1768 replies to this topic

[Bigbaddaboom]

Very well done I use your comprehensive one with the engines etc. ALOT. Thank you for putting this together.

I vote this should be stickied.

[Grote]

Thank you for this.

Exellent work.

[Silverthorn75]

Someone pls sticky this. Omhs no longer plays this game and hasn't updated his info in many months, while smurfy updates within 24 hours of a patch. TY.

[Blark]

xSilverthornx, on 19 December 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

Someone pls sticky this. Omhs no longer plays this game and hasn't updated his info in many months, while smurfy updates within 24 hours of a patch. TY.

Well, I tried to support smurfy.. even wrote some staff members and asked them to sticky this.. no answer, seems they don't care or they don't want to sticky this for whatever reason (would be really nice to get some answer at least), even though this is in fact the only up2date source of information.

Let's just hope the lack of appreciation won't put smurfy off, because It would be a great loss for the community.

Edited by Blark, 19 December 2012 - 08:38 PM.

[Ohmwrecker]

xSilverthornx, on 19 December 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

Someone pls sticky this. Omhs no longer plays this game and hasn't updated his info in many months, while smurfy updates within 24 hours of a patch. TY.

I have no idea what you're talking about. I do play the game, and my sheets were updated just a couple weeks ago (which was the previous patch with significant content updates). I'm in the process of updating my sheets again to reflect the changes in this patch, it should be done within the next 24 hours or so. IGP / Piranha has the habit of timing big content updates when things conflict with other priorities in my life, but I still do my best to ensure that my sheets are updated in a relatively prompt manner.

Blark, on 19 December 2012 - 08:11 PM, said:

Well, I tried to support smurfy.. even wrote some staff members and asked them to sticky this.. no answer, seems they don't care or they don't want to sticky this for whatever reason (would be really nice to get some answer at least), even though this is in fact the only up2date source of information.

This is not the only up to date source of information, I'm not sure where you get that. There's my sheets, there's the excel mechlab by another user, there's the Java based mechlab, and now Smurfy's site. I think the reason there has not been many changes with stickies as of late is because in the end it's redundant and even confusing to have the same information stickied. It has nothing to do with not appreciating what Smurfy or anyone else does, it's about keeping the forums tidy and clean looking.

I don't have the ability to auto-extract, and Smurfy hasn't offered to share that ability. My sheets have to be updated manually, and I have to verify changes myself if I don't want to go off of patch notes and/or what others in the community send me. I've invited Smurfy to assist and collaborate, but he made the choice not to.

Edited by Ohmwrecker, 20 December 2012 - 02:20 AM.

[Snib]

Ohmwrecker, on 20 December 2012 - 02:06 AM, said:

I don't have the ability to auto-extract, and Smurfy hasn't offered to share that ability. My sheets have to be updated manually, and I have to verify changes myself if I don't want to go off of patch notes and/or what others in the community send me. I've invited Smurfy to assist and collaborate, but he made the choice not to.

LOL @ the passive aggressiveness. Why should he write code to generate your sheets for you when he's already got a complete and working site? Makes no sense. Besides it's trivial, the .pak files are zip archives and files you want inside are xml files, so give it a go, coding isn't hard, you might enjoy it.

Nebuchadnezzarr, on 17 December 2012 - 08:17 PM, said:

Is it possible to extract from the game files, the number of missile tubes on applicable mech body parts?

Yes you can. It's no mystery number though, just look at the variant's default loadout and you'll see, if it comes stock with LRM20 you get 20, if it comes with something smaller you get less. But if it comes with a machine gun you can still shoot a Gauss Rifle through it.

[Blark]

Ohmwrecker, on 20 December 2012 - 02:06 AM, said:

I have no idea what you're talking about. I do play the game, and my sheets were updated just a couple weeks ago (which was the previous patch with significant content updates). I'm in the process of updating my sheets again to reflect the changes in this patch, it should be done within the next 24 hours or so. IGP / Piranha has the habit of timing big content updates when things conflict with other priorities in my life, but I still do my best to ensure that my sheets are updated in a relatively prompt manner.

I took you over a month to update your sheets after the last patch; It could not have been due to the lack of time, because you made 9 or 10 game-play review videos for other games on your you-tube channel alone during that time.
And the errors from the last update are still not fixed.

Ohmwrecker, on 20 December 2012 - 02:06 AM, said:

This is not the only up to date source of information, I'm not sure where you get that. There's my sheets, there's the excel mechlab by another user, there's the Java based mechlab, and now Smurfy's site.

Your sheets are updated very irregularly, sometimes with a huge time delay and contain mistakes as pointed out before.
The mechlab however is great work and it deserves it's own sticky, it's amazing for testing configs, but not the best way to get comprehensive information quickly, it's simply not meant for that.
So if you're after comprehensive, up2date and easily accessible mwo information that only leaves smurfy.

Ohmwrecker, on 20 December 2012 - 02:06 AM, said:

I don't have the ability to auto-extract, and Smurfy hasn't offered to share that ability. My sheets have to be updated manually, and I have to verify changes myself if I don't want to go off of patch notes and/or what others in the community send me. I've invited Smurfy to assist and collaborate, but he made the choice not to.

I've spoken with smurfy, and he has never received any message from you.
Besides, snib is right, why should you profit from the work of others?

I think I finally get it now after your post, everything should be in your sticky ("to keep the forums clean and tidy"), even the work of others, because: "Become an Ohmie! Subscribe!"

You did some great work for the community in the beginning, and I'm still grateful for that, but you should be decent enough to admit that someone is simply doing a much better job then you and deserves appreciation.. unless of course you are in fact only after the fame and Subscribers for your youtube channel.

[BottomLine]

is there any way to get torso twist max rotation per mech frame into the stats as well?

[Snib]

If you want until he adds it:

Spoiler

Numbers in brackets are with the respective efficiency (Speed Tweak/Twist X).

Dedicated to Ohmwrecker because it's auto-generated and I didn't share my code with him.

[ArmyOfWon]

You know what, instead of bitching about not having "Up2Date" information in the sticky, why don't you do something about it! You guys are bitching "I don't wanna help Ohm, He's just a fame/attention *****, Become an Ohmie" Shut the hell up. Don't ask to have redundancies within the forum, actually offer to help Ohm out.

Yeah, that's right, I said it. I noticed "Hey, Ohm's sheet is out of date" and instead of trying to get my own thread stickied I offered my own time to get the currently stickied thread up to date.

I wasn't going to post, but all of the pot-shots forced my hand.

And if you're curious, actually yes, I do think Smurfy does a better job presenting some information. Different ways of combining and showing information that Ohm's sheets has. Should we be fighting over who gets the sticky? Well, if I thought that we should I would've created my own thread with the information that I gathered (information, mind you, that doesn't belong to any one of us) and then started bitching about getting stickied.

And if you're wondering what I have to gain over this post? Well, it's not much. What I hope to do is bring information obfuscated by the game into clear view of the public. We only need one thread at the top of the section, I agree. It needs to be updated in a timely manner, yes. As long as it does both, does it matter who's name is on it? If it's not up to date, instead of creating your own thread, wouldn't it be better for the community as a whole to have the already-stickied, most-viewed, most-commented thread to be the one that's both "Up2Date" and accurate?

Well, I certainly think so.

Blark, on 20 December 2012 - 06:40 AM, said:

And the errors from the last update are still not fixed.

Yeah, sorry about that. That was my bad.

Edited by ArmyOfWon, 20 December 2012 - 06:35 PM.

[Blark]

ArmyOfWon, on 20 December 2012 - 06:30 PM, said:

You know what, instead of bitching about not having "Up2Date" information in the sticky, why don't you do something about it!
You guys are bitching "I don't wanna help Ohm, He's just a fame/attention *****, Become an Ohmie" Shut the hell up. Don't ask to have redundancies within the forum, actually offer to help Ohm out.

Smurfy did something about it, he created the site and auto-generated sheets which was a great deal more work then simply manually reading values from xml files and creating sheets.
And he keeps working on mwo related projects.. hell, I heard he put over 12h of work in something that should be quite useful for the community today alone.

Now about the "bitching" part: Your quarrel is with me.
All I did was state an assumption about Ohms motives based on his posts regarding the sticky request for smurfy thread from my side and why he seems so adamant that no other post should be stickied, perhaps I'm wrong, who knows?

Do you think Ohm would be willing to present smurfys site&sheets while clearly stating that it is not his work and completely remove his advertisement?

I always tend to support the best work not the most famous one and that's why I support smurfys thread right now; and It is my opinion that it should be stickied, because, you know, thats what stickies are really for: to present the most current and useful information.

ArmyOfWon, on 20 December 2012 - 06:30 PM, said:

We only need one thread at the top of the section, I agree. It needs to be updated in a timely manner, yes. As long as it does both, does it matter who's name is on it?
If it's not up to date, instead of creating your own thread, wouldn't it be better for the community as a whole to have the already-stickied, most-viewed, most-commented thread to be the one that's both "Up2Date" and accurate?

Well, I certainly think so.

It does in fact matter who's name is on it, for two simple reasons:

Most importantly: the creator of the thread needs to be able to modify and update it and add stuff, you can't do that in someone else's thread.
Secondly: Credit where credit is due, don't you think?

The Most-viewed argument does not matter really, because what is stickied will be most viewed anyway and stickies exist for the sole reason to present the most current and interesting information to the community and not old but most viewed post.

Most-commented matters if you have an say an interesting and constructive discussion or some compilation of important statements etc, in this case however this argument is also void, because posts with expression of gratitude for past work and old feedback hardly matters, or do you honestly think someone is gonna read 66sites of old posts?


All I asked for is that this thread should be stickied, so that the community could benefit more from this...

[ArmyOfWon]

I suppose my argument is instead of using your energy to try to change what's stickied and what's not, instead you should contact the thread owner and see if you could help update his sheets for him. And credit where credit is due? Oh yeah, I was credited when I helped Ohm. So there's that.

I don't mean to discredit Smurfy's work. Quite the opposite, in fact. If instead of using his own website for the updates and not having his work stickied and noticed (as much as the current stickied thread), I think being credited on the stickied thread (which the owner is more than willing to deal, by the way. I'm sure he wouldn't mind adding mwo.smurfy-net.de to the credits list or changing around the formatting if smurfy wants to deal) would be much more constructive for both smurfy, the community, and you, since you spend so much time advertising and being smurfy's loud-speaker, you could spend more time on Caustic Valley or something.

If he wants his information stickied and credited on the existing sticky, I am more than willing to get behind him and help him get his work on the page already there. And seriously, who the hell cares who gave what to the community? Seriously, if you want to help the community you help it. You shouldn't need the attention or accolades and that shouldn't be motive. I'm clearly credited on the sheets, am I not?


Anyway, the more I read of your posts on here, the more I think that you're actually Smurfy using an alternate account to self-promote without the stigma of self-promoting. Now I'm sure you're not Smurfy, hell, who would drop an extra 120 bucks just to self-promote and troll forum posters? But what I'm saying is that your motives sound a bit strange from just reading your posts. You sound less like someone trying to support the community and more like someone trying to support a person. Not his work, not the community, but Smurfy himself. Maybe that's what rubs me the wrong way about this situation, but oh well.

Again, I'll extend the invitation myself, publicly. If Smurfy wants his information on the currently-stickied page, I will do everything I can to talk with Ohm and have Smurfy's information work properly credited (we need to remember, its not 'Ohm's' or 'Smurfy's' or 'My' information. It's the community's. Well, technically PGI's, but that's more legal than usable), as well as the sticky updated regularly and timely. On that you have my word.

Edit for clarity

Edited by ArmyOfWon, 21 December 2012 - 12:46 AM.

[Snib]

ArmyOfWon, on 21 December 2012 - 12:43 AM, said:

You sound less like someone trying to support the community and more like someone trying to support a person. Not his work, not the community, but Smurfy himself. Maybe that's what rubs me the wrong way about this situation, but oh well.

And that from the person supporting the guy who is trying to build a personality cult and plastering his name all over his thread and "information". Amazing. Simply amazing. Keep going, the entertainment value keeps rising.

[smurfynet]

Hi,

BottomLine, on 20 December 2012 - 12:34 PM, said:

is there any way to get torso twist max rotation per mech frame into the stats as well?

yes, i'm currently working on something different for the site, but started on torso/arm twist some days back and will finish including it today or tomorrow.

Snib, on 20 December 2012 - 05:24 PM, said:

Numbers in brackets are with the respective efficiency (Speed Tweak/Twist X).

Hi, i'm just courious, you added Twist X values, but not for all mechs, did you missed them or is there a reasons why you dont add them. also you used 10% twistx right?. if you are on elite it whould give you 20%, so it's maybe usfull to display that too.

And about the missile tubes, i can't find any data inside the files about the number.
You said, its possible by checking the default stock weapons, its a long time that i played my catapult. but i think that way in predicting the missile tube count is not relaiable.

(c4 has lrm 20 out of stock, the other lrm 15) so does the c4 have 20 missile tubes and the others only 15? so i think we need to find a better way (waaaaaaaaaah hardcode) the numbers

Edited by smurfynet, 21 December 2012 - 06:45 AM.

[Snib]

smurfynet, on 21 December 2012 - 06:41 AM, said:

Hi, i'm just courious, you added Twist X values, but not for all mechs, did you missed them or is there a reasons why you dont add them. also you used 10% twistx right?. if you are on elite it whould give you 20%, so it's maybe usfull to display that too.

Twist X doesn't work for mechs without lateral arm movement, so that's why some don't have it. The elite bonus is still broken as well as far as I'm aware.

smurfynet, on 21 December 2012 - 06:41 AM, said:

And about the missile tubes, i can't find any data inside the files about the number.
You said, its possible by checking the default stock weapons, its a long time that i played my catapult. but i think that way in predicting the missile tube count is not relaiable.

(c4 has lrm 20 out of stock, the other lrm 15) so does the c4 have 20 missile tubes and the others only 15? so i think we need to find a better way (waaaaaaaaaah hardcode) the numbers

If you find the number directly somewhere please shoot a PM my way, so far going via GameData\Libs\MechLoadout is the only way I'm aware of. It should be reliable (yes, the different Cats have different launchers) but if you find any mech where it isn't please let me know as well.

[Snib]

(nvm, had it right - also confirmed elite bonuses still to be broken in game)

Edited by Snib, 21 December 2012 - 07:33 AM.

[ReD3y3]

You guys should chill.

Smurfies sight is great and I use it almost daily.

Before his sight became available Ohms was the only thing out there to get the info.

I thank Ohm for his work as well.

In the end, anyone that volunteers time to provide a service for this game should be commended, whether you use that service or prefer a different one is irrelavent.

[smurfynet]

Updated my site with torso/arm infos and weapon health

[Blark]

ArmyOfWon, on 21 December 2012 - 12:43 AM, said:

I suppose my argument is instead of using your energy to try to change what's stickied and what's not[...]

I never tried to change what is stickied, I only requested a sticky for this thread, but apparently that was a really bad idea judging by all the attacks I get for it.

ArmyOfWon, on 21 December 2012 - 12:43 AM, said:

[...]since you spend so much time advertising and being smurfy's loud-speaker[..]

Guess what, I was advertising Ohms work until I saw smurfys site, I told countless people about it.
Almost everyone I play with knows Ohms work form me.
Now I tell everyone I know about smurfys site, and inserted it into my sig because It is not stickied (not that it helps much, simply because I don't post very often).
Apparently thats a very bad thing to do.

ArmyOfWon, on 21 December 2012 - 12:43 AM, said:

[..]if you want to help the community you help it. You shouldn't need the attention or accolades and that shouldn't be motive. [..]

I completely agree with you, but what you need is access to your own post to be able to edit and update it as stated before in my last post, something you either didn't see or choose to ignore.
Now you might understand my assumption in my prior post (regarding the 1.010px × 250px advertisement banner)

ArmyOfWon, on 21 December 2012 - 12:43 AM, said:

Anyway, the more I read of your posts on here, the more I think that you're actually Smurfy using an alternate account to self-promote without the stigma of self-promoting. [..]
But what I'm saying is that your motives sound a bit strange from just reading your posts.[..]

You're right, I'm the 4 armed blark-smurfy monster, playing on two accounts at the same time
Anyway, if you wonder about my motives: please feel free to read all my posts.
Maybe I like to argue too much, thats my fault, but I always try to stay objective and don't spread misinformation, I also hate it very much if people do spread misinformation, I feel personally attacked by it.

Edited by Blark, 21 December 2012 - 01:08 PM.

[iButcher]

Great work, very useful, thanks!

Vote for sticky!