146 replies to this topic

[Kusok Myasa]

All ppl with good dmg numbers contribute. And I don't need your "armor sharing"

[justcallme A S H]

Kusok Myasa, on 24 February 2020 - 03:07 PM, said:

All ppl with good dmg numbers contribute.

Not entirely accurate.

[Kusok Myasa]

It's actually funny when ppl cannot do 500 dmg and blame the person who did 1800-1900 dmg for the loss because he was not "sharing his armor"

[K O Z A K]

Kusok Myasa, on 24 February 2020 - 03:34 PM, said:

It's actually funny when ppl cannot do 500 dmg and blame the person who did 1800-1900 dmg for the loss because he was not "sharing his armor"

yeah, it's also funny when a person who did 1800 dmg and is on his first mech in wave 4 is blaming others for the loss because they're "pugok"

also, is this primos qp alt? lol

[Kusok Myasa]

Hazeclaw, on 24 February 2020 - 03:43 PM, said:

yeah, it's also funny when a person who did 1800 dmg and is on his first mech in wave 4 is blaming others for the loss because they're "pugok"

also, is this primos qp alt? lol

what?

[AizakG]

Vellron2005, on 24 February 2020 - 03:27 AM, said:

They seem to contribute very little, yet the numbers say otherwise. Also, they don't share armor.

Depends on what exactly you're talking about. If they're 1.4km+ away with 2erLL, or 1erPPC, or 4lb2s doing 0-399 damage total, spread all over random components, while surviving 5 minutes after everyone on your team is dead, yeah, they suck. If they're 500m-1km away, doing 1k+ damage with 8ac2 or 5erLL or 4erppc, and getting kills, they're carrying your team, and you should thank them.

Keep in mind, being a priority threat to the enemy team is more beneficial than 'sharing armor' in soloq. If you can keep extreme agro on the enemy team, dealing high dps in optimal range, focusing components, getting kills, you won't help your team much by overexposing and taking loads of damage to get the enemy's attention away from your team's 4hmg kodiak that's staring at a rock.

If we are to presume your team's pilots are on par with your ability to kill mechs though, especially if we presume a certain level of team coordination, then yeah, generally, you want your fresh mechs to take point and your damaged mechs to pull back so they can continue supporting you. But even at 1km away, if you are dishing out a lot of damage, you can still agro or kill enemies, being a threatening annoyance, sort of like a good light mech.

[justcallme A S H]

Kusok Myasa, on 24 February 2020 - 03:34 PM, said:

It's actually funny when ppl cannot do 500 dmg and blame the person who did 1800-1900 dmg for the loss because he was not "sharing his armor"

Sitting @ 1500m with LBX2s plinking away for 1800dmg is about as useful as the 500dmg user.

They are the same thing = both garbage.

[Prototelis]

Health pooling absolutely is a component in winning because like several other good practices it helps to mitigate attrition.

Thats why I don't use the term "armor sharing" because most people seem to equate that term to "eating **** for no reason."

The simplest and easiest thing you can do is present more things to shoot than you are being presented with, and that takes many forms.

Edited by Prototelis, 24 February 2020 - 05:23 PM.

[Flyby215]

AizakG, on 24 February 2020 - 04:01 PM, said:

Keep in mind, being a priority threat to the enemy team is more beneficial than 'sharing armor' in soloq. If you can keep extreme agro on the enemy team, dealing high dps in optimal range, focusing components, getting kills, you won't help your team much by overexposing and taking loads of damage to get the enemy's attention away from your team's 4hmg kodiak that's staring at a rock.

This sounds an awful lot like why many assault mechs are being left behind

justcallme A S H, on 24 February 2020 - 04:05 PM, said:

Sitting @ 1500m with LBX2s plinking away for 1800dmg is about as useful as the 500dmg user.

They are the same thing = both garbage.

If someone actually manages to get 1,800 damage from 1,500m back with only LBX2s, I would be thoroughly impressed

[K O Z A K]

Flyby215, on 24 February 2020 - 08:12 PM, said:

If someone actually manages to get 1,800 damage from 1,500m back with only LBX2s, I would be thoroughly impressed

it's really not that hard to do that in FP

[justcallme A S H]

Yeah it isn't that hard when you bring 2 x Anni with 1500 ammo+.

Seen it a number of times and, of course, players doing such things lose despite claiming they are "gud" despite their 2,000dmg having little to no impact on match outcome.

[JadePanther]

hmm how to poke my nose in this one.. campy sniping isnt really a new thing, it just may have fallen out of favor for a while.. tho i havent played much since the whole MW5 thing burned up the place and can imagine things are not very suited for camping in the nascar world. I enjoyed playing the ERLL sniping role.. though when I really liked it more by another name "Long range harrasser".. And i think that name kinda sums up some of the obvious reasons for it.. Its not for everyone, its not always right or good, and not everyone can really pull it off.. That and ranged weapons arent really what they used to be

While there can be calls of you're useless cause your're not brawling and sharing armor I tend to disagree when its done well.. I can do it well when i really put the effort in, and when it does it can be real gold.. You might have to suffer a bit in the meantime.. but of course people are gonna hate you cause you're not brawling in the nascar with everyone else.. Which leads to the question, why the hell does everyone have to nascar..

How to play it depends alot on how enemys tend to react as well as the loadout/mobility.. shoot n scoot, or stealthy sniper and if done from advantagous positioning it can be alot of helpful damage.. Then theres the bonus of bieng the carrot on a stick for a few donkeys that decide they may want to squirrel after me.. Or just get the enemy mechs to stop and start looking around for me.. Either way i've become a distraction from thier focus on the front.. Even better If i can get a high value threat distracted..

If i get the distraction I'm pulling guys away from fighting my team or even putting them in a crossfire.. If they dont come after me i can end up getting lots of time for well placed shots targetting weak parts or rear armor locations.. If i get 3 people to pull off and deal with me then my team doesnt need my armor as i've cut off part of the enemys firepower and given my team less mechs to fight meaning more focused fire on the enemy while facing less opposing damage..

Things of wonder can happen with just 2 ERLL if played well.. i've mined alot of salt as i whittle down teams and they see thier 10 v 1 reduced to a 2 v 1.. I had a friend whos favorite mech was the 2 ERLL spider and i cant recall how many times i've watched as our team would be rooting for him to clutch the win.. Not gonna lie but those samson and goliath moments are pretty awesome to be in.. It gets pretty thrilling as you start knocking off enemys on your way to a shorthanded comeback.. Especially when its something thats not an OP meta monster damage machine..

Personally tho i just enjoy going against the grain and trying to do things anti-mainstream.. Its boring and lame doing the same old thing.. And thats whats been the downhill for the longest time in one of my opinions.. The games been headed down this path that leads the gameplay into the same old boring routine of how and where a match plays out.. And most of the time thats nascar brawling..

If something different is happening now tho then try to embrace it and make more odd things happen.. if flavors gonna get back in the game then its going to have to be by players trying to do different things and shake it up.. you might be surprised how much fun it is when a team does something different.. But in the end nascar isnt fun, I think the decline of the past few years into mostly nascar can be obivous there..

[Vellron2005]

BlaizerP, on 24 February 2020 - 07:00 AM, said:

Mention of camping behind spawns leads me to believe you are talking Primo and friends, who have been doing that lately in FP.

Those guys are a whole other topic.

Well I WAS trying to avoid name and shame COC violation you know.. but yes.. players like that.. you're on the right track..

AizakG, on 24 February 2020 - 04:01 PM, said:

Keep in mind, being a priority threat to the enemy team is more beneficial than 'sharing armor' in soloq. If you can keep extreme agro on the enemy team, dealing high dps in optimal range, focusing components, getting kills, you won't help your team much by overexposing and taking loads of damage to get the enemy's attention away from your team's 4hmg kodiak that's staring at a rock.

Sounds like my LRM play.. I usually draw the ire of the enemy team very quickly and am often the focus of rushes.. I imagine them screaming over comms something along the lines of "get that $%/ing LRM boat!

That's a nice way to explain why LRM boats don't need to share armor much.. As long as they work with their team..

My ability to survive such rushes or draw rushers into my team's firing line is what gives me pride so many times..

Edited by Vellron2005, 25 February 2020 - 04:06 AM.

[Prototelis]

Vellron2005, on 25 February 2020 - 03:58 AM, said:

Sounds like my LRM play.. I usually draw the ire of the enemy team very quickly and am often the focus of rushes.. I imagine them screaming over comms something along the lines of "get that $%/ing LRM boat!

lol, I don't think you can handle knowing what you're called in comms or why you get dove on.

Hint: It isn't because you present a huge threat.

Quote

That's a nice way to explain why LRM boats don't need to share armor much.. As long as they work with their team..

My ability to survive such rushes or draw rushers into my team's firing line is what gives me pride so many times..

lololoolololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololol

Your idea of working with the team is "make my partner narc for me" and "S key as soon as I see a red."

[Kusok Myasa]

Flyby215, on 24 February 2020 - 08:12 PM, said:

If someone actually manages to get 1,800 damage from 1,500m back with only LBX2s, I would be thoroughly impressed

i usually do damage with ac2s from 800-1000m. In QP ofc.1800 happens pretty often, considering i do not play much lately.

[Teenage Mutant Ninja Urbie]

quickly, everybody get his screenshot while this thread is still alive.

boy, this is pure gold @Vel and his believes

[K O Z A K]

Vellron2005, on 25 February 2020 - 03:58 AM, said:

Well I WAS trying to avoid name and shame COC violation you know.. but yes.. players like that.. you're on the right track..

That's ok, those guys are probably ridiculed and disliked more than even you. Probably extra frustrating for you because they will force you to stay outside of lrm max range and you don't have the skill and knowledge to work out how to beat them.

Vellron2005, on 25 February 2020 - 03:58 AM, said:

Sounds like my LRM play.. I usually draw the ire of the enemy team very quickly and am often the focus of rushes.. I imagine them screaming over comms something along the lines of "get that $%/ing LRM boat!

That's a nice way to explain why LRM boats don't need to share armor much.. As long as they work with their team..

My ability to survive such rushes or draw rushers into my team's firing line is what gives me pride so many times..

Please stay in qp and away from fp. You fit right in there with the rest of the selfish qp players that have basically turned screwing over teammates into meta game for the mode.

[AizakG]

Vellron2005, on 25 February 2020 - 03:58 AM, said:

AizakG, on 24 February 2020 - 04:01 PM, said:

Keep in mind, being a priority threat to the enemy team is more beneficial than 'sharing armor' in soloq. If you can keep extreme agro on the enemy team, dealing high dps in optimal range, focusing components, getting kills, you won't help your team much by overexposing and taking loads of damage to get the enemy's attention away from your team's 4hmg kodiak that's staring at a rock.

That's a nice way to explain why LRM boats don't need to share armor much..

No. It's the opposite. Any player should share armor with any other player who is capable of dealing equivalent or greater damage than themselves, and thus proven themselves valuable to cooperatively keep alive so that they can both dish out as much damage as possible. Importantly, when using this rule of thumb of sharing armor with equivalent or better damage dealers, take into account that LRMs spread damage worse than any other weapon system in the game, and thus need to deal far more damage to kill an enemy mech, so take whatever damage a lrm boat does and divide by roughly 2 or 3 to compare with other mechs capable of getting all their damage into one component. If you know the player is using precision weapons, but also know they're incredibly bad aim, and never focus components, you can divide their damage by 2 or less

As LRM boats are often especially reliant on their teammates to hold locks, they should actually be wary of their team's health percentage. But keep in mind, there's a massive difference between exposing along with your team or taking point around a corner, compared to completely overexposing your mech when no one on your team is out to take a shot. That being said, yes, if LRM boats are capable of dealing far more damage than the rest of their team, they should be guarded, but this is a rather uncommon case, outside of the lower tiers, perhaps.

Quote

As long as they work with their team..

This is partially true of LRM boats. They are best when the team is coordinated with them. Although the relationship isn't quite symbiotic. LRM boats often rely on their teammates' locks in order to be effective--unless the LRM boat is capable of holding their own locks during the fight. This in a way comes back to my original statement of extreme aggression. An aggressive LRM boat will expose in order to hold their own lock so that they can continuously shoot the enemy regardless of what their team is doing, and thus share armor without trying to. But this is uncommon as the vast majority of LRM boats enjoy the weapon system for how extremely passive they can play while still doing damage; where as aggressive players tend to shy away from the weapon system as waiting for their weapon to lock onto the enemy slows them down and is boring when they could otherwise just shoot the enemy on sight and torso twist damage away as they quickly take cover receiving little return damage.

Edited by AizakG, 25 February 2020 - 02:29 PM.

[Kubernetes]

Oh man, I thought this thread was going to be about those tools who sit back in stealth Fafnirs with light gauss.

[Prototelis]

Kubernetes, on 25 February 2020 - 02:44 PM, said:

Oh man, I thought this thread was going to be about those tools who sit back in stealth Fafnirs with light gauss.

Honestly 100% surprised I've never seen FAIT in those ******* things. They seem to mostly prefer kiteyman IS peepers like the BJ and Panther.