answered it, you not liking my answer does not mean I;m avoiding answering.

So again I will say.

Just because a thing is one way right now doesn't mean it should stay that way.

So - in your view - everything should be changed because you failed to read and understand the warning screen and now don't like what is happening as a result of your own conscious decision.

Gotcha.

Well unfortunately I have further news for you that you're still not going to like.




So there is basically nothing coming in 2018.

After 8 pages it boils down to two simple choices (YAY, we got there).

1. Keep playing it how you are, ignoring all advice and dislike Faction Play
2. Take the advice you've been given on-board and thus leading to an improved experience.


What's it gonna be?

Edited by justcallme A S H, 12 January 2018 - 06:54 PM.

[Divenity]

justcallme A S H, on 12 January 2018 - 06:47 PM, said:

So - in your view - everything should be changed

Should be changed? No. Should the devs consider it? Yeah.

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So there is basically nothing coming in 2018.

Just because it won't get implemented any time soon doesn't mean they can't take feedback.

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1. Keep playing it how you are, ignoring all advice and dislike Faction Play

I don't dislike faction play, I just think it could be done much better.

Edited by Divenity, 12 January 2018 - 07:20 PM.

[Deathlike]

All I'm seeing that if you're not putting any effort to be better, then you blame everyone else for failing you?

Am I reading this right?

Divenity, on 10 January 2018 - 09:53 PM, said:

Most PuGs don't enjoy getting stomped by premades, and most premades don't enjoy stomping PuGs.

Time and time again I hear two things

1. "go play quick play"

2. "there isn't enough population to support separated queues."

Thing is, those two statements are contradictory...If all the PuGs went and played quick play, there would be the exact same number of people left playing FP as there would be in the group only queue if queues were separated... So, why not just separate the queues?

You understand that BOTH sides need 12 players to start a match? That makes solo queue depend on 24 individuals, 12 each on both sides to start a match.

You know that takes a lot more time to occur than smaller groups right? Just math.

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Let the PuGs and the groups both contribute to the faction war with reasonably fair fights.

There's no such thing as a fair fight though. You get what you have and you play it out, especially in Faction Play. It's literally the thing that occurs in Quick Play, mainly due to population and PSR being fundamentally flawed.

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Add a checkbox for solo players to optionally fill in gaps in the group queues if they are willing, for when groups can't field a full 12 people.

That's what Faction Play already does though.

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I'd wager you'd actually get MORE people participating in FP with separated queues, since the people not doing it because they got sick of getting stomped by premades every other game would have reason to go play it again.

No, what happened when the "solo queue FP test" was that they decided to play with groups because of the waiting time.

Wait time is your enemy, and you're literally asking to wait for no match or a long wait to start in the prescribed solo FP queue.

Edited by Deathlike, 12 January 2018 - 07:27 PM.

[Rustyhammer]

justcallme A S H, on 12 January 2018 - 06:47 PM, said:

....

What's it gonna be?

It's gonna be another post next week about splitting the FP queue from just another player.


The idea of separate solo Faction Play queue was raised and refuted with the same solid argument multiple times. It won't happen within foreseeing future.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results.
-- Albert Einstein

[Divenity]

Rustyhammer, on 12 January 2018 - 07:29 PM, said:

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results.
-- Albert Einstein

Dunno who told you that was an Albert Einstein quote, but it's not, just so you know.

[justcallme A S H]

Divenity, on 12 January 2018 - 07:11 PM, said:

Should be changed? No. Should the devs consider it? Yeah.
Just because it won't get implemented any time soon doesn't mean they can't take feedback.
I don't dislike faction play, I just think it could be done much better.

Whether you think it could be done better or not, at this stage, is largely irrelevant as it won't change. Once again avoiding the question being asked. Which way...



Is it option 1 or is it option 2?


Once you work it out we can put this thread to rest and get back to the normal Faction Play forum discussions about stuff other than this. You know like, which units gen rush even PUGs and which one's don't. Very important debates they are.

We have all made many suggestions, given feedback (actually properly laid out/concise) and it has gone nowhere. And we've been doing it 24 months, yes, 2 years now. Faction Play is simple a case of - accept it for what it is and make your choice.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 12 January 2018 - 08:08 PM.

[Johnathan Tanner]

justcallme A S H, on 12 January 2018 - 08:07 PM, said:

Very important debates they are.

Yes the great work must continue.

[Divenity]

justcallme A S H, on 12 January 2018 - 08:07 PM, said:

Whether you think it could be done better or not, at this stage, is largely irrelevant as it won't change. Once again avoiding the question being asked. Which way...



Is it option 1 or is it option 2?

Not won't, might not. It won't change any time soon, that doesn't mean never.

And I've already addressed your "option 1 or option 2" question, maybe you should go back and re-read my post.

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We have all made many suggestions, given feedback (actually properly laid out/concise

My feedback is concise, unless you don't understand the definition of the word. I said everything that needed to be said in a measly 168 words. Would you rather I wall of text'd it? Because I could have, that of course would be the opposite of concise..

[justcallme A S H]

So the answer is Option 1 - You're gonna keep dropping solo and continue to complain about it?

Cool. Glad we got there.

And while you believe it's concise, you refuse to accept the fact that it is totally illogical and impossible due to population restrictions I have very clearly provided to you, yet you chose to read/understand/accept them - again, you're issue. Just like choosing to drop solo is.

End of the day it's clear you either do not understand the mode fully. And there is no way you could with 50 odd games and having played MWO for a month. OR you're just posting under an Alt-Account... Which is seemingly more likely at the moment given your arguments sound like that of another...

Edited by justcallme A S H, 12 January 2018 - 08:32 PM.

[justcallme A S H]

Funny story. I chose to drop solo sometimes. I enjoy the challenge it presents. I also like beating organised groups largely by myself. I bring proper loadouts. I communicate in game.

And loh and behold the summary of these points means... I WIN against organised opposition!

If you would like lessons on MWO. Or feedback on your builds - post them up. I will help you turn them into properly optimised builds as I doubt they are currently based on your KMDD ration. I'll even take the time out to private lobby and show you how to use them. Again, I doubt you are currently.

What say you?

Edited by justcallme A S H, 12 January 2018 - 08:38 PM.

[MischiefSC]

I'm all for discussing ways to remove pugging from FW and still let people play that content - the maps, modes, if population permits even allow IS/Clan split. I'm absolutely of the opinion that such a queue needs to remove LP rewards because, again, you're just playing new maps/modes in QP. You're not doing anything that warrants earning additional rewards at that point - just playing QP. Also you really, really don't want the actual good players from FW in that queue because it would just turn into a seal farming festival that makes the current FW look like MWOWC finals.

However quit trying to destroy the group part of FW. Quit trying to force us to only play with a few friends at a time and to not let units be units. Quit trying to nerf teamwork for people who actually can effectively communicate and coordinate with other people. The whole 'Only lances' stuff and associated ideas are terrible and much like the changes to group queue to make it more 'casual friendly' that only ended up drastically slashing the population in group queue (and driving who knows how many players to drift away as FW was never more than a shadow of what it was promised and you can't even play in a group how you want in a game literally designed around 12 v 12 combat) while actually making it WORSE for small casual groups (because now tonnage is a huge factor and not maximizing tonnage in a small group all but ensures failure) the idea of just lances in FW or otherwise trying to gimp groups in FW for being groups is horrible and needs killed with fire in front of its children as a lesson to the next generation.

End pugging in FW. Require someone to group up to play FW. Then increase rewards a bit for FW. Hell, make them scale based on who's on the other team. I've repeatedly recommended something like that.

Trying to gimp teamwork in FW however is an abomination of an idea and needs to be given 0 entertainment. It won't help the bads not be bad, it won't help the people who won't communicate suddenly learn how to function in a group or otherwise fix the crux of the issue that is some people are just really, really bad and/or emotionally unwilling to function in a group in a game designed around playing in a group.

Wait for Solaris. Let people play in Solaris and get constantly, repeatedly and endlessly destroyed in 100 match losing streaks and get that face full of reality that is "If you are consistently losing the problem is you and how you play, either the mechs you take or how you behave in a match not that somehow everyone else is cheating or needs nerfed so you can be bad and not have to get better or put in anything like comparable effort and still win". Solaris will weed out a lot of terribads from FW, I sincerely hope. So will MW5 - people who really, deep down, just want a solo gameplay experience where they can play poorly, take bad mechs and make bad choices and still win.

We will all do better with them gone. Nothing of value will be lost. Honestly if so many pugs were not so timid and taking bad builds and refusing to communicate more groups would drop in small teams more often. Right now 2 pugs being incompetent can turn a close match into a loss so most teams work hard to get to 12 people before they drop and often will just break up to QP if they don't have at least 8-10. If we got rid of the most terribad pugs maybe we absolutely would get more worthwhile players staying in FW for matches longer, improving the overall queue depth.

Quit trying to **** teamwork though. Stop it.

[Divenity]

MischiefSC, on 12 January 2018 - 09:24 PM, said:

remove LP rewards because, again, you're just playing new maps/modes in QP. You're not doing anything that warrants earning additional rewards at that point

Except for, you know, contributing to the war effort.

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However quit trying to destroy the group part of FW. Quit trying to force us to only play with a few friends at a time and to not let units be units.

I'm not, I just want groups to fight other groups instead of stomping pugs, which, from their own admission (of every premade I've asked so far), they don't enjoy doing anyways.

[justcallme A S H]

Also the other thing? PGI doesn't read this part of the forums nor implement ideas from it realistically... Otherwise FP would be glorious, truly glorious. You want to be properly heard the only real way is you have to tweet it to Russ.

So off to Twitter you go, ask Russ to split the queues.

I cannot wait to see the reply to that one.

[Divenity]

justcallme A S H, on 12 January 2018 - 09:45 PM, said:

Also the other thing? PGI doesn't read this part of the forums nor implement ideas from it realistically... Otherwise FP would be glorious, truly glorious. You want to be properly heard the only real way is you have to tweet it to Russ.

Truly inspiring development methodology, that is.

[MischiefSC]

Divenity, on 12 January 2018 - 09:37 PM, said:

Except for, you know, contributing to the war effort.

I'm not, I just want groups to fight other groups instead of stomping pugs, which, from their own admission (of every premade I've asked so far), they don't enjoy doing anyways.

So get pugs out of FW. Let's make it happen. Require being in a premade to play in FW. You could have an opt-in for people who really, really want to but that's likely to bugger up match making.

LP exists as an extra reward for playing in a harder environment. It's not for 'contributing to the war effort'. You're contributing as much as anyone in QP is contributing. You're facing the same caliber of challenges. You want LP and the bigger cbill rewards you play against organized teams.

[Tarl Cabot]

Divenity, on 12 January 2018 - 09:37 PM, said:

Except for, you know, contributing to the war effort.

I'm not, I just want groups to fight other groups instead of stomping pugs, which, from their own admission (of every premade I've asked so far), they don't enjoy doing anyways.

I, even though I solo pug more often than not, would not want a hard separation in place for FP/Siege. There isnt a population to separate it like Quick Play is currently setup. An option would be for PGI to add a selection to opt in for solo/group only. Which ever queue needs a body gets it first. Deselected would be normal FP, and this would apply only to Siege but not with Scouting.

This would not prevent sync dropping, and that is one flag I do not believe PGI would even code in. Of course if a duo is dropping in group and no other groups dropping at the moment that would pull 10 solo pugs into group. The question would be, would PGI code it so even if a 12-man is in queue it will not pull all solo pugs, that the opposition would require a formed group, even if it is a duo? Unlikely not.

[TWIAFU]

Xannatharr, on 12 January 2018 - 04:30 PM, said:

I've done it plenty of times, but I usually wait until I have enough experience with the game to understand it fully.

Edit: Starting to think this is just a troll thread guys... there can't be any way he is actually this ignorant.

Xann

Oh ye of little faith.