467 replies to this topic

[Exilyth]

I'd guess new players quit because after grinding up to the four mechs required to make a deck just to get utterly devastated is not a very uplifting experience. That QP plays completely different and the first drops in FP feel like banging your head agaist a wall doesn't help aleviate the issues.

If there were better ingame tutorials available and maybe a cheap metadropdeck-pack you could buy for IS/CLAN (e.g. 3x heavy, 1x medium mid range laser vomit), people would have an easier time getting into FP.

[Ssamout]

Exilyth, on 17 February 2018 - 08:39 AM, said:

I'd guess new players quit because after grinding up to the four mechs required to make a deck just to get utterly devastated is not a very uplifting experience. That QP plays completely different and the first drops in FP feel like banging your head agaist a wall doesn't help aleviate the issues.

All this should tell you that "grinding up to four mechs" is really not enough; a.) mechs, b.) experience, c.) skills to start playing in a mode where there are no 'tiers' and no fcks given about stomping your sorry ***.

Grind that QP more if you are not ready. Perhaps try to graduate first to group queue where the matches kinda go like in qp, and learn what it means to play as a team by finding a group first ...

Most that play fw mode have like 30-300 mechs from where to chose for different maps and modes as required. One set of meta mechs is not enough to be competitive in the mode.

Edited by Ssamout, 17 February 2018 - 09:01 AM.

[darkcyd]

Ssamout, on 17 February 2018 - 08:59 AM, said:

All this should tell you that "grinding up to four mechs" is really not enough; a.) mechs, b.) experience, c.) skills to start playing in a mode where there are no 'tiers' and no fcks given about stomping your sorry ***.

Grind that QP more if you are not ready. Perhaps try to graduate first to group queue where the matches kinda go like in qp, and learn what it means to play as a team by finding a group first ...

Most that play fw mode have like 30-300 mechs from where to chose for different maps and modes as required. One set of meta mechs is not enough to be competitive in the mode.

So, I guess the real question is if they did a full wipe, would you do it again? Is faction play worth the grind from a fresh account? With the queue problems, finding a unit, learning curve and steam rolling if you mess any of that up, I think from the majority and by that I mean well into the 99 percentile would say no. Which is why you only have 5% participating of people WITH accounts.

And you really can't blame them. Most people who play this either played earlier mechwarriors or are battletech fans. They, and I will lump myself in with them are loyal to the game. But you do have to call Pirahna out for milking the fan base instead of growing it.

Edited by darkcyd, 17 February 2018 - 06:14 PM.

[Cataphractos]

Okay, I've started the new thread here AND I ALREADY HAVE A QUESTION AAAAAAAH oh no (flails hopelessly)

https://mwomercs.com...s-super-thread/

Edited by Cataphractos, 17 February 2018 - 08:15 PM.

[Ssamout]

darkcyd, on 17 February 2018 - 05:57 PM, said:

So, I guess the real question is if they did a full wipe, would you do it again? Is faction play worth the grind from a fresh account? With the queue problems, finding a unit, learning curve and steam rolling if you mess any of that up, I think from the majority and by that I mean well into the 99 percentile would say no. Which is why you only have 5% participating of people WITH accounts.

And you really can't blame them. Most people who play this either played earlier mechwarriors or are battletech fans. They, and I will lump myself in with them are loyal to the game. But you do have to call Pirahna out for milking the fan base instead of growing it.

What you mean full wipe? If I would have to grind all my mechs and everything again, I doubt I would touch this game again. Or at least that would be good time to have a long holiday away. But thats not faction play specific, just overall feeling. I can play FP with full trial deck and do better than most pugs you ran across. In the end, it's not really the mechs as much as your own skills you are bringing to the table. If a player has played so long as to grind a feeble 4 mechs to full mastery, 99/100 times he is still a total scrub with no real use in a proper FP match.

I've always felt that there should have been a proper barrier of entry until you can drop in FP. If that would have been placed from the start CW would have perhaps fared a bit better, as many quit the mode when there was no challenge in beating up players with seriously bad builds and no skills. There have been times when this mode was in a really bad state and times when all the bad players where stomped (repeatedly) out of the mode and good matches were to be had.

Skill differences in this game are so huge that its ridiculous some times. Aaand thats where all the damn hackusations come from. "You are not a good player until you have been blamed for hacking".

For me FP is kinda end game content. Its a place where I can bring mechs optimized for certain situations, doing specific tasks, like in comp play. Normal qp/group queue doesnt give you that. In FP I expect to face tough opposition bringing optimized loadouts and decks and steamrolling as a group, and hope that my side does that also. Longer match duration is a bonus on top.
As all public game modes in this game are in a bad state, I've found most fun and challenge when dropping solo/with a small group in FP. I like playing against good players that kill you fast if you give them a chance.

That said, there are days when dropping with my subpar dakka mechs in qp is the fun I'm looking for. Some times you just wanna derp around. I would not bring those ****** builds to FP though, unless in a big group that can tank for me while I'm chipping away. You kinda want to carry your weight and then some in faction play..

[Peter2k]

Cataphractos, on 17 February 2018 - 08:14 PM, said:

Okay, I've started the new thread here AND I ALREADY HAVE A QUESTION AAAAAAAH oh no (flails hopelessly)

https://mwomercs.com...s-super-thread/

check your messages for that ebon hero you've just got

[K O Z A K]

I finally ran out of SP/GXP pool from the skill tree introduction. Honestly, there's no way I'm going to manually grind mechs from this point, so w/e mechs I have now are probably the only ones I'll use. After for the first time since the skill tree seeing how hilariously slowly XP is gained, I'm amazed new players don't quit after 5 matches

[Johnathan Tanner]

Hazeclaw, on 18 February 2018 - 04:05 PM, said:

I finally ran out of SP/GXP pool from the skill tree introduction. Honestly, there's no way I'm going to manually grind mechs from this point, so w/e mechs I have now are probably the only ones I'll use. After for the first time since the skill tree seeing how hilariously slowly XP is gained, I'm amazed new players don't quit after 5 matches

Yup they up'ed the grind in this game to 11. Not to forget that alot of new players will undoubtedly make mistakes on their trees, And have to grind all over again. Considering how trash quick play and gq are. Its no wonder new players come running onto units guns in FP.

[naterist]

Johnathan Tanner, on 18 February 2018 - 04:10 PM, said:

Yup they up'ed the grind in this game to 11. Not to forget that alot of new players will undoubtedly make mistakes on their trees, And have to grind all over again. Considering how trash quick play and gq are. Its no wonder new players come running onto units guns in FP.

it makes a bit of sense. more to grind, more matches dropped in for grinding, more people in match means faster que time, etc etc.

they didnt take into account that people might just go "f this, i give up" and leave, but hey, at least theres a smidgeon of logic this time.

[Sebaztien Hawke]

justcallme A S H, on 15 February 2018 - 09:28 PM, said:

1. Use Fullscreen-Windowed. Do not use any other option, and don't argue it either cause we've all been there. Also use the Steam Launcher, it's better and will crosscheck for errors easily (sometimes they happen).

2. Don't run every graphics on Ultra (if you are). The engine is ****, everyone knows about it and it's not a MWO issue as such.

3. If you don't have a SSD... Get one.

I'm running on a 2600k (2011, 7 years old) and until recently a GTX970 @ 1080p. Game ran fine with around 45FPS.

Currently using a GTX1070 @ 1440p with the same CPU and getting around 55-65FPS average, sometimes more or less depending on a dozen factors and the random FPS drops that we all have to live with. I know my CPU is probably a limiting factor there as well although I've never actually checked.

As the others have said though you are not ready for Faction Play. You have at least 3-5months of learning the game and if you wanna LORENerd yourself, FP is absolutely not the place to do that. You will get eaten alive by proper FPS/META builds.

That’s interesting, I’m using a STRIX 1070 @ 2.0+ GHz and I get 90-160 fps on ultra settings at 1440p. That is with an i7 8700k currently at 4.8 Ghz on all cores, or 4.9GHz single. So the CPU must be contributing a fair bit. (That extra head room is why I’d love to see more terrain/structure deformation and destruction in the game).

I’m pretty sure I would have been getting a constant 60fps+ on my i7 4790 at 4.1GHz though...

[Sebaztien Hawke]

As a moderately capable player with a few years experience, I have only played ONE invasion drop and TWO recon drops as a solo mercenary.

I just don’t think you get enough pop up ‘call to arms’ and games as a solo mercenary player. I haven’t been able to get into enough games yet to learn the ins and outs.

The specific rules for each drop deck in each battle could be made more simple to understand, and I think mercs should be able to rock a clan mech when assisting Inner Sphere forces if they want to.

I suspect the hardcore “meta or go home” pros might put people off too.

I’m looking forward to Solaris... I think that might be where the real faction warfare (and role playing) will be.

[justcallme A S H]

If you think Solaris will be roleplay... You're going to be in for an awakening.

[justcallme A S H]

Sebaztien Hawke, on 18 February 2018 - 08:16 PM, said:

That’s interesting, I’m using a STRIX 1070 @ 2.0+ GHz and I get 90-160 fps on ultra settings at 1440p. That is with an i7 8700k currently at 4.8 Ghz on all cores, or 4.9GHz single. So the CPU must be contributing a fair bit. (That extra head room is why I’d love to see more terrain/structure deformation and destruction in the game).

I’m pretty sure I would have been getting a constant 60fps+ on my i7 4790 at 4.1GHz though...

While it's kinda off topic... Testing the last hour I'm anywhere from 55FPS avg (River City) to 85FPS avg (HPG). Jumps around a bit. Didn't think it was getting up to 85 as an average, but well it is, so that's good. Card is clocked similar to yours by the sound.

CPU sits @ 4.4ghz as well.

[Sebaztien Hawke]

justcallme A S H, on 18 February 2018 - 10:34 PM, said:

While it's kinda off topic... Testing the last hour I'm anywhere from 55FPS avg (River City) to 85FPS avg (HPG). Jumps around a bit. Didn't think it was getting up to 85 as an average, but well it is, so that's good. Card is clocked similar to yours by the sound.

CPU sits @ 4.4ghz as well.

That sounds very playable. The 1070 is an excellent GPU.

[Yondu Udonta]

Ssamout, on 18 February 2018 - 01:53 AM, said:

I've always felt that there should have been a proper barrier of entry until you can drop in FP. If that would have been placed from the start CW would have perhaps fared a bit better, as many quit the mode when there was no challenge in beating up players with seriously bad builds and no skills. There have been times when this mode was in a really bad state and times when all the bad players where stomped (repeatedly) out of the mode and good matches were to be had.

Speaking of seriously bad builds, I went backstabbing today in Emerald Taiga Defense and found a juicy SNV with 2LRM20A 2ERLL. Lurms on attack, lurmao really. Decided to farm some damage on him taking out his LT initially from the rear and finishing him off with the RT. Saw on the paper doll that his RT was taken out and was proceeding to find my next target when I realized my warhorn didn't go off. Then I realized. Oh **** me I didn't get the kill because that guy was running a standard engine instead of a Clan XL on his SNV. That's how bad some potatoes are when they drop into FP. But yknow I can't comment on it, cos ultimately FP needs more players and if I laughed at his build I would probably make another guy quit FP.

[Yondu Udonta]

Johnathan Tanner, on 18 February 2018 - 04:10 PM, said:

Yup they up'ed the grind in this game to 11. Not to forget that alot of new players will undoubtedly make mistakes on their trees, And have to grind all over again. Considering how trash quick play and gq are. Its no wonder new players come running onto units guns in FP.

Absolutely ridiculous how many times I need to drop my unmastered mechs in FP in order to fully train them. Considering that my account was started post Civil War patch, everything was trained from scratch, no HSP whatsoever. There's so much difference between running an unmastered mech and a mastered mech that dropping just one unmastered mech can result in a significant decrease in match performance. And no, no QP for me to train mechs. QP is for plebs.

[Peter2k]

Sebaztien Hawke, on 18 February 2018 - 08:16 PM, said:

That’s interesting, I’m using a STRIX 1070 @ 2.0+ GHz and I get 90-160 fps on ultra settings at 1440p. That is with an i7 8700k currently at 4.8 Ghz on all cores, or 4.9GHz single. So the CPU must be contributing a fair bit. (That extra head room is why I’d love to see more terrain/structure deformation and destruction in the game).

I’m pretty sure I would have been getting a constant 60fps+ on my i7 4790 at 4.1GHz though...

It's the CPU
I've got an 7600K at 5.2Ghz, there are no slowdowns any more

ASH didn't say how fast his 2600K clocks, usually they're nicely OC'd though
Edit:
Ahh, 4.4Ghz
Me thinks to remember that about 4.5 was a golden value on Intel chips and MWO's performance (and slowdowns)

Errm
I don't have that dev comment handy any more (I have the link to the comment somewhere though), but Karl Berg has been asked like 2 or 3 years ago about hardware suggestions, 4k textures and stuff (man so long ago and still the same engine/API, it shows)

Was explained that there are a lot of draw calls being made in MWO, because of the nature of the Lego like Mechs, Particles, shadows and yada yada
The thing is
DX 11 and 9 cave in with too many draw calls and they don't multithread very well
So many times the gpu is waiting on the CPU, but not all cores, usually only the first one

If you would go down in clocks with your 8700k to 4Ghz (old boost speed for older Intel chips on all cores, think skylake or older) then your fps should also come down

Also RAM speed can matter, as MWO is an unusual taxing game for cpu's (or well considering how it looks and how old it is)

Also I'd rather have an AA mode that doesn't blur and sharper textures
Btw it was stated in a dev log long ago that PGI works internally with 4k or higher res textures, sparking a discussion with Russ, the gist of it was that PGI doesn't want to add 4k textures because of install size (which still seems silly to me since they could make it an optional add-on)

Yondu the Ravager, on 19 February 2018 - 05:53 AM, said:

QP is for plebs.

Guess you like pain a lot

Edited by Peter2k, 19 February 2018 - 12:57 PM.

[Sebaztien Hawke]

justcallme A S H, on 18 February 2018 - 09:14 PM, said:

If you think Solaris will be roleplay... You're going to be in for an awakening.

- More in the sense of players taking on the role of a gladiator, building a career, maybe taunting in chat from their pilot’s point of view. Out of combat RP.

[VeeOt Dragon]

was actually thinking about this a bit the other day. as a new player (started early Dec I think, thank you Holiday Event.) I think the biggest reason most players go into FP to early is the rewards. if you are like me and on a small fixed income you don't have the cash to spend on things like Mech Bays. then you look and see "hey I can get free ones by playing this mode". so you play till you feel like you have a good handle on the basics and jump in only to get 12-48 steam rollers over and over. after experiencing this I nearly quit myself. also in QP there seems little if any tactical play or communication so there you aren't prepared for the required levels of Team play required to do well in FP.

for all those try-hards and meta nonsense players out there (come on a game is about fun, where is the diversity in builds I was hoping to see, the mystery of seeing an enemy mech and not knowing just what it might be packing. hell I get a good laugh when someone in a really derpy build takes me out.) if you really want to keep solo players and new players out of FP then simply get rid of those rewards, problem solved. without the draw of those rewards there is little reason for lower skilled players to try it, so fewer PUGS in your FP.

the only reason I went into FP way to early (seriously I had 2 low skilled custom mechs and 2 trials)
was the need for the mech bays. 4 really isn't enough but I understand PGI's reasoning, they need to sell those micro transactions to keep the game going. if new players had some way of gaining mech bays (or other rewards like say colors or decals, not including special events) they might stay in QP and GQ longer gaining the skills to do better in FP.

(as for TS or other outside programs, I have said it many times but just NO. you shouldn't have to use outside services just to group up and work together or find a team that works for you, its one of my biggest issues with many multiplayer games.)

(a bit sarcastic but any other solution would require a much higher population base than the game seems to have and I don't see there being many more in the future. actually with MW:5 and Battletech (I know i'm really looking forward to this one) on the horizon I see a major drop in the player base. the loss might even be enough to kill MWO who knows.)

[Kubernetes]

Yondu the Ravager, on 19 February 2018 - 05:48 AM, said:

Speaking of seriously bad builds, I went backstabbing today in Emerald Taiga Defense and found a juicy SNV with 2LRM20A 2ERLL. Lurms on attack, lurmao really. Decided to farm some damage on him taking out his LT initially from the rear and finishing him off with the RT. Saw on the paper doll that his RT was taken out and was proceeding to find my next target when I realized my warhorn didn't go off. Then I realized. Oh **** me I didn't get the kill because that guy was running a standard engine instead of a Clan XL on his SNV. That's how bad some potatoes are when they drop into FP. But yknow I can't comment on it, cos ultimately FP needs more players and if I laughed at his build I would probably make another guy quit FP.

No defense for that build, but the SNV is one Clan mech you'll often find using a Std engine. It's got a bunch of free tonnage, a low engine cap, and usually boats energy weapons, which are fairly light.