718 replies to this topic

[Darian DelFord]

Quote

Ok still doesn’t change the fact Tier means nothing. It’s just an XP bar.

2nd time you have said that yet you have been on the forums since 2012 and are only Tier 2. So how much experience do you have? While I agree it is an XP bar, It does show others you have played a bit more.

[Imperius]

Darian DelFord, on 15 March 2018 - 05:28 AM, said:

2nd time you have said that yet you have been on the forums since 2012 and are only Tier 2. So how much experience do you have? While I agree it is an XP bar, It does show others you have played a bit more.

I’ve barely played because it’s not fun...

[Imperius]

dario03, on 15 March 2018 - 05:27 AM, said:

You said the game wasn't being fair because it had changes that were only half done. Basically saying that engine desync isn't fair because it lowered the agility of assaults. I gave you an example of a change that really only hurt smaller fast mechs that was put in long before the engine change.
And I never said streaks on assaults. I said streaks, because they are basically anti-light weapons for some reason.

Legging isn’t always active it’s only active “if someone can and does” shoot the legs. Hill climb and engine desync are always active. Streaks was not put in for lights and the only reason they’re effective is because they track through the server code and require little to no skill to use because they remove the need to have pin point aiming.

Not the same trade offs as you’d like to think. Collisions and stopping when hitting objects is missing.

Edit:

Don’t worry dude. You and I have gone back and fourth at the same subject for years. They’re not adding these systems. They don’t care or can’t.

Edited by Imperius, 15 March 2018 - 05:44 AM.

[Darian DelFord]

So I assume you were not here when they have been put in twice now? Granted they sucked and caused more issues than the fixed. But they have been implemented

[Imperius]

Darian DelFord, on 15 March 2018 - 05:49 AM, said:

So I assume you were not here when they have been put in twice now? Granted they sucked and caused more issues than the fixed. But they have been implemented

Clearly you don’t read or have very bad memory I said a few posts beck I was here and it was wonderful watching them hit stuff and stop.

[Dogstar]

Samial, on 15 March 2018 - 03:08 AM, said:

For the 50th time i'm not tier 5...

Show your tier then dude, it's easy enough to do in the forum.

[Imperius]

Dogstar, on 15 March 2018 - 07:54 AM, said:

Show your tier then dude, it's easy enough to do in the forum.

If he’s Tier 5 his opinion is more important than yours to PGI, just remember that they balance at tier 5 not comp level (and no tier one isn’t comp)

Edited by Imperius, 15 March 2018 - 08:12 AM.

[McGoat]

Dogstar, on 15 March 2018 - 07:54 AM, said:

Show your tier then dude, it's easy enough to do in the forum.

Does it really matter what tier he's in? I very casually play QP, often not more than a few matches a week, and also often to aid in leveling up unskilled mechs; despite having logged 10+ matches in almost every season it's been tracked I am not T1

Edited by McGoat, 15 March 2018 - 08:25 AM.

[dario03]

Imperius, on 15 March 2018 - 05:40 AM, said:

Legging isn’t always active it’s only active “if someone can and does” shoot the legs. Hill climb and engine desync are always active. Streaks was not put in for lights and the only reason they’re effective is because they track through the server code and require little to no skill to use because they remove the need to have pin point aiming.

Not the same trade offs as you’d like to think. Collisions and stopping when hitting objects is missing.

Edit:

Don’t worry dude. You and I have gone back and fourth at the same subject for years. They’re not adding these systems. They don’t care or can’t.

Your points on streaks is pretty much what I was getting at. You talked about how getting cored out from behind by a light wouldn't be fun for a new player in an assault, getting killed by an auto aim weapon that ignores a major part of light defense (being harder to hit) isn't fun for a light player.
And yeah I think those trade offs do work since when we look at the game as a whole right now assaults are doing fine. There is no reason to nerf lights or buff assaults when it is not uncommon at all to see assaults put up massive damage. The kind of damage that makes people scream OP if they see a light doing it, is basically par for the course for a good assault.

So like I said earlier, giving assaults more agility would be having your cake and eating it too. They need more than just low top speed as a downside to keep them balanced.

And yeah I recall having these conversations before and I don't think we will be seeing knockdowns come back in MWO. Now MWO2 or whatever comes out at some future point might. If that happens will the knockdown advocates be okay with a balanced knockdown system? Lights harder to knockdown by terrain but easier to knockdown by mechs but pop right up, assaults easier to fall down hills but harder to knockdown by mechs but have to sit there for a while? Might not be a bad idea for a Jenner to just jump off a building into the back of a Dire and knock it down. Not sure if everybody would find the game funner if we are all falling constantly.

[Imperius]

dario03, on 15 March 2018 - 11:33 AM, said:

Your points on streaks is pretty much what I was getting at. You talked about how getting cored out from behind by a light wouldn't be fun for a new player in an assault, getting killed by an auto aim weapon that ignores a major part of light defense (being harder to hit) isn't fun for a light player.
And yeah I think those trade offs do work since when we look at the game as a whole right now assaults are doing fine. There is no reason to nerf lights or buff assaults when it is not uncommon at all to see assaults put up massive damage. The kind of damage that makes people scream OP if they see a light doing it, is basically par for the course for a good assault.

So like I said earlier, giving assaults more agility would be having your cake and eating it too. They need more than just low top speed as a downside to keep them balanced.

And yeah I recall having these conversations before and I don't think we will be seeing knockdowns come back in MWO. Now MWO2 or whatever comes out at some future point might. If that happens will the knockdown advocates be okay with a balanced knockdown system? Lights harder to knockdown by terrain but easier to knockdown by mechs but pop right up, assaults easier to fall down hills but harder to knockdown by mechs but have to sit there for a while? Might not be a bad idea for a Jenner to just jump off a building into the back of a Dire and knock it down. Not sure if everybody would find the game funner if we are all falling constantly.

I don’t want knockdowns I was ok with the stop when you run into crap at x speed. Also I didn’t say they needed a buff they never needed the nerf is what I’m getting at.

Edited by Imperius, 15 March 2018 - 12:26 PM.

[Der Geisterbaer]

dario03, on 15 March 2018 - 11:33 AM, said:

If that happens will the knockdown advocates be okay with a balanced knockdown system?

They will ... right up to the point where a jump capable Light or Medium hits their cockpit once or twice in Death from Above style an kills them without losing its legs.

[Imperius]

Der Geisterbaer, on 15 March 2018 - 12:29 PM, said:

They will ... right up to the point where a jump capable Light or Medium hits their cockpit once or twice in Death from Above style an kills them without losing its legs.

Please hover™️ at me so I can get a free kill lol.

[Der Geisterbaer]

Imperius, on 15 March 2018 - 12:33 PM, said:

Please hover™️ at me so I can get a free kill lol.

Let's forget that on most maps there's no actually need for a jump capable Light or Medium trying to "hover" at you in order to hit your head but can get to a higher point and then simply drop on you. Let's just focus on the prospect of "collision damage" where that mech indeed "hovers" in at 130km/h from the exact same area that you currently have your issues with: from the back ... preferably while you are just turning towards him

Edited by Der Geisterbaer, 15 March 2018 - 12:42 PM.

[dario03]

Imperius, on 15 March 2018 - 12:25 PM, said:

I don’t want knockdowns I was ok with the stop when you run into crap at x speed. Also I didn’t say they needed a buff they never needed the nerf is what I’m getting at.

They seem to be doing fine with it. And I'd say in some cases they definitely did need it. KDK3 was a have your cake and eat it too mech since its only downside was ~60kph top speed. Which like I said earlier isn't enough to have balance across the classes. Battlemasters and Banshees were also very powerful around then though with all energy builds.
I would say the 40kph legged speed limit nerf is more unneeded since a ~70kph Jenner is still far to slow to be much of a threat, and its not like assaults have most of the rest of their armor fall off when you destroy a component.

[Zergling]

McGoat, on 15 March 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

Does it really matter what tier he's in? I very casually play QP, often not more than a few matches a week, and also often to aid in leveling up unskilled mechs; despite having logged 10+ matches in almost every season it's been tracked I am not T1

Tier actually does matter, because of matchmaker behaviour. If you're Tier 1, the opposition you face is much more likely to be experienced and skilled than at lower Tiers.

Like, I was hitting top 1-2% when I was Tier 2, but my stats tanked hard after I hit Tier 1, dropping to top 20% range, entirely because I was consistently facing more dangerous enemy players that I couldn't beat as easily.

Things that work at Tiers 2, 3, 4 and 5 frequently just don't work at Tier 1, and that includes running MGs on slow mechs.

Edited by Zergling, 15 March 2018 - 07:39 PM.

[PocketYoda]

El Bandito, on 15 March 2018 - 03:10 AM, said:

Hahaha, nope. According the Jarl's list, I spent only 6% of my matches in a Light, and 34% of my matches in an Assault mech. Yet I do defend Lights from nerfs. https://leaderboard....ch?u=el+bandito

I do not want lights nerfed, i want either clan mgs nerfed or mg boating nerfed..

Curccu, on 15 March 2018 - 03:21 AM, said:

It's easier to convince people if you make your tier visible..
Actually you don't have to convince anyone after making it visible publicly, they can see it and cannot claim otherwise.

https://mwomercs.com/profile
Publicly Display Tier

Did that work.. Jesus no one believes anyone anymore.

Edited by Samial, 15 March 2018 - 10:29 PM.

[YueFei]

Samial, on 15 March 2018 - 10:23 PM, said:

I do not want lights nerfed, i want either clan mgs nerfed or mg boating nerfed..

Well, it goes like this.

You should stand in a place with good map vision, long sight lines, to see MG-boating lights at a distance. Shoot them before they get into effective range.

But then you get suppressed by the enemy's bigger mechs with their own long range weapons. So you hunker down. You no longer threaten a decent region of the map. Your sight lines are restricted.

The enemy's MG-boating lights now have more freedom of movement. Freedom which they use to close in on you.

Then they pop up at short range and shred you.

Sounds pretty balanced to me, to be honest. Sounds like teamwork.

[Curccu]

Samial, on 15 March 2018 - 10:23 PM, said:

I do not want lights nerfed, i want either clan mgs nerfed or mg boating nerfed..

Did that work.. Jesus no one believes anyone anymore.

Hey thanks to two dudes world is filled with fake news and alternate facts.

[Mcgral18]

Gristle Missile, on 14 March 2018 - 02:51 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/paARW9xs2nY?t=10m55s
Watch this vid of a Piranha face tanking a supernova and completely solo killing it with just MG damage

What a wonderful example of a Potato (and what even a single Flamer can do to a heatcap)

He had 3 chances to shoot/hit the Piranha, and he failed fantastically on all counts
With Lasers
Pulse Lasers.


LightsOP plz #PGIplz nerf

razenWing, on 14 March 2018 - 04:56 PM, said:

Right, cause we all remembered how Kodiak was like a ballerina. Right...

Get real dood, Kodiak had enough agility to beat an Atlas, but it was no where close to "dancing" with a 35 tonner. Now, it can't even out dance an Atlas, which it was DESIGNED TO DO. So no, no part of your sentence was remotely accurate.

It had a 35% Torso Twist speed quirk
It had a high engine cap

It was marginally less agile than the H2C in comparable builds (2 UAC10 VS 4 UAC10)
I called it the SupaHunchDakkaBear for a reason
Effectively 2 H2Cs strapped together, but without the agility penalty



It isn't that anymore
It isn't that at all
Can't even stop before falling off a ledge

[dario03]

Samial, on 15 March 2018 - 10:23 PM, said:

I do not want lights nerfed, i want either clan mgs nerfed or mg boating nerfed..

Thats basically nerfing lights since you don't see other mechs boating MGs very much. Be like when they nerfed MGs years ago and it had almost no effect on most mechs but basically killed the Ember.